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View Full Version : Faction war boost, any constructive ideas about this?



CandleInTheDark
07-28-2017, 07:12 PM
I've read (and made, quite rantily made) posts on the boost system when it comes to faction war. The general consensus I have seen, from people I know to be in all factions, is that the system as it stands is not transparent and that as it stands it both gives one faction an advantage and makes the whole round boil down to the last two days and who is doing worst towards the end. The general message has been 'Fix It'.

I am very much behind that, the question is how? Personally I would like it turned off and this isn't just reacting to how the end of the season went down, we all had the same rules, season 2 is done and buried, congrats to the samurai, I dislike the mechanic whoever is benefiting from it, I think the end of round fights without it, especially round three where it all went down to territories quickly changing hands right to the death, are much better and more satisfying. But playing what if, what if the devs either don't want to turn it off or had a good reason for having it in that just turning it off would break things more?

Honestly I don't have any ideas and I am not impartial and so not entirely reasoned in this, but the reps (well, mostly Noty) have spent the last couple of days easing the hurts of hacked off knights and hacked off samurai, this is about helping them with the other part of their jobs, taking feedback and suggestions to the devs. We know some things they have done are similar to things people have posted here, whether they had it in mind anyway or they thought hey that's a good idea, so if 'Fix It' isn't turn it off, how should the devs fix it?

EDIT: For that matter while this is about the boost, does anyone have any ideas for faction war as a whole? Like a way of communicating on the map DON'T ATTACK THE VIKINGS would have been good for the knights in that last round, the numbers we had not withstanding, though how they manage that without it being a whole stream of flooded messages I have no idea.

UbiNoty
07-29-2017, 12:46 AM
I think the boost is meant as a comeback mechanic. So even if you're down in territories factions will keep fighting because they know they boost gives them a better chance. There's a lot of factors that go into it, and the results of any season are the results of the collective effort of the entire playerbase. So even we probably couldn't accurately predict how things certain mechanics would impact the faction war. Maybe the boost is too effective right now and could be tempered - this is only our second season and some things are a part of the learning process for us too.

So, with that being said, as we're in the process of improving on the faction war, I'd really love to hear more ideas and thoughts on it.

CandleInTheDark
07-29-2017, 10:14 AM
I had a think about it last night and I think I have a theory on how the boost affects things and possibly on something that can be done (well the latter is one I saw from someone else, just refined it).

Bearing in mind this is all guesswork, but let's ignore the boost for a moment, I remember we saw a graph of the times that different factions put in assets. The knights put in a constant rate, let's call it 3, and the samurai and vikings peak and trough, so let's call the extremes to that 5 and 1. So starting in the morning UTC, the vikings start off very strong at 5 and take some territories against the knights and make a lot of ground against the samurai who are at 1. Throughout the day, the vikings start to dip so the knights take back some of their turf, the samurai are still only managing to get their act into gear as they approach 3, the knights have their best spell of the period because no one has a huge advantage at this time then we hit the night, the knights take back a lot of what the vikings took but are now outclassed by the samurai. The samurai make huge ground on the vikings because they are at 5 while the vikings are at 1 and we have a natural see-sawing based on who is most active when.

Thing is then we add the boost, and this is why, in my opinion, it came to the point where someone asked how come the knights went from 31 to 21 and the samurai only lost 6. So this time we will start at night, the knights have usually amassed a lead by this point, the samurai lost a whole lot all through the day, they hit the boost just as they are climbing through 2 or 3 and they still have it when they peak, so while the knights might have had some chance normally early on in the samurai rise, a time they are more or less even is a time they are actually at a disadvantage and meanwhile on the viking front the samurai absolutely hammer them from the start, the knights don't have much chance against the samurai because of the boost so some people focus on the vikings, now the vikings hit the boost, just like the samurai at a time they are 2 at worst possibly more likely at 3 or 4, so let's say 2, at best the knights are on an equal footing then as the viking asset allocation rises they are still in their boost, the knights take heavy losses, the samurai take heavier losses but knights get the boost, and here is the thing, there is no peak time for them, they are middle of the road, sometimes they might make the kind of heavy gains the others make, at others there is no super high time right when the odds favour them. Still, this allows them to stand up to whichever faction is in their ascendency some until they hit 5 and by then the boost is likely gone and sweep across the board through those that have their quiet patch. There are roughly two times in a 24 hour period when all factions are naturally roughly equal or as equal as they will be, the time that the vikings and samurai pass each other on their rise and fall but the boost makes it so that someone is always stronger. And this, I feel, is borne up by what we see most days (it doesn't always work out like this), knights end the day strong, get hammered first by the samurai then by the vikings then bounce back to end the day strong.

