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RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 05:53 PM
Everybodyís mad now that Kensei actually has a superior dodge. When every other character has superior guard break abilities. Quit messaging me after fights.

UbiJurassic
03-17-2018, 06:29 PM
A lot of the frustration with Kensei likely stems from the influx of players playing him after his rework. While Kensei is certainly strong, players are likely still figuring out the best ways to deal with Kensei when playing their favorite heroes.

That said, hate mail tends to happen. I once got hate mail after a duel...and I was the one who lost. :confused:

If the messages become too much, be sure to report them for harassment and send any evidence along to the support team. (support.ubi.com)

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 07:17 PM
A lot of the frustration with Kensei likely stems from the influx of players playing him after his rework. While Kensei is certainly strong, players are likely still figuring out the best ways to deal with Kensei when playing their favorite heroes.

That said, hate mail tends to happen. I once got hate mail after a duel...and I was the one who lost. :confused:

If the messages become too much, be sure to report them for harassment and send any evidence along to the support team. (support.ubi.com)

Same thing happened to me last night lol. Sore winners? I started playing the game a few weeks before the rework and with only him Iím level 5 level 5 kensei so Iím by no means a master but pretty damn competent against any character. I just find it funny players using other characters talk about nerfing kenseis one superior move. And for the messages i just had to throw that in there I got 3 last night haha

UbiJurassic
03-17-2018, 07:23 PM
Same thing happened to me last night lol. Sore winners? I started playing the game a few weeks before the rework and with only him I’m level 5 level 5 kensei so I’m by no means a master but pretty damn competent against any character. I just find it funny players using other characters talk about nerfing kenseis one superior move. And for the messages i just had to throw that in there I got 3 last night haha

Some people just can't humbly take their win. Į\_(ツ)_/Į

MumfordDaHound
03-17-2018, 07:30 PM
I'd say my frustration with Kensei is that he has no weakness. Fast AF with attacks, tons of mix ups, high damage, mobility, and worst of all HA...no idea why he needs HA... and his side dash should be a light so he thinks twice about spamming it. Keep it same speed but it should do light dmg with the risk of being punished for spam ability. HA on him is the worst part I think.

SEISMIS21
03-17-2018, 07:40 PM
I'd say my frustration with Kensei is that he has no weakness. Fast AF with attacks, tons of mix ups, high damage, mobility, and worst of all HA...no idea why he needs HA... and his side dash should be a light so he thinks twice about spamming it. Keep it same speed but it should do light dmg with the risk of being punished for spam ability. HA on him is the worst part I think.

Kensei has had HA since release. The only difference is they removed HA from his zone and instead gave him HA in his light finishers. Almost every attack in kenseis kit was slowed down during reworks, his lights all received reduced damage while his heavies remained the same except his first and second too heavy in a chain.

His dodge attacks were arguably better before the rework as they were light attacks and as such caused a light recovery. That meant in a multiplayer hank kensei could dodge attack while switching between opponents faster and more seamlessly.

If kensei didn't have HA on his finishers (all side heavy finishers had HA always only light finishers are different now) he would always be knocked out of any attack with a light. Especially when his kit is centered around soft feints, meaning much more delay from initial input to attack landing, he would never be able to use his soft feints.

I am a 41 Kensei and I put all of that except one before season 5. I think he is more viable at all tiers of play, and I think new players will be able to pick him up much easier now. However, he is absolutely low A tier nothing more. Which is fine with me. Just saying, his moves are so slow that if you can delay your responses a little and not over react you will never have issues with kensei.

MumfordDaHound
03-17-2018, 08:03 PM
Yeah, well a lot of characters have to deal being knocked around. I've been playing orochi and I'm always getting batted around. HA I can see for slow moving and slow swinging characters, kensei moves and attacks plenty fast. I've lost so many fights cause the other guy has HA and I don't, it comes down to that a lot. Maybe the lag comp thing will help defending with blocks/parry/deflect. I find HA my biggest issue fighting those types of characters. I'd think LB would have HA over kensei.

RenegadeTX2000
03-17-2018, 08:14 PM
A lot of the frustration with Kensei likely stems from the influx of players playing him after his rework. While Kensei is certainly strong, players are likely still figuring out the best ways to deal with Kensei when playing their favorite heroes.

That said, hate mail tends to happen. I once got hate mail after a duel...and I was the one who lost. :confused:

If the messages become too much, be sure to report them for harassment and send any evidence along to the support team. (support.ubi.com)

I just have an issue with your dodge attack. as a highlander main I really can't beat good kenseis that also know the highlander mu. I just gave up on the mu itself though and just pick conqueror to deal with you guys lol.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 08:25 PM
I just have an issue with your dodge attack. as a highlander main I really can't beat good kenseis that also know the highlander mu. I just gave up on the mu itself though and just pick conqueror to deal with you guys lol.


