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View Full Version : Less reworks in season 6?



Cliff_001
04-05-2018, 06:08 PM
I don't know if they are just counting the three actual reworked heroes in season 5 as characters that have been reworked or if they included nobushi and highlander into that statement but I'm just going to say conq, kensei, and berserker have been the only reworks.

Now since they have said there will be less reworks this time I'm assuming that there will be only two heroes this time, and since the three main heroes that have been talked about a lot by the community and that are in need of a rework or a major balance pass are warden, valkyrie, and orochi I'm just speculating on what two of these three heroes needs it the most.

Now in my opinion I think valk and warden are in need of help more that orochi. Now I know probably I just triggered some people but orochi only needs some highlander like tweaking like making storm rush unblockable or something like that. While warden defiantly needs some new moves and valk needs some numbers adjusted and a light heavy light combo or something to make it easier to get into her sweep or shield bash mixups.

They have said that they are not planning on doing full characters reworks on everybody so the choices will start to get difficult on who they should rework and who they should give minor tweaks to or do more reworked.

Pirus_
04-05-2018, 06:22 PM
Valk just need some numbers, so it would not be even a rework, but a simple tweak.
Warden has two easy to perform unblockables (shoulder bash and top counter), yet few new moves/combos are needed.
Orochi and Shugoki are way more ahead in line to be reworked than others. Orochi has no opener, and no proper unblockable. His side lights are too slow and zephyr slash is too slow. Storm Rush should have option to cancel it a little more later, and Rip Tide should be cancelable. Also he needs soft feints as assasin.
Shugoki needs tons of shiet, cos he has nothing.

Cliff_001
04-05-2018, 07:03 PM
Valk just need some numbers, so it would not be even a rework, but a simple tweak.
Warden has two easy to perform unblockables (shoulder bash and top counter), yet few new moves/combos are needed.
Orochi and Shugoki are way more ahead in line to be reworked than others. Orochi has no opener, and no proper unblockable. His side lights are too slow and zephyr slash is too slow. Storm Rush should have option to cancel it a little more later, and Rip Tide should be cancelable. Also he needs soft feints as assasin.
Shugoki needs tons of shiet, cos he has nothing.
Vakl does need a light heavy combo, light light is too easily shut down and then it is really hard to get into her mixups. Warden does need new stuff, that crushing counter is a counter attack which means it can't be used on command and shoulder bash is so hard to initiate on someone so he does need something else than top light and zone to start a fight. Orochi is almost right he just needs one more thing imo like unblockable storm rush to provide pressure. Shugoki is still decent right now because of his armor and headbutt also his demons embrace is pretty good.

HazelrahFirefly
04-05-2018, 07:47 PM
I agree completely that it should be Valk and Warden.

Orochi only needs the following:
- Storm Rush direction selectable right before attack, akin to the Shaman's leap heavy.
- Light deflect guaranteed (it can be interrupted currently, though its usually only Shaman and Aramusha that manage this)
- Unblockables need to be affected by everything except blocking (hence the name), which would include counter crushing and deflecting.

Knight_Raime
04-06-2018, 12:48 AM
It entirely depends on what they mean by reworks. As bushi and highlander were considered along side the others as reworks till we got real close to season 5 then they were called balance passes.
And just because there are less reworks this time round doesn't mean they won't do some major balance passes on other heros like they did with bushi and HL.

imo the 2 most likely to be reworked would be rochi and warden. Both are extremely popular and considered poor by most of the community.
Valk is very underplayed. So i doubt she'd be reworked. She only really needs a new combo or 2 and some number tweaks.
Goki is the only other one I can see being reworked due to popularity. rest of the OG cast prob will just get number adjustments.

Tirik22x
04-06-2018, 12:51 AM
Centurion needs a health buff... his health pool is awful. Other than that, hes ok imo. Although his kit is pretty boring and could use a little love.

Cliff_001
04-06-2018, 01:24 AM
It entirely depends on what they mean by reworks. As bushi and highlander were considered along side the others as reworks till we got real close to season 5 then they were called balance passes.
And just because there are less reworks this time round doesn't mean they won't do some major balance passes on other heros like they did with bushi and HL.

imo the 2 most likely to be reworked would be rochi and warden. Both are extremely popular and considered poor by most of the community.
Valk is very underplayed. So i doubt she'd be reworked. She only really needs a new combo or 2 and some number tweaks.
Goki is the only other one I can see being reworked due to popularity. rest of the OG cast prob will just get number adjustments.
I don't think they really care too much about how popular the character is conq was never all to popular (not to the extent as valk) and they still reworked him. I'm would hope they would just go by who needs it the most. At the very least adjust some numbers on her.

Knight_Raime
04-06-2018, 01:33 AM
I don't think they really care too much about how popular the character is conq was never all to popular (not to the extent as valk) and they still reworked him. I'm would hope they would just go by who needs it the most. At the very least adjust some numbers on her.

Not this stream but last when they talked about reworks they said something along the lines of "won't be reworking all the hero's. Just the ones that need it the most."
By popularity i'm not exclusively referring to people loving the heros. I mean play time wise and discussion wise. Warden and orochi are probably the 2 most popular heros in that regard.
Conq, zerk, and kensei were all considered (until highlander came along) the worst heros in the game basically universally amongst the community. So while conq wasn't popular in regards to people liking him he was one of the most talked about heros.

