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View Full Version : 109G2: Oleg can you check weight, horsepower/ATA



HayateAce
03-31-2006, 11:51 AM
This plane is performing very uber stunts online and seems to have weight missing. You found extra weight missing for LaGG series, perhaps G2 has too much weight or too much power for 1942.

Thanks for the fun airplane game!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

HayateAce
03-31-2006, 11:51 AM
This plane is performing very uber stunts online and seems to have weight missing. You found extra weight missing for LaGG series, perhaps G2 has too much weight or too much power for 1942.

Thanks for the fun airplane game!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Scen
03-31-2006, 11:55 AM
LoL http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

While you're at it can you make sure you remove the ION drive outta the spits? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Badsight.
03-31-2006, 12:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by A TROLL ~~&gt; HayateAce:
. You found extra weight missing for LaGG series, perhaps G2 has too much weight or too much power for 1942. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>prehaps MG should fix the undermoddeled stall rates for the E & F Bf-109s so that they will have the better constant turn performance you think they are supposed too

kubanloewe
03-31-2006, 01:12 PM
hm, I wonder why the F4 is heavier than the G2 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif...
the K4 climbrate´s are also far away from the other MW50 109´s, not very true.

some 100% outputs from 109´s and 190´s are way off compared to the 110% Power, imho.

PS: was the BF110 really so bad....?http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

JG53Frankyboy
03-31-2006, 02:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:
............ perhaps G2 has too much weight .............: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

nice typo http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Tator_Totts
03-31-2006, 05:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:
This plane is performing very uber stunts online and seems to have weight missing. You found extra weight missing for LaGG series, perhaps G2 has too much weight or too much power for 1942.

Thanks for the fun airplane game!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That explains that. No wonder my Jug will not out turn the 109. Man this game is porked. Whats next the Zero outdiving the Corsair. Oh yea we have that already.

Brain32
03-31-2006, 06:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:
............ perhaps G2 has too much weight .............: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

nice typo http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Chivas
03-31-2006, 07:54 PM
Good idea...Spits shouldn't have any competition to their uberness....its just not right. Long live the Spit.

La7_brook
03-31-2006, 10:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG53Frankyboy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:
............ perhaps G2 has too much weight .............: </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

nice typo http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>yes we must have this fixed i should be bagging way more spits http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

HelSqnProtos
04-01-2006, 01:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chivas:
Good idea...Spits shouldn't have any competition to their uberness....its just not right. Long live the Spit. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

God forbid the bf jocks should actually learn how to bnz ........... or learn to retain energy the way lw pilots were taught to. They want to be able to tnb with us as well......... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

Hetzer_II
04-01-2006, 01:49 AM
Dont feed the trolls...

CMHQ_Rikimaru
04-01-2006, 01:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tator_Totts:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:
This plane is performing very uber stunts online and seems to have weight missing. You found extra weight missing for LaGG series, perhaps G2 has too much weight or too much power for 1942.

Thanks for the fun airplane game!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That explains that. No wonder my Jug will not out turn the 109. Man this game is porked. Whats next the Zero outdiving the Corsair. Oh yea we have that already. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hahahahah Jug outurning BF109? In what galaxy, in which world? Man u are just crazy, Jug never could, and never will outturn BF109.

JG52Karaya-X
04-01-2006, 02:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CMHQ_Rikimaru:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tator_Totts:
That explains that. No wonder my Jug will not out turn the 109. Man this game is porked. Whats next the Zero outdiving the Corsair. Oh yea we have that already. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hahahahah Jug outurning BF109? In what galaxy, in which world? Man u are just crazy, Jug never could, and never will outturn BF109. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Rikimaru, we call that "Sarcasm" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

IIJG69_Kartofe
04-01-2006, 04:00 AM
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/8209/troll13ff.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

IIJG69_Kartofe
04-01-2006, 04:06 AM
BTW ... <span class="ev_code_PINK">Nice april's fools Hayate! </span> http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

joeap
04-01-2006, 07:22 AM
No not an April Fools, Oleg created 109 G2 as "new best" n00b ride. Be sure. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Or was it the Spit? Can't tell I don't like airplanes. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Chivas
04-01-2006, 10:43 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HelSqnProtos:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chivas:
Good idea...Spits shouldn't have any competition to their uberness....its just not right. Long live the Spit. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

God forbid the bf jocks should actually learn how to bnz ........... or learn to retain energy the way lw pilots were taught to. They want to be able to tnb with us as well......... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

In this game the Spit is a better BZ aircraft than the 109. Look out blue if red ever figures that one out. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif

Pinker15
04-01-2006, 10:55 AM
109G2 even now is no compete for spit 25lbs. This plane is for every LW pilot what want to turn with Spitfire. Im happy because every 109 G2 what just start turn or stall fight is finished. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Pinker15
04-01-2006, 11:06 AM
LW pilots must remember that Spitfire was superior dogfighter than 109. For messer only good team tactic of use speed advantage could help. Sorry Spitfire it was not Yak1 on eastern front. Kanalkrank syndrom during BOB not comes from nowhere. Many LW pilots said that meet spitfire against was a nightmare.

Stigler_9_JG52
04-01-2006, 11:20 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
God forbid the bf jocks should actually learn how to bnz ........... or learn to retain energy the way lw pilots were taught to. They want to be able to tnb with us as well......... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, if you remove the penalites this sim imposes on B&Z (e.g., visibility problems, 109 specific stick stiffness and early onset) we'd be happy to use that tactic.

But we all know that turn-n-burn is "favored" by the modeling, by the visuals, etc., so.... we're relegated to just "gaming the game"

Pinker15
04-01-2006, 11:29 AM
In real 109 was suffering of high speed stick stifness.

Stigler_9_JG52
04-01-2006, 02:10 PM
Indeed, but not to the extent of how it suffers in this sim.

Tator_Totts
04-01-2006, 05:05 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Karaya-X:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CMHQ_Rikimaru:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tator_Totts:
That explains that. No wonder my Jug will not out turn the 109. Man this game is porked. Whats next the Zero outdiving the Corsair. Oh yea we have that already. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hahahahah Jug outurning BF109? In what galaxy, in which world? Man u are just crazy, Jug never could, and never will outturn BF109. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Rikimaru, we call that "Sarcasm" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dang caught and I was getting feed to. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Xiolablu3
04-02-2006, 01:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Stigler_9_JG52:
Indeed, but not to the extent of how it suffers in this sim. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just how do you know this?

Brain32
04-02-2006, 04:19 AM
We can't pull with both hands can we? Stiffnes is modelled but I bet I could pull better at say 550kmh in RL than I can in game. Same goes for the P38, actually it's even worse since in P38 you had both hands on the "stick" by default...

VPB_Kjetilman
04-02-2006, 04:32 AM
Since the last patch the 109 series has unfortunately been overmodelled in regards to manouvreabillity, apparently the G-2 more than other versions. It can now outturn Yaks in the horizontal plane which is simply not a reflection of real life.

This is a fact and I cannot understand why it was done.

Rather than just state this without support I'll refer any doubters to a disucssion at my Squad's forum where Erik Pilawskii, a noted expert on aviation history and VVS fighters especially, has kindly offered some comments on WWII fighter performance. You can find the fourm here; http://www.vpbhq.com/

Just check the thread "Basic AIrcraft Properties Data" or go directly here:

http://www.vpbhq.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=142&start=0&...order=asc&highlight= (http://www.vpbhq.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=142&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=)

Just for the record, I am myself a 109 fan and post this simply because I'd like to see this beautful sim achieve a little more realism.

Pinker15
04-02-2006, 05:12 AM
At 550 kmph forces on 109 stick was so high that for pull out use of elevator trim was necessary. I can be wrong but forces was for about 90 kilograms. I want to see strongman in tight 109 cocpit to make fast pullout at these conditions.

Brain32
04-02-2006, 05:35 AM
90Kg?!?!? Where did you see that(I'm not saying it's not true I would just like to see)? To my understanding it was 90lbs(40,8Kg) and that was on Emil, but I may be very wrong...
Also if that was true then max dive speed would be what, 500kmh if you are insanely strong or what? If that was true I don't know what would I do with a man offering me such a bird for a fighter, death penalty or mental institute...

Pinker15
04-02-2006, 05:37 AM
I told that Im not sure for about weight but Im pretty sure that without use of elewator trim pullout on 109 at so high speed was extremally dificult.

polak5
04-02-2006, 05:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chivas:

In this game the Spit is a better BZ aircraft than the 109. Look out blue if red ever figures that one out. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

CHivas i think i saw U on RO the other day

Jim81
04-02-2006, 06:42 AM
If 109 should be corrected well...