Highlander is stupid powerful with unblockables. Highlander is very predictable (like raider imo) but I know exactly how your gonna win either a 3 x heavy attack or in raiders case stamina drain run to the unblockable 3rd heavy. **** always gets me still. Nobody has disagreed with my point that kensei gb is Dog ***t comparative to any character but everybody complains about the heavy dash attack when kensei has superior dodge . It is what it is I guess . FIGHT!

RenegadeTX2000
03-17-2018, 08:36 PM
I only have the Kensei problem because Kensei nullifies Highlanders offensive form. Hard to dodge kensei's attack and plus he has massive range that can knock me out of the stance. and if i dodge his dodge attack, i can only punish with offensive light, he actually has enough time to dodge my kick or attack option after dodge. I only get a 10 damage punish if I actually dodge his dodge attack.

If I start in OF stance he outranges me and beats me to the punch.

If I pressure him he can nullify my options with a dodge attack.

If I try and bait his dodge attack he has enough time to go into his dodge animation and decide whether or not I followed through with my pursuit and he has the option to go through with dodge attack or not at all...

If I get the GB, i only get 15 damage off a light or go for 25 dmg zone that drains my stamina to the point he can pressure me before I'm able to be offensive again.

he has faster attacks and better zone in Neutral.

He nullifies my kick mix up with dodge attack completely.

I'm forced to fight in Defensive stance most of the time to where I become the worst character in the game by being in DEF stance.

It's a bad match up lol and there's a TON of Kenseis running around so I just CP with Conqueror just to end him.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 08:46 PM
I only have the Kensei problem because Kensei nullifies Highlanders offensive form. Hard to dodge kensei's attack and plus he has massive range that can knock me out of the stance. and if i dodge his dodge attack, i can only punish with offensive light, he actually has enough time to dodge my kick or attack option after dodge. I only get a 10 damage punish if I actually dodge his dodge attack.

If I start in OF stance he outranges me and beats me to the punch.

If I pressure him he can nullify my options with a dodge attack.

If I try and bait his dodge attack he has enough time to go into his dodge animation and decide whether or not I followed through with my pursuit and he has the option to go through with dodge attack or not at all...

If I get the GB, i only get 15 damage off a light or go for 25 dmg zone that drains my stamina to the point he can pressure me before I'm able to be offensive again.

he has faster attacks and better zone in Neutral.

He nullifies my kick mix up with dodge attack completely.

I'm forced to fight in Defensive stance most of the time to where I become the worst character in the game by being in DEF stance.

It's a bad match up lol and there's a TON of Kenseis running around so I just CP with Conqueror just to end him.




Sooo it sounds like your getting ranged up by the better sword fighter. Highlanders pressure is ridiculous if you donít dash and avoid GB

RenegadeTX2000
03-17-2018, 08:50 PM
Sooo it sounds like your getting ranged up by the better sword fighter. Highlanders pressure is ridiculous if you don’t dash and avoid GB

Highlanders pressure is nice but it's not free.

If you have anything 500ms or faster you can beat his mix ups, his mix ups only count if he lands heavy, crushing counter into kick mix up. If he lands a light in defense and offense and try and go for kick mix up, you can hit him out of his kick.

What makes Kensei difficult as well because even if we avoid we don't have time to follow up with a big punish, only OF light that won't give us that mix up and even if we did get the mix up going he can easily just dodge attack the mix up.

RenegadeTX2000
03-17-2018, 08:54 PM
If I were to take 1v1''s seriously or to go in on somebody, I'd choose PK as my main and 2nd main Conqeuror. lol

Arekonator
03-17-2018, 09:06 PM
Pretty sure kensei GB is same as everyone elses.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 09:19 PM
Pretty sure kensei GB is same as everyone elses.

Obviously. Defensively. But offensively only When your standing still directly in front of me. Which is not kensei most effective range.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 09:22 PM
GB is just not an effective Weapon or Defense in kenseis arsenal if your asking me

We.the.North
03-17-2018, 09:26 PM
A lot of the frustration with Kensei likely stems from the influx of players playing him after his rework. While Kensei is certainly strong, players are likely still figuring out the best ways to deal with Kensei when playing their favorite heroes.

That said, hate mail tends to happen. I once got hate mail after a duel...and I was the one who lost. :confused:

If the messages become too much, be sure to report them for harassment and send any evidence along to the support team. (support.ubi.com)


No, the biggest rage inducing thing in a video game is when the player is feeling cheated by the game itself. Regarding Kensei, there are 3 very weird things happening when fighting him as opposed to fighting another hero. Bear in mind, I play mostly Shinobi at rep 46.

