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VoIume Control
06-20-2017, 11:27 PM
How many post about connection problems do you need?

Blackout 1 wasnt enough?

whiteout FAILED

Blackout 3 will come if you dont SHOW servers solutions that work. GET DEDICATED SERVERS

Duuklah
06-20-2017, 11:55 PM
They are probably cleaning out the boxes in their office as I type.. Roman should be fired and never work in development again.

UbiJurassic
06-21-2017, 02:19 AM
We are aware of the connection issues players have shared with us and development still holds it as a top priority. We will be looking to get more information on when another stability focused patch will be released.

KiahsRevenge
06-21-2017, 08:44 AM
"We are aware of the connection issues players have shared with us and development still holds it as a top priority. We will be looking to get more information on when another stability focused patch will be released."


I hope so. Unlikely for the near future is my bet.
6-8 months sounds more likely. My interest in For Honor dies with every disconnection...I would love to be able to play 2 games in a row!?

C00tBAjenkins
06-21-2017, 10:43 AM
So, if this is a p2p deal with a simulation for each game state. Why is it so difficult to add a server as host for said simulation instead of a player?

Aarpian
06-21-2017, 10:51 AM
They are probably cleaning out the boxes in their office as I type.. Roman should be fired and never work in development again.

While Roman is awful at his job, I don't think his job includes oversight of the networking.

This one I actually have a lot of sympathy for Ubi on - they basically had to create an entirely new architecture for this game and rush it out the door. It's a miracle it works at all.

My connection issues are certainly no where near as bad as they were in the past, and it's about as stable as any other online game I've played (and much better than tekken 7)

C00tBAjenkins
06-21-2017, 10:59 AM
While Roman is awful at his job, I don't think his job includes oversight of the networking.

This one I actually have a lot of sympathy for Ubi on - they basically had to create an entirely new architecture for this game and rush it out the door. It's a miracle it works at all.

My connection issues are certainly no where near as bad as they were in the past, and it's about as stable as any other online game I've played (and much better than tekken 7)

4 years isn't exactly rushing out the door

Gray360UK
06-21-2017, 11:05 AM
they basically had to create an entirely new architecture for this game


Did they have to? Why? It doesn't work so wouldn't it have been better to have normal servers?

C00tBAjenkins
06-21-2017, 11:18 AM
Did they have to? Why? It doesn't work so wouldn't it have been better to have normal servers?

I think the latency involved would have given a much worse overall experience. Thats just a guess though. It serves a purpose the way its enabled but I think a redundant state of the match on a server would solve all connection issues.

nur1sl4m
06-21-2017, 11:22 AM
soo sad........

D3j4.Vu
06-21-2017, 11:31 AM
I must admit it is recently much better than it used to be. I get 1 - 2 dced per night which is absolutely acceptable for myself

Gray360UK
06-21-2017, 11:44 AM
I think the latency involved would have given a much worse overall experience. Thats just a guess though. It serves a purpose the way its enabled but I think a redundant state of the match on a server would solve all connection issues.

I can't see that to be honest, I've played MMOs for years and shooters like Battlefield, all of them with their own dedicated servers. Yes lag can cause problems sometimes, and 'Yeah yeah, blame the lag' has always been a bit of a meme / joke in these games if you die and don't want to admit that you suck, but in reality the experience is usually very stable. These are games people play day in and day out for years and enjoy doing so. Lag does not ruin these games in the way that P2P ruins For Honor.

Are we really supposed to believe it would be impossible for For Honor to run on dedicated servers when games like Battlefield do and still handle the precision timing required to headshot a moving target from across a map with a Sniper Rifle?

World of Warcraft is so complex when it comes to combat that I used to have 4 quickbars of attacks and several combinations of moves and trinkets bound to programmable keys, and I would enter into combat against numerous enemies with a similar array of skills and abilities. Timing was vital, Stuns and Damage Over TIme moves and Heal Over Time spells and Evasion moves all had timers and cooldowns and split second timing was vital to activating them at the right moment. Times that by 20 players in a 10 vs 10 Capture the Flag mode like Warsong Gulch ... all taking place on a dedicated server in real time ... you get the idea I'm sure ...

