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View Full Version : Feedback on S2 DLC Characters (For Devs)



Vasher.
06-16-2017, 12:09 AM
As we know, the Devs are looking at nerfing the Centurion, but do not want to break him completely. He's mid teir in 1v1, but basically you're dead if you're in a ganking situation. I know it's going to be difficult to balance the Centurion for 4v4 and 1v1, but quite frankly, right now he alone basically broke the 4v4 modes (yes I know they had issues before). I really like both the new hero's (minus the ranged aspect of Shinobi, mainly because it doesn't fit in this game at all), but the introduction of them I feel has dropped the player base of this game dramatically.

I'd like to provide some of the issues I've seen and I'm sure everyone has posted on before. Let's use this post as an opportunity not just to NERF the crap out of the new Toons but fix this game to where it needs to be (Beta anyone?).

Some feedback for both Centurion and Shinobi:

1.) Adjust the tracking on all this magnetism that's happening. They do 360 air twirls like they're in Olympic figure skating. Or fly/slide around corners when you've done a whole dodge roll backwards like their grinding a half pipe in the X-Games.

For Centurion:

1.) Stamina drain on opponents is too much.
2.) The story mode cut scenes during his 10 second (exaggeration) jump combo (This could be added to the kneeling cutscene for Shin but it's not as bad).
a.) There needs to be something done about this game mechanic...it's very frustrating in general not being able to defend yourself at all for a good 5 seconds. In a gank situation you're dead if the Cent get's his combo off, as you're beaten into the ground by another hero.
3.) Wall splat is still an issue...
4.) Revenge is useless against them. Stop all Hero's in the game being able to puncture through Revenge on activation.

I'd also like to see buffs done to a lot of the ignored lower tier toons...balance is an issue and I know they're working on it. Just tossing this into the discussion as well.

Add or rebuttal some of my suggestions...let's have a decent conversation about this...and make this game great again (you know the reference)...

UbiNoty
06-16-2017, 12:27 AM
Thank you! If we can get some good, clean discussion here on centurion I'd love to pass this thread back directly to the team.
We have some changes in mind already, but it will be good for them to see what you all see as your main concerns, pain points, suggestions, etc.
3,2,1 - go!

JibletHunter
06-16-2017, 12:38 AM
Thank for your feedback! We will ignore it until the player-base leaves and the game dies!

Fixed it for you.

WABO423
06-16-2017, 12:52 AM
My thoughts
Increase his stamina consumption/lower stamina pool so that he is unable to spam his combo multiple times.
Reduce the amount of uniteruptibles in his very long combo.
Reduce is jumping attack range and amount of tracking
Make it to where all attacks are interrupted when revenge is activated (this goes for all classes)
And shorten that cut scene PLEASE.

OR

Make an alternative "hardcore" mode for 2v2 and 4v4 games where friendly fire from all sources is 100%, the hud is limited and revenge requires more build up.
This could potentially put an end to the Cent gank squads as they would kill each other.
Also if you kill a teammate make it count negatively to your teams score and positivly fpr the other team like it does in the call of duty games in their hardcore mode.

If a "hardcore" mode was implemented it may be the easiest way to address the Cent without ruining him and doing any drastic tweaks

Vasher.
06-16-2017, 01:56 AM
My thoughts
Increase his stamina consumption/lower stamina pool so that he is unable to spam his combo multiple times.
Reduce the amount of uniteruptibles in his very long combo.
Reduce is jumping attack range and amount of tracking
Make it to where all attacks are interrupted when revenge is activated (this goes for all classes)
And shorten that cut scene PLEASE.

OR

Make an alternative "hardcore" mode for 2v2 and 4v4 games where friendly fire from all sources is 100%, the hud is limited and revenge requires more build up.
This could potentially put an end to the Cent gank squads as they would kill each other.
Also if you kill a teammate make it count negatively to your teams score and positivly fpr the other team like it does in the call of duty games in their hardcore mode.

If a "hardcore" mode was implemented it may be the easiest way to address the Cent without ruining him and doing any drastic tweaks

Very interesting ideas and feedback.

Vingrask
06-16-2017, 02:00 AM
Shinobi just need 1 change, the same Ubi did to Kensei:

- Ranged heavy attacks can continue the chain if blocked.

Wolf-Heathen
06-16-2017, 03:08 AM
I've been proponent for 100% friendly fire damage for a long time. I feel it would deal with the gank squad problems. Would there be an adjustment phase were ppl initially ***** about it? Yes, but it would deal with the gank squads that just roll around as a posse and spam unblockable/gb/zone attacks.

And as for the centurion, his stamina draining moves cost him next to nothing in stamina, even when they whiff. His stamina cost needs to increase dramatically, or you lower his stamina pool. Also it's far too easy for him to drain an opponent's stamina pool with 1 combo. Maybe that is your vision for him... but that was a role reserved for the Raider initially, and the Raider has had stamina issues from day one. He does what we were told was the Raider's role on the battlefield, and does it 1000% better.

