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View Full Version : Braking on a joystick axis...



Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 07:50 AM
Been trying to change my setup so that when I apply brakes it is done through the axis of a joystick. Specificaly if I lean the joystick forward I want this to be the application of the brakes.

But it doesn't seem to work. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Game doesn't seem to like it unless a key on the keyboard or a joystick button is pressed.

I even tried to edit the settings.ini file by hand to get it to apply. The game took it (when I went in the normal way to check the change had been registered) But still not dice.

Any bright ideas?

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 07:50 AM
Been trying to change my setup so that when I apply brakes it is done through the axis of a joystick. Specificaly if I lean the joystick forward I want this to be the application of the brakes.

But it doesn't seem to work. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Game doesn't seem to like it unless a key on the keyboard or a joystick button is pressed.

I even tried to edit the settings.ini file by hand to get it to apply. The game took it (when I went in the normal way to check the change had been registered) But still not dice.

Any bright ideas?

Hoarmurath
07-15-2004, 07:53 AM
you set it up in the end of the control command list, did you? it worked fine for me. The end of the commands list is where you can find all controls that can be assigned an axis in game.

http://hoarmurath.free.fr/images/sighoar.jpg (http://hoarmurath.free.fr/)

ednavar
07-15-2004, 09:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Waldo.Pepper:
Been trying to change my setup so that when I apply brakes it is done through the axis of a joystick. Specificaly if I lean the joystick forward I want this to be the application of the brakes.
...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just to be nosy, but how would it work during take off? Let say you wanna lift your tail to gain speed, leaning the joystick forward would result in nosing down the runway I suppose.

S! Waldo http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif (he knows why http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif)

Ed

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 09:37 AM
OK http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

More details...

Uhmm I have two joysticks plugged in.... X45 as ID2 (which I use to do most everything - flying shooting etc)... and the one I'm talking about.. which I have modified into rudder pedals - via the twist function.

Then I got to thinking ..."if I could push on both pedals at the same time... (i.e. the rudder pedals joystick being pushed away from me!) then that would make it just like differential braking"

So if I set it up in the hotas controls... it does't work right. The brakes are being applied ALL THE TIME...rather than only when I press on (away from me like toe brakes) both pedals - which is the goal.

If I try to setup the axis to be brakes under the section with flaps ,gear etc... then it won't recognize the axis (only key press or joystick button) unless I edit the settings.ini file by hand. Then it recognizes the axis but fails to function at all.

Bugger! It was a good though off beat idea. I don't think I can make this work.

Hoarmurath
07-15-2004, 09:45 AM
waldo, the place you try to assign your axis to brakes is reserved for keys/buttons, there is a special section for assigning axis... scroll down, it is at the end of the list.

http://hoarmurath.free.fr/images/sighoar.jpg (http://hoarmurath.free.fr/)

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 09:50 AM
Thanks Hoar.. for your persistance (sp?)
I know.. but when I assign it there... the brakes are applied ALL THE TIME (whether I press them or not) making taxi/takeoff/anything impossible.

AnalFissure
07-15-2004, 10:02 AM
the problem is that your joystick has springs, mate. It centers itself halfway in the range of y axis motion, so you're getting half brakes applied constantly

Maybe you can re-calibrate and narrow the range so you get the zero value at center, and maximum value at the full forward position.

ZG77_Lignite
07-15-2004, 10:06 AM
That sounds like a problem with the joystick then Mr. Pepper, you might try swapping in the X45 just to check. It should work fine (not really 'differential', but still braking on the axis) if you assign the axis in the 'HOTAS' setup inside FB, for example, that is exactly how my CH rudder pedals work (V axis I believe? memory fails).

Lion_13
07-15-2004, 10:40 AM
I have the brakes, under FB HOTAS Control Settings, assigned to the X45 throttle's rudder (Z-axis). I discovered, after a couple of scarey takeoff attempts, that the brakes are 50% applied. So now I press and hold the left side of the switch in during takeoffs and landings. Becareful, if you release the switch too soon on landing, you will flip, release the switch gradually to prevent this from occurring.

I haven't been able to work around this yet.

Zeus-cat
07-15-2004, 10:57 AM
I set up my brakes on the throttle control of my old joystick. It works great. I use my MS FFB2 as my main stick and my old Logitech Wingman as ID2.

The only thing you need to be careful is that you select the control in the proper direction. I set the throttle at 0%, selected it as brakes in HOTAS and ran it up to 100%. I still have the "B" key set on the keyboard if I just want to touch the brakes.

Zeus-cat

BaldieJr
07-15-2004, 11:04 AM
You need to recallibrate the stick or rearrange the potentiometer.

