PDA

View Full Version : 4.02 AI.......DON'T change em!!!



LEBillfish
12-11-2005, 10:27 PM
Without question the best AI I have ever seen. If I could get 3 people and myself to fly like the AI does now as a team all players online would QUIT!

The A.I. is outstanding now, only aspect I don't like are bombers instantly twitching their tails toward you to block your shots.....

However, fighter AI is awesome, stunning, enough can't be said. I have watched them team up and ping pong a pilot to oblivion....

Very well done 1c........absolutly amazing.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif

LEBillfish
12-11-2005, 10:27 PM
Without question the best AI I have ever seen. If I could get 3 people and myself to fly like the AI does now as a team all players online would QUIT!

The A.I. is outstanding now, only aspect I don't like are bombers instantly twitching their tails toward you to block your shots.....

However, fighter AI is awesome, stunning, enough can't be said. I have watched them team up and ping pong a pilot to oblivion....

Very well done 1c........absolutly amazing.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif

WWMaxGunz
12-11-2005, 10:56 PM
That's odd. I would expect a bomber to twitch the tail away from me to cut my path at
the maximum angle... and maybe drop alt in the process to turn quicker and spoil my aim.

Tail towards you, turning onto your path ahead... and giving his tailgunner a sweet
position to shoot from.

jds1978
12-12-2005, 05:27 AM
I'm with you, Billfish.

The AI is turning into something wicked. The first time i fired up 4.01 was like "UH-OH...all those old tricks i learned are now moot." The Ai works better as a team and has no problem dragging the fight down to the deck.
I've seen the AI pull some nasty D'n'B.

ElAurens
12-12-2005, 05:35 AM
Their evasion tactics are better, but after a while you notice that they do the same things, over and over. Predictable as ever. Better to be sure, but still predictable.

LEBillfish
12-12-2005, 06:26 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens:
Their evasion tactics are better, but after a while you notice that they do the same things, over and over. Predictable as ever. Better to be sure, but still predictable. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

True to a point, though they "seem" to vairy dependant upon the situation. The impressive part actually viciously saving your butt and how they attack the enemy in a coordinated fashion.

Sturm_Williger
12-12-2005, 06:39 AM
Predictable, maybe, but in a no-icons furball, you can get drag'n'bagged faster than you can curse.

Excellent improvement in AI IMHO. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Kuna15
12-12-2005, 07:32 AM
Gotta say I agree with @ LBF.
I play a lot offline (much more than online) and AI is by far the best of all FB versions.
I especially like new AI bnz style (played SBD campaign so I kinda know what I am talking about http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif).

The only complaint is that Ai is spiralling to ground when hit in wing(tip) to easy. It isn't a mortal damage yet AI is crashing.

Anyway if they fix that I think they are going to be closest to perfect than they ever were.

Kuna15
12-12-2005, 07:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sturm_Williger:
Predictable, maybe, but in a no-icons furball, you can get drag'n'bagged faster than you can curse.

Excellent improvement in AI IMHO. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agree 100%.
In no icons enviroment they are as dangerous as experienced human online (especially when they sneak up to you from rear http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif).

Tater-SW-
12-12-2005, 08:18 AM
I swear I see more bombers following their leader down if you kill him first though.

tater

Kuna15
12-12-2005, 08:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tater-SW-:
I swear I see more bombers following their leader down if you kill him first though.

tater </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

tbh I didn't noticed such tendency. Perhaps it exists but it isn't what happens in most cases.
I have made a track yesterday about attacking B-17 formation and I shot down leading bomber but the rest didn't followed.
bomber attacking track (http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/offline/402__kunabf109g_vs_4xb17.zip)

Or maybe doomed bomber needs to have a pilot (not to bail) in for other in formation to follow? Maybe that's it?
(I say this because aircrew bailed from doomed B-17 in my track almost immediatelly)

JtD
12-12-2005, 09:12 AM
I too have notived improvements with the AI but it is still far from perfect.

