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View Full Version : 4v4 ESL Tournaments Should Be The Focus



xECS DESTROYER
07-31-2017, 03:26 PM
I participated in the ESL Hero Series tourney (NA Xbox), and I believe that while the 1v1 tournament was a great idea, the current issues with characters such as Raider and Warlord who just run around unlocked damages the potential amount of viewers the game could receive. No one wants to see two fighters just running around in circles.

I understand that the chances of 4v4 are slim until dedicated servers help stabilize team-based game variants, but I believe 4v4 tournaments will bring more excitement.
There will be less staring contests and unlock maneuvers because there will be more fights involving multiple heroes. The issues with the defensive meta will be removed during most of the gameplay with the only occasions being when 1 player is left alive on each team (which does not happen often).

I think most hardcore players realize that this game was built more for the team mode variants rather than 1v1, so I believe that tournaments involving team-based gameplay will bring larger excitement for the viewers and help the game grow more in popularity.

CandleInTheDark
07-31-2017, 04:19 PM
The dominion matches were certainly far more entertaining to watch than the duels in the premiere stream. 1v1's may get more interesting with the meta changes and like you say they need to get the connection right first, there is no point in showing people this is all the awesome stuff you can do if they can't finish a match, and I would argue they need to do something with the crowd control whether fixes for it or changing matchmaking so that you can get single pick without denying someone using their main (assuming there is ranked for pug groups and not just pre-mades).

xECS DESTROYER
07-31-2017, 05:07 PM
I believe single pick is a must for any tournament play. In every competitive team game that is popular, this is the focus. By doing single pick, you actually have to build strategies around a certain character or two on your team, and counter the opponent's team based on who they select. That is what makes Rainbow Six Siege so fun, because certain maps create better opportunities for specific operators.

With Halo, what makes their competitive scene so amazing is the diversity of game types. This creates a necessity to have different types of players on your e-sports team. With For Honor, every game type involves strictly slaying besides dominion. Having a couple more objective modes with minions providing more of an impact would be a great addition. Also, if the servers could handle it, having a big-team style mode with 6v6 components would be fantastic, especially if there was a siege mode where attackers were ACTUALLY attackers by having to take certain points of the fortress to move on.

CandleInTheDark
07-31-2017, 05:15 PM
I believe single pick is a must for any tournament play. In every competitive team game that is popular, this is the focus. By doing single pick, you actually have to build strategies around a certain character or two on your team, and counter the opponent's team based on who they select. That is what makes Rainbow Six Siege so fun, because certain maps create better opportunities for specific operators.

With Halo, what makes their competitive scene so amazing is the diversity of game types. This creates a necessity to have different types of players on your e-sports team. With For Honor, every game type involves strictly slaying besides dominion. Having a couple more objective modes with minions providing more of an impact would be a great addition. Also, if the servers could handle it, having a big-team style mode with 6v6 components would be fantastic, especially if there was a siege mode where attackers were ACTUALLY attackers by having to take certain points of the fortress to move on.

If they are going with single pick then they need to do one of two things if they intend to have pug groups as well as premades in my opinion, either disable gear stats all together because for epic you're looking at 100 levels to get into, legendary I am guessing by the current pattern will be 140, or they need to change the matchmaking so people can be matched into groups without the character they want, the system used for brawl would screw a lot of people over if gear stats are involved.

I do agree that objective based game modes would be an awesome thing, I am quite interested in what season 4 will bring in that regard.

xECS DESTROYER
07-31-2017, 05:46 PM
Single pick in my opinion should only be for ranked and tournament modes. This would leave the casual 4v4 variants to allow multiple picks of the same hero.
Gear score definitely needs to be removed in ranked 4v4. This would make it similar to Injustice in how gear is allocated in different game types.

CandleInTheDark
07-31-2017, 05:52 PM
Single pick in my opinion should only be for ranked and tournament modes. This would leave the casual 4v4 variants to allow multiple picks of the same hero.
Gear score definitely needs to be removed in ranked 4v4. This would make it similar to Injustice in how gear is allocated in different game types.

