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XyZspineZyX
08-26-2003, 11:17 PM
Well, my usual watering hole seems to be down, so I thought I'd pick your brains on this matter. So what a/c do you prefer and why? Which one will you be flying if/when you get LOMAC? Hogs or Frogs? What's it gonna be.

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XyZspineZyX
08-26-2003, 11:17 PM
Well, my usual watering hole seems to be down, so I thought I'd pick your brains on this matter. So what a/c do you prefer and why? Which one will you be flying if/when you get LOMAC? Hogs or Frogs? What's it gonna be.

<marquee>Stukageschwader 77 : coming soon to an airbase near you. </marquee>

<center>http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/media/cleared/wolverine_th.jpg


Remember: It's not just a job, it's a chance to bomb the crap out of everything you see and NOT get called a dirty vulcher!
<center> founder of the GFC

XyZspineZyX
08-26-2003, 11:28 PM
the A10 its unbetable and got a big 30mm rotary cannon

XyZspineZyX
08-26-2003, 11:37 PM
A-10. no doubt.

XyZspineZyX
08-26-2003, 11:50 PM
Let me think....hmmmmm...........looks at sig........now I remember.....Why?.....made in USA my son../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

25th_Buzz
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<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-26-2003, 11:54 PM
ALLRIGHT! We have got four solid posts for my favorite gun toting weapon of doom, the A-10 Warthog. Who else wants to chime in? Do we have NO SU drivers in here?

<marquee>Stukageschwader 77 : coming soon to an airbase near you. </marquee>

<center>http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/media/cleared/wolverine_th.jpg


Remember: It's not just a job, it's a chance to bomb the crap out of everything you see and NOT get called a dirty vulcher!
<center> founder of the GFC

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:00 AM
Some of the Ivans no doubt.

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:04 AM
IBTL

oh and A-10



"Of all my accomplishments I may have achieved during the war, I am proudest of the fact that I never lost a wingman. It was my view that no kill was worth the life of a wingman. . . . Pilots in my unit who lost wingmen on this basis were prohibited from leading a [section]. They were made to fly as wingman, instead."
Erich 'Bubi' Hartmann "Karaya One"

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:07 AM
BuzzU wrote:
- Some of the Ivans no doubt.
-

how do the americans called? (just asking)

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:10 AM
You look like a Warthog, Clown!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

http://mason.gmu.edu/~rzumbro/warthog.jpg

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Nevermore!</center>

Bearcat101
08-27-2003, 12:11 AM
Do you mean: What are the Americans called?

The Bad @ss Cowboys

"-When in doubt, empty your magazine.
-Never share a foxhole with anyone braver than you are.
-Never forget that your weapon was made by the lowest bidder.
-If your attack is going really well, it's an ambush.
-No plan survives the first contact intact.
-All 5 second grenade fuses burn down in 3 seconds." Excerpt from Murphy's Laws

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:12 AM
ohadbx

Call me whatever you like. I'm not bothered.

25th_Buzz
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<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:14 AM
I'm no Ivan. But I'll be definitely flying the russian aircraft. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://members.shaw.ca/cuski4678/sig.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:29 AM
never mind, i remember now, you yankees! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:36 AM
I'll be flying the Su-25 for sure. A-10's been done before, so it's boring. Su-25 will be different, which is good. Su-25 has a depressable gun I think, so it should be easier to aim too.

Same reasons I prefer flying the Ka52 in CvsH - the Commanche was featured in sims before.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:41 AM
A-10

and the rest.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:55 AM
Wait a minute now, Proud American here, but uh, i think the unwavering Pride has to some heads. Or maybe people don't realize that Su-25 when clean can break the sound barrier, also has an excellant anti tank cannon, and is if not more just as heavily protected as A10 Warthog; whose max speed is less than a few of the prop planes in this game. That's why Hog is now mainly used counter insurgery(read: non-sophisticated AA weapons) and observation roles(Many have been converted to OA-10's as fast FACs and delegated to National Guard units) For the most part, in USAF front line ground attack units A-10's have been replaced by F-16's; I don't care how armored u are, 425 mph doesn't cut against todays Roland and SA-13 missles. As far as the cannon, in the Gulf War it was only used against helicopters; the primary anti-armor weapon of choice was the Maverick agm, too dangerous to sit there lining up for strafing when u have IR guided missle.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:59 AM
ohadbx wrote:
- never mind, i remember now, you yankees!