Now the idea I saw someone else have was that maybe the boost should stop at a faction's border. I'd like to expand on this a little, so what do we call the border? My take on it, and this won't be completely accurate until all the new territories are accessed in season 4, is you draw a three way intersection as to what the map would look like if everyone had equal territories and that is their home ground, at the point a faction is still in their own territory, they have the boost, I don't know what it is exactly but I have heard a two thirds to third split is what it generally is, outside of this point the territories start equal or to compensate for the 66/33 split, are maybe 45/55 down which would also take into account the whole peak hours thing.That second step would need a lot more monitoring and managing mind, I'm not so sure about that, but if you think about it in terms of if our little people were in their own game of thrones, you can liken the boost to the ruler conscripting and pulling all units they can afford at the front into reclaiming their own lands.

I don't know if this is a perfect solution, just what came to me in thinking about the natural ebb and flow.

RatedChaotic
07-29-2017, 01:21 PM
I say keep it simple. Remove the boost. Let us just fight it out. If the Samurai take the next 4 seasons so be it. Eventually players will get tired of it and will switch things up if they want the faction war to be any fun. From the complaints of the last few seasons. I'm sure we care about it enough to do what we can to help. Happens in other games when one faction is dominate. Players get tired of a one sided war and start sliding over to the other factions for a more challenged fight or experience. I've seen it in many faction type pvp games.

I personally always chose the underdog faction myself.

CandleInTheDark
07-29-2017, 01:28 PM
I say keep it simple. Remove the boost. If the Samurai take the next 4 seasons so be it. Eventually players will get tired of it and will switch things up if they want the faction war to be any fun. Happens in other games when one faction is dominate. Players get tired of a one sided war and start sliding over to the other factions for a more equal chance at the Faction War.

Yeah, like I said in the op, I favour turn it off but I have always hated it even when it was my faction that benefited so figured devil's advocate and all lol.

The_B0G_
07-29-2017, 01:58 PM
Yeah I was the one who brought up how while both Knights and Samurai were 31 at one point, Knights went down to 18 the following round while the Samurai went down to 23. Round assets and tiebreaker aside, the war would of ended completely different if Knights only went down to 23 territories as well.

Thats the only thing that still confuses me about the faction war, how do they decide who will get the bigger penalties? Why did Knights get a bigger one? When I logged on we were at 31 territories and just started a new round, but all territories we held were 33%-66% except for at least 1 on the Samurai border, so Knights and Samurai fought over 1 territory for 6 hours, which ended 50%-49% for Samurai.

Not sure how it works but some clarity would be nice.

I have an idea for a new way to play FW, I'll write it up at break, at work now.

CandleInTheDark
07-29-2017, 02:01 PM
Yeah I was the one who brought up how while both Knights and Samurai were 31 at one point, Knights went down to 18 the following round while the Samurai went down to 23. Round assets and tiebreaker aside, the war would of ended completely different if Knights only went down to 23 territories as well.

Thats the only thing that still confuses me about the faction war, how do they decide who will get the bigger penalties? Why did Knights get a bigger one? When I logged on we were at 31 territories and just started a new round, but all territories we held were 33%-66% except for at least 1 on the Samurai border, so Knights and Samurai fought over 1 territory for 6 hours, which ended 50%-49% for Samurai.

Not sure how it works but some clarity would be nice.

I have an idea for a new way to play FW, I'll write it up at break, at work now.

Yeah I thought it was you or someone else but I couldn't find it and didn't want to commit lol.