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View Full Version : Stall-climbs: Real-Life tactic or bogus FM exploit?



BaldieJr
04-09-2004, 10:16 PM
I've never flown a plane, so what do I know?

But if you hold an La7 at about 170 km/h you can maintain the wierdest climb you've ever seen. And you can do it straight off the runway.

Another oddity: You can pull endless loops with just trim. La7 will loop all day with only trim... is this real?

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

BaldieJr
04-09-2004, 10:16 PM
I've never flown a plane, so what do I know?

But if you hold an La7 at about 170 km/h you can maintain the wierdest climb you've ever seen. And you can do it straight off the runway.

Another oddity: You can pull endless loops with just trim. La7 will loop all day with only trim... is this real?

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

VW-IceFire
04-09-2004, 10:41 PM
Well alot of airshow style crowd pleasing acrobatics is based on riding stalls or even using them to advantage...but I don't know exactly in this case...

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ElfunkoI
04-09-2004, 11:07 PM
What you should test is torque during a high AOA manuever like a hard climb as you described. In real life the torque is increased because (iirc) the lower left portion of the prop cycle moves faster than the other portions, or with russian planes it would probably be lower right (their props turn clockwise iirc). Increased torque means more drag, more fight to compensate, more prone to over compensation thus too high AOA and stall, etc. But I think oleg has increased torque as much as he can without breaking the game, so this won't be realized until another game includes it or the next Maddox game (hopefully).

"A6?http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Will be A6!"

BaldieJr
04-10-2004, 07:39 AM
Back when the I-153 was first made available, it could do the same thing. Of course everyone *****ed about its flight model.

I could put that thing into a stall-climb* with full rudder and spiral to the top of the world in no-time.

The La7 will do the same stupid move, only much faster.

* for lack of a better term, I call it a stall-climb, because you need to dip one wing in order to make it work.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

ajafoofoo
04-10-2004, 09:58 AM
What's more annoying than seeing this junk online is that the AI occasionally pulls this bogus move.

Quite silly.

crazyivan1970
04-10-2004, 10:09 AM
Baldie, where the track? And why is it here, not on il2beta@1c.ru?

V!
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BaldieJr
04-12-2004, 06:00 AM
Make me a track Ivan. I don't have time.

Just hold the highest AoA possible with some rudder. Its easy.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

WUAF_Co_Hero
04-12-2004, 06:20 AM
I would imagine that, as it is your complaint and you know how to do it so well, that it would be your responsibility to present proof.

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

BaldieJr
04-12-2004, 06:47 AM
I am just a consumer, not a criminal.

I didn't have to post this.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

JG5_JaRa
04-12-2004, 07:18 AM
Baldie has a valid point there and it doesn't require a track unless you actually feel like wasting hours of time making annoying slow speed climb measurments and compare them to data calculated from thrust-vs-airspeed and thrust-vs-drag curves for every suspect aircraft or at least make some good estimations for it.
The "stall climb" is more noticeable in some planes than in others. It is a general flight model characteristic which may be a result of various different model weaknesses (too high thrust at slow speed, too little induced drag at high AOA and stability characteristics - all this depends on the particular aircraft) and probably goes far beyond quickly fixing one or two FM parameters in some aircraft.
The general observation is that you can easily pull up from slow speed steeply and hang on the propeller at full power for a while while still getting a decent climb rate. Furthermore, due to the neglectably weak torque, gyro and side slip effects and generally good slow speed controlability, such a "maneuver" is rather stable. I can't imagine that such slow speed stunts would be helpful in real life, it would probably kill you rather quick.