Joystick axis are always at center of their travel. The potentiometer goes from 0k to 100k, and rests at 50k.

If you open up the callibration util and never pull the stick back you should be able to fool windows into thinking that dead center is minimal stick input.

The only other option is to hack at the hardware.

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 11:18 AM
Analfissure...

First off.. nice handle...

Yup - know that - already tried that...I think that it is obvious that this is the essence of the problem... will richard around with this more.

ZG77_Lignite

The rudder joystick tests fine... on this computer and others... retested today. The rudder function is set to z axis (the twist function) and my goal is u axis (forward- backward) however I will only be pressing forward.


Lion_13

I can solve your problem.

Here's how - pay attention its a little complex but not too bad.

Firstly assign a key in il2 that is brakes. Lets say b for brakes. This is in the regular section not HOTAS setup.

Now go into the hotas setup and clear the setting you made.

Now use the saitek profiling software to change the way the rocker rudder behaves.
Right click on rudder choose bands.
Then break the rudder bands into 4 segments. 0-25% 25-50% 50-75% 75-100%
Now you can make full left equivalent to a keypress and full right equvalent to a keypress. Leave the middle two blank...so it looks like this.

0-25% = B
25-50% =
50-75% =
76-100% =B

So that a full press either way will be a brake press.

In my profile I use the rocker rudder switch on the x45 hotas as the mixture control. .. full left for increase mix.. full right for decrease mix. Works great. Saitek on their website has a zip file that is a html based Manual on their profiling softwear that goes into more detail.

Hope thats clear if not let me know.

BaldiJr

Yup..I know..I agree. The way I have it setup right now it is impossible to pull the stick as I made a plywood cradle to cripple its backward (toward me) movement..will let you know.

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 11:37 AM
Alright! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I got it to work...and it is ever sweet. I know its not differential braking per se. But does it ever SIMULATE it really nicely. If I want to turn left I can just push left rudder pedal...(like always) if thats not enough and I'm taxiing slowly enough I can add a touch of brake but shoving both rudder pedals forward a touch. Because I'm already putting some left rudder in it will work rather perfectly for taxing and such.

The solution was to realize that it was being miss assigned -y Axis is what I wanted.

In short I was doing it wrong.

Thanks everyone. Now my ground handling should match the precision of my flying.

(Hmmpt! Yeah right) http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BaldieJr
07-15-2004, 11:45 AM
How about a few pics? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 11:59 AM
Oh man - but its ugly!

I don't mean ugly like "oh well I can love her in a few years" But ugly like "she better own a distilery ugly!"

But it works well...guess that what counts.

I made it from an old stick (with a twist function) some scrap light steel and plywood. HAHAHA http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Man is that ever crummy sounding eh?

The only thing I needed to buy was a hoseclamp. Total budget was under a buck.

I posted a pick after I finished it a few months ago but the pic is long since gone.

I was going to make (and may still do so) a real swanky pair of pedals that even look like the pedals in a fw190 or me262 (shaped like feet with little straps and all - you know?!) I even cut the steel and drilled out the holes for the footy parts. (and the strapd too!)

But then this ugly pair went and worked really well! And there was no wiring or anything.

I'l see if I can find a pic... might take till tomorrow.

Thanks for all the help tips and advice guys!

SparrowThree
07-15-2004, 12:23 PM
I was thinking of doing this very thing with my spare Saitek EVO. Twist for rudder pedals, forward for brake. Did you just stick some rudder pedals on the existing joystick or did you transfer the pot and other pieces to a different base?

I would love to see a photo.

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 12:27 PM
I found some pics I took of this thing...

I just went to photobucket to setup an acount but they are down for a few days they say... any alternatives?

SparrowThree
07-15-2004, 12:39 PM
email them to webmaster@ringside.com and i'll host them for you.

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 12:58 PM
Ok sparrow you've got mail. Thanks!

SparrowThree
07-15-2004, 01:10 PM
Not bad at all Mr.Pepper, especially when you consider the price.

http://www.ringside.com/personal/waldopedals-1.jpg

http://www.ringside.com/personal/waldopedals-2.jpg

I was going to throw the EVO on Ebay, but now you've got me thinking. I am going to try and build a base for the pot and stick hardware to sit in, minus the actual joystick base.

Waldo.Pepper
07-15-2004, 01:19 PM
Thanks Sparrowthree.. you are fast - appreciate it.

As you can see make pedals... screw them to a bar then to a base... then hose clamp the base to the stick (so you can take them off if need be)...then make a cradle to hold the stick upright.

Since the pics were taken I also made a little base with a non skid mat beneath to keep 'em in place.

Good thing they sit under my desk so I don't have to look at them all that often. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif