PDA

View Full Version : Shugoki vs. Valk



SikanderAzam
07-31-2017, 12:14 AM
I just dominated someone on his main Warden 3-0. He readied up for a second round, but got mad and picked Shugoki. I lost 0-3. It's shameful, because I know Shugoki is regarded as a pretty low tier hero, but... He has way way more health than Valk, Valk does basically no damage so he laugh when she hits him. On the other hand, he has uninterruptible stance so I can't chain things properly. If I try to he can literally GB me out of a chain due to his stance and smack me down for nearly a third of my health. All he has to do is stand there and wait for me to attack, absorb one or two, then smack me for a third of my health. And it really doesn't help that if you block one of Valks dashes or side step lights, or anything at all really, you can a free GB since her recovery time is so heinously and unfairly bad. Any tank can just turtle up and punish instead of actually, you know, fighting, and they'll win because they can last longer. I've spent almost all of my time on FH learning Valk, and I love the style, but I'm starting to see why so few people bother with her--she's just not feasible if your opponent a) isn't an idiot or b) just knows how to cheese a Valk. Nobody in high skill level uses her, because it's suicidal. I hate it... But Valk is just a really really bad class right now I think. (Even fighting other Valks, I can see this, because I know the weaknesses and it's a joke to beat her because they're so easily exploited)

That_guy44
07-31-2017, 02:00 AM
Walk up to shugoki and gb him. His UI stance is gone. Problem solved.

SikanderAzam
07-31-2017, 02:15 AM
Walk up to shugoki and gb him. His UI stance is gone. Problem solved.

In the lowest levels that may work, but most people aren't such bozos that you can just walk up and GB. Only I'm that dumb. Me and maybe a couple potatoes laying around these forums.

Linnix1
07-31-2017, 02:20 AM
Parry, headbutt, trip, suck him into your vortex cause shugoki can't dodge out of it, may take a few years but he'll slowly bleed out. Rinse and repeat the trip combo and boom he can't do nothing.

Tyrjo
07-31-2017, 06:40 AM
Shugoki is laughably weak against fast attacking heroes. Once his UI stance is gone and the battle tips the wrong way for him, it's over.

My.Insanity
07-31-2017, 07:31 AM
yes Valk is too punishable for nearly everything... i struggle too against Shugoki.. i can always land 1 light attack but at the same time i will receive 1 light and a headbutt which throws me out of range so he can build his HA. Best you can do is GB him and hope he dont use light attacks all the time to block it or use a heavy / faint ... .Zone cancel / GB

Antonioj26
07-31-2017, 08:15 AM
Parry, headbutt, trip, suck him into your vortex cause shugoki can't dodge out of it, may take a few years but he'll slowly bleed out. Rinse and repeat the trip combo and boom he can't do nothing.

why would you headbutt and trip after a parry? I don't even think you can sweep after headbutt because I've never bothered trying it, You literally get the same reward of 25 damage if you just gb and heavied and you've wasted less of your own stamina. Secondly Valkyrie doesn't have a vortex, her sweep mixup is prevented by blocking the second light or dodging the shield bash, both of which are completely reactable and even if you flub that you can cgb the gb or dodge the sweep.

Shugo not being able to dodge the sweep is a myth, every character can dodge and it's also a myth that the dodge has to be from the opposite side of the sweep. none of her attacks apply bleed aside from the shoulder pin and that wasn't even mentioned so not sure what you mean by bleed out.

In short, definitely don't follow this guys advice. It sounds like he hasn't played valk more than a few rounds, he's not even taking into account how many times shugos UI would have replenished in this entire build of getting off 25 damage total. He also didn't think about how your stamina would be gone long before a shugo would be dead.

Honestly fishing for parries is the best course. Shugos are quite possibly the worst character to deal with turtles. He has no fast lights and no unblockables that can reliably crack open a shell. Once he gives up being aggressive than gb to get rid of HA, I know it can suck to turtle but really one of the few ways to not be constantly trading a light for a gb or heavy. Once he turtles though it might be hard to crack him open but at least you have a couple tools that are a bit better than his.

SikanderAzam
07-31-2017, 09:44 PM
why would you headbutt and trip after a parry? I don't even think you can sweep after headbutt because I've never bothered trying it, You literally get the same reward of 25 damage if you just gb and heavied and you've wasted less of your own stamina. Secondly Valkyrie doesn't have a vortex, her sweep mixup is prevented by blocking the second light or dodging the shield bash, both of which are completely reactable and even if you flub that you can cgb the gb or dodge the sweep.

Shugo not being able to dodge the sweep is a myth, every character can dodge and it's also a myth that the dodge has to be from the opposite side of the sweep. none of her attacks apply bleed aside from the shoulder pin and that wasn't even mentioned so not sure what you mean by bleed out.

In short, definitely don't follow this guys advice. It sounds like he hasn't played valk more than a few rounds, he's not even taking into account how many times shugos UI would have replenished in this entire build of getting off 25 damage total. He also didn't think about how your stamina would be gone long before a shugo would be dead.

Honestly fishing for parries is the best course. Shugos are quite possibly the worst character to deal with turtles. He has no fast lights and no unblockables that can reliably crack open a shell. Once he gives up being aggressive than gb to get rid of HA, I know it can suck to turtle but really one of the few ways to not be constantly trading a light for a gb or heavy. Once he turtles though it might be hard to crack him open but at least you have a couple tools that are a bit better than his.

You seem to understand my woes... I guess they could be called... the plight of the valkyrie... anyone? Anyone? But yeah, I'm not really sure what class that guy was referring to, because it sure as hell wasn't the Valkyrie since he's referencing moves that we don't have.
I guess that's the best thing to do is fish for parries, I just never cared much for turtling up. Noted for future reference.

UbiInsulin
07-31-2017, 10:17 PM
the plight of the valkyrie... anyone? Anyone?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yd0fBXwDBmo