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View Full Version : My thoughts after 240 hours of playing For Honor



big.meme
09-23-2017, 05:49 PM
I honestly don't know why I'm posting this. I have never posted in a forum before, but I feel like I need to voice my opinion about this game in a more constructive way before I end up smashing my keyboard or something. To be completely honest, this was probably one of my favorite games that I've ever played. The concept, the design, the customization, the combat - everything about it was great. I even preordered the gold edition. In no way do I regret buying this game, but I've come to a point where I'm just really frustrated.

As I've mentioned, I've played this game for over 240 hours in between college and working a full-time job upon graduating, but I've noticed recently that this game doesn't bring me the same enjoyment as it did previously and I can't quite figure out at what point my feelings toward this game changed. It seems that no matter what game mode I play, or character I choose, I just end up getting mad (which I find unusual because I'm not the type of person who generally gets mad when playing video games). I can recognize it's just a game and there is no reason to be upset over it, but this game is different.

Even after 240 hours of playing this game, I feel that there is no indication that I've improved as a player. Just one small slip-up and you're dead. When it comes to the game modes - either in 4v4 you get ganked and die or in 1v1 you die to cheap exploits or bugs. People are constantly just throwing out light spam or only safe attacks, which I can understand; I want to win just as much as the next guy, so there is no reason for them to be throwing anything else. Otherwise, in 4v4 you get ganked and die 0.5 seconds later only to be taunted or called out in the chat with something like "Wow you're so trash at this game" (I'm assuming because I'm not the best in a 3v1 situation). The toxic player base is a whole other issue, but I don't want to beat that dead horse, and I can't blame Ubisoft for the behavior of other people because that isn't their fault.

It's also pretty ironic coming from someone who works full-time in a Customer Support position, positing something that I would generally roll my eyes at, but I guess what I want to say is that I wish For Honor all the best. I've had a lot of fun playing this game, but I think I should probably just take a break or something because I'm spending hours out of my day getting mad at a video game for no reason, and quite frankly that's just stupid. I would love to see where For Honor is later on, and I'm probably going to continue wasting the little free time that I have getting mad at a video game, but For Honor is a great concept that I hope succeeds in the future. Right now, I think there are just too many things wrong with the game (such as balance changes and bug fixes) that can be fixed quick enough to satisfy the majority of this unreasonable player base, but I certainly hope you don't give up trying.

Thanks for reading this, whoever you are.

We.the.North
09-23-2017, 07:53 PM
I get where you are coming from, a lot of things in this game induces rage and I can pinpoint exactly what they are. But I keep on playing, trying as best I can to avoid those rage inducing things and hopefully, the talk about the next balance patch coming on September 28th Warrior's Den will bring back some hope of better days to come.

All the rage inducing things can be summarize in one simle word : Cheese. Bare in mind, there are other things wrong in this game outside its gameplay, but I'll stay focused purely on gameplay for now :

Cheese #1 : Safe moves

There aren't a lot, but some moves are 100% safe to do. Gladiator zone for instance. I see a lot of them spamming it and if it missed, they cancel and back dodge to reset. Repeat. This bring a feeling of hopelessness as you can do very little against that.


Cheese #2 : Stunlock

Some characters can stunlock other characters even while their target is taking damage or activates revenge. This is "ok" in duel, but as soon we enter 4v4, it's cancerous. Losing control over your character is always rage inducing.


Cheese #3 : 50/50

Some moves in this game are a real coin toss. For instance, Warden might shoulder bash ; might cancel into a guard break. No matter if you are the best player in the world or not, it always comes down to a 50/50 and thus, even if you have 240 hours experience with the game, it's still a 50/50.


#4 : Proliferation of unblockable moves

In season 1, there were barely any unblockables or they were way easier to react to. Now, since most new characters came with their load of unblockable, ganks have become way more difficult to handle. This lead to way more "snowballing" effect in Dominion where the winning team has a higher chance of winning than the losing team as a chance of making a come back. Feats unlocking faster for the winning team also makes it hard for the losing team to make a come back.


#5 : Gear stats in 4v4

It's hard to balance both 1v1 and 4v4. But with the ******ed "defense penetration" stat on gear, 4v4 is basically a gamemode where everyone deals 20% more damage. As a result, all of the above "cheese" will be able to close fights 20% faster. Surviving a gank, especially with a stunlock, becomes near impossible.

big.meme
09-23-2017, 10:46 PM
I think you just about hit the nail on the head with that one, those are all terrific points. And as I said previously - thanks for reading this and thank you for taking the time to respond. I'm glad I'm not the only one feeling this way. I would very much like to continue playing For Honor, so I'm looking forward to see what Ubisoft has planned for Sept. 28th

UbiNoty
09-23-2017, 11:29 PM
Thank you for your good wishes. I hope that the fun and enjoyable memories of the time you spent with FH will outweigh any negative ones.
We're working on addressing the balance issues in many aspects of FH - heroes, combat systems, fight mechanics, matchmaking - and we're doing our best to make sure that we do a good job of it, which is why turnaround and responsiveness isn't as quick as might be ideal. But trust me when I say that the team only has the Player's and For Honor's best interests at heart. We want to make decisions that will lead to better and healthier gameplay, and will do our best to make it so.