#1 : The Zooming : Zooming is when the player feels he is out of range from his opponent attacks, but then the opponent starts gliding in the air and zooooooms to your character to connect the hit. This is extremely frustrating to a player and Kensei is the king of zooming attacks.

After zooming, everything else is Icing on the cake ... but the Zooming is why most players hate Kensei so much.

#2 : Best Dodge Attack in the game : The dodge property on Kensei Dodge attacks is nuts. It's not the superior block ... it's the fact the Kensei will do a wide circle that will actually dodge attacks.
Just try dodging an attack with Valkyrie dodge attacks ... you'll get hit most of the time even tho you perform a "dodge attack". Kensei is almost invulnerable during his dodge attack, it's just nuts. Add the fact it's counter intuitive to react to, stunlock well since it's a heavy attack and almost garantees the following light attack, while also allowing you to enter your mix up even after it's blocked because uninterruptible ... and then you have a move that's overly abused because it's that good. Oh ... and it ZOOOMMS enough to catch even assassins back dodging.

Now here is also a secret from a Shinobi player on why we hate the Kensei dodge attack even more ... it's out of synch with our backflip ranged guardbreak !!! Against most hero, whiffing a light attack on purpose to bait a dodge attack, performing a backflip and throwing the ranged Guardbreak works and will let you win the trade (if the dodge attack ever hits you) by a wide margin. But against Kensei, the ranged Guardbreak will whiff because the following light attack of the Kensei is that fast. As a result, that punish option is out the window ... but worst, since your used to using that punish option against other heroes with dodge attack, you'll trick yourself into using this and as usual against Kensei, the Shinobi player is now under the impression the game is cheating him.

#3 : Hyperarmor : On side heavy finisher. But add the zooming Kensei has and that move becomes ******ed too.

TL:DR : If you are a turtle super good at blocking, Kensei is annoying, but kindda fair still. But for players like me that pick Shinobi because we're good at guessing when to dodge and absolutly trash at blocking because of slow outdated computer and high input delay monitors ... then ya, Kensei becomes an absolute monster to fight against and quite unfair ... because hardware makes him hard to block and design makes him impossible to dodge, forget about punishing him.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 09:36 PM
No, the biggest rage inducing thing in a video game is when the player is feeling cheated by the game itself. Regarding Kensei, there are 3 very weird things happening when fighting him as opposed to fighting another hero. Bear in mind, I play mostly Shinobi at rep 46.

#1 : The Zooming : Zooming is when the player feels he is out of range from his opponent attacks, but then the opponent starts gliding in the air and zooooooms to your character to connect the hit. This is extremely frustrating to a player and Kensei is the king of zooming attacks.

After zooming, everything else is Icing on the cake ... but the Zooming is why most players hate Kensei so much.

#2 : Best Dodge Attack in the game : The dodge property on Kensei Dodge attacks is nuts. It's not the superior block ... it's the fact the Kensei will do a wide circle that will actually dodge attacks.
Just try dodging an attack with Valkyrie dodge attacks ... you'll get hit most of the time even tho you perform a "dodge attack". Kensei is almost invulnerable during his dodge attack, it's just nuts. Add the fact it's counter intuitive to react to, stunlock well since it's a heavy attack and almost garantees the following light attack, while also allowing you to enter your mix up even after it's blocked because uninterruptible ... and then you have a move that's overly abused because it's that good.

Now here is also a secret from a Shinobi player on why we hate the Kensei dodge attack even more ... it's out of synch with our backflip ranged guardbreak !!! Against most hero, whiffing a light attack on purpose to bait a dodge attack, performing a backflip and throwing the ranged Guardbreak works and will let you win the trade (if the dodge attack ever hits you) by a wide margin. But against Kensei, the ranged Guardbreak will whiff because the following light attack of the Kensei is that fast. As a result, that punish option is out the window ... but worst, since your used to using that punish option against other heroes with dodge attack, you'll trick yourself into using this and as usual against Kensei, the Shinobi player is now under the impression the game is cheating him.

#3 : Hyperarmor : On side heavy finisher. But add the zooming Kensei has and that move becomes ******ed too.

TL:DR : If you are a turtle super good at blocking, Kensei is annoying, but kindda fair still. But for players like me that pick Shinobi because we're good at guessing when to dodge and absolutly trash at blocking because of slow outdated computer and high input delay monitors ... then ya, Kensei becomes an absolute monster to fight against and quite unfair.

1 so your mad kensei uses his combos to get in range?

