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View Full Version : Revisiting the C tier, Valkyrie



lazerg20555
03-05-2018, 06:11 PM
I am not up to date whether or not Ubi has plans for my favorite spear chucking, shield bashing gal. In any case, I wanted to touch on what I think she needs in order for her to, in the very least, get out of C tier, it's such a shame that she's been down there for so long. Below are some ideas that I thought should be implemented in order for this character to be more in line with the others. Hopefully, they will be given some attention in Operation Health, Version: For Honor.


Potential fixes and change (tentative, preliminary ideas):

-New combo (RB, LB, RB)

-Damage buff or spear sweep now damages (similar to the buff raider received for his wall tackle)

-New attack animation, triggers when the enemy is knocked down, similar to centurion's Eagle's Fury, deals high damage.

-Decrease time for Shield Tackle to activate full-block stance.

This is all I think she needs, for now, please note that I have no intentions of seeing this character all the way up in S tier all of a sudden, so just take these suggestions for what they are--potential fixes.

DoodTheMan
03-05-2018, 08:43 PM
-New attack animation, triggers when the enemy is knocked down, similar to centurion's Eagle's Fury, deals high damage.
Plz

Dry.Fish
03-05-2018, 11:14 PM
They only really need to speed up her recovery frames, maybe buff her light attack's and make her riposte timing not so sensitive after a deflect. Personally I like her chains the way they are.
She can be dangerous in the right hands so buffing her too much could create a monster. The only hero's I have problems with are Glad, Kensei and Zerk but that could just be me though.

Kinda an after thought. Maybe speed her recovery with a dash attack like Nobushi. For some reason I want to do a forward dash attack after a missed shield bash.

EvoX.
03-05-2018, 11:28 PM
Devs said they will rework/rebalance all 12 OG heroes during Season 5, so they most definitely have plans for Valkyrie. She needs a serious buff or rework.

HazelrahFirefly
03-06-2018, 03:20 AM
Devs said they will rework/rebalance all 12 OG heroes during Season 5, so they most definitely have plans for Valkyrie. She needs a serious buff or rework.

Actually, they stated that the OG heroes will all get reworks.... not all in S5. We could be waiting a long, long time for 10 heroes to be worth playing again.

SphericalChip53
03-06-2018, 05:52 AM
Valk was one of my mains so I'll comment on these. I also play on console so that's going to affect my opinions as I adamantly believe console and PC needs separate balancing due to the frame difference (and other issues).



-New combo (RB, LB, RB)

I don't know what you mean by LB? As in the emote button on Xbox? Anyways I don't think Valk needs more combos as what she has now are pretty decent. The light-light-light and heavy-light combos are her bread and butter. Especially the lights because Valk's light spam on consoles is really bad, up there with Ara and Conq 2.0.



-Damage buff or spear sweep now damages (similar to the buff raider received for his wall tackle)

Spear sweep damage is unnecessary because it guarantees a top heavy that can further combo. And the damage there does not need to be buffed because the only spear sweep counter is a very tight dodge timing. And even though the moveset doesn't say it, the spear sweep animation is also uninterruptible, which makes it great for using it as a trade into the top heavy.



-New attack animation, triggers when the enemy is knocked down, similar to centurion's Eagle's Fury, deals high damage.

No. No. No. No....
And again, no. Like I said above, the spear sweep guarantees a top heavy, so ANOTHER animation right after is completely unnecessary, especially not for "high damage" or anything like Cent's jumping stab. I don't know if you missed this, but the community has agreed that that move was the cancer of Season 2 because it locked you in an animation where the Cent's teammates could 100-0 you. But at least you could justify it by saying it has to come through Cent's combo chain which has multiple exits beforehand. Making a copy of that with Valk, though? No way in hell. She can get a swear sweep off half her moveset, so having so many options to get Eagle's Fury 2.0 is definitely a no-go.



-Decrease time for Shield Tackle to activate full-block stance.

I also don't know what you mean by this? She gets the full block immediately after the back dash, and keeps it entirely through the forward charge. She only loses it if you cancel into the top light with the charge. This is actually a really underutilized move because it can act as Orochi's storm rush punish-lite, and it's way less predictable.