Also that cut scene has got to go. And for god sakes, why did you insist on adding insult to injury by making the screen shake on top of everything else so we have no idea what is going on?

jeannedeorleans
06-16-2017, 03:43 AM
I've been proponent for 100% friendly fire damage for a long time. I feel it would deal with the gank squad problems. Would there be an adjustment phase were ppl initially ***** about it? Yes, but it would deal with the gank squads that just roll around as a posse and spam unblockable/gb/zone attacks.

Tell that to my AI teammate, they hit and stagger me willy nilly. We can not play with only people all the time.

WABO423
06-16-2017, 03:50 AM
Tell that to my AI teammate, they hit and stagger me willy nilly. We can not play with only people all the time.

This is a good point. Maybe they could apply a honorable fight rule for the bots possibly to avoid that problem?

Wolf-Heathen
06-16-2017, 04:08 AM
All you would have to do would disengage and wait for the AI to die, or defeat your opponent. It makes sense because in a a 2 versus 1 you both wouldn't both be swinging wildly at your target. You be using controlled thrusts and feints waiting until after your partner and attacked and moved out of the way.

brashtralas
06-16-2017, 04:41 AM
My thoughts
Increase his stamina consumption/lower stamina pool so that he is unable to spam his combo multiple times.
Reduce the amount of uniteruptibles in his very long combo.
Reduce is jumping attack range and amount of tracking
Make it to where all attacks are interrupted when revenge is activated (this goes for all classes)
And shorten that cut scene PLEASE.

OR

Make an alternative "hardcore" mode for 2v2 and 4v4 games where friendly fire from all sources is 100%, the hud is limited and revenge requires more build up.
This could potentially put an end to the Cent gank squads as they would kill each other.
Also if you kill a teammate make it count negatively to your teams score and positivly fpr the other team like it does in the call of duty games in their hardcore mode.

If a "hardcore" mode was implemented it may be the easiest way to address the Cent without ruining him and doing any drastic tweaks

Friendly fire would scarcely affect the centurion because most of his game breaking attacks are jabs and stabs, not wide slashes.

He'd still just hit with surgical precision and completely shut his opponents down despite friendly fire.

Gray360UK
06-16-2017, 09:51 AM
Friendly fire would scarcely affect the centurion because most of his game breaking attacks are jabs and stabs, not wide slashes.



I don't know about that, depends on the player maybe, but I had an awful Centurion in a game with me last night who was repeatedly zone attacking me, knocking me out of my attacks or out of my execution chances, and hitting me with his heavy attacks because he seemed to think standing behind me and attacking through me was a perfectly reasonable thing to do. It's a player / positioning thing rather than a class / moveset thing.

matt89connor
06-16-2017, 10:42 AM
you speak well, cent is not a monster in 1v1 but he needs a nerf important ,not a super nerf. The projection stun and destroy stamina: this is very hard to match, especially in gank situation.
kick should only remove stamina and the pounch should be a stun attack, for example,and the eagle jump attack should reduce -20% of dmg than now, this is my idea for a little nerf.

Shakti.
06-16-2017, 10:59 AM
ALso he coudn t be able to start unblockable without hitting. And no punch if blocked

Shakti.
06-16-2017, 11:04 AM
This is fun.
1) The moves of the centurion are too spammable cause they cost very little stamina. I will adjust some of that especially the feint cost.
2) His unblockable move cannot start if the first heavy doen't actually connet.
3) Punch only after an Hit. If blocked he cannot punch

Proḅlem solve. The hero is lalways strong if he catch you but is a little more in line with all the other character. Problem solved.
*** removed pin from jump attack and you also fix dominion.... soOOO difficult. Oh w9 are you guys asking this to buy time and make us feel invested aren't u? Burp

Lyskir
06-16-2017, 12:16 PM
This is fun.
1) The moves of the centurion are too spammable cause they cost very little stamina. I will adjust some of that especially the feint cost.
2) His unblockable move cannot start if the first heavy doen't actually connet.
3) Punch only after an Hit. If blocked he cannot punch

Proḅlem solve. The hero is lalways strong if he catch you but is a little more in line with all the other character. Problem solved.
*** removed pin from jump attack and you also fix dominion.... soOOO difficult. Oh w9 are you guys asking this to buy time and make us feel invested aren't u? Burp

i like this ... i guess it would not make him crap in 1v1 either

My.Insanity
06-16-2017, 02:25 PM
Im sure there where uncountable numbers of Forum Threads in which the Players have already left their feedback on Centurio but okay.. here we go again:

Centurio need a Nerf in his Stamina Pool / or increase of his Stamina consume for all of his kicks and jabs.

His range is too long for a Meele (he can use the SAME jump as Warlord or just track you down with his heatseeking charged heavy / kick)

The Pin effect of his Heavy is totaly overpowerd (Im sure they give him this tool so he could follow up with a jab and the groundjump.. but in the current state you are all time out of stamina which means each GB can throw you down and dont forget about revenge jabs or other players who help you throw people down) so i think they need to reduce the pin time so you can only follow with a normal attack and not a full charged jab.

the Centurio need much less Stamina drain.. atm he will suck you dry in 1 parry or 1 combo.

his Jabs should not count as Wallsplatt ... this is just too much.

and Compared to other Mix-up Heros like Valk you should stop his combo with a simple BLOCK!!!