2 SUPERIOR DODGE


3 SUPERIOR DODGE. Kenseis combo heavys are slow. This dodge heavy is only way to get off two heavys fast with kensei

You canít go blow for blow with any buddy in any 1 style hence why kensei is so adaptable and can MIX THINGS UP.. sorry if i sound like an ******* itís just the way I talk and type I mean no disrespect and thank you for debating

Arekonator
03-17-2018, 09:47 PM
Obviously. Defensively. But offensively only When your standing still directly in front of me. Which is not kensei most effective range.
GB is just not an effective Weapon or Defense in kenseis arsenal if your asking me

I have to admit i am bit confused here. Ar you saying that his GB range is shorter than others or that it doesnt mesh well into his kit? Because meither of them are true.
Combination of grasping pounce and superior block means you can safely dash into any top attack and get a free GB with whatever followup you chose. And still be safe from most feints because you can CGB during the forward dodge.
Its pretty efective tool, while somewhat situational.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 09:58 PM
I have to admit i am bit confused here. Ar you saying that his GB range is shorter than others or that it doesnt mesh well into his kit? Because meither of them are true.
Combination of grasping pounce and superior block means you can safely dash into any top attack and get a free GB with whatever followup you chose. And still be safe from most feints because you can CGB during the forward dodge.
Its pretty efective tool, while somewhat situational.


Grasping pounce is forward dodge into GB nothing special. Pommel strike works only if they donít see it coming and has to be canceled from a top heavy opener which doesnít have great range either. And yeah honestly kensei gb is all of an inch long without Dodging forward and when you do ppl expect it block it and now your in close range with any character. Also itís superior block on dodge which you cannot change mid dodge so you have to guess right or left because top Anything isnít gonna land unless itís at the end or mid combo

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 10:06 PM
So Iíve been saying superior dodge this whole time and was wrong itís superior block dodge but what kensei does have is a dodge attack chain starters. Which means your getting caught up in combos.

Arekonator
03-17-2018, 10:07 PM
If you are certain the attack is commited, the superior block on forward dodge gives you free gb which can net you lot more than a parry would.
I have played kensei for fair bit, and his GB range is same as everyone else. Every character suffers from t-rex arms syndrome once in a while, its not specific to kensei.

bob333e
03-17-2018, 10:14 PM
The things I currently personally dislike in Kensei's rework:

- He can delay the heavy attack input during the side dodge
- If you block the first hit of his zone and he proceeds to cancel the zone, you have little to no window to exercise a counterattack or punish (debatable whether he should be punishable upon blocking the quick first hit of his zone)
- His zone hitbox is now ridiculous

Otherwise he feels pretty solid and he's pretty fun to challenge. And he's certainly the most bearable of the three reworks. I do like him. They only need to tone down the hitbox on his zone and to make it so that he has a tight window to input heavy attack during the side dodge.

RealNo1shooter
03-17-2018, 10:23 PM
If you are certain the attack is commited, the superior block on forward dodge gives you free gb which can net you lot more than a parry would.
I have played kensei for fair bit, and his GB range is same as everyone else. Every character suffers from t-rex arms syndrome once in a while, its not specific to kensei.

Iíll digress to the fact Iím probably just not good at GB on time then so Iíd rather keep range and not play that game. idk always is a pain in my *** if Iím not in the range I want. I think itís smarter to Dodge than GB somebody up close with kensei. Everybody attackís when I dodge sometimes twice kensei is adaptable against anybuddy but that gos down significantly up close if you stay there

RenegadeTX2000
03-18-2018, 02:48 AM
The things I currently personally dislike in Kensei's rework:

- He can delay the heavy attack input during the side dodge
- If you block the first hit of his zone and he proceeds to cancel the zone, you have little to no window to exercise a counterattack or punish (debatable whether he should be punishable upon blocking the quick first hit of his zone)
- His zone hitbox is now ridiculous

Otherwise he feels pretty solid and he's pretty fun to challenge. And he's certainly the most bearable of the three reworks. I do like him. They only need to tone down the hitbox on his zone and to make it so that he has a tight window to input heavy attack during the side dodge.

yeah i like the inputs stated here. If this was the case I'd actually use Highlander vs Kensei mains and not get a free win with conqueror.

Protos_88
03-18-2018, 09:20 AM
if that how rebalancing looks like now, waiting for shaman... just love what this game came. 0 skill

Protos_88
03-18-2018, 09:23 AM
ohh sorry ... u need to have skill when you play old character. ohh wait.... conection dont let you parry or block faint...

RealNo1shooter
03-18-2018, 07:05 PM
I think you guys are just getting dodged, countered and are not blocking the shots you need to.

mrmistark
03-18-2018, 08:36 PM
I only have the Kensei problem because Kensei nullifies Highlanders offensive form. Hard to dodge kensei's attack and plus he has massive range that can knock me out of the stance. and if i dodge his dodge attack, i can only punish with offensive light, he actually has enough time to dodge my kick or attack option after dodge. I only get a 10 damage punish if I actually dodge his dodge attack.

If I start in OF stance he outranges me and beats me to the punch.

If I pressure him he can nullify my options with a dodge attack.

If I try and bait his dodge attack he has enough time to go into his dodge animation and decide whether or not I followed through with my pursuit and he has the option to go through with dodge attack or not at all...

If I get the GB, i only get 15 damage off a light or go for 25 dmg zone that drains my stamina to the point he can pressure me before I'm able to be offensive again.

he has faster attacks and better zone in Neutral.

He nullifies my kick mix up with dodge attack completely.

I'm forced to fight in Defensive stance most of the time to where I become the worst character in the game by being in DEF stance.

It's a bad match up lol and there's a TON of Kenseis running around so I just CP with Conqueror just to end him.

I will respectfully disagree here for a few reasons. I am a Kensei main (rep 10) since beta and my secondary is HL (rep 7) so I understand the characters very well (though I actually hate the Kensei rework, mostly because I was Kensei master and now any fool can easily do all the mix-ups. Takes the fun out of it....anyways though).

Hereís some good pointers for you (I hope) for the match up.

The first two tips in regard to countering, which arenít just for HL strictly either, is learn to dodge all attacks later. Especially when in OS with HL, this is very important and his dodge in OS is incredibly good. This isnít against just Kensei either but rather any good mix up characters that have a lot of options such as shaman. The next thing is donít be afraid to throw out lights attacks upon attack start ups. This right here is a big one because most people stop and wait to try and respond to all of the mix ups instead of throwing out a light to interrupt the start up. For Kensei admittedly this doesnít apply as much except for when he goes into UB heavy finisher (which from a dodge attack he would be dumb not to as it forces a reaction), but is still a helpful when you train yourself to do this in applicable situations.

The second part is all about HL DF. The first thing that blew my mind here is your comment about DF. Honestly DF is highly underrated by almost everyone. Not only do heavies have HA but he has is counters which deal 30 damage. That being said forget about parties and go for the counters unless opponent is kind of close to OOS. The key here is to bait for counters into fast flow OS. If itís a dodge heavy Kensei, which with HL HA Iím sure he will be dodge attacking at least a bit, this makes a good bait. Train the Kensei to be wary of dodge attacking with these counters. It is also important to use your Celtic curse. Itís not an opener, but can dodge attacks when soft feinted and has HA. This is a good counter to many attacks and their options as the trade value typically is pretty good. It is also another ok bait for dodge attacks as you can delay the soft fient pretty long or fast flow if the Kensei doesnít do anything. Another good bait is whiffing a light attack. This does 2 things: baits an incoming attack for either a counter or chain into a HA heavy. Donít underestimate HL lights. They are slow but also are not exactly expected. Use these randomly when there seems to be a pause and youíll also interrupt a lot more start ups randomly than youíd expect and will also let you fast flow.

For HL OS stance, always fast flow if you can. With the added option for Celtic curse this is made a little easier. Any successful attack or wiffed allows you to fast flow so this isnít too hard. Staying into OS is the hard part. Thatís where the late dodges and lights really come into play. The other thing is light attacks right from fast flow, if close enough are almost guaranteed theyíre so quick. No one expects them either. Another thing is donít be afraid to go for Caber toss instead of kick. Caber toss catches almost everything mid attack honestly. Itís impressive how long in an attack it can grab. If youíre getting dodge attack spammed, UB into caber toss. This will catch Kensei before his animations go through. If he doesnít dodge attack and tries to parry itís the same thing. The problem is his dodge isnít ďpartĒ of the actually attack animation, thatís why so many people have difficulty with it. Donít be afraid to throw out light attacks when close in range and donít forget that his UB heavies can be chained. If you dodge an attack the kick works well, but again, if they start to dodge you can caber toss and catch them. I prefer just a strait heavy into caber if need be though as it uses less stamina and is about the same timing. Also using the emote while OS ends up getting a reaction out of the more jumpy players as if you feinted an attack.

Lastly donít be afraid to go back into DF as a hard feint into gb or light, or to counter attack.

I know most of this SOUNDS easier said than done so Iíll leave this vid here because this guy helped me become way better as HL and implements a lot of what Iím talking about in an easier to understand visual way.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=k8WXrfBgZYo

ArchDukeInstinct
03-18-2018, 09:25 PM
Everybody’s mad now that Kensei actually has a superior dodge. When every other character has superior guard break abilities. Quit messaging me after fights.

It's simple. Some people are just butt hurt that the reworked heroes aren't free wins for them in duels anymore. It's not some coincidence that there's huge tantrums all over this forum about every reworked character.