I understand it can be frustrating, and I'm very sorry. I hope that one day we can show you a For Honor that will win your loyalty and your trust back.
Thank you once again for voicing your thoughts in such an earnest and poignant way and I'd like to personally send your post to the team as a heartfelt message from the players.

UbiNoty

Malyngo
09-23-2017, 11:39 PM
We.the.North makes some very good point, I just want to comment on his #5: Gear stats.
I think that is a really difficult one. The gear is something that people can kinda grind for, and it is really nice to get something cool after a match. Though playing the game should be reward enough, as it should be fun, the Skinner Box is a strong concept in human minds.

So I don't know if removing these would be the best idea. Though, maybe, it could be enough to only give gear looks? Hm, I am not sure.
I can imagine that especially new players will work through some rough times in the beginning because of "when I have better gear, it will probably be easier".

I kinda liked how gear stats will boost one stat while lowering another, so they are kind off a tradeoff. But, blue gear can give you plus on all the stats, and also Some stats are clearly more desirable than others, it seems. So there maybe some work needed on the stats themselves.
Maybe the only plus sides gear (with lower overall stats) should rather be the gear you get in the beginning, to give newbies an easier time (they don't know anything about which stats are good, in the beginning I often stuck to what I had instead of equipping the new stuff)

SwellChemosabe
09-23-2017, 11:40 PM
Don't worry ya'll, soon as we get those dedicated servers I can almost guarantee we're gonna see the game population sky rocket :)

We believe in you ubisoft! keep up the good work.

@OP, I feel what you're saying my guy. It can be disappointing sometimes. I work night shifts and I've got obligations elsewhere, so when you sit down to relax by playing a video game it can be pretty tough when you realize you can't relax because you're getting so upset at the one thing you were relying on to wind down with what little time you got. I love this game, soon as I saw the trailers back in 2015 my first thought was "Finally! now that's something I can get hyped about!"

I still play regularly, and I find that a good way to get around that frustration is to play with friends, hold your own little custom tourneys, go into brawls together and just goof around. But no one here can judge you for wanting to take a break, believe me, we've all been there. Hope to see you back in the ranks soon! :)

Sir.Nguyen
09-24-2017, 05:53 AM
Gear stats should never have been a thing to be honest. It makes balancing an already unbalanced game much harder. If you just had cosmetics that would have been better. More like Dota 2 and Counter Strike format. I wouldn't mind trying my luck in "legendary chests" for just legendary pieces but make it fair like in kind of like in Dota 2 where you always get something, but could get a bonus.

big.meme
09-24-2017, 07:55 AM
Hi UbiNoty,

I really do appreciate you taking the time to read and respond to my comment, it truly does mean a lot. I definitely do not regret purchasing this game or pouring over 200 hours into it, so I don't feel an apology is necessary. I actually don't blame you guys for how I'm feeling, even though that may seem ironic considering my previous post. In any case, I completely understand the delay for balance changes and bug fixes as those do take time to get right. Additionally, as I watch the Warriors Den streams and consistent updates to the game, I can tell you guys really care and your reasoning is with the best of intentions. With that said, I wish you and your team (as well as For Honor) all the best and I look forward to playing again soon.

gj4063
09-24-2017, 01:42 PM
Don't worry OP, For Honor will be fine. Ubi is building exactly the game that they want... for the 4 or 5 people that are still playing it in 2018 when it is finally out of beta.

Ubi, these are the feelings of a typical gamer in this day and age. Most people aren't interested in hanging out waiting for this game to take whole new directions and eventually get stable servers. Like third guy who id's struggling to pour his finger on why he doesn't like it, butt he knows he doesn't like it. Cater to them if you want to be profitable.

Kaijudub
09-25-2017, 04:18 PM
Dear OP.

I and many other day one players share the exact sentiments that you posted. I for one put in more time than i'd care to share on this game and it turned me into an angry person. Every opponent you face you end up thinking "****" regardless of the character they play.

I've moved onto other games recently, and I and my mrs instantly noticed the change from grumpy kaiju to back to normal mildly happy Kaiju.

The funny thing is, The division made me feel exactly the same way.

Ubisoft are very good at publishing rage inducing games. Most of the rage revolves around the fact that these games have awesome concepts but upon release are normally broken.

I wish you luck.

Devils-_-legacy
09-25-2017, 04:26 PM
This is there first attempt at this sort of game it's out there comfort zone and there not doing that bad but I seem to be the minority

PeanutBlock
09-25-2017, 05:42 PM
I get where you are coming from, a lot of things in this game induces rage and I can pinpoint exactly what they are. But I keep on playing, trying as best I can to avoid those rage inducing things and hopefully, the talk about the next balance patch coming on September 28th Warrior's Den will bring back some hope of better days to come.