Please, call us Yanks, not Yankees. Yankees are a stupid ball club that plays outta da bronx, and not everyone from NYC is a Yankee fan. Yanks or Cowboys will do just fine.

And I'll fly the A-10 anyday of the week.


"Yellow-nosed b@st@rds, 6 o'clock high, coming down now!"

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:18 AM
jung0l wrote:
- Wait a minute now, Proud American here, but uh, i
- think the unwavering Pride has to some heads. Or
- maybe people don't realize that Su-25 when clean can
- break the sound barrier, also has an excellant anti
- tank cannon, and is if not more just as heavily
- protected as A10 Warthog; whose max speed is less
- than a few of the prop planes in this game. That's
- why Hog is now mainly used counter insurgery(read:
- non-sophisticated AA weapons) and observation
- roles(Many have been converted to OA-10's as fast
- FACs and delegated to National Guard units) For the
- most part, in USAF front line ground attack units
- A-10's have been replaced by F-16's; I don't care
- how armored u are, 425 mph doesn't cut against
- todays Roland and SA-13 missles. As far as the
- cannon, in the Gulf War it was only used against
- helicopters; the primary anti-armor weapon of choice
- was the Maverick agm, too dangerous to sit there
- lining up for strafing when u have IR guided missle.
-
-
-
-

Some of that may be true, but the Hog is STILL ACTIVE as a ground attack role a/c and that's the bottom line. Every time I hear someone say something like this about the Hog I see some news story wherein the A-10 was used for some ground attack in Afghanistan or Iraq. Yes it's slow, I WANT it to be slow. If I am flying for speed I WON"T FLY GROUND ATTACK a/c. But If I want to line up a good nape drop before strafing a tank column, I want to be low n slow. I will let the Wild Weasels clear out the SAMs and the AAA. That's Their job. Killing things with the GAU-8A is mine.


<marquee>Stukageschwader 77 : coming soon to an airbase near you. </marquee>

<center>http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/media/cleared/wolverine_th.jpg


Remember: It's not just a job, it's a chance to bomb the crap out of everything you see and NOT get called a dirty vulcher!
<center> founder of the GFC

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:20 AM
Psssttt.... (fly all of them... its your sim, you bought it.)


DW

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:25 AM
The A-10 is slow compared to the F-15, but it's not slow. It's faster than the 262 if you call that slow?

25th_Buzz
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<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:34 AM
BuzzU wrote:
- The A-10 is slow compared to the F-15, but it's not
- slow. It's faster than the 262 if you call that
- slow?

And the Rata is faster than the Sopwith Camel, so I guess it's not slow either?

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:36 AM
heh the A-10 and the SU-25 could never hope to acheive the kind of results 4 20mm cannon and 12 heavy armour peircing rockets could when mounted on the ultimate ground attack fighter which you should of already figured out, if not check my name.







LOOKOUT, TYPHOONS' COMIN' TO GET YA'..........

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:37 AM
I'm not even sure I'll get LOMAC,but if I do I guess I'll choose the Warthog over the Su-25....

47|FC
http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/p47-6.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:40 AM
well boys,
I think I'll fly some Russian iron. How else can I tell if that NATO ground equipment was really worth all that cash? SU25 Frogfoot driver here. Yessirree, Bobski!
besides, don't let me see a Hog nearby. He'll get a nice WAX job! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
T

Speed is Life! But being a good shot comes in handy too. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:40 AM
never call a southern man a yankee, they still hold it all against them. callings us Cowboys is ok, but most of y'all really don't know what a real cowboy is. Maybe just call us BAMF's. that should make most everone happy.


Oh, and i say fly them both.


Message Edited on 08/26/0307:41PM by Supr

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:44 AM
Bnej_03

Not the same thing. You can get to a point where it is slow, and feels slow (Rata). I don't think the A-10 will feel slow to fly. Especially since you hug the ground during your flights. Only if you jump from an F-15 will it feel slow. I'm flying it no matter. I like blowing up ground targets better then picking off a plane with a missle.