AkenoKobayashi
03-18-2018, 10:13 PM
Maybe if people stopped playing nothing but Assassins with light spam, they would do better against Kensei. Go for a light, and Kensei Swift Strikes and Hyper lights them. They cry because their meta is falling apart.

RenegadeTX2000
03-18-2018, 11:08 PM
I will respectfully disagree here for a few reasons. I am a Kensei main (rep 10) since beta and my secondary is HL (rep 7) so I understand the characters very well (though I actually hate the Kensei rework, mostly because I was Kensei master and now any fool can easily do all the mix-ups. Takes the fun out of it....anyways though).

Here’s some good pointers for you (I hope) for the match up.

The first two tips in regard to countering, which aren’t just for HL strictly either, is learn to dodge all attacks later. Especially when in OS with HL, this is very important and his dodge in OS is incredibly good. This isn’t against just Kensei either but rather any good mix up characters that have a lot of options such as shaman. The next thing is don’t be afraid to throw out lights attacks upon attack start ups. This right here is a big one because most people stop and wait to try and respond to all of the mix ups instead of throwing out a light to interrupt the start up. For Kensei admittedly this doesn’t apply as much except for when he goes into UB heavy finisher (which from a dodge attack he would be dumb not to as it forces a reaction), but is still a helpful when you train yourself to do this in applicable situations.

The second part is all about HL DF. The first thing that blew my mind here is your comment about DF. Honestly DF is highly underrated by almost everyone. Not only do heavies have HA but he has is counters which deal 30 damage. That being said forget about parties and go for the counters unless opponent is kind of close to OOS. The key here is to bait for counters into fast flow OS. If it’s a dodge heavy Kensei, which with HL HA I’m sure he will be dodge attacking at least a bit, this makes a good bait. Train the Kensei to be wary of dodge attacking with these counters. It is also important to use your Celtic curse. It’s not an opener, but can dodge attacks when soft feinted and has HA. This is a good counter to many attacks and their options as the trade value typically is pretty good. It is also another ok bait for dodge attacks as you can delay the soft fient pretty long or fast flow if the Kensei doesn’t do anything. Another good bait is whiffing a light attack. This does 2 things: baits an incoming attack for either a counter or chain into a HA heavy. Don’t underestimate HL lights. They are slow but also are not exactly expected. Use these randomly when there seems to be a pause and you’ll also interrupt a lot more start ups randomly than you’d expect and will also let you fast flow.

For HL OS stance, always fast flow if you can. With the added option for Celtic curse this is made a little easier. Any successful attack or wiffed allows you to fast flow so this isn’t too hard. Staying into OS is the hard part. That’s where the late dodges and lights really come into play. The other thing is light attacks right from fast flow, if close enough are almost guaranteed they’re so quick. No one expects them either. Another thing is don’t be afraid to go for Caber toss instead of kick. Caber toss catches almost everything mid attack honestly. It’s impressive how long in an attack it can grab. If you’re getting dodge attack spammed, UB into caber toss. This will catch Kensei before his animations go through. If he doesn’t dodge attack and tries to parry it’s the same thing. The problem is his dodge isn’t “part” of the actually attack animation, that’s why so many people have difficulty with it. Don’t be afraid to throw out light attacks when close in range and don’t forget that his UB heavies can be chained. If you dodge an attack the kick works well, but again, if they start to dodge you can caber toss and catch them. I prefer just a strait heavy into caber if need be though as it uses less stamina and is about the same timing. Also using the emote while OS ends up getting a reaction out of the more jumpy players as if you feinted an attack.

Lastly don’t be afraid to go back into DF as a hard feint into gb or light, or to counter attack.

I know most of this SOUNDS easier said than done so I’ll leave this vid here because this guy helped me become way better as HL and implements a lot of what I’m talking about in an easier to understand visual way.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=k8WXrfBgZYo

If you whiff a light you will get whiff punished by kensei zone attack.

If you try and use OF light to beat kensei light, highlanders OF light either randomly whiffs or you just get out ranged.

Kensei doesn't have to fall for baits since he can activate his actual dodge attack late into the dodge animation itself.

Celtic curse vs Kensei is extremely risky in general.

Highlanders Armor is slow on activation so you won't be able to actually use it on reaction and if you try and use it during a whiffed light, Kenseis zone will pop you out of it before your hyper armor actually activates.

Both Kensei and Berserker beat the breaks off of highlander. it's not worth the headache.

RenegadeTX2000
03-18-2018, 11:24 PM
It's simple. Some people are just butt hurt that the reworked heroes aren't free wins for them in duels anymore. It's not some coincidence that there's huge tantrums all over this forum about every reworked character.

This would have gotten to me 10 years ago, but I've learned. I just hop on the next best thing. I picked up Conqueror fast and haven't regretted it lol.