Rata should be re-modelled again (actually is the strongest plane in the game ! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif )

I -16 should be called X-Wing

P51 should be called with another name cause that plane in the game is not a P51 at all

FW 190 should be remodelled totally ( wrong cockpit view, Flight model not existent)

So before talking of 109..pls think of wich planes allied have over modded.

PS: i forgot to tell that if you damage control cables to a spit , generally it gets easier to fly, especially it turns a lot more !! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Manuel29
04-02-2006, 07:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jim81:
PS: i forgot to tell that if you damage control cables to a spit , generally it gets easier to fly, especially it turns a lot more !! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I think actually it's easier to change ONE plane's FM (G2) than the FM of a large number of planes (How many Spit versions?).

Now we have Uber-Spit vs Uber-Bf109.

The stiffness of the diving Bf109 can't be really implementated since we haven't the fatigue factor... what we have now is not realistic.

Bye

AndyHigh
04-02-2006, 12:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pinker15:
At 550 kmph forces on 109 stick was so high that for pull out use of elevator trim was necessary. I can be wrong but forces was for about 90 kilograms. I want to see strongman in tight 109 cocpit to make fast pullout at these conditions. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it could fly faster level speeds than 550 kmph. Trim was used at extremely high speeds, while speed in dive was around 800-900 km/h.

All the planes in the game have stick response modelled for same amount of feedback which is not so much (under 30kg or something). For sure 109 was pulled with much harder forces.

Cajun76
04-02-2006, 12:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CMHQ_Rikimaru:


Hahahahah Jug outurning BF109? In what galaxy, in which world? Man u are just crazy, Jug never could, and never will outturn BF109. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd take that challenge @ 35,000 ft. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Otherwise, I leave that low and slow turning stuff to the obsoletes... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Pinker15
04-04-2006, 04:32 AM
Here we have few comments about of 109g dive features.
http://www.virtualpilots.fi/feature/articles/109myths/

Description of Mark Hanna.

During a dive at 400 mph all three controls were in turn displaced slightly and released. No vibration, flutter or snaking developed. If the elevator is trimmed for level flight at full throttle, a large push is needed to hold in the dive, and there is a temptation to trim in. If, in fact, the airplane is trimmed into the dive, recovery is difficult unless the trimmer is moved back owing to the excessive heaviness of the elevator.

This is an exceptionally good control at low air speeds, being fairly heavy and not over-sensitive. Above 250 mph, however, it becomes too heavy, so that maneuvrability is seriously restricted. When diving at 400 mph a pilot, pulling very hard, cannot put on enough 'g' to black himself out; stick force -'g' probably esceeds 20 lb/g in the dive.

Dive compare from Virtual pilots site.

- The Me 109 was dived to Mach 0.79 in instrumented tests. Slightly modified, it was even dived to Mach 0.80, and the problems experimented there weren't due to compressility, but due to aileron overbalancing. Compare this to Supermarine Spitfire, which achieved dive speeds well above those of any other WW2 fighter, getting to Mach 0.89 on one occasion. P-51 and Fw 190 achieved about Mach 0.80. The P-47 had the lowest permissible Mach number of these aircraft. Test pilot Eric Brown observed it became uncontrollable at Mach 0.73, and "analysis showed that a dive to M=0.74 would almost certainly be a 'graveyard dive'."
- Source: Radinger/Otto/Schick: "Messerschmitt Me 109", volumes 1 and 2, Eric Brown: "Testing for Combat".
- (Comment: it seems Eric Brown's analysis is flawed, though, and test pilot Herb Fisher performed 150+ such dives: an example of a 0.79 dive. Several of the dives achieved Mach 0.83. Sources: Herb Fisher, Herb Fisher Jr., and Curtiss-Wright.

Few other pilots description.

