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View Full Version : why the Lawbringer it's so OP



Dakaal
09-24-2017, 10:40 PM
why the Lawbringer got so much attention till he become super OP in Dominion, it's hard to kill i dont know how much HP he have, but he have at least 7 bars , he have so many fallow ups, and faints, I had a match right now, my entire team didn't menage to kill the Lawbringer, my Valkyrie with 180 gear score barely scratch him, i am sick of this ****ing game, i keep coming back everyday, i get upset and rant, but my question is... How the Devs from Ubisoft calculated the Lawbringer buff and the Warlord nerf, i want to see the data

G4y_aZn_BoY420
09-24-2017, 11:16 PM
He's really not OP, he's just a one of valks many terrible match ups.

UbiJurassic
09-24-2017, 11:50 PM
The Warlord nerf was done in response to feedback players have been sending to us for quite some time. Many aspects of his kit were too strong when compared to other heroes in the same class type. With Lawbringer however, his buff was meant to help his poor dueling potential, something many players agreed upon. Something to remember when fighting Lawbringer is that he is a counter-attacker and many aspects of his kit revolve around following up after you attack. Forcing him to try unsafe openers should allow Valkyrie the opportunity to lay him out and get the damage you need in.

UnhappyLawbro
09-25-2017, 12:14 AM
After Warden, Warlord, Raider, Centurion, Ninja, Gladiator and Highlander, now even the Lawbringer is OP? What's next, bloody conqueror? How about we just make all character 1 hp so you can win every single fight without learning and practicing?

ChampionRuby50g
09-25-2017, 12:37 AM
The only thing that could possibly be OP on Lawbringer is the light after shove, according to a lot of people. Aside from that, I would say he is a very well balanced hero. He has slow attacks which are easily parried, lights and heavy. Valk been your hero against him would be a reason you struggled. She isn't a strong hero ATM.

kweassa1
09-25-2017, 02:23 AM
In a sense, Lawb and Conq share common problems, sort of as if the Lawb's a slightly rearranged/reskinned Conq.

Systematically speaking, both are quite limited in offense, being essentially "one-trick ponies" in the fact there's not much to be gained by aggressive defense. So both play the reactive/passive defense game -- supblock on Conq makes it very unlikely for anyone to try using heavies on a Conq, so the Conq usually only needs to handle directional variance in light attacks. It limits the opponent's options severely, making the next attack and timing predictable, which in turn makes it even more easier to defend/parry and counter. The Lawb follows this same suite, in which case the krapshi* of a move block-shove limits ALL of the opponent's attempts be it light or heavy, and therefore also extremely limits the opponent's option of attack, and any failed attempts directly leading to small but frustrating counter attack damage.

Hence, both classes degenerate the fight into this long and boring, drawn-out staring contest which usually goes in favor of the Lawb/Conq if the opponent's attack attempts are frequently thwarted, and ends up with the Lawb/Conq just continuously and slowly chipping HP off the other guy, while the other guy's just frustrated of the passive and boring attitude the Lawb/Conq maintains.

I'm all in for overhaul to both classes, but that's gotta mean something has to give. If changes are made to help Lawb/Conq use better and more useful attacks, then proportionately something from the defense has to give: Conq supblock needs to have the guranteed GB removed, and the Lawb block-shove needs the "light" removed as a guarantee in any situation. No friggin' "can be dodged if..." or "can be blocked when..." stupid scenarios -- just straight up "got pushed -> saw Lawb attack indicator -> block" block.

ArchDukeInstinct
09-25-2017, 02:35 AM
What's next, bloody conqueror?

That's already happening.

We.the.North
09-25-2017, 02:41 AM
The Warlord nerf was done in response to feedback players have been sending to us for quite some time. Many aspects of his kit were too strong when compared to other heroes in the same class type. With Lawbringer however, his buff was meant to help his poor dueling potential, something many players agreed upon. Something to remember when fighting Lawbringer is that he is a counter-attacker and many aspects of his kit revolve around following up after you attack. Forcing him to try unsafe openers should allow Valkyrie the opportunity to lay him out and get the damage you need in.

The Lawbringer buff for Duels were on point. He's in a better place.

However, the "Poke" into almost garanteed wallsplat move is still infuriating and broken in 4v4. That much guaranteed damage from a gank should be nerfed down. Either remove the wall splat from that move or cut the distance the Lawbringer can carry you over in half.

G4y_aZn_BoY420
09-25-2017, 02:45 AM
The Lawbringer buff for Duels were on point. He's in a better place.

However, the "Poke" into almost garanteed wallsplat move is still infuriating and broken in 4v4. That much guaranteed damage from a gank should be nerfed down. Either remove the wall splat from that move or cut the distance the Lawbringer can carry you over in half.