The other day a IJN career fight had me scramble against about 20 Wildcat plus a few SBD. My wingmen went for the bombers and I engaged the fighters in the A6M2. Had a 30 minutes fight against these 20 planes and shot down 13 of them. I was not impressed.

XyZspineZyX
12-12-2005, 09:25 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JtD:
I too have notived improvements with the AI but it is still far from perfect.

The other day a IJN career fight had me scramble against about 20 Wildcat plus a few SBD. My wingmen went for the bombers and I engaged the fighters in the A6M2. Had a 30 minutes fight against these 20 planes and shot down 13 of them. I was not impressed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If that is the case alter your campaign difficulty, I had done this before 4.02 (4.01 patch) & it was a friken nightmare, I changed back quick.

It will be interesting to see how dangerous the A/I is with a campaign difficulty setting of hard in 4.02.

Professor_06
12-12-2005, 09:32 AM
They are one of the best. Must be very very difficult to program but AI cant deflection shoot.If you are attacked from the rear you just turn until the AI disengages. The AI will not be able to get a good solution on a turning plane as the algorithm/ data for deflection shooting la off. Dead on if you are got going straight and level. If a wing man is killed the single will run away rather thn try to join the other flight. Plenty of room for improvement. Im glad to not see the AI doing 30 snap rolls in a400mph dive though like in 3.XX.

JtD
12-12-2005, 09:46 AM
You are probably right. Just checked the mission file and they weren't that experienced. One third each novice/regular/veteran. Guess I got all the not-veterans. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

But the point is they completely failed to exploit their 20vs1 numerical advantage. I would stay at 4500 meters, they would try to come up, stall and I'd kill them (well, this easy only until I ran out of cannon ammo). The other ones wouldn't bother to go the longer way to come back at 6000 meters. The death from above method has worked very well even before PF was released and it still does.

Popey109
12-12-2005, 10:18 AM
AI are better http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif but would like too see damaged AI run for home, and have priority too land. Also would like them to lose me in clouds : blink: the way padlock breaks if they inter clouds...it's already in the game http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

XyZspineZyX
12-12-2005, 11:06 AM
By altering campaign difficulty, you will get are marked improvement in enemy A/I. This will be demonstrated in their flying ability & gun accuracy. I once flew against FW190As in a Kursk WS fighter campaign (Campaign difficulty hard). Chasing FW190 low level, I am slightly high & astern. FW190 barrel roles over the top of me & I lose sight & real awarness of 190 location. Seconds later 1 burst & the screen goes black, FW190 1, player nil.
Another Time flying WS Hurricane in DOF campaign, I didnt even know about 109G2s until they zoom & boom my flight leader. I was then quite literally blown out of the sky & watched the other pair of G2s I didnt know about fly through the smoke & debris of the hurricane I was in.

Try campaign difficulty hard if you find the current batch of A/I easy, you will not regret it.
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Maraz_5SA
12-12-2005, 11:15 AM
Some days ago I had my a## saved by an AI wingman in a VOW2 mission. I had a Spit on my tail and called "wingman cover me" without trusting much in the effect of this call. Few seconds later the Spitfire (human player) was killed. A noticeable thing indeed!

With previous patch wingman would reply "OK I've got you covered" and a second later it was ME who was killed!

Maraz

vocatx
12-12-2005, 11:33 AM
I was doing some testing in a QMB yesterday and saw the AI actually using terrain features to try and lose me. I have never seen them do that before. I, too, believe that the AI has improved markedly in the last patch or two.

rr9
12-12-2005, 01:38 PM
If there's one thing about the AI they could change, this is my wish:

Currently (and it's been like this for quite a few versions) you often see an AI pilot chasing two enemy planes. The other plane is probably flying as #1's wing man. The problem is that many times the AI pilot keeps chasing plane #1 that is far away, when there's this other plane much closer. The chase may continue for several minutes, plane distances staying about the same. Still the chasing plane doesn't understand that by switching target to this closer plane, he could easily shoot it down. After that maybe continue catching plane #1.

I don't mean that AI pilots should change targets all the time, but if they could somehow recognize this particular chase situation after a while, it would make their flying look much better.

hobnail
12-12-2005, 02:19 PM
AI will continue to be pants until it can hit me in a gentle banking turn.

ECV56_Rolf
12-12-2005, 02:47 PM
In some aspects AI is better, in others don't.

Receiving the message from the AI that I'am covered when my AI wingman is 2Km far away is wrong!

The AI do fire good deflection shots. At least in ace mode.

But somehow it does fight better against a human pilot than other AI.

This is so that an ace AI will try to evade me in every manner they can, but if an average AI is there they will fly much more calmly, not doing much effort to evade.

I use to try them flying 2 vs 2, the enemy AI on ACE and my wingman on average, and always avoid the frontal pass so to evaluate the doggy capabilities and not the chicken play.

Kuna15
12-12-2005, 03:13 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ECV56_Rolf:
The AI do fire good deflection shots. At least in ace mode. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is true. I get hit by really demanding deflection. On the other hand they can still miss from some fair easier chances but not like before... now i usually end up in dirt if I make a mistake vs ace AI (to allow them to send a burst towards me).

Bearcat99
12-13-2005, 05:53 PM
My complaints about the AI are few... I just wish AI in smoking planes would bail.... instead of flying around for up to 10 minutes after they have been set aflame.. or asmoke.. (Is there such a word? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif) and I also wish that friendly AI would respond to enemy AI who fly right across thier path above the horizon... consistently. But yeah.. this AI is still the best ther has been. I find that you get even better AI when you mix them up...... some Ace... mostly veteran... a few average.. and one or two rookies... it makes for an intewrsting match... much more tha setting them all to Ace..

I hoipe in BoB we can communicate with individual AI... that would be great.

WWMaxGunz
12-13-2005, 07:54 PM
BC, S! and remember that with limited damage graphics and I am sure smoke and flame graphios that
while you see a huge flame and smoke display, it may be a much smaller flame in the model.

Call it roundoff, it's always been there in sims. The more we see, the more we realize
the difference between sim and real.

EDIT: Added word graphics after 'smoke and flame'

JadehawkII
12-13-2005, 08:05 PM
They still need to fix the "Sleeping AI Pilots" Syndrome I reported several months back. I even showed a pic of one while flying the Go-229! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

mortoma
12-17-2005, 05:24 PM
I disagree with the notion the AI are really good now, despite what the original poster states. If they are so good why did I engage two ace level AI flying Hamps ( A6M3 Zero ) in my Gladiator and easily defeat both of them the other day?? If they would have been even half way competent human players I would have never got a sight on them and they would have easily taken me out. Case temporarily dismissed!! The jury will reconvene after more player experience the type of thing I just described. AI are not so hot after all.

mortoma
12-18-2005, 12:32 PM
Really, those Hamps should have never even let me behind their 6/9 line, let alone let me get crosshairs on them.

msalama
12-18-2005, 12:39 PM
Erm... maybe they didn't see you?

(Which BTW would be a huge AI improvement too)

LEBillfish
12-19-2005, 01:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by msalama:
Erm... maybe they didn't see you?

(Which BTW would be a huge AI improvement too) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That seems to actually be the case..........Just like the original poster I agree........AI is very realistic now. That doesn't mean they're all aces....It means they fly so human it's often hard to tell......

That is what makes the latest AI stunning. They're a giant leap from all other versions.

lowfighter
12-19-2005, 03:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEBillfish:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by msalama:
Erm... maybe they didn't see you?

(Which BTW would be a huge AI improvement too) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That seems to actually be the case..........Just like the original poster I agree........AI is very realistic now. That doesn't mean they're all aces....It means they fly so human it's often hard to tell......