Me 109 G:
"The maximum speed not to be exceeded was 750kmh. Once I was flying above Helsinki as I received a report of Russkies in the South. There was a big Cumulus cloud on my way there but I decided to fly right through. I centered the controls and then something extraordinary happened. I must have involuntarily entered into half-roll and dive. The planes had individual handling characteristics; even though I held the turning indicator in the middle, the plane kept going faster and faster, I pulled the stick, yet the plane went into an ever steeper dive.
In the same time she started rotating, and I came out of the cloud with less than one kilometer of altitude. I started pulling the stick, nothing happened, I checked the speed, it was about 850kmh. I tried to recover the plane but the stick was as if locked and nothing happened. I broke into a sweat of agony: now I am going into the sea and cannot help it. I pulled with both hands, groaning and by and by she started recovering, she recovered more, I pulled and pulled, but the surface of the sea approached, I thought I was going to crash. I kept pulling until I saw that I had survived. The distance between me and the sea may have been five meters. I pulled up and found myself on the coast of Estonia.
If I in that situation had used the vertical trim the wings would have been broken off. A minimal trim movement has a strong effect on wings when the speed limit has been exceded. I had 100kmh overspeed! It was out of all limits.
The Messerschmitt's wings were fastened with two bolts. When I saw the construction I had thought that they are strong enough but in this case I was thinking, when are they going to break
- What about the phenomenon called "buffeting" or vibration, was there any?
No, I did not encounter it even in the 850kmh speed."
- Ky¶sti Karhila, Finnish fighter ace. 32 victories. Source: Interview by Finnish Virtual Pilots Association.

Me 109 G:
"- The vertical dive was how to disengage.
Jussi Huotari: That was the remedy.
Antti Tani: That is how I survived when attacking two of them and losing the first round. They had more speed because I was coming from a lower altitude.
It was nothing special, the (Yak-9) planes were climbing and began to turn back. I had planned to get to shoot at them as they have lost their speed in the turn. But I was not in the right position. I turned at them and pulled the nose up - and I lost my speed, I had to turn below them. I had to push the stick to get behind them, and as they dived at me I dived right down. I turned with ailerons a couple of times, and had full power on.
Then I started recovery from the dive, of course in the direction of home, then checked the dials, the reading was eight hundred plus kmh. Then I started pulling the stick, pulled harder as hard as ever: never in my life did I pull so hard. I pulled with right hand and tried to trim the horizontal rudder with my left hand. But it did not budge, as if it had been set in concrete. But by the by the nose began to rise, but terribly slowly. As my angle was about 45 I heard over the radio as Onni Paronen said, "hey lads, look, a Messerschmitt is going in the sea!" I wanted to answer back but I could not afford to do anything put pull with two hands. As soon as I had returned to level flight and had been able to breath normally for a while, I in a way regained consciousness. I pushed the transmitter key and said "not quite". It was a close shave.
- It was so hard that you almost blacked out?
Antti Tani: I felt I was on the edge, pulling as hard as I ever could."
- Antti Tani, Finnish fighter ace. 21,5 victories. Source: Interview by Finnish Virtual Pilots Association.
- Jouko "Jussi" Huotari, Finnish fighter ace. 17 victories. Source: Interview by Finnish Virtual Pilots Association.

Me 109 G:
- How difficult was it to control the 109 in high velocities, 600 kmh and above?
The Messerschmitt became stiff to steer not until the speed exceeded 700kmh. The control column was as stiff as it had been fastened with tape, you could not use the ailerons. Yet you could control the plane."
- Ky¶sti Karhila, Finnish fighter ace. 32 victories. Source: Interview by Finnish Virtual Pilots Association.

Chivas
04-04-2006, 05:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by polak5:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chivas:

In this game the Spit is a better BZ aircraft than the 109. Look out blue if red ever figures that one out. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

CHivas i think i saw U on RO the other day </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes...I've been trying out RO. Its the first non combat flight sim I ever tried. I thought I sucked at FB....but RO....I have no clue. Talk about cannon fodder. LOL

HellToupee
04-04-2006, 06:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pinker15:
I told that Im not sure for about weight but Im pretty sure that without use of elewator trim pullout on 109 at so high speed was extremally dificult. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

one tactic of the spitfire ive read about was to dive for the ground pull out at last moment, and if 109 followed they would not be able to pull out.

Chivas
04-04-2006, 09:31 PM
I've heard the same from a old RAF pilot at my golf club years ago. I believe he said he started the pull out a 1500ft. I can't remember if he was flying a Spit or Hurricane at the time. But my memory is failing me and he had a reputation of being a bit of a old bull****ter. lol.

JG5_UnKle
04-05-2006, 05:00 AM
OMG - You people fall for this asinine cr@p every day of the week http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif