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View Full Version : Huge danger for the game, we have a solution, Moderators, Devs we need your assist



Redditmember55
06-15-2018, 01:21 PM
Dear Honor players, Respected Moderators,

this thread is one of the most important ones in the games history, it can be a bit longer, but definitely needs to look at by the forum moderators, the Dev team, and by fellow players.

For Honor has at the moment a monumental interest, because of the E3 reveal, plus giving the starter edition free on PC or with a big discount on consoles, Honor has the chance to raise the playerbase widely. But the offical launch for Marching Fire is on 16. October, that is 4! months from now, the game can lose all the positive attention what it owns now. Here are multiple reasons why it is not a good idea, to have the launch in October:

-Other AAA big games will launch at the exact same period, for instance: COD BO 4 October 12, Battlefield 5 October 19. and these are just the shooting games, lots of players will go for the total new games

-E3 hype, attention will die out long before the Marching Fire update, gaming hype is a strong thing, but it only lasts for 3, 4 weeks,(exept the tryhards, pro players) and the hype will cool down, now you have the gamers attention all over the world, use this

-It is summer time, one of the biggest potential for gaming time, because obviously younger players have summer holiday and can play a lot, players who are working, mostly have more freetime during the summer, your whole playerbase can play more Honor in summertime than in October, you need to build on this

- Humans are not patient, you just showcased a lot from 2 of your new heroes, we want to play them now, not 4 months later, it is a long time in modern gaming, when players cannot use their new favourite, they will go to other games, and they will wont be as hyped in October as now

-In the offical launch plan 4 heroes will join the battlefield at the same time, that is obviusly too much at one time, the players wont know which hero they should try first, because all of them are cool, gamers can’t focus to learn everything about one warrior, when you want to fight with the others too, 2 heroes on a launch would be perfect, as you did in the past effective

If Ubisoft does not act to eliminate these problems For Honor can lose it’s chance to evolve and get a much bigger playerbase on each platform, the newcomers of the Free game wont stay long, most of them wants to play with the new heroes, than they realize they have to wait more than a quarter year

Soltuion: if you can make the offical launch earlier before the other huge games come out do it, it is important. You have the E3 hype now, it will last only 3, 4 weeks maximum if the players know they have to wait until October, we hope that the Tiandi and the Shaolin are almost ready to launch, so you can launch them at the end of Season 6 as the Pre Marching Fire update, it is around middle of August, until that Ubisoft can figure out the Season Pass, and players will have plenty of time to buy it in order to get early acces to the premium content, this solution eliminates the second, third, fourth and fifth big problem that can cause serious damage to the game

You showcased basically most of the things about 2 brand new heroes, you have to understand, that players wont wait so long, they want it now, it is so in the modern world, you mentioned in the past Warriors Dens some surprises for the summer, they are obviously reworks tweaks, thats is good, but reworks wont be enough for the players after the E3, gamers are hyped about the new faction and heroes, try to reschedule, I think that you will finish way earlier with the content creating, than October, and you need only too finish the Tiandi, and the Shaolin, we have to use these heroes in the summertime for multiple reasons I wrote about, if you can do it this way For Honor will grow on every platform and will be better, that is our shared goal, players and Devs wants this. If you release the content earlier the playerbase will send you their best regards and will make nice threads tweets, about how good is For Honor, and the Honor Dev Team

This thread needs to be looked at a high level in the Dev team, an „I will send it to the team” wont be enough this time, we ask you Dear Moderators, let the Devs really speak and consider this important topic, it will save the game and helps it to evolve to the maximum potential what For Honor has.
Respected fellow Honor players, help this thread to get larger and together we can get this to the Devs table, let’s make an open discussion

Baggin_
06-15-2018, 01:31 PM
Yeah, I highly doubt they're going to release the heroes early.

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 02:13 PM
Speak for yourself OP. Some of us have more attention span and patience than that of a spoiled kid/man child who wants their Christmas presents now, now, now! I'm happy to wait 4 months and I'm also pretty sure Ubi have other things planned for the summer seeing as how they have already said they do.

This thread is about how you feel and that's fine but you can only speak for yourself. If I were you I would drop all the "we" as you do not speak for the community as a whole and it just sounds very obnoxious of you to assume that you do.

HNU_vidiviktor
06-15-2018, 02:14 PM
He's totaly right
I think they have the caracters movement so
If they want they can realese them earlier and it can save the game.

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 02:18 PM
He's totaly right
I think they have the caracters movement so
If they want they can realese them earlier and it can save the game.
The game doesn't need saving. It's in the best place it's ever been in its life. And yeah sure, release early. And the reworks? Screwing the old roster in favour of releasing new heroes because impatient kids and man children are whining on the forum is not a good look.

CandleInTheDark
06-15-2018, 02:24 PM
First of all, on the Den they said the characters are in alpha state, releasing them early is not going to happen.

Secondly, we are not all so weak minded that having four options at once will make our heads explode, I know who I am playing and which of them I am playing first

Thirdly, I have seen these kind of threads several times, the first when season 2 dropped on the same date as Injustice 2, if it didn't kill us when the game had crippling disconnect issues, it sure as hell isn't going to now.

Redditmember55
06-15-2018, 02:57 PM
Dear Vakris_One, I never said that we dont need the reworks, we need them more now than ever because the new heroes will be strong, but on the summer hopefully there will be some reworks (like Warden) and we are happy about that, your answer was a little bit offensive, my friend it was really childish, you dont like when hundreds of players have other opinion than you? All my friends, my community and thousands of others are impatient for the new content but in a good way, not in a childish way, And For Honor needs more players, especially on PC, and for a bigger playerbase Ubisoft have to use the hype, which was built, on the summer we will have some surprises they said it (reworks, some tweaked game modes, dance of death) and maybe a surprise new characters.

My favourite forum member Candle, I said, that they should release the new heroes in August, not today, and your second point is offensive too, you know which is your favourite, but those who like to play each type of character at the same time it's a hard choice because all of the heroes are exciting. And for your third point, I have written 5 issues, not all of them are the same level as a danger for the game, one of the biggest from them is that the E3 hype can die in several weeks, if Ubi does not give us something cool.

We started an open discussion, everybody can share his (or her) thoughts but do it in a polite way, I did not say anything offensive about you guys , so just keep going.

DrinkinMyStella
06-15-2018, 03:00 PM
what ever new games come out which I will get, I will always hop onto for honor, for honor has a place in my heart :o and I might love another game but will alway come back.

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 03:07 PM
Dear Vakris_One, I never said that we dont need the reworks, we need them more now than ever because the new heroes will be strong, but on the summer hopefully there will be some reworks (like Warden) and we are happy about that, your answer was a little bit offensive, my friend it was really childish, you dont like when hundreds of players have other opinion than you? All my friends, my community and thousands of others are impatient for the new content but in a good way, not in a childish way, And For Honor needs more players, especially on PC, and for a bigger playerbase Ubisoft have to use the hype, which was built, on the summer we will have some surprises they said it (reworks, some tweaked game modes, dance of death) and maybe a surprise new characters.

My favourite forum member Candle, I said, that they should release the new heroes in August, not today, and your second point is offensive too, you know which is your favourite, but those who like to play each type of character at the same time it's a hard choice because all of the heroes are exciting. And for your third point, I have written 5 issues, not all of them are the same level as a danger for the game, one of the biggest from them is that the E3 hype can die in several weeks, if Ubi does not give us something cool.

We started an open discussion, everybody can share his (or her) thoughts but do it in a polite way, I did not say anything offensive about you guys , so just keep going.
I guess I was a little sharp there but that's because you write as if you speak on behalf of thousands of other players which in all fairness sounds very off. I've never heard of you as someone famous or significant in the community and yet you claim you speak for "my community" and "thousands of others". I guess I'm just curious about why your default position is that of someone who can speak for thousands with any degree of accuracy - a feat which many countries top politicians cannot even master.

Can you enlighten me as to who you are in the community and why you are assuming that your personal opinion should be regarded as more significant than any other single person's opinion?

GaelonD
06-15-2018, 03:08 PM
I totally agree with you Redditmember55,

the hype train is on, we need in the summer the reworks, and if its possible, two from the new warriors. He made some really true points, for instance on the summer I dont have university lessons, so I can play a lot more, and just a side question to Vakris and CandleintheDark, you made some harsh reactions, but why? I like the dudes ideas and agree with them, why were you so insulting? It is an open and friendly discussion, they can have their ideas, and you can have yours, we share the ideas and then maybe we can get a better idea which can help our favourite game.

Armosias
06-15-2018, 03:09 PM
I'm not sure that releasing the new heroes now will do any better than doing it later honestly. Because it will actually make more heroes to understand now for newbies than in october when they're planned to come out. Also this allow for more testing and balancing, and I think they absolutely need it.

I think Roman said "pre-alpha state" which means what it means right?

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 03:13 PM
I totally agree with you Redditmember55,

the hype train is on, we need in the summer the reworks, and if its possible, two from the new warriors. He made some really true points, for instance on the summer I dont have university lessons, so I can play a lot more, and just a side question to Vakris and CandleintheDark, you made some harsh reactions, but why? I like the dudes ideas and agree with them, why were you so insulting? It is an open and friendly discussion, they can have their ideas, and you can have yours, we share the ideas and then maybe we can get a better idea which can help our favourite game.
Simple really. Because his default position was to claim that he speaks for the community which implies he speaks in my name as well. I dislike someone assuming they speak for me without even having asked for my opinion. Would you be happy for someone to say they speak for you when they don't even know what your opinion is?

Redditmember55
06-15-2018, 03:18 PM
Vakris, I try to enlighten you

I'm constantly playing from the beta, just to make it clear, I never said, that this concept, should be on a higher level than anybody else's idea, I dont know why you think this, I try to be polite and answer to everything even you were a little bit offensive. So on the topic most of the Honor players are excited, and would be happy if they could get the new heroes a little bit earlier than October, just ask your friends. I read the forums, the E3 twitch chat, Honor facebook groups, huge amount of players are unpatient and want to play earlier, if Ubisoft can let this happen (and before it the reworks, balancing) why is it a problem for you?After the E3 I have spoken dozens of Honor players and they are all wating the launch, they would like the idea of getting the heroes earlier when they are fully finished and balance tested

And one more thing, do you think it is possible that I ask every Honor player on the world before I say, it will be good for the game, and lots of players agree with it? That is ridiculus and hard to do.

Redditmember55
06-15-2018, 03:20 PM
Armosias, I said, that if they can they should release the heroes in August, not today

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 04:04 PM
Vakris, I try to enlighten you

I'm constantly playing from the beta, just to make it clear, I never said, that this concept, should be on a higher level than anybody else's idea, I dont know why you think this, I try to be polite and answer to everything even you were a little bit offensive.
I've played since the alpha but it doesn't make my opinion suddenly count for a thousand people, which you have implied yours does. That is what I take issue with - trying to foster a false sense of immediate importance above just a normal person's opinion. I criticised your wording by saying that it is obnoxious to claim you speak for anyone other than yourself. That's not offensive, that's just criticism. It was a bit sharp and I could have phrased it more diplomatically of course so for that I will take the blame.



So on the topic most of the Honor players are excited, and would be happy if they could get the new heroes a little bit earlier than October, just ask your friends. I read the forums, the E3 twitch chat, Honor facebook groups, huge amount of players are unpatient and want to play earlier, if Ubisoft can let this happen (and before it the reworks, balancing) why is it a problem for you?
It's not. I have no problem with other people's opinions nor in distinguishing opinions from wishful thinking out loud. The problem is the way you worded your thread to make it seem like the world will end if Ubisoft don't release the update earlier. That's called hyperbole and in my opinion it's a very poor, very crass tool to use in a polite and civilised discourse about something you want to happen. That's just how I feel about the use of hyperbollic statements.



After the E3 I have spoken dozens of Honor players and they are all wating the launch, they would like the idea of getting the heroes earlier when they are fully finished and balance tested.
That's great. We all would like this update out as soon as possible because we're all fans of this game but that should ultimately be left up to the devs in my opinion. They have decided they will need 4 months to get this update ready for release and I trust them because they are professional game developers who know their stuff. Like pretty much everyone I want to play this update as soon as possible but I also have to respect that the developers know what they are doing and that they have access to a bigger picture than me. I don't want to pressure them into releasing an unfinished product as that is how For Honor got into trouble in the first place on it's launch. Nor am I nearly arrogant enough to believe that I know more about the games market or this community than the developers themselves.

I think they are well aware of the community's hunger for this update and no amount of "the game will suffer if you don't release early" over-the-top threads (with all due respect) will convince them to change their release date. Because frankly the developers know more about how to do their jobs than we do.



And one more thing, do you think it is possible that I ask every Honor player on the world before I say, it will be good for the game, and lots of players agree with it? That is ridiculus and hard to do.
Not ridiculous. Just hard to do. I've seen people from other games communities than are much larger than For Honor's community go out and gather data in order to present it back to the devs and the community. I've seen a massive survey of over 30, 0000 players conducted by one person who then painstakingly collated the data and presented it for use as a tool to see what player's favourite game modes and play styles were for a game called Elite Dangerous. And even he knew he didn't speak for the whole community which was made up of more than a million players worldwide. He made it clear that his survey was not meant to be the be all and end all about the community's opinion, just that it would be the largest piece of community sourced data but by no means the final word.

So you can see now why I take a bit of an issue with you simply claiming you speak for the majority without even providing cursory evidence of your research and data gathered. I mean that's just too easy to say. If you want to make the claim then you gotta be willing to do the hard work to back it up with. Otherwise you are only ever speaking for yourself and your own personal opinion, which is perfectly fine just so long as you don't go claiming to be speaking for other people as well. State your own opinion, without pretentions to be speaking for others, and then let other people speak for themselves. That's just how I feel on this matter.

I hope that's cleared that up.

Lord_Cherubi
06-15-2018, 04:25 PM
I don't mind waiting, hell i've been waiting the Breach mode ever since i installed lol. But newcomer's hype might be long gone before the DLC drops.

Still i'd rather they take their sweet time, this is propably their last shot at making this game big and a broken update would pretty much seal the deal for it. I can already name way too much PS4 players than i should be able to which is both very alarming and kinda fun because you get to know a bit on what and how people play.

Mia.Nora
06-15-2018, 06:08 PM
It is true that game would have benefitted more from an earlier release than October which is just too far away, simply because that is how human psychology works. Player base who is already into FH wont be effected, those new player who are hyped will forget and cool down by October.

And I think the over reaction from candle and valkris is unwarranted. They are both die hard fans like the many rest of us here on forums who still tag along regardless of the problems game have, and using our own commitment to the game as a benchmark for the general playerbase game could have reached is simply silly.

Of course earlier release can not be done, they are just not ready, but E3 had a set date and they had to announce at that date regardless of when it will actually be released. I don't think they will even be really ready by October, and I am sure it will be released in a almost or literally beta state for the new stuff. Dev team here is notorious for how slow they work, and my worry is old stuff that is forced to be released broken almost never gets to be fixed. We still have several beta state game mods in the game.

Alustar.
06-15-2018, 06:20 PM
The release of this update has got nothing on the hype train for other games. Take the final fantasy 7 remake for instance. Players have been waiting YEARS for that and will likely wait even longer still. And here are you guys complaining about a 4 months wait? GTFO

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 06:25 PM
It is true that game would have benefitted more from an earlier release than October which is just too far away, simply because that is how human psychology works.

And I think the over reaction from candle and valkris is unwarranted. They are both die hard fans like the many rest of us here on forums who still tag along regardless of the problems game have, and using our own commitment to the game as a benchmark for the general playerbase game could have reached is simply silly.