Kelson27
03-18-2018, 11:41 PM
This would have gotten to me 10 years ago, but I've learned. I just hop on the next best thing. I picked up Conqueror fast and haven't regretted it lol.

If you canít beat em join em eh? Might do the same thing... Iíd people canít find a can opener... become the can 😋

ArchDukeInstinct
03-19-2018, 12:43 AM
This would have gotten to me 10 years ago, but I've learned. I just hop on the next best thing. I picked up Conqueror fast and haven't regretted it lol.

So you only use characters that you perceive to be at an advantage. That's extremely sad.

Knight_Raime
03-19-2018, 12:52 AM
I'd say my frustration with Kensei is that he has no weakness. Fast AF with attacks, tons of mix ups, high damage, mobility, and worst of all HA...no idea why he needs HA... and his side dash should be a light so he thinks twice about spamming it. Keep it same speed but it should do light dmg with the risk of being punished for spam ability. HA on him is the worst part I think.

1) Kensei does have a weakness. Any hero with 500-600ms can dodge on reaction to the top heavy neutral and avoid anything that he soft cancels into and punish him. Sans 600ms. They can't avoid the light soft cancel.

2) Kensei has always had HA on some attacks. They gave armor to his light finisher. Which isn't used too often and the trade in itself is not worth it damage wise in most situations.

RenegadeTX2000
03-19-2018, 12:54 AM
So you only use characters that you perceive to be at an advantage. That's extremely sad.

It's actually not, and that comment you just made showed me you aren't really a competitive player...

Anybody that wants to win chooses any advantage they can possibly get. It's worse when there's actual $$ involved.

Tell me how it's extremely sad though. lol I'm listening

mrmistark
03-19-2018, 01:03 AM
If you whiff a light you will get whiff punished by kensei zone attack.

If you try and use OF light to beat kensei light, highlanders OF light either randomly whiffs or you just get out ranged.

Kensei doesn't have to fall for baits since he can activate his actual dodge attack late into the dodge animation itself.

Celtic curse vs Kensei is extremely risky in general.

Highlanders Armor is slow on activation so you won't be able to actually use it on reaction and if you try and use it during a whiffed light, Kenseis zone will pop you out of it before your hyper armor actually activates.

Both Kensei and Berserker beat the breaks off of highlander. it's not worth the headache.

If you wiff a light you can chain into HA heavy so even if you get hit by Kensei zone you trade much better.

You shouldnít try to beat a light with OS light on reaction, you should use the dodge into UB heavy or cancel into counter.

Kensei can delay the dodge attack in the dodge, this is true, but 1. If he commits to it itís easily punished and 2. Either if he commits or doesnít his dodge recovery and dodge attack delay start up arenít fast enough to stop the Caber toss.

Celtic curse against anyone is extreamly risky, thatís why I said use it as a counter attack when they are being aggressive and if he does nothing just flow into OS instead of committing.

HL heavies canít be used well on reaction, this you are correct, but in chain they are much faster. Try wording a light next time into a chained heavy. You assume that the enemy wonít try to punish you when they most likely will just through sheer forced muscle memory. If they donít go for the bait your heavy is still feintable.

HL is really strong against both Kensei and Berserker, you just canít rely so much on OS when dealing with quick and fast chains and feel out when applying that pressure is appropriate rather than forcing it.

RenegadeTX2000
03-19-2018, 01:10 AM
If you wiff a light you can chain into HA heavy so even if you get hit by Kensei zone you trade much better.

You shouldn’t try to beat a light with OS light on reaction, you should use the dodge into UB heavy or cancel into counter.

Kensei can delay the dodge attack in the dodge, this is true, but 1. If he commits to it it’s easily punished and 2. Either if he commits or doesn’t his dodge recovery and dodge attack delay start up aren’t fast enough to stop the Caber toss.

Celtic curse against anyone is extreamly risky, that’s why I said use it as a counter attack when they are being aggressive and if he does nothing just flow into OS instead of committing.

HL heavies can’t be used well on reaction, this you are correct, but in chain they are much faster. Try wording a light next time into a chained heavy. You assume that the enemy won’t try to punish you when they most likely will just through sheer forced muscle memory. If they don’t go for the bait your heavy is still feintable.

HL is really strong against both Kensei and Berserker, you just can’t rely so much on OS when dealing with quick and fast chains and feel out when applying that pressure is appropriate rather than forcing it.

Hyper armor isn't fast enough, you'll be beat out before it's active.

If you dodge his dodge attack in OF stance you actually don't have enough time to get a big punish, he can cancel his unblockable into another dodge attack before you can get your kick or unblockable off on him.