All the rage inducing things can be summarize in one simle word : Cheese. Bare in mind, there are other things wrong in this game outside its gameplay, but I'll stay focused purely on gameplay for now :

Cheese #1 : Safe moves

There aren't a lot, but some moves are 100% safe to do. Gladiator zone for instance. I see a lot of them spamming it and if it missed, they cancel and back dodge to reset. Repeat. This bring a feeling of hopelessness as you can do very little against that.


Cheese #2 : Stunlock

Some characters can stunlock other characters even while their target is taking damage or activates revenge. This is "ok" in duel, but as soon we enter 4v4, it's cancerous. Losing control over your character is always rage inducing.


Cheese #3 : 50/50

Some moves in this game are a real coin toss. For instance, Warden might shoulder bash ; might cancel into a guard break. No matter if you are the best player in the world or not, it always comes down to a 50/50 and thus, even if you have 240 hours experience with the game, it's still a 50/50.


#4 : Proliferation of unblockable moves

In season 1, there were barely any unblockables or they were way easier to react to. Now, since most new characters came with their load of unblockable, ganks have become way more difficult to handle. This lead to way more "snowballing" effect in Dominion where the winning team has a higher chance of winning than the losing team as a chance of making a come back. Feats unlocking faster for the winning team also makes it hard for the losing team to make a come back.


#5 : Gear stats in 4v4

It's hard to balance both 1v1 and 4v4. But with the ******ed "defense penetration" stat on gear, 4v4 is basically a gamemode where everyone deals 20% more damage. As a result, all of the above "cheese" will be able to close fights 20% faster. Surviving a gank, especially with a stunlock, becomes near impossible.

So much of this is right on point. Especially the stuff about Stun lock, unblockables and Defense Penetration. The combo of these makes 4v4 modes complete ******** sometimes.

Trying to parry unblockable after unblockable in an outnumbered scenario is a load of ****, especially when your auto-parry on Revenge doesn't work half the time and on normal parries, you parry on attack, but a second attack hits you before your parry animation even finishes. What the **** are you suppose to do? You HAVE to parry the unblockable but the animation makes you vulnerable to the next ****er swinging top heavies at you because he delayed it slightly from the one you parried.

And Defense Penetration.. don' get me started. Who the **** though adding a single stat that basically negates THREE items worth of stats was a good idea?

Sometimes I wonder if they even think before htey add some of this **** to the game.

StriderBorne
09-26-2017, 03:45 PM
Yeah I think I'm about done also. Ya'll aren't going to balance the game, seems to be just a delay tactic until you decide it isn't worth spending anymore money because the population is low and move on to the next project.

Rikuto01.tv
09-26-2017, 04:07 PM
Even after 240 hours of playing this game, I feel that there is no indication that I've improved as a player. Just one small slip-up and you're dead. When it comes to the game modes - either in 4v4 you get ganked and die or in 1v1 you die to cheap exploits or bugs.


Allow me to tell you where you are as a player.

You don't "get ganked". You fail as a team mate and find yourself alone and vulnerable. You don't "die to exploits or bugs", you fail to do what is necessary to win while your opponent is stronger minded and unbound by the fictitious prison of rules you have created in your mind.

Finally, the fact you are making excuses such as these indicates you fit Sirlins classic definition of a "scrub", as can be read about here (http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub). It is one of the earliest stages a competitive player can be in, meaning you have yet to make any progress whatsoever.

In short, you are incredibly lacking as a player and have a long way to go. Good luck.

gj4063
09-26-2017, 07:04 PM
Allow me to tell you where you are as a player.

You don't "get ganked". You fail as a team mate and find yourself alone and vulnerable. You don't "die to exploits or bugs", you fail to do what is necessary to win while your opponent is stronger minded and unbound by the fictitious prison of rules you have created in your mind.

Finally, the fact you are making excuses such as these indicates you fit Sirlins classic definition of a "scrub", as can be read about here (http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub). It is one of the earliest stages a competitive player can be in, meaning you have yet to make any progress whatsoever.

In short, you are incredibly lacking as a player and have a long way to go. Good luck.

The git gud skreb argument is usually accurate, except in this case where we're discussing a game that has a player base in free fall due to (1) p2p servers running circa 1987 quality netcode, and (2) min-max characters, heavy on CC and stamina drains negating what should otherwise be a twitch combat game. Ir doesn't need to be Crossy Road easy to attract newbs but what FH is, is not bringing in the paying average joe anytime soon. So they can either cater to the very few hardcore and string this song out as long as possible, or they can address its failings inspite of the hardcore cheerleaders.

TheUglyHunter
09-26-2017, 08:09 PM
I have played many games that are published by Ubisoft studios and most of them are awesome, but in this series I only like Prince of Persia Warrior Within and no doubt this is the best game ever. I would suggest you to play that game 240 hours and share your thoughts because you will never get bored even after playing it 240 hours.