I'm not buying that in For Honor, where I press my Right Trigger to hit you with a Heavy attack while you try to dodge is too complex to be able to run on a dedicated server.

I'd take occasional lag over a server that collapses whenever someone leaves any day.

DrExtrem
06-21-2017, 11:50 AM
At this point, they should make games vs bots more customizable. Bot level and maybe aggressiveness and playstyle should be selectable.

PvP is getting more and more toxic, difficult to matchmake and unstable. While playing alone with and vs. bots is certainly not ideal (and not the way I would have liked to enjoy the game, when I brought it), it at least works. This mode allows to use combos and gives fluid fights.

Really. Top priority: Adjust the game to the platforms Individually, to take the different visual output, controller input and fps issue into account and add adjustments to botmatches.

Aarpian
06-21-2017, 12:16 PM
It's not a matter of being too complex - dedicated servers will always have higher latency than p2p. In a fighting game where milliseconds matter, that lag is unacceptable.

WoW was very different because you could buffer attacks and the game would account for that latency in the buffer. Trying to do that to For Honor makes things that were reactable completely unreactable.

Nexo.C
06-21-2017, 12:48 PM
It's not a matter of being too complex - dedicated servers will always have higher latency than p2p. In a fighting game where milliseconds matter, that lag is unacceptable.

WoW was very different because you could buffer attacks and the game would account for that latency in the buffer. Trying to do that to For Honor makes things that were reactable completely unreactable.

This. I think players would go crazy about blocking something and the attack does just run through it. Or imagine parries. But no one knows, perhaps it would be a better overall experience.
Now they have to roll with P2P and improving that. And they have to do it quick. And additional to that, they really do have to improve the their own Server Enviroment. Ubis server outtages have nothing to do with P2P.

Gray360UK
06-21-2017, 12:58 PM
It's not a matter of being too complex - dedicated servers will always have higher latency than p2p. In a fighting game where milliseconds matter, that lag is unacceptable.

WoW was very different because you could buffer attacks and the game would account for that latency in the buffer. Trying to do that to For Honor makes things that were reactable completely unreactable.

There are things in WoW Raids that you need to react to perfectly with precision timing or else you die and your entire raid team wipes. People have DPS meters and cooldown monitoring mods so that they can precisely time when to activate a move or a trinket or a buff to maximize their DPS. This is in milliseconds. Maybe you've never belonged to a top rading guild in WoW, but reacting in seconds just won't cut it. I clearly remember the days of watching numerous bars count down and waiting for the last millisecond before activating a skill. In PvP, if you don't follow an Ambush with a Stun fast enough your opponent escapes. If you don't follow a Stun with a Gouge fast enough your opponent escapes. The faster you can react the better you do.

How about Battlefield, like I said, dedicated servers can hande the timing required to shoot a rider on a horse moving at speed with a sniper rifle from across a map while accounting for distance and bullet drop. Latency would destroy that. You can't be a second out or your shot will miss.

Why is this kind of precision possible on a dedicated server but in For Honor it would be impossible to press X when you see a Guardbreak incoming?

In reality it's just not the case that in 2017 with the kind of internet speeds we have these days that people are unable to perform attacks that require precision timing or respond quickly to incoming threats on dedicated servers. Certainly it's not my experience anyway. I could be wrong, maybe you really can't do what For Honor asks you to do on a dedicated server. I doubt it very much though.

WABO423
06-21-2017, 01:21 PM
There are things in WoW Raids that you need to react to perfectly with precision timing or else you die and your entire raid team wipes. People have DPS meters and cooldown monitoring mods so that they can precisely time when to activate a move or a trinket or a buff to maximize their DPS. This is in milliseconds. Maybe you've never belonged to a top rading guild in WoW, but reacting in seconds just won't cut it. I clearly remember the days of watching numerous bars count down and waiting for the last millisecond before activating a skill. In PvP, if you don't follow an Ambush with a Stun fast enough your opponent escapes. If you don't follow a Stun with a Gouge fast enough your opponent escapes. The faster you can react the better you do.

How about Battlefield, like I said, dedicated servers can hande the timing required to shoot a rider on a horse moving at speed with a sniper rifle from across a map while accounting for distance and bullet drop. Latency would destroy that. You can't be a second out or your shot will miss.

Why is this kind of precision possible on a dedicated server but in For Honor it would be impossible to press X when you see a Guardbreak incoming?

In reality it's just not the case that in 2017 with the kind of internet speeds we have these days that people are unable to perform attacks that require precision timing or respond quickly to incoming threats on dedicated servers. Certainly it's not my experience anyway. I could be wrong, maybe you really can't do what For Honor asks you to do on a dedicated server. I doubt it very much though.

If precision timing wasn't possible in for honor on dedicated servers wouldn't the obvious fix for something like CGB be to just extent the window slightly? I find it hard to believe it could not work on dedicated servers like you said.

Temjinyuy
06-21-2017, 01:32 PM
How many post about connection problems do you need?

Blackout 1 wasnt enough?

whiteout FAILED

Blackout 3 will come if you dont SHOW servers solutions that work. GET DEDICATED SERVERS

Dedicated servers would be a terrible idea! People already complain about light spam as it is. imagine some one how has a superior connection which gives the a 100ms (or more) advantage? That will be game breaking for anyone that goes against them.

Whats better?

1 in 4 games that disconnect or 1 in 4 games that fair?

The way the P2P works in for honor is so everyone is on a equal playing field no host advantage or connection advantage. No point in complaining about problems that UBI and DEVS are aware and don't think for a second that they are ignoring you.


Also BLACK OUTS are stupid idea. This game has been supported from day one and they are giving constant updates since launch. This is a new IP no other game out there that is equal to For Honor i can't imagine how complex the code is for this game so people please have some patience! Also there are other games out there is far worse condition after 4 months of release.

Feel free to rage at me if you wish :)

Gray360UK
06-21-2017, 02:25 PM
If precision timing wasn't possible in for honor on dedicated servers wouldn't the obvious fix for something like CGB be to just extent the window slightly? I find it hard to believe it could not work on dedicated servers like you said.

Exactly, I was thinking about this after I posted. Surely the worst that could happen would be slightly slower combat, longer reaction windows, slower incoming threats, a slightly slower pace. I don't believe the difference would have to be massive, assuming we accept that a difference would be needed at all.

thornh
06-21-2017, 02:29 PM
I agree with Gray360UK. I personally prefer single player games over online games but for those I have played quite a bit of I have never had the issues that I have had with For Honor. In the past year other than For Honor I have played Battlefield, SW Battlefront, Overwatch and Smite. Particularly Smite. Someone will correct because I'm not a tech head with the online stuff (I grew up putting a cartridge in an Atari 2600) but, for lack of a better term, there's quite a bit of stuff happening continuously in a game like Smite and I NEVER had any issues at all online. I'd play for hours and hours and would never be disconnected, never lose end of match rewards, etc. Yes, there would be moments of lag but that ultimately was a result of my router not being able to handle things when both my son and I were playing on separate PS4s.

I really believe there was a huge battle at Ubisoft over the server issue. Decisions were made at some point and they ran with P2P. Remember we were supposed to have split screen play too and that was removed. I'd love to know the true story one day. Jason Vandenberghe isn't there anymore for a reason. Either he was against the P2P idea or it was his idea. Either way, to have the guy who continuously talked up this game for years to leave the team right after release seems very odd. Something big went down and we will probably never know the whole truth.

Capoupacap
06-21-2017, 03:46 PM
Just remain Ubisoft reputation in term of multiplayer quality experience ;)

Tyrjo
06-21-2017, 04:23 PM
I really believe there was a huge battle at Ubisoft over the server issue. Decisions were made at some point and they ran with P2P. Remember we were supposed to have split screen play too and that was removed. I'd love to know the true story one day. Jason Vandenberghe isn't there anymore for a reason. Either he was against the P2P idea or it was his idea. Either way, to have the guy who continuously talked up this game for years to leave the team right after release seems very odd. Something big went down and we will probably never know the whole truth.

The true story reads time...and money. Which is the same thing in this regard. I'm only guessing here, but it probably was that Jason VandenBerghe wanted to delay the release since they game wasn't finished. Or he wanted to continue developing after the release with the same amount of resources to be able to make the game into what he _really_ envisioned.


They are probably cleaning out the boxes in their office as I type.. Roman should be fired and never work in development again.


While Roman is awful at his job, I don't think his job includes oversight of the networking.

This one I actually have a lot of sympathy for Ubi on - they basically had to create an entirely new architecture for this game and rush it out the door. It's a miracle it works at all.

My connection issues are certainly no where near as bad as they were in the past, and it's about as stable as any other online game I've played (and much better than tekken 7)

It's easy to stand by the sidelines and comment on someone else not doing their job. Until you have experience as a project leader in a multi million dollar project before (which you haven't and I have) you don't really know what you are talking about. Decisions are so much harder to make when you own the responsibility, have a budget and maybe someone on a higher level setting the conditions your work with. Sometimes it simply is not possible to solve every problem thrown at you. My guess is that the dev team is only a fraction of what it once was, and I think Roman and Damien (and everyone else left on the team) are doing their out most to solve the problems the game still has.

C00tBAjenkins
06-21-2017, 05:25 PM
Exactly, I was thinking about this after I posted. Surely the worst that could happen would be slightly slower combat, longer reaction windows, slower incoming threats, a slightly slower pace. I don't believe the difference would have to be massive, assuming we accept that a difference would be needed at all.

The deal with a server is that info from you has to transfer to the server and then from server to other players and vice versa. That takes time.

For honor works by (im sure everyone knows) creating simulations. My guess is Really low latency is achieved in this state by vary small packets of data being sent and received simultaneously to each player. All the moves already have that buffer for latency built in. The game is optimized for this.

Dedicated servers would require all of that to be reworked. You might aswell make a new game at that point. I was thinking on how to get the best of both worlds. The low latency of this p2p and the stability of a server run game without an entire rework.

Also, Did any of you play battlefield 4 on launch? It was horrible. Dying behind cover, shots not registering, teleporting players all kinds of goofy stuff. It took a long long time for that to get worked out. So as much as this has issue's they are pretty small anymore and i think it has more to do with people's interweb connections than the game itself.

Tillo.
06-21-2017, 05:34 PM
Soon™ strikes back...

thornh
06-21-2017, 05:39 PM
The true story reads time...and money. Which is the same thing in this regard. I'm only guessing here, but it probably was that Jason VandenBerghe wanted to delay the release since they game wasn't finished. Or he wanted to continue developing after the release with the same amount of resources to be able to make the game into what he _really_ envisioned.

And this is where we have to go back to Ubisoft in general and not necessarily the developers. I think companies like Ubisoft and EA definitively prioritize release dates over vision. 14Feb17 was a date set in stone at some point and there was going to be a game released that day. Developers you better get your sh*t together and get this done. If Vandenberghe is a visionary, and I believe he is, then it is unfortunate that Ubisoft was the publisher he was finally able to sell his idea to. I'm a Sony supporter and, while I'm certainly not saying Sony does not put pressure on their developers to hit target dates, the culture at Sony seems to be one that is more developer friendly. I wonder how patient a company like Ubisoft would be with someone like Polyphony Digital's founder Kazunori Yamauchi, a true visionary and a man and a development team that has been given so much time to make his visions reality. Sony does it with Naughty Dog, Guerilla, Sony Santa Monica, etc. Love or hate Sony but you cannot argue that giving developers a little more freedom, and whole bunch more understanding, that the end products will truly speak for themselves. I wish EA, Ubisoft and Activision would honestly look at their business practices and seriously consider this type of approach. We all know they love money and we have to stop giving it to them so easily.

C00tBAjenkins
06-21-2017, 06:13 PM
And this is where we have to go back to Ubisoft in general and not necessarily the developers. I think companies like Ubisoft and EA definitively prioritize release dates over vision. 14Feb17 was a date set in stone at some point and there was going to be a game released that day. Developers you better get your sh*t together and get this done. If Vandenberghe is a visionary, and I believe he is, then it is unfortunate that Ubisoft was the publisher he was finally able to sell his idea to. I'm a Sony supporter and, while I'm certainly not saying Sony does not put pressure on their developers to hit target dates, the culture at Sony seems to be one that is more developer friendly. I wonder how patient a company like Ubisoft would be with someone like Polyphony Digital's founder Kazunori Yamauchi, a true visionary and a man and a development team that has been given so much time to make his visions reality. Sony does it with Naughty Dog, Guerilla, Sony Santa Monica, etc. Love or hate Sony but you cannot argue that giving developers a little more freedom, and whole bunch more understanding, that the end products will truly speak for themselves. I wish EA, Ubisoft and Activision would honestly look at their business practices and seriously consider this type of approach. We all know they love money and we have to stop giving it to them so easily.

I think sony must be in a much better spot to allow that. Ubi on the other hand probably not so much. I miss the old days of gaming when that was the main goal it seemed. Some of the best games i played were user created mods. Counter strike being one of them. To bad that's all been flushed out of the modern gaming industry.

CrunaCross
06-21-2017, 06:47 PM
How many post about connection problems do you need?

Blackout 1 wasnt enough?

whiteout FAILED

Blackout 3 will come if you dont SHOW servers solutions that work. GET DEDICATED SERVERS

Seriously. My gameplay will never be affected if you black out. At all. This is a game not a social movement. Your "Blackout" bullcrap will always fail because one simple reason. People will play if they feel like it, and they will not play if they don't feel like it. The devs have no obligation towards you or me, and they can drop the entire game right now if they want to. You have nothing. If you are bored of a game, do a blackout starting from now, and keep it up forever. Nothing will change.

FledgeSRondo
06-21-2017, 06:58 PM
See here's what I don't understand, I started playing Overwatch on PS4 last week (which uses dedicated servers afaik), and not only are there no disconnect issues at all but more importantly there's absolutely no lag or latency whatsoever, it's super stable and runs so smoothly for hours and hours without hiccups or frame drops whatsoever. I play For Honor on PS4 as well, and though I personally don't mind the DC's that folks complain about (which don't happen as regularly as they used to, and never really bothered me too much in the first place), it's the horrible latency and lag in For Honor that regularly throws off my input timing that puts me in a rage: parries to obviously telegraphed heavy attacks that were properly timed and should have connected but didnít, opponents whose speed shifts from slow to suddenly teleporting in frame jumps, trying to release a lock or shift guard stance block or just simply input an attack only for it to execute 1-2 inexorable seconds later (as though you're desynched slightly and are falling behind what's "actually" happening in the game timeline), the obvious framerate drops when multiple players appear onscreen. I keep hearing people saying P2P has a speed advantage, but in practice comparing two hairtrigger sensitive input timing games on the same platform using different connection methods that just hasn't borne out to be the case, at least in my experience, and for me it's this lag/latency that really makes play insufferable more than anything else. I have literally lost desperately close matches in their very final moments because of this, where glorious victory or cruel defeat is separated by the timing of one good parry, and when you're sitting there staring at the defeat screen in disbelief that the game very clearly failed to register your input there's nothing quite so miserable or discouraging.

DrExtrem
06-21-2017, 07:03 PM
@ tillo

Don't forget: "when it's done."

I just played my first match if he day - off course vs. bots, because I actually want to play instead of waiting and the ****ing bots on my team were obliterated while outnumbering the enemy. The did not come to help me against three of the enemies either. They were again unable to capture or hold a position and simply fixed the game. The enemy bots however were turtling and abusing my attacks start up time every ****ing move.

Even your PvAI has become a steaming pile of horse crap. Or did I win too many games yesterday and this is the "equalizer"?

Add to it, that I have to reset my console every time I want to play or the input lag of my controller becomes unbearable.

One game and I want to throw something solid into my tv screen. Pure frustration on all fronts and the best example for and inconsistent experience.

Gray360UK
06-21-2017, 07:08 PM
See here's what I don't understand, I started playing Overwatch on PS4 last week (which uses dedicated servers afaik), and not only are there no disconnect issues at all but more importantly there's absolutely no lag or latency whatsoever, it's super stable and runs so smoothly for hours and hours without hiccups or frame drops whatsoever.

Exactly. I don't really get how anyone can suggest that you can't perform actions that require timing and precision on dedicated servers, especially when most of us have been doing exactly that quite happily for years. You do not do anything so special, so unique or so new in For Honor that you are instantly struck with the thought 'wow this would never work on a dedicated server'. There seems to be some kind of lag myth, where people believe games that have dedicated servers are nothing but continuous lag fests with players moving as if in a sea of tar trying to shoot at or hit things that actually left the room 30 seconds ago. Maybe if this was the 90's and players were still using dial up modems but not in 2017.

DrExtrem
06-21-2017, 07:15 PM
We are having lag-fests ib this game as well and it has p2p.

Hell I played space marine - a pure p2p experience and that game was basically unplayable in mp, because of various players lagging around.

On the other hand, I played a lot of tf2 on dedicated servers - there, it was easy to vote-kick people with high lag, if the system did not take care of them by itself.

Dedicated servers and p2p systems both work with predictions to make sure, an online experience looks flawless - the question is, what part of the system makes the prediction. The dedicated server or your client.

In my experience, dedicated servers are better - period.

Temjinyuy
06-21-2017, 07:21 PM
See here's what I don't understand, I started playing Overwatch on PS4 last week (which uses dedicated servers afaik), and not only are there no disconnect issues at all but more importantly there's absolutely no lag or latency whatsoever, it's super stable and runs so smoothly for hours and hours without hiccups or frame drops whatsoever..

I also Play Overwatch and you can easily tell when you against some who has a better connection to the server. The thing is in Overwatch 100ms doesn't make a great deal of difference but in For Honor its does.

I kinda want them to bring out Dedicated server just to watch people B**** and moan about lag. Trust me if you ever played War of the Roses you will know what i mean.

Tillo.
06-21-2017, 08:09 PM
And to make it a large combo, support and the forum wods are the worst things we have ever met.
Lying, taking us by fools, pointing at our connection or net configurations instead of acknowledging that they have released a broken product and refund our money for it.
They wouldn't even let us rant closing threads all over the place, censoring mercenaries!

EDG_Avocado
06-22-2017, 12:17 AM
Just put in servers Ubisoft. The game is at its last breath. It needs cpr. Even with servers the game still has a really big chance of dying. But please just fullfill this game's last request.

Mia.Nora
06-22-2017, 02:43 AM
I completely agree with @Gray.

I play many online games, some of which require intense timing and reactions;

- like headshotting a running enemy with a sniper rifle from a very long distance

- LoL: flashing out of very fast incoming skillshot in LoL (Sona ult for example)

- Overwatch. /Period

- Elsword PvP arena. I am a star ranked Eve Nemesis & Empress. If you think making a mistake is too punishing in For Honor, go see that game PvP. If they start a combo on you you have to manabreak to survive at all. Latency of dedicated never ever been an issue at any point in a game that is extremely fast paced and punishing for mistakes.


Moreover, like I said in another thread. Here all we see is colored bars. Where are the NUMBERS in ms for latency? How can I compare a yellow bar in For Honor to 60ms latency in LoL??

Only ms latency numbers revealed for For Honor were in a network analysis, which resulted in over 100ms. Apparently it is already subpar to dedicated servers. This game has to have dedicated servers before ranked mode comes, I dont see any other hope to keep it alive at all.

C00tBAjenkins
06-22-2017, 09:57 AM
I completely agree with @Gray.

