PDA

View Full Version : Nobushi balance issues.



Trenk2009
03-27-2018, 10:56 AM
1- Her dodge recoverys are too long and her dodge them selves are too short. Period. The nerf was dumb. Nerfing the backward dodge capability was already enough. Nobushi can't use her dodged attacks to actually dodge anything so please reduce the dodge recovery times.

2- Her hidden stance stamina consume and stamina cooldown are too high. On a controller, utilizing the hidden stance properly is a freaking pain in the ***, between timing it to dodge anything, choosing direction of attack afterward, and not getting her out when not intended it just feels as a super hard to use move for how much it cost.

3- The hidden stance recovery cancel is too slow. DOesn't feel fluid at all.

4- The hidden stance mix up is too slow. Someone going for a light parry that gets feinted into hidden stance and followed up by another light shouldn't be able to react to it, cancel his parry attempt, and block the following light.

5- The blocking retreat not giving Nobushi I-frames is dumb since it basically can't be used to disengage from an harrasing enemy. Most of them will simply still hit you with the next attack of their chains.


I think Nobushi would go out from the B tier if, first, her dodged attacks were actual dodged attacks, and 2nd, her full kit was useful enough. Also, I feel as tho her soft feint capability being almost inexistant is quite a bummer when we look at how she looks. She could really "dance" with and around her weapon. For instance, being able to soft feint a side winder by turning it around in the other side just like Highlander can would be a great addition Givign her longer dodges and follow up timings would also be super great to play with attack timings, which is overall a really deep mecanic.

Knight_Raime
03-27-2018, 11:29 AM
From what i've heard the dodge nerf didn't effect her hugely. unless you're referring to how she performs in 4v4. Her dodging is less about actual dodging and more about canceling her moves. she's got good constant range. If that fails she uses hidden stance to "dodge."

Hidden stance is a super powerful tool. I can understand why they're hesitant to cheapen the cost. Perhaps they can just get rid of the auto 4 seconds of time before her stamina starts to regen once she's left HS. and/or let her gain stamina while being in HS. Recovery I can't speak on.

If you're using HS feint to react to a light you should be HS feinting a heavy. it for whatever reason gives you better time to avoid an attack. HS a light is less about baiting a parry attempt and more about mixing up. I've seen good nobushi use the block retreat just for spacing. and if the enemy tries to persue in any fashion vipers retreat.

BTTrinity
03-27-2018, 01:45 PM
Honestly, if her dodge attacks were actually dodge attacks, shed probably be perfect imo. I dont understand why Kensei (a vanguard) gets better dodge attacks, that he can delay to make a full 180 jump to your opponents back-side, and cant be interrupted lol.

5 is also a huge issue, you cant use swift retreat on half the classes cuz of it.

HS is powerful, so I do understand it having the drawbacks it does, but if they do wanna give it another buff... I agree with raime, to remove the regeneration delay and let her regen stamina in HS.

the first hit of her zone could probably go back up to 25 damage from 20 (It was op, but to make a 600ms attack hit as hard as Orochi's 500ms is... not good)

xAnaToMx
03-27-2018, 02:33 PM
ok, let her recover stamina faster, nerf her super fast attacks.

Knight_Raime
03-27-2018, 02:35 PM
ok, let her recover stamina faster, nerf her super fast attacks.

Nobushi has no super fast attacks. all are 600ms and above.

BTTrinity
03-27-2018, 02:40 PM
ok, let her recover stamina faster, nerf her super fast attacks.

What in her kit is "Super fast" the fastest move in her kit ( her lights ) are easily telegraphed and 500-600 ms (Average, or slower) than everyone elses.

Anyway, since the most recent patch, even some of the most top tier players all share the same sentiment as we who talk about her on the forums. Her nerfs far overshadow her buffs.

Fun fact, that warlord you have a profile pic of... has faster attacks than Nobushi

Knight_Raime
03-27-2018, 02:44 PM
What in her kit is "Super fast" the fastest move in her kit ( her lights ) are easily telegraphed and 500-600 ms (Average, or slower) than everyone elses.

Anyway, since the most recent patch, even some of the most top tier players all share the same sentiment as we who talk about her on the forums. Her nerfs far overshadow her buffs.

Fun fact, that warlord you have a profile pic of... has faster attacks than Nobushi

I sort of think that was the intention. They were not really looking to major buff her performance.
She was basically fine as a duelist. but the kick buff and the retreat being chainable are situationally good. (the former more than the latter but still.)

I think their main goal was literally just to reign in her 4v4 performance without nerfing her into the ground for 1v1. imo the only change she needs is with HS. She's probably the purist hero in the cast imo.

BTTrinity
03-27-2018, 02:51 PM
I sort of think that was the intention. They were not really looking to major buff her performance.
She was basically fine as a duelist. but the kick buff and the retreat being chainable are situationally good. (the former more than the latter but still.)

I think their main goal was literally just to reign in her 4v4 performance without nerfing her into the ground for 1v1. imo the only change she needs is with HS. She's probably the purist hero in the cast imo.

I already make due with hidden stance fairly well, I can live with or without a buff to that. Most Nobushi players I've talked to about this all commonly agree (I've even talked to some higher tier players like Mr.Medium) that the her dodge attacks just arent worth using against more often than not. You really only get away with it by abusing "Unlock" or if you're opponent is just completely unaware.

Knight_Raime
03-27-2018, 02:55 PM
I already make due with hidden stance fairly well, I can live with or without a buff to that. Most Nobushi players I've talked to about this all commonly agree (I've even talked to some higher tier players like Mr.Medium) that the her dodge attacks just arent worth using against more often than not. You really only get away with it by abusing "Unlock" or if you're opponent is just completely unaware.

Mr medium finds her dodge attacks useless? surprising. He seems to make great used of them in the videos i've seen.
Would you happen to have a link of him saying something like that?

BTTrinity
03-27-2018, 02:58 PM
Mr medium finds her dodge attacks useless? surprising. He seems to make great used of them in the videos i've seen.
Would you happen to have a link of him saying something like that?

Ill try to find one when I have decent internet speed (Not at home rn) it was during one of his streams where he talked about it, didnt necessarily call them useless but said something along the lines of them not being worth using if you're opponent is patient. Someone who gets overwhelmed easily, will fall victim to her dodge attacks very often.

Knight_Raime
03-27-2018, 02:59 PM
Ill try to find one when I have decent internet speed (Not at home rn) it was during one of his streams where he talked about it, didnt necessarily call them useless but said something along the lines of them not being worth using if you're opponent is patient. Someone who gets overwhelmed easily, will fall victim to her dodge attacks very often.

Oh well yeah. If you fight someone as bushi who really doesn't take risks she struggles.
Appreciate that. I just discovered him a few days ago and he's re lit the fire in me to try and use her again.

BTTrinity
03-27-2018, 03:02 PM
Oh well yeah. If you fight someone as bushi who really doesn't take risks she struggles.
Appreciate that. I just discovered him a few days ago and he's re lit the fire in me to try and use her again.

Same, dude is my 150% inspiration to be a great Nobushi and is the reason Ill come back to play her... All to realize, IM NOT THAT GOOD D:

Kryltic
03-27-2018, 06:54 PM
Hidden Stance costs/penalties need reducing. Allow her to regen stamina in HS or shorten the delay and slightly lower the cost to enter HS.