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View Full Version : Why choose old heroes



Kahuf1
06-16-2018, 07:25 PM
Hi there, dont get me wrong, but i have 1 question on my mind.



One time some moderator say to me reworks are way to get deep to old hero playstyle. On case Kensei, dews does great. On Conq they just make him more spam shiledbash for me. This is just examples. But every new hero is some kind of mix of old ones with theirs abilities. Great example is Monk. He have ki stance (Nobushi hidden stance + highlander off stance). Have kick (nobushi), sweep (valk), 3 guaranteed lights (varden + PK staby stab) etc etc... So there is question which i have to place here...


Why should some newcomer play some of old heroes?

Halvtand
06-16-2018, 07:30 PM
Counter-question: Why not?
Sure, Shaolin will have a good spread of tools, but is that all? Are you seriously picking which hero to play based on which hero has the most stuff to spam out?

Kahuf1
06-16-2018, 07:49 PM
Its not about myself. Probably no hero will fit to my playstyle as Highlander now. Its about newcamers, about hyped players, maybe sheeps who fit to flock for easy win. (No offence to anyone)

Its about posibilities, not spams. If one hero have tons of posibilities, he is just easier to play against all others and compare to all others.
But its rly flustrating some player is definitly lower in skills but simply pick "better" hero give him victory.

And im not complaining here. I just place question here and want to see some responds :)

Lord_Cherubi
06-16-2018, 07:58 PM
Hi there, dont get me wrong, but i have 1 question on my mind.



One time some moderator say to me reworks are way to get deep to old hero playstyle. On case Kensei, dews does great. On Conq they just make him more spam shiledbash for me. This is just examples. But every new hero is some kind of mix of old ones with theirs abilities. Great example is Monk. He have ki stance (Nobushi hidden stance + highlander off stance). Have kick (nobushi), sweep (valk), 3 guaranteed lights (varden + PK staby stab) etc etc... So there is question which i have to place here...


Why should some newcomer play some of old heroes?

I have a feeling that Shaolin won't be as terrifying or OP (god i hate that word) that people are pointing him out to be now. He might have more tools to work with than any other hero but im sure he will have his flaws like everyone else and struggle in some areas of play.

As of this "better hero will always win" talk, this simply isn't true. Sure some of the original heroes are a bit weaker than others especially the DLC ones but all this means is that they're just a bit more limited in their playstyle but if you make the most of the character's moveset and mechanics and master him/her then you can shine as any of the heroes in the game.

So whenever you lose you lose to the opponent, not the character.

Kahuf1
06-16-2018, 08:11 PM
I have a feeling that Shaolin won't be as terrifying or OP (god i hate that word) that people are pointing him out to be now. He might have more tools to work with than any other hero but im sure he will have his flaws like everyone else and struggle in some areas of play.

As of this "better hero will always win" talk, this simply isn't true. Sure some of the original heroes are a bit weaker than others especially the DLC ones but all this means is that they're just a bit more limited in their playstyle but if you make the most of the character's moveset and mechanics and master him/her then you can shine as any of the heroes in the game.

So whenever you lose you lose to the opponent, not the character.

So ur opinion is here :
- there is no easier hero
- more posibilities of moves of hero doesnt count on % of win

Kobi_Blade
06-16-2018, 08:29 PM
I have a feeling that Shaolin won't be as terrifying or OP (god i hate that word) that people are pointing him out to be now. He might have more tools to work with than any other hero but im sure he will have his flaws like everyone else and struggle in some areas of play.

As of this "better hero will always win" talk, this simply isn't true. Sure some of the original heroes are a bit weaker than others especially the DLC ones but all this means is that they're just a bit more limited in their playstyle but if you make the most of the character's moveset and mechanics and master him/her then you can shine as any of the heroes in the game.

So whenever you lose you lose to the opponent, not the character.

Agreed, even today there's lots of players who haven't figured out every move of the old heroes, cause they to lazy and inpatient to learn them.

This is where the difficulty comes, on how difficulty it is to execute every move properly for the character (on how to actually play them).

The old heroes have the tools to crush any character in-game, in all goes down to the player and it's skill set.

Halvtand
06-16-2018, 08:32 PM
Its not about myself. Probably no hero will fit to my playstyle as Highlander now. Its about newcamers, about hyped players, maybe sheeps who fit to flock for easy win. (No offence to anyone)

Its about posibilities, not spams. If one hero have tons of posibilities, he is just easier to play against all others and compare to all others.
But its rly flustrating some player is definitly lower in skills but simply pick "better" hero give him victory.

And im not complaining here. I just place question here and want to see some responds :)

Sorry if I sounded a bit offensive, that was not my intention. It wasn't helped by my choice of words (which got censured) either.
My question was simply if availability of tools and options is so important or if actually liking to play the hero should be of the highest priority.
As in he case with Shaolin I fully support him having lots of tools. I've practiced shaolin kung fu myself and it is a type of martial art that relies in the base of equipping its artists with an abundance of multi-purpose tools. Of course in a game you also need to balance this against the other characters, so it'll be interesting to try this hero out when they release.

Kahuf1
06-16-2018, 08:45 PM
Sorry if I sounded a bit offensive, that was not my intention. It wasn't helped by my choice of words (which got censured) either.
My question was simply if availability of tools and options is so important or if actually liking to play the hero should be of the highest priority.
As in he case with Shaolin I fully support him having lots of tools. I've practiced shaolin kung fu myself and it is a type of martial art that relies in the base of equipping its artists with an abundance of multi-purpose tools. Of course in a game you also need to balance this against the other characters, so it'll be interesting to try this hero out when they release.