25th_Buzz
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<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 03:11 AM
Neither, you'll see my smiling face in the f-15

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 03:37 AM
I expect there will be quite a few F-15s and Flankers getting shot down by attack planes in guns-only servers. If the fighter is too slow, the A10 and Su25 can turn inside them and give them a dose of big-gun. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

There might even be whining, won't that be somthing to look forward to. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 04:10 AM
I'll fly them all. The Su-25 might become my favorite, though. Have you seen the LOMAC video Frog-Cluster-Attack.avi? The Frogfoot talks! After it takes a hit on the port wing, a pleasant female voice says "look at the display" (in Russian, of course)

That's way better the IL-2's negative-G annunciation system: "wtf you doing, oh noooo!"

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 04:23 AM
A-10, no doubt. Who could kill a plane named Warthog!!!

Boosher-PBNA
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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 04:30 AM
A-10, because I'm an ultra-nationalist, and it hurts peoples' feelings.

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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 06:40 AM
Uh ME again. Don't get me wrong, I was enamored with A-10 every since I saw as model loaded down on every pylon in toy store, and especially when I saw TAC demo film at Langley(JROTC) strafing tanks. And like I said before, it is probably unmatched in low density AA threat situations(Kosovo, depleted Iraq), but USAF people have stated it would not be as effective in the modern AIRLAND doctrine against a fully equiped Soviet Bloc missle air defense environment; you need speed( high transonic). This plane will always have a use however, as powerfully armed and nimble as it is. But the Frogfoot is just about supersonic, on top of that, and Western test pilots that had the chance to fly it were astonished at its performance. But I enjoy flying Warthog in Janes USAF, cannon is fun to shoot.


Oh, and by the way, 425 knots IS slower than Me262, as well as P47N, P51D, TA152,...

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 10:45 AM
jung0l wrote:
- density AA threat situations(Kosovo, depleted Iraq),
- but USAF people have stated it would not be as
- effective in the modern AIRLAND doctrine against a
- fully equiped Soviet Bloc missle air defense
- environment; you need speed( high transonic). This

I don't know why ,but generally USAF was lead by morons compared with the other defence components of US defense (marines,navy,army).For Christ the morons opposed to the F16 when the program started since the Viper was better than their newest toy the F15 up to mach 1.2. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif Read at FAS.org
Anyway, Su25 will be my first options .I am a fan of the UBx57x32 rockets/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif . And when I am done with it (read bored) , A10 baby/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif That gun is from hell./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif .Like a brit soldier said the sound that he never want to hear again/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


http://www.soft4net.ro/~phoratiu/tomcat.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 10:54 AM
A-10! Always fancied flying around in those of those warthogs and blowing up stuff with that huge gun!

<center>


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</center>

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 10:59 AM
tomcat1974 wrote:
Like a brit soldier said the
- sound that he never want to hear again/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
-

Would that happen to be one of these guys:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2901515.stm

??/slush

http://dk.groups.yahoo.com/group/aktivitetsdage/files/Eurotrolls.gif

You can't handle the truth!
Col. Jessep

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 11:20 AM
Su 25 for sure! two reasons: first it`s much more maneuvarable- there`s a demonstration group in Russia that flies those babies, second in the new version of the Su it was taken into account the conclusions from the actions in Afganistan, and most importantly, AFAIK, the new russian AT missile "Vihr" was installed, and that bird flies for 9.5 kilometers

After the research of what damege a stinger missile did on the engines of the Su-25, none were lost to Stingers in the Afganistan war.

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king."

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 11:31 AM
Frogfoot driver here.

Should I feel the need for speed, there's always a MiG29 or a Flanker B.

Why? Because those Birds are sexy. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

-------------------------------------

A superior pilot may be defined as one who stays out of trouble by using his superior judgement, to avoid situations which might require the use of his superior skills.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 11:33 AM
SU25 all the way.The A-10 is way too slow for my taste.As for the reason why the A-10 has done well in all the wars its fought till now is that none of the opposing countries had a decent airforce or an organized SAM network.Take these two factors into the equation A-10 no matter how armored they are gonna get shot down in droves.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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JU87B2 of 8/St.G77 , Smolensk Sept 1941

Stukageschwader77 soon divebombing an airbase near you.---- Visit www.stg-77.net (http://www.stg-77.net) to join StG77 ----

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 11:36 AM
I am no Ivan either but I will definitely fly Su-25. Hehe... I am Serbian.

I can't wait to see LOMAC.