Yes i know these are MANY MANY changes / nerfs ... but you have to admint... he is the most broken Hero in this game.

Netcode_err_404
06-16-2017, 03:47 PM
both heroes are trash designed.

Are so trash designed, that they both cause people to literally get angry and leaving the game.

In a game, where the gameplay complexity should be a strenght, they designed the centurion, a cheap unblockable spammable character that ignores core mechanics of the gameplay like, the revenge knockdown.

And added magic users.


I think theres very little to feedback here.

Its like adding a supercar, in a bicycle game. Its cool, but you know its gonna completely **** up the core of the game


For the ones claiming that cent is not that good in 1v1, I'd like to remember those people, that 1v1 is a side mode. The main mode is 4v4. So, suck it.

JibletHunter
06-17-2017, 12:21 AM
both heroes are trash designed.

Are so trash designed, that they both cause people to literally get angry and leaving the game.

In a game, where the gameplay complexity should be a strenght, they designed the centurion, a cheap unblockable spammable character that ignores core mechanics of the gameplay like, the revenge knockdown.

And added magic users.


I think theres very little to feedback here.

Its like adding a supercar, in a bicycle game. Its cool, but you know its gonna completely **** up the core of the game


For the ones claiming that cent is not that good in 1v1, I'd like to remember those people, that 1v1 is a side mode. The main mode is 4v4. So, suck it.

On top of that, the "hes only good in 4's so don't touch him" people are willing to sacrifice ALL character's 4's viability for ONE character's 1's viability (which as you point out is not even the main/most popular game mode). It would make much more sense to simply undermine his 1's performance (which is not bad my any means) and preserve the general state of 4's for all until they can figure out a more permanent solution.

SnugglesIV
06-17-2017, 03:57 AM
As we know, the Devs are looking at nerfing the Centurion, but do not want to break him completely. He's mid teir in 1v1, but basically you're dead if you're in a ganking situation. I know it's going to be difficult to balance the Centurion for 4v4 and 1v1, but quite frankly, right now he alone basically broke the 4v4 modes (yes I know they had issues before). I really like both the new hero's (minus the ranged aspect of Shinobi, mainly because it doesn't fit in this game at all), but the introduction of them I feel has dropped the player base of this game dramatically.

I'd like to provide some of the issues I've seen and I'm sure everyone has posted on before. Let's use this post as an opportunity not just to NERF the crap out of the new Toons but fix this game to where it needs to be (Beta anyone?).

Some feedback for both Centurion and Shinobi:

1.) Adjust the tracking on all this magnetism that's happening. They do 360 air twirls like they're in Olympic figure skating. Or fly/slide around corners when you've done a whole dodge roll backwards like their grinding a half pipe in the X-Games.

For Centurion:

1.) Stamina drain on opponents is too much.
2.) The story mode cut scenes during his 10 second (exaggeration) jump combo (This could be added to the kneeling cutscene for Shin but it's not as bad).
a.) There needs to be something done about this game mechanic...it's very frustrating in general not being able to defend yourself at all for a good 5 seconds. In a gank situation you're dead if the Cent get's his combo off, as you're beaten into the ground by another hero.
3.) Wall splat is still an issue...
4.) Revenge is useless against them. Stop all Hero's in the game being able to puncture through Revenge on activation.

I'd also like to see buffs done to a lot of the ignored lower tier toons...balance is an issue and I know they're working on it. Just tossing this into the discussion as well.

Add or rebuttal some of my suggestions...let's have a decent conversation about this...and make this game great again (you know the reference)...

1a) A lot of people don't realise this, but the 360 air twirls CAN make you miss the Eagle's Talon as well. This needs fixing ASAP. It's very frustrating to do a 360, hit a wall and get hit with a free GB if anyone is nearby to punish you for using a core mechanic of Centurion's kit.
1b) If you nerf the stamina drain on Centurion's moves, please make his moves a little harder to dodge. They really aren't that hard to dodge in a 1v1 (which is why he is B tier in duels but rises to A or higher when ganking).
2) The fact that I get punished so hard for using a core part of Centurion's kit/moveset to the point where I genuinely try to avoid using it in anything else but a duel is really broken. I'm ok with it being punishable, but a free GB into heavy from anyone close enough to get it off on me is pretty excessive (especially considering how easy it is to do, and the massive window you get to punish him).
3) I don't see it being that much of an issue since this can easily be mitigated by working on your positioning.
4) This is a problem with Warlord, Shinobi, Lawbringer, Warden and Conqueror and it really needs looking at. Ganks become so strong because one person can focus on CC'ing the target whilst the other can pile on the damage. As a result, revenge becomes worthless because you aren't allowed to do anything while someone is spamming kick, head butt, shield bash, shove on you etc. and there isn't a whole lot you can do except roll out.