Least its blockable unlike raiders. Also doesnt eat your whole stam bar.

Cac.maus
09-28-2017, 12:08 PM
That's already happening.

Can I ask how is conq going to be OP?

Haemmerst0rm
09-28-2017, 12:17 PM
The Warlord nerf was done in response to feedback players have been sending to us for quite some time. Many aspects of his kit were too strong when compared to other heroes in the same class type. With Lawbringer however, his buff was meant to help his poor dueling potential, something many players agreed upon. Something to remember when fighting Lawbringer is that he is a counter-attacker and many aspects of his kit revolve around following up after you attack. Forcing him to try unsafe openers should allow Valkyrie the opportunity to lay him out and get the damage you need in.

About the warlord nerf, you did that on request of the brainless community. But have you heard any complaints from the top tier players? No. They stated that warlord was balanced and wasnt OP. I really wonder how you are thinking about balance? What kind of data do you use? Are you competent enough to balance stuff or need to hire better balancing people?

Warlord was as balanced as gladiator. Those were the model-heroes you had to use for to balance the other heroes to their level. Also: there are 0 warlords in duel/brawl/dominion now since your nerf. Have you ever wondered why? If not: warlord is trash tier now. I do not know if you know this? You gutted this hero into the dirt. Revert the changes and do proper balance changes like any other game instead of saying: "we did it on request of the community". Not the whole community complained about it, just a very little fraction of it.

Netcode_err_404
09-28-2017, 12:37 PM
About the warlord nerf, you did that on request of the brainless community. But have you heard any complaints from the top tier players? No. They stated that warlord was balanced and wasnt OP. I really wonder how you are thinking about balance? What kind of data do you use? Are you competent enough to balance stuff or need to hire better balancing people?

Warlord was as balanced as gladiator. Those were the model-heroes you had to use for to balance the other heroes to their level. Also: there are 0 warlords in duel/brawl/dominion now since your nerf. Have you ever wondered why? If not: warlord is trash tier now. I do not know if you know this? You gutted this hero into the dirt. Revert the changes and do proper balance changes like any other game instead of saying: "we did it on request of the community". Not the whole community complained about it, just a very little fraction of it.


Ahahahahah

DrinkinMyStella
09-28-2017, 01:15 PM
im not sure what its called but his spike charge needs to be nerved, it drags your so far and most of the time your hit a wall and then its a free heavy and light or it will throw you of a ledge.

Haemmerst0rm
09-28-2017, 01:17 PM
Ahahahahah

Whats so funny? Are you always like a saddist on these forums? Being cocky and such?

ChampionRuby50g
09-28-2017, 01:30 PM
About the warlord nerf, you did that on request of the brainless community. But have you heard any complaints from the top tier players? No. They stated that warlord was balanced and wasnt OP. I really wonder how you are thinking about balance? What kind of data do you use? Are you competent enough to balance stuff or need to hire better balancing people?

Warlord was as balanced as gladiator. Those were the model-heroes you had to use for to balance the other heroes to their level. Also: there are 0 warlords in duel/brawl/dominion now since your nerf. Have you ever wondered why? If not: warlord is trash tier now. I do not know if you know this? You gutted this hero into the dirt. Revert the changes and do proper balance changes like any other game instead of saying: "we did it on request of the community". Not the whole community complained about it, just a very little fraction of it.

Warlord was NOT balanced. Do you think that the majority of players chose Warlord in tournaments just because he's fun to play? No, they chose him because he literally had the most effective kit to fight with. He had almost 0 cons, everything that every other hero had, amazing throw distance, more health than LB with feats (pre feat nerf), could trade heavies with you all day and win everytime, Full Block was incredibly strong. Amazing recovery times for a HEAVY class. His headbutt was strong, although reachable. In the hands of a good player, in 4v4 and geared up he was far above the other heros. He was basically on top of every tier list.
Don't forget about how he had very safe light attacks, and a incredible zone.

Yes, he was possible to beat like any other hero. He was too strong, and top tier players shouldn't be the only people to have a say in game balance.

S0Mi_xD
09-28-2017, 01:37 PM
About the warlord nerf, you did that on request of the brainless community. But have you heard any complaints from the top tier players? No. They stated that warlord was balanced and wasnt OP. I really wonder how you are thinking about balance? What kind of data do you use? Are you competent enough to balance stuff or need to hire better balancing people?

Warlord was as balanced as gladiator. Those were the model-heroes you had to use for to balance the other heroes to their level. Also: there are 0 warlords in duel/brawl/dominion now since your nerf. Have you ever wondered why? If not: warlord is trash tier now. I do not know if you know this? You gutted this hero into the dirt. Revert the changes and do proper balance changes like any other game instead of saying: "we did it on request of the community". Not the whole community complained about it, just a very little fraction of it.

Everything they nerfed was requested or better say mentioned by many experienced players.
Exactly those changes, that happened.

My opinion on it is, they overdid it, by fulfill most of those things people complained about.
The only thing that wasn't needed was the head butt delay.
In exchange they could have give him a Heavy - heavy combo, because his mix-up potential is pretty low.

But instead of adapting to actually having some weak spots, like full block isn't safe anymore or dodges are always safe, they start to exaggerate excessively, calling him trash tier etc. even if he is still viable and better than most heroes.
That's why they do not play him, they are to lazy to adapt, or better say - he isn't "invincible" anymore, that's why many people drop him.
So they go to the next one they can abuse, until he gets balanced.

Top tier players do not complain about it (most of them) because they play those heroes xDDDD because they where to good, why should they shoot themselves in their own leg :'D.
Are you really so narrow minded to believe that top players always want the best for the game? No they want the best for themselves, because most of them are egoistic.

For them the best char is the one they can abuse/exploit the best. Every other hero is trash.

Aarpian
09-28-2017, 02:04 PM
About the warlord nerf, you did that on request of the brainless community. But have you heard any complaints from the top tier players? No. They stated that warlord was balanced and wasnt OP. I really wonder how you are thinking about balance? What kind of data do you use? Are you competent enough to balance stuff or need to hire better balancing people?

Warlord was as balanced as gladiator. Those were the model-heroes you had to use for to balance the other heroes to their level. Also: there are 0 warlords in duel/brawl/dominion now since your nerf. Have you ever wondered why? If not: warlord is trash tier now. I do not know if you know this? You gutted this hero into the dirt. Revert the changes and do proper balance changes like any other game instead of saying: "we did it on request of the community". Not the whole community complained about it, just a very little fraction of it.

The **** are you talking about? We were telling them Warlord was OP since release. You only had a couple of fanboys who would fully admit that he was overpowered, they only argued that other characters needing bringing up to his level instead.

Netcode_err_404
09-28-2017, 02:15 PM
Whats so funny? Are you always like a saddist on these forums? Being cocky and such?

You make me smile :)

Well, not you, but more like what you type. :)

SangLong524
09-28-2017, 02:26 PM
Just because u cant kill lawbringer with your Valk doesn't mean he's OP. I've killed many lawbringers with my undeveloped prestige level 4 valk. I'm sure many people out there can claim the same or better.

Devils-_-legacy
09-28-2017, 02:29 PM
Why would u buff more hero's to put them in line when u could nurf one?

Nokhchalla
09-28-2017, 03:44 PM
The Lawbringer buff for Duels were on point. He's in a better place.

However, the "Poke" into almost garanteed wallsplat move is still infuriating and broken in 4v4. That much guaranteed damage from a gank should be nerfed down. Either remove the wall splat from that move or cut the distance the Lawbringer can carry you over in half.

The poke + wallsplat is basically Lawbringers only opener which can be easily blocked if you are in guard mode, so no, it should not be removed or nerfed.

SemperFortis201
09-28-2017, 06:20 PM
Least its blockable unlike raiders. Also doesnt eat your whole stam bar.


The poke + wallsplat is basically Lawbringers only opener which can be easily blocked if you are in guard mode, so no, it should not be removed or nerfed.

Both good points, unlike raiders wild charge it doesnt touch the recievers stam at all. Not to mention if its blocked LB will be OOS or damn near it depending on gear, it always comes from the same side, if its parried he is guaranteed to be OOS, and even when it lands it consumes well over half his stam bar. Getting blindsided with it in dominion sucks but thats the nature of 4v4. No different than getting blindsided by a shibobi GB, wild charge, cent pin, etc.

Netcode_err_404
09-28-2017, 07:53 PM
Both good points, unlike raiders wild charge it doesnt touch the recievers stam at all. Not to mention if its blocked LB will be OOS or damn near it depending on gear, it always comes from the same side, if its parried he is guaranteed to be OOS, and even when it lands it consumes well over half his stam bar. Getting blindsided with it in dominion sucks but thats the nature of 4v4. No different than getting blindsided by a shibobi GB, wild charge, cent pin, etc.

In 4v4 is a totally cheap way to deal damage/insta kill. The throwing distance needs to be reduced for every similiar unlock charges

Lyskir
09-28-2017, 08:35 PM
nah Lawbro is fine, his blockshove + light is really anoying but even with that he is not op