Valk has always had a small fanbase and still does. Most people think that she's god awful. But she really isn't. and one of her major issues got fixed (blocking a dash gave a GB.) if she was slightly less punishable in some regards and she had another combo that let her have access to her sweep mix up she'd be perfectly fine.

Cliff_001
04-06-2018, 01:44 AM
Not this stream but last when they talked about reworks they said something along the lines of "won't be reworking all the hero's. Just the ones that need it the most."
By popularity i'm not exclusively referring to people loving the heros. I mean play time wise and discussion wise. Warden and orochi are probably the 2 most popular heros in that regard.
Conq, zerk, and kensei were all considered (until highlander came along) the worst heros in the game basically universally amongst the community. So while conq wasn't popular in regards to people liking him he was one of the most talked about heros.

Valk has always had a small fanbase and still does. Most people think that she's god awful. But she really isn't. and one of her major issues got fixed (blocking a dash gave a GB.) if she was slightly less punishable in some regards and she had another combo that let her have access to her sweep mix up she'd be perfectly fine.
I agree but that would constitute as a rework. She is the worst character in the game rn but not unusable and needs some sort of help no matter how popular she is. Imo orochi does not need any new moves he is almost perfect the way he is all he needs is something for his storm rush to make it more of a pressure tool.

Knight_Raime
04-06-2018, 02:00 AM
I agree but that would constitute as a rework. She is the worst character in the game rn but not unusable and needs some sort of help no matter how popular she is. Imo orochi does not need any new moves he is almost perfect the way he is all he needs is something for his storm rush to make it more of a pressure tool.

imo a new combo and better recovery isn't really a rework. (unless they use new animations. But they wouldn't need to.)
I would say goki is objectively the worst hero in the game.
I agree that orochi doesn't need much to be in a good place. imo warden doesn't either. but we just have to wait and see what the devs do.

Alustar.
04-06-2018, 02:11 AM
If they aren't giving reworks to the entire cast I'm just going to check out here, then. No excuse as to why they shouldn't be reworking the vanilla roster to compete with the DLC cast.

Knight_Raime
04-06-2018, 02:25 AM
If they aren't giving reworks to the entire cast I'm just going to check out here, then. No excuse as to why they shouldn't be reworking the vanilla roster to compete with the DLC cast.

It was never specified. We were told awhile ago when reworks were confirmed that they wanted to bump up the whole OG roster. Only recently did they mention not all heros would be reworked. But it was said so vaguely. I assume this means they won't rework heros they've already touched (so like some people want conq more flail based and less shield based) and DLC heros. Because almost everyone wants centurion rebuilt. And there is quite a lot of people asking for aramusha to be reworked.

And as I tried to elaborate in one of my earlier posts they've used reworks loosely term wise. bushi and highlander were mentioned as reworks along side the other 3 until they were basically ready to share details. Then they called those 2 "major balance passes." I've no doubt that every OG hero will at least get that. But I don't see every OG hero getting a kensei or conq treatement. Nor do I think that's really needed for the rest of the OG cast.

kanuzira
04-06-2018, 08:29 AM
What about LB, he has no openers and all you can really do is a staring contest if the other guys is just waiting. The pole stab and bash from neutral are borderline un-usable. Tho i agree other heroes need reworks i think the defenders should be reworked to. Shugo can only stand, look and trade. So for the sake of gameplay and makingbit fun to play against i would say the defenders ge some love to. Either way i hope all the heroes get what they deserve to make the game more fun.

Charmzzz
04-06-2018, 08:41 AM
I would be fine with a PK balance pass that only fixes her fcked up Chains and nerfed her Zone to 500ms. :D

Knight_Raime
04-06-2018, 10:24 AM
What about LB, he has no openers and all you can really do is a staring contest if the other guys is just waiting. The pole stab and bash from neutral are borderline un-usable. Tho i agree other heroes need reworks i think the defenders should be reworked to. Shugo can only stand, look and trade. So for the sake of gameplay and makingbit fun to play against i would say the defenders ge some love to. Either way i hope all the heroes get what they deserve to make the game more fun.

LB is sort of in a weird spot because block shove exists. and off of any parry he gets a light parry punish worth of reward at worst or an insta kill at best (impaling riposte.)
He's got some semi decent parry options and landing a heavy gives him shove which does give him some options in combo.

Issue for him though is how disjointed his kit overall is. combos are fairly restricted. Block on shove is too strong. Long arm is OP in team fights/ganks but basically useless in duels. etc.
I could see him being reworked as well. But I don't know if i'd place him above warden, orochi, or goki in regards to being demanded to be reworked the most.

Baturai
04-06-2018, 12:50 PM
Orochi main.
Storm Rush: Faster and increase Back leap distance. 1 more step further to make it cancelable at least 2 steps away from Opponent. Faire enough.. + hyperarmor.
Riptide: Like Kensei Top heavy. Soft Feintable. and increase the back leap distance. it pisses me off to get guard broken half way.
Orochi needs some Tracks or Range for his attacks. faster side lights
make side heavies Area heavy ( Track) or undodgeable.
Light Heavy Heavy combo should be included in the combo list.
Thats all.