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Jezzadog
06-27-2004, 12:32 AM
This book appears to be well respected in the real world. So how useful is it as reference material for IL2FB 'ground training' purposes?

Does anyone know a point of sale for the book in Australia?

Jezzadog
06-27-2004, 12:32 AM
This book appears to be well respected in the real world. So how useful is it as reference material for IL2FB 'ground training' purposes?

Does anyone know a point of sale for the book in Australia?

Waldo.Pepper
06-27-2004, 12:52 AM
Good book - not very useful as IL2/FB/AEP is just a game - remember. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Don't know how much it cost - mine is a pdf file.

Freycinet
06-27-2004, 03:25 AM
Heavy reading, but i'd say it is VERY useful for Il-2 FB players. The energy tactics described in the book can be perfectly employed in the game.

For instance, the book helped me understand that if I couldn't turn horizontally with an opponent I was chasing, I could just pulll up in the turn, convert speed into altitude, turn more sharply, and remain on his tail from a good, high position.

There's lot's of info like that which can help you. If you fly only with a buddy, even more.

It basically gives a very complete understanding of combat maneuvering, which things are healthy to do, which aren't. And it can really be applied in Il-2FB... - In 90% of online dogfights it's the man, not the machine which counts, as the really good players will show you.

BBB_Hyperion
06-27-2004, 04:57 AM
Its a good book but only about 50 % of the tactics work in FB for several reasons.

High Ground is not only more agreeable and salubrious, but more convenient from a military point of view; low ground is not only damp and unhealthy, but also disadvantageous for fighting.

Sun Tzu : The Art of War

Regards,
Hyperion

VMF513_Viper
06-27-2004, 06:16 AM
Waldo,

Can you send me this PDF File?

S! Viper

<table style="filter:glow(color=Navy Blue, strength=3"><tr><td> <B><font color=white>Viper<BR>Commanding Officer VMF-513
http://www.vmf513.com
UBI Movie Maker Forum Moderator
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"Chance Favors The Prepared Mind"
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Blottogg
06-27-2004, 12:15 PM
I like the book, despite Robert Shaw being a Squid (Navy type.) The subjects include missile tactics which obviously aren't needed for Il-2, but the gunfighting tactics are informative and useful, especially for full FM aircraft flown by players on-line. Not everything is applicable in Il-2, due to limitations of the flight model engine (high altitude performance and simple Ai FM's, as examples), but even so it's a valuable read.

If the PDF transfer doesn't work, Barnes & Noble still carries it:

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=z0s1Off6Sa&isbn=0870210599&itm=1

I didn't find it at Amazon (typical), but some of the aviation oriented book stores/web sites might carry it as well.

Blotto

"Speed is life." - Anon
"Sight is life. Speed is merely groovy." - "Junior"

XyZspineZyX
06-27-2004, 02:29 PM
The book is heavy reading to be sure, very technical and dry, but what you can get out of it is invaluable for flight simming.

The concepts allow you to also see some of the gaping holes in this particular FM, too: how AI planes can "turn in place on their CG", the "physics light" energy retention of certain planes (which render some time tested energy tactics much less effective), etc.

ridgeback_01
06-27-2004, 08:45 PM
It's available at Napoleons online bookshop. They have shops in Brisbane and Melbourne. Link is:

www.napoleons.com.au/home.html (http://www.napoleons.com.au/home.html)

Do a search on Shaw as the author and it will come up - $85.00 (ouch!!)

Cheers

Mark

TacticalYak3
06-27-2004, 10:25 PM
Why not consider borrowing it from your local library like I did mate?

I would say worthwhile to read. There are some stuff not applicable, but as others have said gives you a good understanding of E flying. Plus decent read on wingman tactics.

There are also tons of interesting quotes that are insightful in themselves.

Happy reading!

TactS!

___________________________________________

"My Luftwaffe is invincible . . . And so now we turn to England. How long will this one last - two, three weeks?" (Hermann Goring, June 1940)

:FI:TacticalS!

JG14_Josf
06-27-2004, 11:09 PM
Sustained turn technique (http://mysite.verizon.net/res0l0yx/sustained%20turn%20technique.htm)

The above is an example of how "Fighter Combat" can be a valuable tool in understanding fighter combat and applying this knowledge to the game.

When I read the words Boom and Zoom it makes me wonder. No where are those words written in that book. Why?

Read the book and perhaps you can figure it out.

Waldo.Pepper
06-28-2004, 01:04 AM
Viper need a way to get a hold of you.

VMF513_Viper
06-28-2004, 02:28 AM
boyington214@cox.net

There ya go waldo

<table style="filter:glow(color=Navy Blue, strength=3"><tr><td> <B><font color=white>Viper<BR>Commanding Officer VMF-513
http://www.vmf513.com
UBI Movie Maker Forum Moderator
Virtual War Cinema Admin
http://www.virtualwarcinema.com
"Chance Favors The Prepared Mind"
<BR></font></td></tr></table></B>

Jezzadog
06-28-2004, 03:38 AM
Thanks guys for the rundown and advice. Seems its cerebral and dry (just my kind of book) but worth perusal as an instructional tool for A2A.

Mark's $85 (ouch) is noted; and, in fact, raised by a "yikes". http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/cry.gif

Good thinking, TactS, but I'll need to travel a little further than MY local library for the book. I believe the only aviation book there is Enid Blyton's "Noddy and Big Ears Fly United" (a ripping yarn though) http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif

Regards all,

Jezza the dog from Oz