Of course earlier release can not be done, they are just not ready, but E3 had a set date and they had to announce at that date regardless of when it will actually be released. I don't think they will even be really ready by October, and I am sure it will be released in a almost or literally beta state for the new stuff. Dev team here is notorious for how slow they work, and my worry is old stuff that is forced to be released broken almost never gets to be fixed. We still have several beta state game mods in the game.
Can you please explain to me which part of my post was an overreaction Mia? I didn't like the OP's hyperbole and I did not agree with their tone of "I speak for the majority of players when I say this...". I wasn't aware that me simply stating my own personal opinion and putting forth some criticism is considered as an "overreaction". In most places that's called giving an opinion.

As per your statement here, "using our own commitment to the game as a benchmark for the general playerbase game could have reached is simply silly." - The OP did exactly what you just wrote. They used their own personal benchmark for what they want to happen and expressed it as if that's how the majority of the playerbase automatically feels. Why am I copping flack from you while the OP opened their thread like this? Seems a bit hypocritical of you.

CandleInTheDark
06-15-2018, 06:33 PM
And I think the over reaction from candle and valkris is unwarranted. They are both die hard fans like the many rest of us here on forums who still tag along regardless of the problems game have, and using our own commitment to the game as a benchmark for the general playerbase game could have reached is simply silly..

Ok, so outside of maybe my second point being a little tart, can you tell me where any of the rest of my post was factually wrong? Since the devs did say alpha state yesterday and people did say this game would die when season 2 was released on the same day as Injustice 2 and when Absolver came out and the game was in a worse state than it is now in both cases.

NHLGoldenKnight
06-15-2018, 06:40 PM
Speak for yourself OP. Some of us have more attention span and patience than that of a spoiled kid/man child who wants their Christmas presents now, now, now! I'm happy to wait 4 months and I'm also pretty sure Ubi have other things planned for the summer seeing as how they have already said they do.

This thread is about how you feel and that's fine but you can only speak for yourself. If I were you I would drop all the "we" as you do not speak for the community as a whole and it just sounds very obnoxious of you to assume that you do.

While I cannot comment on everyone's personal feelings and opinions, strictly speaking from business perspective, OP is completely right.

1. Some huge games are coming out at similar time
2. Kids having free time during summer and I personally don't like it, but they are large population when it comes to video games and spending real money for pay to win upgrades.
3. They are giving game for free right now and without update they will get nothing in return. Players who get free game will most likely stop playing by the time update gets out.

Kobi_Blade
06-15-2018, 06:47 PM
I agree with everything Vakris_One said.

OP doesn't speak for the majorly of the community and I find it offensive when someone puts words in my mouth.

The content is not ready nor it will affect the new branch of players that just joined, the only players hyped and impatient for the new content are the old players (Why? Because everything is still new to the new players, and they have much to discover and try until the new content is out).

Releasing the content now would only affect the game negatively, as it would be buggy and unbalanced (exactly the same reason why the game had problems in day one), not to mention as already stated there's still systems in BETA that haven't been touched in months.

Developers better finish, balance and rework everything that is currently in-game before releasing new content.

Alustar.
06-15-2018, 06:49 PM
Not to mention the same players who leave WILL BE BACK when the new content goes live. It's happened EVERY SEASON. And to be frank, if they leave because they get impatient like that, good riddance. I'd rather not deal with them.

CandleInTheDark
06-15-2018, 07:13 PM
While I cannot comment on everyone's personal feelings and opinions, strictly speaking from business perspective, OP is completely right.

1. Some huge games are coming out at similar time
2. Kids having free time during summer and I personally don't like it, but they are large population when it comes to video games and spending real money for pay to win upgrades.
3. They are giving game for free right now and without update they will get nothing in return. Players who get free game will most likely stop playing by the time update gets out.

So ignoring the kids comment because the rating of the game that shouldn't be a thing (likely more of a thing than some people would like though I agree) again, the same points I made to the OP. Given that the two characters that were ready to be shown were said to be in alpha state, how do you expect the devs to get around that? Put out the characters barely finished and have people complaining about balance issues for the next three months where they could have gotten it polished? Also, again, people have said that For Honor will suffer because big games are coming out or because the season is launching at the same time as another game, it is still here.

I don't claim to speak for everyone, obviously, and I do not use myself as a benchmark for every other person, but since I am stating facts that can be researched and the op is saying that he speaks for thousands of people, it is not me that the burden of proof, so to speak, is on.

NHLGoldenKnight
06-15-2018, 07:52 PM
So ignoring the kids comment because the rating of the game that shouldn't be a thing (likely more of a thing than some people would like though I agree) again, the same points I made to the OP. Given that the two characters that were ready to be shown were said to be in alpha state, how do you expect the devs to get around that? Put out the characters barely finished and have people complaining about balance issues for the next three months where they could have gotten it polished? Also, again, people have said that For Honor will suffer because big games are coming out or because the season is launching at the same time as another game, it is still here.

I don't claim to speak for everyone, obviously, and I do not use myself as a benchmark for every other person, but since I am stating facts that can be researched and the op is saying that he speaks for thousands of people, it is not me that the burden of proof, so to speak, is on.

Well, those are the issues that Ubisoft should have planned for. If they have worked harder, faster and smarter, they would be in a position to release the update earlier.

I can't comment on other people's opinion, but as I said earlier, from strictly business prospective, it doesn't make any sense at all.

Also, I can give you my personal situation. I stopped playing game recently and this updated would definitely bring back not just me, but my wife as well. Now, we have to wait for way too long.

So 4 months from now, issue will not be do I still want to play this game. Issue will be time I have, since most grown-ups and actually kids as well, have a limited time for entertainment. For me, that is about 2 hours per day. Right now, there is not really many games I play and I have some spare time. However 4 months from now, things are going to change. There are many interesting games coming out and my gaming time is limited. How much of my time should I allocate for playing half broken game ( that I still like) compared to new triple A games coming out?

I am going back to business again, but giving free game right now makes no sense at all. Update is too far away and I feel like new mode could really help this game. But if new players will get stucked playing ganking dominioin for 4 months, you really think majority of them will stay in the game after that experience? Giving game for free 1 week before update would be good PR move, this not so much.

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 08:26 PM
While I cannot comment on everyone's personal feelings and opinions, strictly speaking from business perspective, OP is completely right.

1. Some huge games are coming out at similar time
2. Kids having free time during summer and I personally don't like it, but they are large population when it comes to video games and spending real money for pay to win upgrades.
3. They are giving game for free right now and without update they will get nothing in return. Players who get free game will most likely stop playing by the time update gets out.
Fair points except that from a business perspective surely it is better to release something that isn't in a buggy and unfinished beta state. If they rush it out the door prematurely they will lose a massive number of players who will not be coming back because of this game's bad history. Losing some players to boredom or to other games happens naturally anyway with any type of ongoing game, nobody can prevent that. All the devs can and should do is to focus on making sure that when they do release content it is of the highest quality possible.

Angering your playerbase with rushed and buggy content is one of the worst things any developer can do.

NHLGoldenKnight
06-15-2018, 08:50 PM
Fair points except that from a business perspective surely it is better to release something that isn't in a buggy and unfinished beta state. If they rush it out the door prematurely they will lose a massive number of players who will not be coming back because of this game's bad history. Losing some players to boredom or to other games happens naturally anyway with any type of ongoing game, nobody can prevent that. All the devs can and should do is to focus on making sure that when they do release content it is of the highest quality possible.

Angering your playerbase with rushed and buggy content is one of the worst things any developer can do.

Well, I absolutely agree. But that is something Ubisoft should have taken into account and planned better. Maybe work faster, or smarter, whatever you want to call it. Also, let's be honest. Ubisoft regularly delivers broken updates and heroes when it comes to For Honor, it doesn't matter how much time they got. Call me pessimist, but new update will no be exception, 1 month or 4 months from now.