What platform you play on? I have some top Kensei players you could play against, I think it's a terrible match up. But you could prove me wrong.

or just show me gameplay of your HL vs Kensei.

mrmistark
03-19-2018, 02:08 AM
Hyper armor isn't fast enough, you'll be beat out before it's active.

If you dodge his dodge attack in OF stance you actually don't have enough time to get a big punish, he can cancel his unblockable into another dodge attack before you can get your kick or unblockable off on him.

What platform you play on? I have some top Kensei players you could play against, I think it's a terrible match up. But you could prove me wrong.

or just show me gameplay of your HL vs Kensei.

I donít think the UB cancel into dodge attack is fast enough against the Ub if you dodge and instantly heavy. Iíll have to test it again to be 100%.

I play on Xbox. In the middle of a move though so going to need a little bit longer before I can get my Xbox. Gamer tag is mistARTIK FOX but as soon as I get it back if you want to play just let me know.

The one thing I will say is donít ever try to parry his top heavy as HL as Kensei can cancel into side heavy and still parry your 1000ms top heavy and the HA will allow his side soft fient to unaffect your top heavy. Additionally your feint if you read the cancel is still too slow. Another reason why crushing counter is super important.

ArchDukeInstinct
03-19-2018, 02:57 AM
It's actually not, and that comment you just made showed me you aren't really a competitive player...

Anybody that wants to win chooses any advantage they can possibly get. It's worse when there's actual $$ involved.

Tell me how it's extremely sad though. lol I'm listening

Well duh, but I was obviously not talking about competitive level play because nobody in competitive level play would have been getting free wins off of pre-rework Kenseis/Berseker/Conqueror to begin with because they virtually didn't exist at that level, right?

Don't just say you're listening, actually listen. Thanks.

RenegadeTX2000
03-20-2018, 04:45 PM
Well duh, but I was obviously not talking about competitive level play because nobody in competitive level play would have been getting free wins off of pre-rework Kenseis/Berseker/Conqueror to begin with because they virtually didn't exist at that level, right?

Don't just say you're listening, actually listen. Thanks.

No, Tell me how it's sad lol.

ArchDukeInstinct
03-21-2018, 03:53 AM
No, Tell me how it's sad lol.

Yeah it's very sad in a pathetic/embarrassing way that someone would be so concerned about stroking their own ego that they pick characters for no other reason other than that they perceive the character as having an unfair advantage. The exception, again, being competitive play in a tournament for money, etc.

RenegadeTX2000
03-21-2018, 08:12 PM
Yeah it's very sad in a pathetic/embarrassing way that someone would be so concerned about stroking their own ego that they pick characters for no other reason other than that they perceive the character as having an unfair advantage. The exception, again, being competitive play in a tournament for money, etc.

I'm not concerned about stroking my own ego. I just pick what's gonna grant me advantage, so when the time comes for tournament play i'll have a good grasp on how to actually utilize that character to it's max potential.

I'm not an idiot to play a bad match up, lol... Stroking my own ego when I've actually won tournaments using my methods. Post your matches, I'm actually really curious on your playstyle and how good you actually are. You sound legit, but I believe that's as far as that goes. I have a feeling if I see your gameplay or your play in tournaments I'll be disappointed. I even type your name up on google and nothing comes up. Anything that I can type into google that will make you stand out?

Tournament entry, placings, anything of the sort... Doesn't have to be for honor, can be anything.

Kelson27
03-21-2018, 10:05 PM
Back on track from the one ups...


I think his dodge needs a fix. Most the rest of his kit seems fair to deal with so far but Iím seeing kensei players start to spam just the dodge now, getting a free pass and some major damage in. There was one player that basically just circled myself and another team mate with it and nothing got through, itís got such a wide arc and tracking that itís almost a zone. Wouldnít take hits, gb never works either... key word never. Havenít seen it. As an orochi usually if an assassin or raider goes for the dodge attack a zone could connect or a gb would stop them. Not the case with kensei.

Right now Iíd put it down as the most effective dodge attack in the game.

Protos_88
03-21-2018, 11:54 PM
i will say it agian.... devs need to learn what is f balance. its 1 game with so f bad suport what I play... bugs with sound animations disapire wepons on ps4, mass gb and christmas armor for poor characters... and more more and more....

Protos_88
03-22-2018, 12:10 AM
3month sound problem and disapire wepon on ps4...only ubisoft can do sth like that and dont repare it for so long.

Kryltic
03-22-2018, 12:46 AM
My concerns are just how far he can jump with his forward heavy. His ability to side dodge and automatically get a free light. And finally his hyper armour on his side feints. All three seems to be too much.

JadeBosson.
03-22-2018, 01:12 AM
I mean I don't hate it but it does catch me off guard to were I'm like >.>