Honestly I feel like most people who say Valk is "C tier" don't know how to fully utilize this character's moveset. She's not like Shinobi who actually has a half-useless moveset; Everything Valk has is actually decent, and using all of the options is a really good way to mess with your opponent. She has fast lights, a bash cancel that essentially acts as a neutral bash, a full block punisher, a knock-down that can chain off virtually everything, a good-damage deflect, and most importantly, she's the only hero with light dash attacks that isn't risking a GB if they get blocked.
Ultimately, players who know how to take full advantage of her kit can be real monsters, far from "C tier."

Card1acArrest
03-06-2018, 01:27 PM
It would be good if people state if they talk 1v1 or 4v4.

I do not play duels anymore. I suspect she is relatively weaker there. Her lights get repetitive and the sweep and the knockdown bash will get dodged for a free GB most of the time at medium or higher level. Her bash is a decent opener, but can also be dodged. Also, she needs to hit the enemy maybe 6-7 times to kill them. For some other classes you need 1-2 less hits to kill the enemy. it makes a large difference.


For 4v4, things are different. I agree with those who say she is almost in the right place there.

She is weak in the damage department. She can not pound on with 30-40 damage heavy attacks like Kensei or Warden.
In a 2v2 or more, many heavy attacks from various directions, timed, can kill you in 2 seconds.

But Valkyrie has very powerful crowd control in 4v4. She can:
- sweep - for knockdown - short range
- charged bash - for knockdown - long range
- control a large area by dodge top light attacks, switching between several attackers fast - medium range.

This is where she really shines!

In a 2v2 or more, she can basically shut down 1 or more of the other players by being a constant knockdown threat to them.
She can also go defensive/charge the knockdown, and any enemy with half a brain will watch her with at least 1 eye for those second(s).

EXample:
- we played 3 assassins vs 2 shugokis + 1 Raider in 4v4 (cant remember the other classes). We got SLAUGHTERED. It is really difficult to bring down 2 Shugokis and their charged heavies is kinda painful :-)

So I switched the Orochi for the Valkyrie, and she shifted the whole balance of the fight. It doesnt help to be 2 big Shugoki's who gets GBd to remove hyperarmour, and then knocked down on a regular basis, or made more passive as they constantly were tiptoing around my viking girl :-).

I would also say her defensive abilties are good; I really dont fear anybody playing her. It is more I get too aggressive. her full block has good uses.

I actually dont play her to potential, I struggle with the deflect which has odd timing.

I dont dare to use her side dash attacks much really, as it is a free GB on block. Why should I risk 12 damage for a heavy 30 damage retaliation from parry?
I would rather go for a counter attack, which is the same reward, but next to no risk. All I forsake is a parry which could give me the 25 damage from heavy..

CrY_Honorzz
03-06-2018, 06:29 PM
My time with valk is very limited so this may not be what she needs, but I think all she needs is a small damage increase and either make her dodge attack actually dodge or give it superior block so if you miss the deflect you get the opportunity to deal a light attack to put you back into your mixups

Armegedon1208
03-06-2018, 07:00 PM
valk needs more than just damage adjustments, once you get to mid and high tier play on console getting her second light is hard and the leg sweep almost never hits unless they are getting ganked which then leads to a free gb. A blocked dodge attack, missed shield crush also gives a free gb. Then her heavies are slow with a long start up giving easy gb or parry. Shoulder pin has next to no reward to it and her superior light block which is essentially a light parry has such a short window that you either hit it on accident or eat an attack trying. On her full block stance is really the only thing that does not need to be changed the timing for it is about the same as the other full block stances or hidden stance.

HazelrahFirefly
03-07-2018, 03:33 AM
My time with valk is very limited so this may not be what she needs, but I think all she needs is a small damage increase and either make her dodge attack actually dodge or give it superior block so if you miss the deflect you get the opportunity to deal a light attack to put you back into your mixups

I swear it USED to dodge. I have videoa of me whipping around opponents, dodging their attacks. Now I can't do it at all; I believe she was stealth nerfed at the start of S5.

Until tonight she was my second main, at Rep 13. I'm giving her up though, despite how much I love her. She juat can't compete in this game anymore.

EvoX.
03-07-2018, 04:05 AM
Actually, they stated that the OG heroes will all get reworks.... not all in S5. We could be waiting a long, long time for 10 heroes to be worth playing again.

Really? I'm sure I saw a CM say all 12 will be reworked, and there was ''Season 5'' in that sentence, though I could be remembering wrongly.

I shudder to think how long they'll take otherwise.

Devils-_-legacy
03-07-2018, 09:00 AM
A mod has stated season 5 is strictly on rebalancing the original cast it could go on till the next season I wouldn't be surprised