That is what makes the latest AI stunning. They're a giant leap from all other versions. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I thought the 4.01 AI's were acting more human than in previous versions, and somehow 4.02 is a step back towards AI allmightiness. Not in all respects though, one thing already mentioned as positive is the better response of wingmen. It all depends on what one means by better AI, better AI= more competitive AI vs human virtual pilots
OR
better AI= more close to real WWII pilot behavior.
What is clear is that we virtual lads are flying a 'bit' differently from real life pilots, cause we don't have THAT fear, cause we don't have those physical sensations etc. So what is Oleg modeling, AI's to match our virtual skills? I would like to know!

muffinstomp
12-26-2005, 07:23 AM
Sorry guys,
I'm with the latest post.
AI in previous patch had some impossible failures (esp. in attacking designed ground targets) but in dogfights they are cheating like hell again.

Gosh, I'm not the best sniper out there, but I can't stand watching my squadron being clobbered through rocksteady barrels whilst my first shots throws off my aim ending in a useless overshoot.

Followed by the usual six-sticking of your former "victim" (acceleration galore).*sigh*

I think years of practicing should make you an ace in the contemporary environment.

Lacking challenge in individual AI evasion/attacking action could be countered by raising your ratio bar, i.e. flying outnumbered one to three. I would really love it.

My biggest worries since 4.02:

AI accelerates/decelerates in impossible moments
AI stands in the air (again!)- unreproducably
AI still uses flaps in notches that can't be set and are unhistorical anyway
AI again has never met any problems of used up WEP or overheat and engine cut-outs from negative G

Sorry, but especially AI controlled I-16s turn history upside down in early war campaigns and spoil the entire feel of the Il-2 series atm.

Thanks for Oleg's attemptions nevertheless,

muffinstomp

VW-IceFire
12-26-2005, 08:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by lowfighter:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEBillfish:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by msalama:
Erm... maybe they didn't see you?

(Which BTW would be a huge AI improvement too) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That seems to actually be the case..........Just like the original poster I agree........AI is very realistic now. That doesn't mean they're all aces....It means they fly so human it's often hard to tell......

That is what makes the latest AI stunning. They're a giant leap from all other versions. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I thought the 4.01 AI's were acting more human than in previous versions, and somehow 4.02 is a step back towards AI allmightiness. Not in all respects though, one thing already mentioned as positive is the better response of wingmen. It all depends on what one means by better AI, better AI= more competitive AI vs human virtual pilots
OR
better AI= more close to real WWII pilot behavior.
What is clear is that we virtual lads are flying a 'bit' differently from real life pilots, cause we don't have THAT fear, cause we don't have those physical sensations etc. So what is Oleg modeling, AI's to match our virtual skills? I would like to know! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
4.01m was definately more human than previous versions....BUT...they had an annoying habit of crashing after a few hits. They still behave like AI but its getting harder and harder to tell them apart from pilots online...the difference is of course that humans are incredibly inconsistent with some humans piloting very well and others being complete idiots http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The AI is borderline both http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

At least you can count on that.

lowfighter
12-26-2005, 09:57 AM
Icefire you would like that:
veteran AI pilots behave more like veteran WWII pilots
OR
veteran AI pilots behave more like veteran virtual pilots?

It's quite funny, these two wishes can never be satisfied at the same time! Perhaps you find a compromise though.
It's hard to say but I think if Oleg would go for the first variant, the game would become more and more boring. But still I like much more the first one. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

HansGruber1977
12-27-2005, 03:44 PM
Please change them, I would rather have realistic movement out of AI then more difficult ai that defy the laws of physics and can be easily spotted as AI.

SeaFireLIV
12-27-2005, 05:35 PM
*sigh* I find myself joining these `AI is bad and AI is good` arguments less and less. I look but can`t be bothered to post these days cos the situation is always the same. Someone will whine when something`s actually improved, even though previously they`d whine because of the lack of it!

For example the `AI let me shoot it down. Why?`

Because, as others have now pointed out, in the latest patch the AI has been made more blind from the rear and below, which is an excellent touch. Now it`s actually possible to kill an enemy AI plane with ANY plane in the game, just as could happen in reality. How quickly people forget that it wasn`t so long ago that people were complaining about the `all-seeing` AI and how a guy could never creep up on them.

Well now you can. Just one of the great improvements made to IL2`s latest Patch!

Also, no more `bat` moves from AI, it`s much easier to follow them through proper manouevers. It`s easier now, but only because we`ve been so used to doing acrobatics to keep with an enemy AI plane. er... they do, however sometimes force me to overshoot without cheating - Impressive.

Also, online, it can be easy to mistake an AI plane for a Human player plane. My Squad and I have made the error a few times now since 4.02m.

lowfighter
12-28-2005, 03:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
*sigh* I find myself joining these `AI is bad and AI is good` arguments less and less. I look but can`t be bothered to post these days cos the situation is always the same. Someone will whine when something`s actually improved, even though previously they`d whine because of the lack of it!

For example the `AI let me shoot it down. Why?`

Because, as others have now pointed out, in the latest patch the AI has been made more blind from the rear and below, which is an excellent touch. Now it`s actually possible to kill an enemy AI plane with ANY plane in the game, just as could happen in reality. How quickly people forget that it wasn`t so long ago that people were complaining about the `all-seeing` AI and how a guy could never creep up on them.

Well now you can. Just one of the great improvements made to IL2`s latest Patch!

Also, no more `bat` moves from AI, it`s much easier to follow them through proper manouevers. It`s easier now, but only because we`ve been so used to doing acrobatics to keep with an enemy AI plane. er... they do, however sometimes force me to overshoot without cheating - Impressive.

Also, online, it can be easy to mistake an AI plane for a Human player plane. My Squad and I have made the error a few times now since 4.02m. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Seefire the really nice examples of improvement you gave were actually introduced in 4.01 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

mortoma
12-31-2005, 08:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by msalama:
Erm... maybe they didn't see you?

(Which BTW would be a huge AI improvement too) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Erm....of course they saw me, they were in a dogfight with me and knew I was there!!!

How could they not know I was there when they took a few potshots at me??? They were both "Ace" level too and were trying to kill me but were not good enough to do so, even if I was in an aircraft with vastly worse handling. So much for this theory of the AI being so adept lately.
I was flying 4.02M too.

ZK-DABLIN
01-01-2006, 12:36 AM
I believe the differing views regarding the AI correspond to everybodys differing levels of flying and gunnery experience/ability.

It is true the AI can become quite predicatable at times; that cannot be denied but I it must be understood that as long as the AI is developed towards a limited set of analytical responses to any given situation they will always remain predictable and inevitibly inferior to any half decent human player.

Humans have the advantage of self-improvement through learning so over time become more proficient online combat pilots ; which in turn will give them a much broader perspective on good and bad enemy ability AI and not.

The AI though are pretty static and arent given this luxury to keep up with the human players progress through ability.

We are surprised now and again when new AI does something quite extroadinary but that is only relative to what it used to do and in any practical form most online players had been doing since day one.

As this simulation is developed the AI will continue to progress and become much more human like. In the end though, only a human player is capable of true self-improvement and who knows, you may find some human player quite ineffective until one moment he or she has some form of inspiration or enlightenment and identify a weakness in your ability and exploit it. That is something the AI cannot do, and may never do.

What I would like to see though is more customizable AI where they can be (semi) programmed to follow certain strategies or tactics depending on customizable radio calls etc.

An effective AI in my opinion would work more effectively if they can work in more unison with a human player as a wing man or team component. Their connection with a human player subject to all superior human ability (customisation included) would make online AI something to really be respectful of.

Either way, the AI is good enough to keep me in challenge so by my perspective at this time, they will suffice to keep me going as I continue to refine my abilities and learn new tactics.

Thanks Oleg and the Maddox Crew.

Grue_
01-06-2006, 04:14 AM
For me, immersion will be lacking until the enemy AI have the same blackout/flight model/visibility restrictions we have.

Friendly AI are mostly uncontrollable because we have no effective command system. If they see an enemy fighter they will just break formation and do their own thing, even if they are are carrying bombs or are on a bomber interception.