Im not offended mate :)

I practice historical fencing for some years and i know, this game is like scenic fencing. Nothing about reality, but looks good :) I preffer 2handed axe in real and if we talk about scenic fencing and make it ingame, raider for example can after parry light press emefiately light attack and can perform some guaranteed damage or throw to ground enemy to ground.

In my opinion is just availability counts. And devs with rework old heroes will not give more availability, just get deeper their main key move. Thats pity for me.

Lord_Cherubi
06-16-2018, 09:42 PM
So ur opinion is here :
- there is no easier hero
- more posibilities of moves of hero doesnt count on % of win

Didn't mean that mate, some of the heroes are definetely easier to learn than others but easier isn't the same as better. If a rep 50 Shugoki faces a lvl 10 Orochi, who would win?

The answer is you can't tell but my bet would be on the Shugo, he doesn't have much tricks up his sleeve but he knows everything of his character and propably more of the Orochi than his opponent as well because of his experience.

So i have to disagree that bigger moveset would mean highr change of winning, he just has more options.

Lord_Cherubi
06-16-2018, 09:53 PM
Warden is actually a lot better example. He is one of the strongest pick for duels right now but if we forget about normal attack combos that every hero has, what special he has to his kit? Double light attack which does decent but still somewhat low damage, shoulder bash and a high damage counter attack which you can only use from top stance. His zone attack is great for 1v1 combat but you can't really build your whole play around that move.

Of course this will soon change as the rework is just around the corner but as of now you could say that he's very limited in options. But if you take everything he has and mix them up so you're hard to predict, you have one of the strongest characters from the old roster.

bannex19
06-16-2018, 10:10 PM
Hi there, dont get me wrong, but i have 1 question on my mind.



One time some moderator say to me reworks are way to get deep to old hero playstyle. On case Kensei, dews does great. On Conq they just make him more spam shiledbash for me. This is just examples. But every new hero is some kind of mix of old ones with theirs abilities. Great example is Monk. He have ki stance (Nobushi hidden stance + highlander off stance). Have kick (nobushi), sweep (valk), 3 guaranteed lights (varden + PK staby stab) etc etc... So there is question which i have to place here...


Why should some newcomer play some of old heroes?

Simple answer, the original heroes are flat out all around cooler. All of the new heroes rely on their game breaking gimmicks while the old heroes come from a different design where simplicity and pacing beat spam and ganks. The reworks are just pushing the old heroes into the new dance fighting that for honor has become.

Knight_Raime
06-16-2018, 10:17 PM
I'd imagine to get a better grasp at the game. As older heros are simpler to learn. Then beyond that just for the sake of diversifying your cast of people you played.
I used to pretty much only play centurion. Before him I bounced around a lot. And then around season 5 I started playing a lot more heros a lot more often.

Lord_Cherubi
06-16-2018, 10:32 PM
I'd imagine to get a better grasp at the game. As older heros are simpler to learn. Then beyond that just for the sake of diversifying your cast of people you played.
I used to pretty much only play centurion. Before him I bounced around a lot. And then around season 5 I started playing a lot more heros a lot more often.

I have mad respect to anyone that can commit to one hero only. I myself can't, even tho i like a few more than the rest, i can't play even one night as one single hero without getting bored. This is propably why im at total rep 30 but my two highest reps are both 5

Knight_Raime
06-17-2018, 12:10 AM
I have mad respect to anyone that csn commit to one hero only. I myself can't, even tho i like a few more thsn the rest, i can't play even one night as one single hero without getting bored. This is propably why im at total rep 30 but my two highest reps are both 5

I'm rep 22 or 23 atm I forget. my highest is Centurion at rep 6. But I have a few that are at rep 2. some almost at rep 2. and I have one that's at rep 3 and 1 or 2 that are almost rep 3.

Kahuf1
06-17-2018, 09:20 AM
I'm rep 22 or 23 atm I forget. my highest is Centurion at rep 6. But I have a few that are at rep 2. some almost at rep 2. and I have one that's at rep 3 and 1 or 2 that are almost rep 3.

Guys, im 24 rep and on Highlander i have 17rep. So there is sample, how fun his playstyle is for me. Cause his playstyle have 2 forms and both of forms (ok one is weaker but playable) are different but the same brutal.

And in this fact I had the question on start. Why newcomer should pick old heroes?

Ok, Warden have good % wins but this is lot about 50:50 like Conquerors now. They can do rework like give him some special shield attack (not bash), or some kind of hooking mechanism with flail. Damned chain if flail can spin around weapon... he can have slower heavies but when simple block (or even in parry heavy!), hook enemys weapon for a while, press light on time window to pull enemy and hit him with a shield to face (like will probably have new assasin girl), but nop, they give him more oportunity to bash, bash and bash... thats booring for me.

Funnest is (to play and play against) have lot of oportunities before "lot of feints to bash". My opinion.

Jazz117Volkov
06-17-2018, 11:10 AM
Why should some newcomer play some of old heroes?

The Warden is still the coolest looking hero, there's really nothing else to consider. All this balancing noise is just hot air.

Lord_Cherubi
06-17-2018, 11:28 AM
The Warden is still the coolest looking hero, there's really nothing else to consider. All this balancing noise is just hot air.

Can you hear the Shugo crying in the distance?

Jazz117Volkov
06-17-2018, 12:13 PM
Can you hear the Shugo crying in the distance?

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