Halvtand
06-15-2018, 09:09 PM
Alright, I’ve finally read through this thing and I’m ready to give my reply.
So basically, what you’re after here is that the dev team should move the release of the new heroes we saw on E3 closer because four months is too far away and we’ll lose hype. Your first argument:


Other AAA big games will launch at the exact same period, for instance: COD BO 4 October 12, Battlefield 5 October 19. and these are just the shooting games, lots of players will go for the total new games
It is very true that many games are released in that month. They are released in that month for a reason, because market analyses show that it is a good month for releasing games with some fairly big holidays right around the corner where the games can be given as gifts to people. Some of these games are pretty big, you mention both CoD and Battlefield and it is true that these games will draw quite a crowd. The one thing you forget, and that dismisses this as an argument is that not all players play all games. Some people don’t give a rat’s flying toenail about certain games or even entire genres. For some, CoD means nothing, just like FH means nothing to many gamers. What does matter is that FH stands out as a unique game that is definitely doing its own thing. It is also the only game of its kind that has some sort of thing in October. As such, people who like this type of game has nothing else to distract them at release.


E3 hype, attention will die out long before the Marching Fire update, gaming hype is a strong thing, but it only lasts for 3, 4 weeks,(exept the tryhards, pro players) and the hype will cool down, now you have the gamers attention all over the world, use this
Hype is a strong force and you are correct that it tends to die out if you are a fleeting player. But do you really think that Ubisoft would go to E3 to reveal something of this magnitude and then do nothing more until it is released four months later? That would be the single worst marketing decision they could make.
Again, they didn’t set the release date at random, it has some real thought put behind it. E3 was the start and I have no doubt in my mind that we’ll be seeing more of the Wu Lin faction with regular intervals until October. Hype is a strong thing, maintaining it is an art.


It is summer time, one of the biggest potential for gaming time, because obviously younger players have summer holiday and can play a lot, players who are working, mostly have more freetime during the summer, your whole playerbase can play more Honor in summertime than in October, you need to build on this
So this is related to my first point. Not many games are released during the summer, why? Games don’t sell well during summer. Releasing now (or in August) would be a very bad thing for a profit-driven company.


Humans are not patient, you just showcased a lot from 2 of your new heroes, we want to play them now, not 4 months later, it is a long time in modern gaming, when players cannot use their new favourite, they will go to other games, and they will wont be as hyped in October as now
Humans are not patient? Please provide a source for this. Humans, because of our higher intellect and thus ability to reason with ourselves internally are only beaten in patience by reptiles.
“We want to play them now” – Yes, that is exactly the reaction the devs wanted when they decided to unveil this at E3. It is all going according to the plan set up by Ubisoft’s marketing department. Again, this is not random.


In the offical launch plan 4 heroes will join the battlefield at the same time, that is obviusly too much at one time, the players wont know which hero they should try first, because all of them are cool, gamers can’t focus to learn everything about one warrior, when you want to fight with the others too, 2 heroes on a launch would be perfect, as you did in the past effective
Four heroes are too much because people won’t be able to decide? That is a very moot point. I assume that many players, like me and those I regularly talk about about the game, have one or a few favourites. A main and a few subs as it is called. Some even like a particular kind of hero, the fast and agile assassins, the never-wrong vanguards, stout heavies or the much more loosely defined hybrids. I will dare to venture out on a limb here and claim that most people does not find all four Wu Lin heroes equally attractive (If you do, good for you). I for one know exactly who I will play first, and second, I also know full well which one I probably won’t play at all.
In the end, I believe you’re making a mountain out of a molehill here. If you want to try them all, do so. It’ll take you exactly four matches to go through them all. You can do that in an hour and move on with the ones you found interesting.
Heck, when you buy the base game you have an even bigger problem as three factions four heroes = twelve heroes are right there, staring you in the face. Who will you pick first?!
I think we can handle four.


If Ubisoft does not act to eliminate these problems For Honor can lose it’s chance to evolve and get a much bigger playerbase on each platform, the newcomers of the Free game wont stay long, most of them wants to play with the new heroes, than they realize they have to wait more than a quarter year
Yeah, none of these are problems, you just can’t see the plan in motion behind the curtains (Lacy, gently wafting curtains). You claim that the newcomers won’t stay because what they really want is to play the new heroes. I don’t think this makes much sense. Either these new people saw E3 and thought this would be a good time to get into the game, in which case they know that the Wu Lin will not be available until October. The other group of newcomers will have heard that the game was free and jumped in for whatever reason, there is no reason to expect that these people even know about the Wu Lin faction, and if they do they’ll also know that they won’t be available for a while.


Soltuion: if you can make the offical launch earlier before the other huge games come out do it, it is important. You have the E3 hype now, it will last only 3, 4 weeks maximum if the players know they have to wait until October, we hope that the Tiandi and the Shaolin are almost ready to launch, so you can launch them at the end of Season 6 as the Pre Marching Fire update, it is around middle of August, until that Ubisoft can figure out the Season Pass, and players will have plenty of time to buy it in order to get early acces to the premium content, this solution eliminates the second, third, fourth and fifth big problem that can cause serious damage to the game
Not a solution, only more problems. Last I heard both Tiandi and Shaolin were in their alpha state (or even pre-alpha) of development. This means that they’re sorely lacking, this might be balance issues, graphical or mechanical bugs, issues with input and execution, playing them and performing certain moves might even break the game. Remember what I told you earlier about there being a plan behind releasing in four months? This is part of it, making the new characters playable and at least sort of balanced against the rest of roster. This solution may eliminate your proposed “problems”, but would introduce some pretty big ones as well. One month isn’t enough time to get everything ready, remember, we don’t even have a release date for the next season pass yet.


You showcased basically most of the things about 2 brand new heroes, you have to understand, that players wont wait so long, they want it now
Tough ****. It’s not done.
Just because you’re hungry now doesn’t make the food ready, and you better wait if you don’t want salmonella.
This really is your only point with the whole thread, thinly veiled behind a long opening post – you’re impatient and you want the thing now. The way you’ve worded the whole thing shows that you either don’t realise or appreciate the amount of time and work that a release of this size requires. The devs have set a date in October, and this because it works with the market and with their schedule they should be done unless something goes catastrophically wrong. They will be done before release day, that is what they’ve planned, because that means that they won’t have to cram (if you do know game development you’ll know why this is to be avoided at all cost). The long and the short of it is that game development takes time, and the more you want to do the longer it takes, this is a substantial update and they’re releasing it all at once because that is what the developers want to do, that is their vision for this next step in For Honor’s life.
To be honest, demanding that this request is sent to the high levels of game development is literally telling the devs that their work, their plans, their schedule (and with that their lives) aren’t as important as you getting what you want. I can’t see it as anything else than an insult that you want to have hurled right at the top of the dev team.


Yeah, I highly doubt they're going to release the heroes early.
Yer darn tootin’ right about that, my boy.


He's totaly right
I think they have the caracters movement so
If they want they can realese them earlier and it can save the game.
Save the game from what exactly? We haven’t had a good “this game is dead”-thread sourcing stats from steam in here for a while now. Yes, they have the characters movements (and by which I take it you mean move sets) but they are still in the alpha stage, they are not ready to be released. This should really mean something seeing how people proclaimed this game to still be in beta for several months after release.


you dont like when hundreds of players have other opinion than you? All my friends, my community and thousands of others are impatient for the new content but in a good way, not in a childish way, And For Honor needs more players, especially on PC, and for a bigger playerbase Ubisoft have to use the hype, which was built, on the summer we will have some surprises they said it (reworks, some tweaked game modes, dance of death) and maybe a surprise new characters.
Argumentum ad populum or the majority fallacy states that a proposition is claimed to be true or good solely because a majority or many people believe it to be so. This is of course false because there is no correlation between somethings truthfulness and the number of people who agree to it. In short – many people can be wrong. Your argument should be able to stand on its own if it is a good one.
Also, the hype is not over as I’ve written earlier. Successful hype is not generated all at once and then not maintained.


what ever new games come out which I will get, I will always hop onto for honor, for honor has a place in my heart :o and I might love another game but will alway come back.
Exactly my point from earlier. Good to hear that you enjoy this game so much. For me, Good old Mount&Blade will always be the first one I install after getting a new computer.