4.02 AI have improved tactically but these improvements are still eclipsed by the basic flaws.

SeaFireLIV
01-06-2006, 05:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Grue_:
For me, immersion will be lacking until the enemy AI have the same blackout/flight model/visibility restrictions we have.

Friendly AI are mostly uncontrollable because we have no effective command system. If they see an enemy fighter they will just break formation and do their own thing, even if they are are carrying bombs or are on a bomber interception.

. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

AI will not make manouevers that will cause them to black out though. They`ll always steer from that. Oleg posted this himself. They also have a limited visibility restriction (rear and behind, but obviously (or probably) not to the level you want - I mean Oleg would have to program head-swivel eye cone view as well as cockpit area. Maybe in his BOB.

As for the AI dropping bombs when you don`t want them to... There IS a command structure:

Order them to rejoin, using the TAB command, before enemy fighters appear. then the AI wingman will keep their bombs and NOT break until actually hit by enemy fighter gunfire, where they WILL take defnsive action. You`ll have to remember to order them to fight if you change your mind. Such is the responsibilities of command.

Sturm_Williger
01-06-2006, 05:36 AM
I think the AI often behave as RL pilots would have in WWII.

Example. You're in a heavy dogfight tangle with an AI plane. You strain every fibre of your being and you get him off your 6. He heads away, you sneak up on him and give him a good burst, thinking "Dumb AI, why doesn't he try to get away or jink."

But if it was RL, he might be hungover, unfit, flown too many ops ... and now he's exhausted from pulling all those G's. If it was real life, you too would perhaps be those things .. in which case his actions are perfectly understandable and both of you would have disengaged and gone home.

Instead, you're able to hunt him down mercilessly, while shaking your head at the "unrealistic" AI.

Personally I reckon the AI is now the best it's ever been http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Grue_
01-06-2006, 06:10 AM
SeaFire, I'll create a mission where an i16 passes close to the formation and give your Rejoin command a try. Thanks for the tip http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

DuxCorvan
01-06-2006, 12:50 PM
Sorry guys, but I've not seen any AI changes in the patch 'readme' file nor in any previous one, and it seems to me AI HAS NEVER CHANGED AT ALL.

I think it's all in your heads.

AI is still stupid as he** and still benefits from unrestricted awareness, Robocop sniping abilities, UFO superpowered FMs and tireless chasing.

AI is the same than in 4.01m, 3.xx, and 2.xx. In fact, AI is the same since FB v1.00: only changes in mission design, airfield taxiing routines and spreader formations -to avoid stupid crashes.

If you think AI is better now, is because flying and aiming are harder now for the human player. That makes harder to face the cheating 'ace' AI.

tomtheyak
01-06-2006, 01:13 PM
Gotta disagree with you there, Dux.

Been playing FB offline for years now. I only got online recently so I was an offline campaign addict for sometime, & I can without equivocation say that there has been definite modification to AI behaviour for the better in recent patches.

I have been cleverly BnZ'd by experienced AI, I have also been led into a false sense of victory by a slow turning Fw only to have his wingman sneak up whilst I wasn't paying attention, and yes tho there are still problems (target fixation, seeing thru cloud and inability to cope with wing damage to name a few) the restrictions facing AI programming are huge (computer programmes can't make arbitrary or irrational choices) and I think the AI is first rate.

Anyone remember CFS2? Gawd that was a turkey shoot; I've seen dead chickens fly more skillfully!

SeaFireLIV
01-06-2006, 07:30 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
Sorry guys, but I've not seen any AI changes in the patch 'readme' file nor in any previous one, and it seems to me AI HAS NEVER CHANGED AT ALL.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

hello, dux, long time no see. As much as I enjoy your jovial ways, you are completely wrong. Surely, you can`t be serious with that claim. I won`t go through some of the more obvious changes, but even if some of the more optimistic of us are wrong (like me maybe), no one can deny that there have been stark changes from 2.XX up to the present.