The thing is that there are people who only play one character. Without gear score I could get by easy enough but then there is one I have on gold gear and four I am working to get up there, not everyone is in that position.

xECS DESTROYER
07-31-2017, 07:41 PM
I believe that for Ranked, you should be able to play more than one character effectively, because of how map variation can impact strategy. Because it would be competitive, each player should be able to play more than one hero, like in Siege.

I can see where others may disagree, but I think it is reasonable to put in effort to learn more than one character for the competitive scene. Raider is my favorite hero in For Honor, but I have learned how to play every hero other than Kensei to a recently skilled level.

xECS DESTROYER
07-31-2017, 07:42 PM
Decently*

Trbevis
07-31-2017, 07:50 PM
Fully agree with this, i like that they are doing tournaments and ranked ect and i understand duel is a good olace to start, but bring in team modes!

And about the one pick i fully agree, for ranked and that, i dont think its too much of an issue, i doubt ranked or tournies will appeal to new people and i dont believe believe people with experoence dont have at the vwry least 2 or 3 heroes theyve repped up, i have i think 4 fairly high reps that i can play with, its boring just playing with the same hero over and over

CandleInTheDark
07-31-2017, 07:53 PM
I believe that for Ranked, you should be able to play more than one character effectively, because of how map variation can impact strategy. Because it would be competitive, each player should be able to play more than one hero, like in Siege.

I can see where others may disagree, but I think it is reasonable to put in effort to learn more than one character for the competitive scene. Raider is my favorite hero in For Honor, but I have learned how to play every hero other than Kensei to a recently skilled level.

Yeah without gear score it is more of a viable thing, I main peacekeeper and can do everything in her kit, she is in gold gear, will be in green gear (pretty sure I only need to spend crates as is), I can play warden pretty well and I have him in purple, then all in blue I have nobushi, shinobi and berserker (I am an assassin guy, only people with assassin somewhere I have no levels in are centurion and orochi >.>) with conqueror and valkyrie on the outside though at current levels of skill that would be scraping the barrel for me.

On the other hand there are people I have seen on here say they only do Warlord or Raider or whatever, though yeah I do get a good deal of where you are coming from.

Alustar.
08-01-2017, 12:54 AM
The thing is that there are people who only play one character. Without gear score I could get by easy enough but then there is one I have on gold gear and four I am working to get up there, not everyone is in that position.

maybe queue as your hero, and the matchmaker then filters in players based on roles, vanguard/heavy/assassin/hybrid.

Rikuto01.tv
08-01-2017, 01:21 AM
4v4 needs to be relegated to leagues, ladders, and playoffs. Not direct tournament signups.

The fact of the matter is that while its the most popular mode casually, it is extremely difficult to get that many people organized into functional teams together for tournaments.

It's been given a chance in the past several times and has failed in tournament setting. Even 2v2 struggles in that area, though not as harshly.

nufrancis
08-01-2017, 05:03 AM
WARNING !!!

Centurion Squad detected :rolleyes:

I agreed with this. Dominion tournament will be better than duels, but I also disagree with character lock. Everyone has their own main and specialty. Locking characters will take away players freedom.

Again, before this tournament roll out, they have to nerf Cent, if not all team will use cent. Take away his pinning ability for first step and we'll see how he fare in dominion.

Also there is shinobi, in gangin situation his long range GBcan pull you out from far away.

Both of them will be favorite for dominion.

UbiNoty
08-03-2017, 01:41 AM
More competitive 4v4 modes is definitely something we're working towards and the transition to dedicated servers will definitely help us to progress in our goals towards achieving that. Duel is a much more stable mode, which is why we went with duel only for our first major tournament.

But I agree, I would love to see competitive dominion as it would promote the evolution of higher level dominion teamplay and strategy. The turtle meta was actually more of a problem in duel and not dominion (since ganking and teammates exist), and the upcoming def meta changes should definitely make dominion a bit more exciting and fast-paced as well. It will happen one day.