And one more thing, do you think it is possible that I ask every Honor player on the world before I say, it will be good for the game, and lots of players agree with it? That is ridiculus and hard to do.
Of course it is not possible to ask every player of a game with this many players. Keep in mind that only a fraction of players frequent this forum, the crowd on reddit is even larger and even then I can’t say that it is likely that everyone who plays the game is a member there. However, if you do want to claim to speak for the community at large you must first make sure that your views are actually shared by at least a sizeable chunk of said community. The least you could do would be to start a thread with a poll saying “I want this game released earlier, who’s with me?” and see if you get more people with you than against you.


I don't mind waiting, hell i've been waiting the Breach mode ever since i installed lol. But newcomer's hype might be long gone before the DLC drops.

Still i'd rather they take their sweet time, this is propably their last shot at making this game big and a broken update would pretty much seal the deal for it.
I agree fully. Newcomers hype will be long dead by the time this release hits. However, there is no way we can state that all of the newcomers would stay if the release came earlier either. I imagine that many people see this as an opportunity to really test the game. Free weekends are great and all, but if you aren’t free (much) that particular weekend it doesn’t mean much. With this you can grab the starter set, then play when you want. You can sample some of it now, some next month, some next year if you want.
Broken updates are always bad, but I don’t think we’re quite in “sealing the deal”-space just yet. The same kind of rhetoric has circulated before. When new heroes were released, when we made the switch to servers, when ranked mode came… This game is actually doing quite well and I think that the dedicated players that are still sticking around (such as yourself, waiting for siege mode all this time) will still find the game fun even if the release of all this new stuff doesn’t go perfectly.


It is true that game would have benefitted more from an earlier release than October which is just too far away, simply because that is how human psychology works.
You’ll have to take that up with Piaget, the 18+ playerbase that this game it marketed toward should’ve outgrown that way of thinking in favour of longer wait – bigger payoff.


And I think the over reaction from candle and valkris is unwarranted. They are both die hard fans like the many rest of us here on forums who still tag along regardless of the problems game have, and using our own commitment to the game as a benchmark for the general playerbase game could have reached is simply silly.
While I do agree that one cannot use a veteran’s commitment as a baseline for the whole community, I cannot see that either of them has done so. They have pointed out that their own patience is stronger than what the OP suggests is true for the whole community. In fact, Vakris is arguing your very point quite adamantly. Also, the way this is written makes it read as if you’re trying to dismiss Candle’s and Vakris’s arguments because they are themselves extreme cases. I don’t know if this was intended or not, but I cannot see their stance of “Not everyone is that impatient” as unreasonably extreme.


Of course earlier release can not be done, they are just not ready, but E3 had a set date and they had to announce at that date regardless of when it will actually be released. I don't think they will even be really ready by October, and I am sure it will be released in a almost or literally beta state for the new stuff. Dev team here is notorious for how slow they work, and my worry is old stuff that is forced to be released broken almost never gets to be fixed. We still have several beta state game mods in the game.
I touched upon this point earlier, but I agree with much of this. This update cannot be released earlier than expected because of the amount of work that needs to be done. I do, however, believe that this update should come out on time as both Roman and Eric have talked about how long they’ve planned the Wu Lin faction. Perhaps there have been someone working on this ever since release and now they only need to finalise it?


While I cannot comment on everyone's personal feelings and opinions, strictly speaking from business perspective, OP is completely right.
1. Some huge games are coming out at similar time
2. Kids having free time during summer and I personally don't like it, but they are large population when it comes to video games and spending real money for pay to win upgrades.
3. They are giving game for free right now and without update they will get nothing in return. Players who get free game will most likely stop playing by the time update gets out.
Great starting point. However, from a business perspective Ubisoft is doing everything right. I’ve already talked about the first two of your points, but the TL;DR is that games sell very badly in summer, which is why we get so many releases during autumn.
Giving the game away for free now is a good step to get new players into the actual game while they wait for all the shiny things they saw at E3. Someone who gets into it now will be at a good level of skill and understanding of game mechanics in four months when the new guys comes. Continual upkeep of the hype started at E3 (and actually having a pretty good game to begin with) is of course essential to keeping these new players interested.


Well, those are the issues that Ubisoft should have planned for. If they have worked harder, faster and smarter, they would be in a position to release the update earlier.
Yes, and had they worked even harder they could’ve released even sooner, and had they then worked harder still, the release would be even earlier. It doesn’t work like that. These people have a schedule, things to work on besides this and so on and so forth…


So 4 months from now, issue will not be do I still want to play this game. Issue will be time I have, since most grown-ups and actually kids as well, have a limited time for entertainment. For me, that is about 2 hours per day. Right now, there is not really many games I play and I have some spare time. However 4 months from now, things are going to change. There are many interesting games coming out and my gaming time is limited.
This has been a fact since video games first saw the light of day. Since then an industry as profit-driven as the gaming industry have put a lot of money into figuring out when to release games for maximum payback. I’ve already said this, but we see so many releases at specific times for a reason. These people have done their homework, this is what years of experience and research shows works. Even though people had less spare time when the games release they sell better if released at those times. When you play games doesn’t matter that much for the developers, when you buy them does.

NHLGoldenKnight
06-15-2018, 09:36 PM
Halvtand,

I couldn't not to notice how you are referring to new games and market for new games throughout your post. However, For Honor is not a new game. We are not getting For Honor 2 but just a larger update for which many players will not have to spend any money at all to enjoy it. So it is really hard to compare just a update with completely new games coming out from triple A studios. Sometimes opportunity lies when market is down. Ubisoft doesn't offer new For Honor game, it is hard to compete against completely new games which will actually generate real revenue, since you have to pay for them. So what is best time to capture market and increase customer base? Now, when competition is weak and you can "hook" someone into playing this game or at the end of year when dozens of new games are waiting for us?

The other point is time we have to wait for it. I understand that Ubi has professionals who work in finance and marketing but that doesn't mean everything they do makes sense. I work as marketing analyst for large hospitality company in Vegas and we deal with huge revenues and huge marketing budgets, on much higher level than Ubisoft as a whole company. So I have pretty good team of people and guess what? Mistakes happen. So from my business experience, their approach when it comes to new update is wrong. IMO, 4 months is too long to keep interest of new players when game has limited experience to offer. Dominion is cancerous and most new players will give up much quicker than 4 months.

Distributing free game right now ( without an update) achieves very little on a long term basic. If we were talking about 1 or maybe 2 weeks before update, it would be a huge PR move. But 4 months before the update? Not so much, most likely not many players will even get free game at this time. A lot of them could be returning players who also have nothing worth returning to, unless eager to try tribute mode.

Kryltic
06-15-2018, 10:45 PM
I'll happily wait 4 months for this content if, in the meantime, we get proper reworks for older characters (I'm looking at you Nobushi and you Peacekeeper) and a few new maps for Dominion and Tribute.

Edit: Oh and feat balancing/reworks. That's also another thing that will need doing before the new characters are released.

Vakris_One
06-15-2018, 11:23 PM
Halvtand,

I couldn't not to notice how you are referring to new games and market for new games throughout your post. However, For Honor is not a new game. We are not getting For Honor 2 but just a larger update for which many players will not have to spend any money at all to enjoy it. So it is really hard to compare just a update with completely new games coming out from triple A studios. Sometimes opportunity lies when market is down. Ubisoft doesn't offer new For Honor game, it is hard to compete against completely new games which will actually generate real revenue, since you have to pay for them. So what is best time to capture market and increase customer base? Now, when competition is weak and you can "hook" someone into playing this game or at the end of year when dozens of new games are waiting for us?

The other point is time we have to wait for it. I understand that Ubi has professionals who work in finance and marketing but that doesn't mean everything they do makes sense. I work as marketing analyst for large hospitality company in Vegas and we deal with huge revenues and huge marketing budgets, on much higher level than Ubisoft as a whole company. So I have pretty good team of people and guess what? Mistakes happen. So from my business experience, their approach when it comes to new update is wrong. IMO, 4 months is too long to keep interest of new players when game has limited experience to offer. Dominion is cancerous and most new players will give up much quicker than 4 months.

Distributing free game right now ( without an update) achieves very little on a long term basic. If we were talking about 1 or maybe 2 weeks before update, it would be a huge PR move. But 4 months before the update? Not so much, most likely not many players will even get free game at this time. A lot of them could be returning players who also have nothing worth returning to, unless eager to try tribute mode.
Well who's to say they won't have another free Starter Edition promotion 4 months from now? It's not like they've missed an opportunity by doing one now. They could easily offer another free Starter edition when Marching Fire launches depending on what their marketing data tells them. As for the argument that 4 months is too long, well there are a couple of flaws with it:

1) This game has managed to generate and keep the interest of a steadily growing player base through one of the worst possible starts that one could find in gaming's history. And yet the game is still kicking, still bringing new and returning players and still keeping old players playing. If players haven't lost interest in this game in over a year I very much doubt they are in any real danger of losing their player's interest in just a paltry 4 months.

2) There is no other game out like For Honor currently on the market. They have the market cornered in this type of genre because they are the first to create this type of game. New games may be coming out but none of them are a direct competitor to For Honor.

3) We don't know what content Ubisoft has planned for the summer so it's a bit presumptuous to assume that these 4 months will be filled with absolutely nothing. For one thing there are the reworks that many people have been eagerly waiting for.

Halvtand
06-15-2018, 11:31 PM
I couldn't not to notice how you are referring to new games and market for new games throughout your post. However, For Honor is not a new game. We are not getting For Honor 2 but just a larger update for which many players will not have to spend any money at all to enjoy it. So it is really hard to compare just a update with completely new games coming out from triple A studios. Sometimes opportunity lies when market is down. Ubisoft doesn't offer new For Honor game, it is hard to compete against completely new games which will actually generate real revenue, since you have to pay for them. So what is best time to capture market and increase customer base? Now, when competition is weak and you can "hook" someone into playing this game or at the end of year when dozens of new games are waiting for us?

One of the original "problems" was that October was a month full of new (game) releases. This is why i talk about it, as I have to argue against the OPs arguments. You are however correct in that this new update is not a full (game) release. It is however a huge update, an update so big that Ubisoft thought it fitting to reveal it at E3. This is not a simple patch, nor it is a smaller update as in year one where we got two new characters and a few maps. It is a big one, so the comparison is not entirely unfitting. I completely understand the point of your argument here, since nothing new is coming right now, this update would stand out and shine on its own for a while. However, as stated already, the content isn't done yet. No matter of forum arguing will change that fact. They literally cannot release it yet. August? I don't think so. The characters we've seen are in alpha or pre-alpha states of development. We have no idea exactly where they are or what needs to be done or even how many people they have working on this project. In short, we have no clue how much work is needed to make these new characters playable. The only thing we've been given is a teaser about them and a release date. This is all, yet people want to tell the dev team "you should've known people would want this now and so you should have it ready to release now" - No, nothing on E3 is ready for release now. E3 is all about teasing the crowd about upcoming games. Teasing. Knowing how things have gone in the past, some of the things won't even get released.


The other point is time we have to wait for it. I understand that Ubi has professionals who work in finance and marketing but that doesn't mean everything they do makes sense. I work as marketing analyst for large hospitality company in Vegas and we deal with huge revenues and huge marketing budgets, on much higher level than Ubisoft as a whole company. So I have pretty good team of people and guess what? Mistakes happen. So from my business experience, their approach when it comes to new update is wrong. IMO, 4 months is too long to keep interest of new players when game has limited experience to offer. Dominion is cancerous and most new players will give up much quicker than 4 months.
Your insight into the industry of market analysis, interesting and seemingly relevant as it may be, doesn’t really give us much. I do respect your professional opinion, I’m sure you wouldn’t throw something like that around for nothing, and as such I accept that you believe that four months is too long.
However, you’ve built your experience, and as such your frame of reference, in the hospitality business – not the gaming industry. I’m not trying to belittle your expertise here, but in what way are these industries similar enough for a statement such as yours to be entirely relevant? Both rely on market analysis, yes, but other than that ?
Sure, mistakes happen. Mistakes happen everywhere humans are involved and funny enough the most glaring mistakes seems to happen where many people are involved. The old saying about chefs and broth seems to be true. But as your insight builds upon experience gained in an entirely different area of commerce, what you see as a mistake might be just right.


Distributing free game right now ( without an update) achieves very little on a long term basic. If we were talking about 1 or maybe 2 weeks before update, it would be a huge PR move. But 4 months before the update? Not so much, most likely not many players will even get free game at this time. A lot of them could be returning players who also have nothing worth returning to, unless eager to try tribute mode.
I don’t know about this. Sure, this is one way of looking at it. Another might be to try and preserve some of the hype caused by the big reveal and getting a boost in players because of it. Those new players will see what the game is and might decide to stick around. If not, they have the game now and come October when everyone talks about how great the update for For honor is they can come back and buy all the season passes needed to play everything. It is of course also a PR-move to give away the game for free, even if it is only the starter edition. It might bring old players back as well, as they can now convince their friends to try the game. It’s for free forever after all.
This is, however, pure speculation. Neither of us has enough insight either into the gaming industry or into the future to really say if this is a good move or a bad move. All we can say is that it is a move. A game like For honor, which has been silent to the masses for a year apart from the odd story about how bad and unbalanced it is, needs a move right now. It needs to wiggle around and remind everyone that we’re still here, and still going, and making new ****.

Mia.Nora
06-16-2018, 04:52 AM
Ok, so outside of maybe my second point being a little tart, can you tell me where any of the rest of my post was factually wrong? Since the devs did say alpha state yesterday and people did say this game would die when season 2 was released on the same day as Injustice 2 and when Absolver came out and the game was in a worse state than it is now in both cases.


Can you please explain to me which part of my post was an overreaction Mia? I didn't like the OP's hyperbole and I did not agree with their tone of "I speak for the majority of players when I say this...". I wasn't aware that me simply stating my own personal opinion and putting forth some criticism is considered as an "overreaction". In most places that's called giving an opinion.

As per your statement here, "using our own commitment to the game as a benchmark for the general playerbase game could have reached is simply silly." - The OP did exactly what you just wrote. They used their own personal benchmark for what they want to happen and expressed it as if that's how the majority of the playerbase automatically feels. Why am I copping flack from you while the OP opened their thread like this? Seems a bit hypocritical of you.

Both of you were very harsh and personal in your first posts, it was clear that you both felt personally insulted with what OP said. My point is; if you put aside whatever you thought it implies on you as individuals of the community and just look at what he said in terms of business reality, his points all make sense.

We are already here, so what we think does not really matter at all, what matters is what the guy who is not here thinks, aka potential new player. So by using our own commitment as a baseline for 4 month wait not being a problem is pointless. If you can not see that I don't know how else to explain.

I don't think E3 announcement was aimed at the existing community all. And new players will either join now and be disappointed to find out that we are still 4 months away from the thing that got them hyped, or they will decide to wait but simply will forget by October their hype being dead. I already stated why it can't be pulled forward and yet why they had to make the announcement right now at E3. It is simply what it is; they were not ready for release, but had to make the announcement regardless due to E3 set date.

Also about the IJ2 during S2 comment; Do you seriously think for honor does not have a bad reputation and a population problem? All modes are empty except dominion, and even there I keep seeing same people again and again all the time. This has been the case for a long while. Something that almost never happens in any other online game I have, let alone the ones with AAA publishing and marketing budget behind them. Everyone I know reacts to for honor as "ah that ****ty unbalanced game with P2P?, you still play that?" For Honor's marketing attempts are not launching from a neutral ground, it is starting from a negative point and it is a climb uphill for getting new players who have heard nothing but bad things about for honor. And putting a 4 month delay between the hype they created at E3 and the actual access to it will obviously hinder some of the potential players they could have lured otherwise.

I guess in the end of the day I see for honor as an online game and benchmark it against other online games. Whereas you are happy to experience it within its own merit, willing to disregard its shortcomings compared to other games. This approach is something we will have to agree to disagree.

CandleInTheDark
06-16-2018, 08:38 AM
Both of you were very harsh and personal in your first posts, it was clear that you both felt personally insulted with what OP said. My point is; if you put aside whatever you thought it implies on you as individuals of the community and just look at what he said in terms of business reality, his points all make sense.

We are already here, so what we think does not really matter at all, what matters is what the guy who is not here thinks, aka potential new player. So by using our own commitment as a baseline for 4 month wait not being a problem is pointless. If you can not see that I don't know how else to explain.

I don't think E3 announcement was aimed at the existing community all. And new players will either join now and be disappointed to find out that we are still 4 months away from the thing that got them hyped, or they will decide to wait but simply will forget by October their hype being dead. I already stated why it can't be pulled forward and yet why they had to make the announcement right now at E3. It is simply what it is; they were not ready for release, but had to make the announcement regardless due to E3 set date.

Also about the IJ2 during S2 comment; Do you seriously think for honor does not have a bad reputation and a population problem? All modes are empty except dominion, and even there I keep seeing same people again and again all the time. This has been the case for a long while. Something that almost never happens in any other online game I have, let alone the ones with AAA publishing and marketing budget behind them. Everyone I know reacts to for honor as "ah that ****ty unbalanced game with P2P?, you still play that?" For Honor's marketing attempts are not launching from a neutral ground, it is starting from a negative point and it is a climb uphill for getting new players who have heard nothing but bad things about for honor. And putting a 4 month delay between the hype they created at E3 and the actual access to it will obviously hinder some of the potential players they could have lured otherwise.

I guess in the end of the day I see for honor as an online game and benchmark it against other online games. Whereas you are happy to experience it within its own merit, willing to disregard its shortcomings compared to other games. This approach is something we will have to agree to disagree.

Ok so first of all, as I have said before, maybe that second point in my first post was a little tart, here is the thing though, that wasn't because he said anything about the game, it is because he said basically that he speaks for me and for the vast majority of players. There is exactly one person that speaks for me and there is no one else that happens to be in my head, so when someone assumes that they do speak for me, especially over something daft like what if I can't choose between four new characters, they are going to be told otherwise, occasionally I am a little sharper than I might be depending on life in general, but that is the way it is, generally I try to be pretty chill.

Honestly, when it comes to E3, I don't think people expect to have anything announced for tomorrow, most of what is found there is anything up to a year away and even then it might not come to pass. The Division 2 was announced for March, Skull and Bones was announced last year for Fall with nothing more precise than that and they announced before this E3 that they were going to delay it because they wanted to make sure things were right. In comparison four months isn't that long.

As for the population, while it might all be in two or three games, I have moved platform recently, I have seen plenty of rep 0-10, I have grouped with others in this forum and have seen plenty 50-200, on PC at least which has been said to have the lowest population, I don't think the problem is as bad as some people make out. Of course we could always do with more but I have rarely come across the same name twice and when I have it has been in a single gaming session and they were people matched very early on in matchmaking making it likely the game considers them a strong match for me.

Further to that I have seen posts on reddit for over the last month, well before E3, from people saying they are coming back, either in posts asking the general state of things and changes since x season or posts like I saw last night, someone saying he dropped the game in beta and praising the devs for the turnaround they have made on the game as he had seven hours last night. Here is the thing, these people left for reasons, some of them may have been connections, others may have been for bugs and balance. In my opinion the worst thing Ubisoft could do in terms of retaining those players and any new they get from the sale and giveaway, and for, as you pointed out, their reputation, is for the first release to be in a barely finished state and, as a result, ridden with bugs or vastly not balanced. I consider that idea a worse threat to the health of the game and its player base than announcing that something will be in four months and delivering in four months. Personally I want those new heroes, I want to be in that faction and to rep them all up because they all sound interesting to me, but I also feel that if the devs say October then that is how long they need to put it out in a good state and therefore that is what is best for the game.

Kobi_Blade
06-16-2018, 12:46 PM
I disagree about E3 being for the new players, it was for the current player base (who have interest in the game).

New players couldn't care less and probably didn't even pay attention to the whole thing, until Ubisoft said "For Honor free to get", as I said before new players have more than enough content to keep them busy until the new expansion comes out.

It's not 4 heroes that are going to make a difference, when the new players have a way bigger roster to play with right now.

Meaning not only E3 was for the old players, but only the old players are impatient for it.

Vakris_One
06-16-2018, 02:31 PM
Both of you were very harsh and personal in your first posts, it was clear that you both felt personally insulted with what OP said. My point is; if you put aside whatever you thought it implies on you as individuals of the community and just look at what he said in terms of business reality, his points all make sense.

We are already here, so what we think does not really matter at all, what matters is what the guy who is not here thinks, aka potential new player. So by using our own commitment as a baseline for 4 month wait not being a problem is pointless. If you can not see that I don't know how else to explain.

I don't think E3 announcement was aimed at the existing community all. And new players will either join now and be disappointed to find out that we are still 4 months away from the thing that got them hyped, or they will decide to wait but simply will forget by October their hype being dead. I already stated why it can't be pulled forward and yet why they had to make the announcement right now at E3. It is simply what it is; they were not ready for release, but had to make the announcement regardless due to E3 set date.

Also about the IJ2 during S2 comment; Do you seriously think for honor does not have a bad reputation and a population problem? All modes are empty except dominion, and even there I keep seeing same people again and again all the time. This has been the case for a long while. Something that almost never happens in any other online game I have, let alone the ones with AAA publishing and marketing budget behind them. Everyone I know reacts to for honor as "ah that ****ty unbalanced game with P2P?, you still play that?" For Honor's marketing attempts are not launching from a neutral ground, it is starting from a negative point and it is a climb uphill for getting new players who have heard nothing but bad things about for honor. And putting a 4 month delay between the hype they created at E3 and the actual access to it will obviously hinder some of the potential players they could have lured otherwise.

I guess in the end of the day I see for honor as an online game and benchmark it against other online games. Whereas you are happy to experience it within its own merit, willing to disregard its shortcomings compared to other games. This approach is something we will have to agree to disagree.
Here's the thing Mia, I was being brutally honest in expressing what I thought of the OP's claim that he speaks for me because I don't like someone claiming that they can speak for me without even having asked my opinion. I think you'll agree that it's a little rude to start a thread off with the assumption that "I speak for you when I say this.", no? I wasn't biting into him for any other reason than to say, "no, you do not speak for me and please don't assume that you do." - I thought that should have been pretty clear to see to be honest.

Secondly, in terms of "business reality" his points still don't make sense. If they release this content early and in an unfinished state it will be a PR disaster for them that is ten times worse in terms of lost revenue and reputation than simply releasing it in 4 months time and naturally losing some players they already would have lost due to them drifting away to some other game anyway. I don't think you're correct about E3 being expressly aimed at new players. As a new player who never invested interest in For Honor before why would they even notice that some game they thought was old news or dead has a new update? They wouldn't. The only thing that was aimed expressly at appealing to new players was the free starter edition. The reveal of the update and the update itself was heavily biased towards existing players. What with a new faction, new heroes, updated graphics and the mother of all love letters to existing players: Siege Mode - a feature requested by the game's veteran community since day one. E3 was all about hyping up the existing player base and getting old players to come back to the game or getting their friends into the game for the first time. New players who get into the game now with the free starter edition have more than enough content to keep them busy for 4 months, realistically speaking they're not likely to plow through a year's worth of content in just 4 months. The first 2-3 months alone will be spent in mastering all the different combat mechanics and repping up 2-3 of their favourite characters.

As for your final statement/assumption about me: I'm not willing to disregard any of this game's shortcomings so please don't assume you know me when you clearly don't. Check my posting history if you wrongfully believe that I cut this game any kind of slack when it gets something wrong. I've criticised this game and it's developers on every single thing that I felt they did wrong but I am also not going to ignore the things they have done right because I'm not jaded or dishonest in that way. I criticise them on the things they do badly and give them credit where credit is due on a case by case basis.

At the end of the day Mia, you might want to make certain that you know the facts about a person's opinions before you make false assumptions about them and just go with it simply because it suits you better.

Alustar.
06-16-2018, 02:35 PM
I disagree about E3 being for the new players, it was for the current player base (who have interest in the game).

New players couldn't care less and probably didn't even pay attention to the whole thing, until Ubisoft said "For Honor free to get", as I said before new players have more than enough content to keep them busy until the new expansion comes out.

It's not 4 heroes that are going to make a difference, when the new players have a way bigger roster to play with right now.

Meaning not only E3 was for the old players, but only the old players are impatient for it.

This guy gets it. All you other lurkers agreeing with the OP are just spare tools in the shed.

Stop assuming you know what goes on in other players minds. You all make it sound like not only will NO new players even remember the news about the game, but that then even current players are going to start jumping ship just because they have to wait four months.

relosaoZ
06-16-2018, 03:10 PM
The choice to release the update along the other big AAA games
is for the game to remain alive.
for if they make it early , people will play it until october , and move on to the new release.

AzureSky.
06-16-2018, 04:20 PM
I think the fix would be releasing 2 of the 4 heros now and the 2 others at the launch time they already said.

Lord_Cherubi
06-16-2018, 07:48 PM
The choice to release the update along the other big AAA games
is for the game to remain alive.
for if they make it early , people will play it until october , and move on to the new release.

Agree, dropping it now would be a mistake. Another reason that has already been pointed out here is the fact that genre-wise, For Honor has zero competition. There's no game that offers this kind of experience and there won't be in October either, a lot of exciting releases coming out but no one is going to pick Battlefield if they want to play a multiplayer fighting game lol

Titanodragon
06-16-2018, 08:22 PM
Tell you right now this game is just turning into who can spam better on console. And there are too many good games comeing out later this year that this game will just put on the shelf.

Camemberto
06-19-2018, 10:18 AM
They have the change to FOR ONCE balance the characters before they come out, not release them totally OP and break the game in the process. And here you are, demanding them to release them earlier, because apparently "thousands" of people agree with your opinion. I dare to to open a poll.

Should the marching fire update drop sooner?

1. Hell no, I'd rather wait longer and have a properly balanced game by the time the new heroes come out. Remember Centurion? Now you get four of 'em. Fun times.
2. Gimme! Yum yum!

I double dare you Motherf*cker (please don't be offended by this, it's just a phrase and not to be taken personally :D)

SpaceJim12
06-19-2018, 11:37 AM
-Other AAA big games will launch at the exact same period, for instance: COD BO 4 October 12, Battlefield 5 October 19. and these are just the shooting games, lots of players will go for the total new games

Nope. For Honor have nothing in common with this game and most new games. So, I really doubt, that FH players will skip biggest update of the game for shooters. New players will come (I think) during Christmas Holidays with all sales ther in Steam and Uplay or PSN, Microsoft Store


E3 hype, attention will die out long before the Marching Fire update, gaming hype is a strong thing, but it only lasts for 3, 4 weeks,(exept the tryhards, pro players) and the hype will cool down, now you have the gamers attention all over the world, use this

Sure, but what is wrong here? Me, personaly, supposed to make a break with game for Crew 2, cause I waited it for years. But I'm (no doubt!) will return in season 7 and than in season 8.


Humans are not patient, you just showcased a lot from 2 of your new heroes, we want to play them now, not 4 months later, it is a long time in modern gaming, when players cannot use their new favourite, they will go to other games, and they will wont be as hyped in October as now


I have job and wife. And I have like 15-17 hours per week to play games. So I don't even need to be patient. I have Deus Ex Mankind Devided and Crew 2 that will keep me occupied until 16th of October.


And please let devs do it all right, no rush! I waited a year already forproper seige mode and deffenetly could wait 4 more months.

HeintaiJesus
06-19-2018, 02:38 PM
Text bellow might Content broken english. Sorry for that.

I'm not a "Big" For Honor Player, even thou I'm playing since Open-Beta.
I'm usually not often on the Boards, or have a high Level in FH, but I really love this game and I'm very passionate about it.
So here are my unasked Feelings about all this:



E3 hype, attention will die out long before the Marching Fire update, gaming hype is a strong thing, but it only lasts for 3, 4 weeks,(exept the tryhards, pro players) and the hype will cool down, now you have the gamers attention all over the world, use this

Aren't they using it? O.o
I assume there are already Gamers, that are playing the game because of the E3, since the Marching Fire Trailer brought For Honor back their Attention. If they like the game, they will Keep on playing, if they don't like it, they won't. I don't think the Marching Fire update would Change that.
Also: Many People didn't wanted to Play For Honor when it was released, because it was broken mess (at least I experienced it as that, which is why I abadoned the game after two weeks, still here I am). When they check the game know, they see a stable Community, working Servers, fixed bugs, rebalanced Heroes, new Content and so on. They gonna see a For Honor as a game worth to try, since it's a really good game now (in my Opinion).

ALSO:
Not only is For Honor hyped, it is free right now is (More or less) and all the PC Gamers can check the game. If they like what they see, they stay. They stay and they wait together with us.
After all, the Marching Fire is just an update. A Little part of a really good game that already exists.



It is summer time, one of the biggest potential for gaming time, because obviously younger players have summer holiday and can play a lot, players who are working, mostly have more freetime during the summer, your whole playerbase can play more Honor in summertime than in October, you need to build on this

Yup, and unlike Battlefield V, or CoD you can already Play For Honor. You don't have to wait for the whole game, it's already out, exept for an update with 4 Heroes and a Gamemode (simply spoken).



Humans are not patient, you just showcased a lot from 2 of your new heroes, we want to play them now, not 4 months later, it is a long time in modern gaming, when players cannot use their new favourite, they will go to other games, and they will wont be as hyped in October as now

I feel with you my fellow comrade-in-arms, I want the update as badly as everyone. But again: the same goes with EVERY other Game on the E3. Well actually with games in General. But I understand your aprehension.


In the offical launch plan 4 heroes will join the battlefield at the same time, that is obviusly too much at one time, the players wont know which hero they should try first, because all of them are cool, gamers can’t focus to learn everything about one warrior, when you want to fight with the others too, 2 heroes on a launch would be perfect, as you did in the past effective

Okay, I can understand your worries and your other points, but (and that might be wrong with that an will probably offend you/someone with that thought) I don't think you truly think that 4 heroes at once will be Problem. To me it appears like you just want to make your "Heroes-Prerelease-Suggestion" more valid. Don't want to offend you at any meaning, but to me it seems like so.


If Ubisoft does not act to eliminate these problems For Honor can lose it’s chance to evolve and get a much bigger playerbase on each platform, the newcomers of the Free game wont stay long, most of them wants to play with the new heroes, than they realize they have to wait more than a quarter year

Yup, and they have a whole game to discover in that time. It's not like For Honor doesn't have anything to offer besides the comming update. So they got a good, unique and GROWING game with free updates. That was the reasons I came back half a year ago, and yet I'm here.

Actually I came back after I coincidentally stumbled upon a Video about the Highlander and I was like: "Wow, he Looks cool, lets give the game another try."
Installed the game, trained a Little with the Highlander and went into a Duell. Got destroyed by a Lawbro. I was really impressed by the Lawbringers moveset and tried him out after the game. Oh look! New gamemodes! Wait a Sec.. Can't remember this map...

In the end I kept on playing for everything else BUT the Highlander.
Migh happen to other Players now.


After all For Honor ended up as a great game. The big update might just be a eyecatcher to non FH Players. Kinda:
"Hey guys! Remember this game noone talks about? Yeah, we were working on it."

For Honor at ist current state deserves to be called a good game. It deserves Attention.
Attention the E3 Trailer brought.

Thats my look at the things.
Might be wrong thou.

Also:
It seems like a lot of People are afraid that new For Honor Players who got hyped by the Marching Fire Trailer, will Abandon the game an never come back.
Guys, just because you haven't played For Honor for a few month, because the game didn't hook you, doesn't mean you will never come back.
I'm pretty sure there will be People who got hyped by the E3 Trailer, buyed the game and didn't got hooked/were disapointed.
Still, that doesn't mean they are gonna ignore FH from now on. When the marching fire update goes live, they have a valid reason to give FH another shot.
And who knows? Maybe they finaly find their destiny on the battlefield, wielding a sharp blade, seeking for honor and spamming their emotes.