I play many online games, some of which require intense timing and reactions;

- like headshotting a running enemy with a sniper rifle from a very long distance

- LoL: flashing out of very fast incoming skillshot in LoL (Sona ult for example)

- Overwatch. /Period

- Elsword PvP arena. I am a star ranked Eve Nemesis & Empress. If you think making a mistake is too punishing in For Honor, go see that game PvP. If they start a combo on you you have to manabreak to survive at all. Latency of dedicated never ever been an issue at any point in a game that is extremely fast paced and punishing for mistakes.


Moreover, like I said in another thread. Here all we see is colored bars. Where are the NUMBERS in ms for latency? How can I compare a yellow bar in For Honor to 60ms latency in LoL??

Only ms latency numbers revealed for For Honor were in a network analysis, which resulted in over 100ms. Apparently it is already subpar to dedicated servers. This game has to have dedicated servers before ranked mode comes, I dont see any other hope to keep it alive at all.

It would require the whole game be reworked to get servers. Realistically I dont ever see that happening ever Unfortunately. The first review I ever watched before open beta on this game said all these great things about it and then ended with "but its going to fail because of p2p". I think they were right.

Aarpian
06-22-2017, 02:58 PM
I can't see that to be honest, I've played MMOs for years and shooters like Battlefield, all of them with their own dedicated servers. Yes lag can cause problems sometimes, and 'Yeah yeah, blame the lag' has always been a bit of a meme / joke in these games if you die and don't want to admit that you suck, but in reality the experience is usually very stable. These are games people play day in and day out for years and enjoy doing so. Lag does not ruin these games in the way that P2P ruins For Honor.

Are we really supposed to believe it would be impossible for For Honor to run on dedicated servers when games like Battlefield do and still handle the precision timing required to headshot a moving target from across a map with a Sniper Rifle?

World of Warcraft is so complex when it comes to combat that I used to have 4 quickbars of attacks and several combinations of moves and trinkets bound to programmable keys, and I would enter into combat against numerous enemies with a similar array of skills and abilities. Timing was vital, Stuns and Damage Over TIme moves and Heal Over Time spells and Evasion moves all had timers and cooldowns and split second timing was vital to activating them at the right moment. Times that by 20 players in a 10 vs 10 Capture the Flag mode like Warsong Gulch ... all taking place on a dedicated server in real time ... you get the idea I'm sure ...

I'm not buying that in For Honor, where I press my Right Trigger to hit you with a Heavy attack while you try to dodge is too complex to be able to run on a dedicated server.

I'd take occasional lag over a server that collapses whenever someone leaves any day.

Unfortunately for you I did a lot of raiding in WoW in TBC and WOTLK. In fact in WOTLK I invented the highest DPS rotation for death knights.

Milliseconds don't matter in WoW, not even in PVP. You could run around with 150 ping and clear any raid without any problems.

Gray360UK
06-22-2017, 03:46 PM
Unfortunately for you I did a lot of raiding in WoW in TBC and WOTLK. In fact in WOTLK I invented the highest DPS rotation for death knights.

Milliseconds don't matter in WoW, not even in PVP. You could run around with 150 ping and clear any raid without any problems.

Well that's not my experience of the game. Numerous CC and healing mods have timing options that include milliseconds. I know many healers and DPS classes that would disagree with you and I am one of them. After 4 years of raiding I don't really feel the need to argue the case, it's not something I need to debate, it's something I did for years, week in, week out. A basic requirement of raiding with the guilds I belonged to was having all of the latest versions of Curse / Boss mods etc to keep track of very precise timings measured in milliseconds.

Pressing X when someone tries to Guardbreak you in For Honor or moving your stick to the right when an attack is coming from the right requires no more precision than activating a new spell or ability in Wow at the precise moment the previous one expires (measured in milliseconds). If you didn't play to the standard I am describing then you wouldn't have been allowed into the guilds I played with.

RatedChaotic
06-22-2017, 04:59 PM
Unfortunately for you I did a lot of raiding in WoW in TBC and WOTLK. In fact in WOTLK I invented the highest DPS rotation for death knights.

Milliseconds don't matter in WoW, not even in PVP. You could run around with 150 ping and clear any raid without any problems.

I call BS.