Best,
Kursula

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 11:40 AM
I once was on a field exercise with A-10's flying overhead and doing simulated attacks. They might be slow if you look at the specs, but when they're at tree-top level you don't hear'em come before they roar over you. Then they turn on a dime (with cool wingtip trails), and you suddenly face that gun going "bwwwwwwwwwwww!". Scary! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Anyway, I'm gonna fly'em both of course. No question about it!

cheers/slush

http://dk.groups.yahoo.com/group/aktivitetsdage/files/Eurotrolls.gif

You can't handle the truth!
Col. Jessep

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 11:43 AM
gimme a su-25, it may not have a big gun, but the gun isnt really useful these days, the su-25 is faster and every bit as strong.

http://lamppost.mine.nu/ahclan/files/sigs/spitwhiners1.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 12:06 PM
HellToupee wrote:
- gimme a su-25, it may not have a big gun, but the
- gun isnt really useful these days, the su-25 is
- faster and every bit as strong.
Actualy it has a powerfull gun also..Just not that many projectiles./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/30-2.jpg

First from Left GSh30-2 Su25 projectile
GSh30-2 fire rate 3600-3800 rpm at 860m/s-900m/s
Fifth the Avenger Projectile
GAU8 3600-4200rpm at 1000m/s

http://www.soft4net.ro/~phoratiu/tomcat.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:31 PM
jung0l wrote:
- Wait a minute now, Proud American here, but uh, i
- think the unwavering Pride has to some heads. Or
- maybe people don't realize that Su-25 when clean can
- break the sound barrier, also has an excellant anti
- tank cannon, and is if not more just as heavily
- protected as A10 Warthog; whose max speed is less
- than a few of the prop planes in this game. That's
- why Hog is now mainly used counter insurgery(read:
- non-sophisticated AA weapons) and observation
- roles(Many have been converted to OA-10's as fast
- FACs and delegated to National Guard units) For the
- most part, in USAF front line ground attack units
- A-10's have been replaced by F-16's; I don't care
- how armored u are, 425 mph doesn't cut against
- todays Roland and SA-13 missles. As far as the
- cannon, in the Gulf War it was only used against
- helicopters; the primary anti-armor weapon of choice
- was the Maverick agm, too dangerous to sit there
- lining up for strafing when u have IR guided missle.


?????????????????????????????????????

PHHHT

Just a month or so ago they were downtown on the ashphalt in Bagdhad bustin up the defense ministry with the burping cannon ... I would consider that frontline engagement ..

Have you ever heard that thing fire in real life ??

Forget tapes, and stats and jrotc videos ...
no sound like it on the planet ... sounds like a 5 thousand ton zipper !

a three second burst can COVER an airfield

someone else hit it on the nail too ... before you go in low and slow, the boys running weasel missions have all but vaporized the aa in the bushes .. leaving shoulder fired junk to keep you yankin and bankin ...

and buddy can that thing jink !!!

pop,pop,pop .... three quick flares.. a dash of chaff

and turn in the missle .... you think a yak can turn ??



CC






Message Edited on 08/27/0312:42PM by Coon-Chow

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:53 PM
I dont know why anyone is compairing the A-10's speed and saying its useless that slow. Thats wrong. A modern AA missile will catch a Su-25 just as well as a A-10. Speed is not a factor for ground support other then getting to the target. Also, as for the Su taking a missile hit. Big deal! A-10 has taken multiple hits and still flown home. And about not being able to go into a modern SAM defended sight. Bagdad had a very advanced missile system, but it was still circling the city. Not one shot down. Why? Its called orginized attacks. You take out the SAM's, and then send in the warthog. You send in a Su-25 without support into a SAM system, it will get a few rockets up its tailpipe. No matter the speed! Both aircraft are not good without support.

Im not saying I like the A-10 more. A-10 is my favorite for years, but I can see the Su-25 is just as good. Im just saying a lot of your arguements your using here as "proof" of ones superiority on the battlefield are really quite bunk. Speed has no factor! WHAT SO EVER! Stability, and payload does. I think payload goes to the A-10, im not sure what would be a more stable gun platform.

I have also seen A-10's doing flare jinks to dodge missiles. These things could fight Yak 3's!!! I have not seen a Su-25 yet.

Gib

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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 01:56 PM
Su25 easy, not because I know it's better than the A10 or anything but simply because it's never been done before.

Looks kinda mean too....

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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 02:33 PM
Gibbage1 wrote:
- I dont know why anyone is compairing the A-10's
- speed and saying its useless that slow. Thats
- wrong. A modern AA missile will catch a Su-25 just
- as well as a A-10. Speed is not a factor for ground
- support other then getting to the target. Also, as
- for the Su taking a missile hit. Big deal! A-10
- has taken multiple hits and still flown home. And
- about not being able to go into a modern SAM
- defended sight. Bagdad had a very advanced missile
- system, but it was still circling the city. Not one
- shot down. Why? Its called orginized attacks. You
- take out the SAM's, and then send in the warthog.
- You send in a Su-25 without support into a SAM
- system, it will get a few rockets up its tailpipe.
- No matter the speed! Both aircraft are not good
- without support.
-
- Im not saying I like the A-10 more. A-10 is my
- favorite for years, but I can see the Su-25 is just
- as good. Im just saying a lot of your arguements
- your using here as "proof" of ones superiority on
- the battlefield are really quite bunk. Speed has no
- factor! WHAT SO EVER! Stability, and payload does.
- I think payload goes to the A-10, im not sure what
- would be a more stable gun platform.
-
-
- I have also seen A-10's doing flare jinks to dodge
- missiles. These things could fight Yak 3's!!! I
- have not seen a Su-25 yet.
-
- Gib
-



AFAIK there was a A-10 shot down in the recent war against Iraq most probably by an SA7 shoulder launched SAM.And BTW Bagdhad's SAM network was nothing short of a fantasy.Most of its defenses were AAA with a few SA6 SAM's.Most of the Iraqi sam network was either taken out or offline.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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JU87B2 of 8/St.G77 , Smolensk Sept 1941

Stukageschwader77 soon divebombing an airbase near you.---- Visit www.stg-77.net (http://www.stg-77.net) to join StG77 ----

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 02:48 PM
Speed always was important. When the huge SAMs are gone, all that is left are radar guided and visually guided AA guns and cannons, as well as hand launched IR guided missiles. And speed does matter when you run into a wall of flak! and I will repeat: after the russians strengthened the parts of the engine that were more easily damaged by stingers, NO SU-25 were lost to the Stingers. That is Zero!

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king."

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 02:51 PM
Speed always was important. When the huge SAMs are gone, all that is left are radar guided and visually guided AA guns and cannons, as well as hand launched IR guided missiles. And speed does matter when you run into a wall of flak! and I will repeat: after the russians strengthened the parts of the engine that were more easily damaged by stingers, NO SU-25 were lost to the Stingers. That is Zero!



"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king."

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 03:26 PM
A-10 is an inmense GAU cannon with wings. Who does not want to ride into a titanium cabin over an inmense machinegun? Firing it must be unforgettable... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

- Dux Corvan -

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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 03:54 PM
No doubt the GAU-8 is going to be lots of fun. I plan to fly BOTH.

Maybe we should get the ball rolling early.... has anyone heard the GAU-8 cannon in LOMAC? Does it sound right? Someboy better start complaining that it doesn't sound correct. I expect to see complete charts with plots of dB at various ranges, gun windup with RPM vs. time for short bursts, and measured differences between DU ammo vs. training rounds. Also, a chart of fneb vs. splee for the SU-25 would be highly educational.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 03:57 PM
Both are obsolete and could only survive in combat against third-world air defenses (which is where the A-10 has been used).

Advances in air defence technology made the "jet-powered Sturmovik" concept redundant by the early 1990s.

Regards,

RocketDog.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 04:29 PM
RocketDog wrote:
- Both are obsolete and could only survive in combat
- against third-world air defenses (which is where the
- A-10 has been used).
-
- Advances in air defence technology made the
- "jet-powered Sturmovik" concept redundant by the
- early 1990s.
-
- Regards,
-
- RocketDog.

Survival is optional. The tried-and-true Soviet strategy wins wars, yet the Sturmoviks often don't make it back in one piece.

Although it's kinda scary, imagine a modern scenario where highly motivated/coerced pilots (kamikaze, Selbstopferpiloten, prisoner-pilots, fundies destined for martyrdom, etc) go up against overwhelming odds. Seriously. You online DF'ers have all seen how one crazy vulcher can do serious damage to an enemy base before he's killed...

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 08:32 PM
Baloban wrote:
- No doubt the GAU-8 is going to be lots of fun. I
- plan to fly BOTH.
-
- Maybe we should get the ball rolling early.... has
- anyone heard the GAU-8 cannon in LOMAC? Does it
- sound right? Someboy better start complaining that
- it doesn't sound correct. I expect to see complete
- charts with plots of dB at various ranges, gun
- windup with RPM vs. time for short bursts, and
- measured differences between DU ammo vs. training
- rounds. Also, a chart of fneb vs. splee for the
- SU-25 would be highly educational.


This was a great post. Well done. And Gibbage up there has it right so why do you all still argue? ANY plane left hanging in the wind without support over enemy territiory will not last. A proper battle plan means taking out the ground threats with wild weasels and ground support troops. Then sending in the bombers with air cover. A-10's with f-15s is a strike package I would fear.
-
-



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Remember: It's not just a job, it's a chance to bomb the crap out of everything you see and NOT get called a dirty vulcher!
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XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 09:37 PM
I'd say Gib has it about right. Speed aint gonna help you when SAMs are flying up yer arse. If that were the case Thuds, Phantoms, and F-8s wouldn't have gotten taken down by them. The A-10 doesn't go in there till all that stuff is toast and neither would the Su-25. And as for it's speed, you aren't gonna be going "near supersonic" when you're flying in for ground attack. The F-16 isn't doing that kind of speed when it attacks ground targets either, is it? And after an attack run it'll take a while for those engines to spool up to get the Frog up to that speed anyway. Till then it's just as much bait for ground fire as an A-10.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 09:59 PM
Jung, I think your mistaken on them being put in the Air Guard. I know a few USAF pilots and most are stil in full active duty and are used in such missions as SAR Support, Wild Weisel Action, Ground Support and FAC. There were a number of times when A-10's came back from fighting in desert storm with nearly half a wing missing from direct SAM hits. There are also currently being used in Afgan, and Iraq in the ground support roll as they were originally intended for.

XyZspineZyX
08-27-2003, 10:04 PM
Well, I personnaly prefer the A-10

It is more resistant to AAM's and cannonfire, it has a MICH BETTER cannon [the SU-25's gun don't come close], and just looks a hell of a lot more scary!

XyZspineZyX
08-28-2003, 11:58 AM
VOL_Jon wrote:
- It is more resistant to AAM's and cannonfire, it has
- a MICH BETTER cannon [the SU-25's gun don't come
- close]

You do realise that you are missinformed?
If you take in cosideration that Su25 is a smaller lighter plane ,its armour proportion is the same as A10.


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XyZspineZyX
08-28-2003, 10:44 PM
Well if the A-10 has 20% (just random numbers) of its weight to armor and is 20,000 pounds, that means it has 4000lb's of armor. If the Su-25 has 20% armor (equivilant) and its 10,000 pounds, that means it has 2000 pounds of armor. Sure it has an "eqiviliant" of an A-10's armor, but the A-10 is still better protected. Is this what you mean?

Gib

tomcat1974 wrote:
-
- VOL_Jon wrote:
-- It is more resistant to AAM's and cannonfire, it has
-- a MICH BETTER cannon [the SU-25's gun don't come
-- close]
-
- You do realise that you are missinformed?
- If you take in cosideration that Su25 is a smaller
- lighter plane ,its armour proportion is the same as
- A10.
-
-
-
- http://www.soft4net.ro/~phoratiu/tomcat.jpg



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XyZspineZyX
08-28-2003, 11:45 PM
A-10 here, 'cause I fell for her in "A-10 Cuba!"... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

I'll fly the Flanker instead of the Eagle though: much sexier!

A.

XyZspineZyX
08-29-2003, 08:28 AM
Gibbage1 wrote:
- Well if the A-10 has 20% (just random numbers) of
- its weight to armor and is 20,000 pounds, that means
- it has 4000lb's of armor. If the Su-25 has 20%
- armor (equivilant) and its 10,000 pounds, that means
- it has 2000 pounds of armor. Sure it has an
- "eqiviliant" of an A-10's armor, but the A-10 is
- still better protected. Is this what you mean?
That is not what i ment. Su25 has also Titanium armor, coupled with titanium control rods and a lot of other feature. Just read Afgan war records and see how the Rook camme back after being shoot to pieces.
What i mean is that Su25 has equivalent protection like the A10. COuple that with the speed and maneuvrabilty and u might get the picture. And Speed do count in CAS since the missions are low level, covered by ground, ingress is very fast usually a total surprise..

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