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View Full Version : What a great move shinobi was indeed, GJ



WFL_M4sT3R_
05-26-2017, 08:13 PM
What i have noticed is that some turtle heroes (don't want to name them), instead to go below the rock and wait for attack are actually forced to open and fight, what a nice refreshment that is for the gameplay. Before it was "i will wait, i will wait some more, yep he attacked me lets block/parry and repeat my move and strike that i learned" and all over again 24/7. Game is much more intense now and its not all about defense 100% like it was before. Very nice indeed.

GJ UBI!

watsonclan335u
05-26-2017, 09:16 PM
What i have noticed is that some turtle heroes (don't want to name them), instead to go below the rock and wait for attack are actually forced to open and fight, what a nice refreshment that is for the gameplay. Before it was "i will wait, i will wait some more, yep he attacked me lets block/parry and repeat my move and strike that i learned" and all over again 24/7. Game is much more intense now and its not all about defense 100% like it was before. Very nice indeed.

GJ UBI!

Agreed, amen.

l8knight347
05-26-2017, 10:37 PM
What i have noticed is that some turtle heroes (don't want to name them), instead to go below the rock and wait for attack are actually forced to open and fight, what a nice refreshment that is for the gameplay. Before it was "i will wait, i will wait some more, yep he attacked me lets block/parry and repeat my move and strike that i learned" and all over again 24/7. Game is much more intense now and its not all about defense 100% like it was before. Very nice indeed.

GJ UBI!
yep

UbiJurassic
05-26-2017, 11:56 PM
Glad to hear you're enjoying the new hero, CV_M4st3R_! While we're glad to hear Shinobi is able to help you open up those turtle players, we're still planning on releasing a patch to further address the defense meta. We want every hero to be viable when your opponent decides to play strictly defensive.

Felis_Menari
05-27-2017, 12:26 AM
Glad to hear you're enjoying the new hero, CV_M4st3R_! While we're glad to hear Shinobi is able to help you open up those turtle players, we're still planning on releasing a patch to further address the defense meta. We want every hero to be viable when your opponent decides to play strictly defensive.

Oh boy, do you guys have your work cut out for you. All heroes viable when dealing with turtles is a tall order, considering the trend of balance changes we've seen this far.

UbiJurassic
05-27-2017, 12:28 AM
Oh boy, do you guys have your work cut out for you. All heroes viable when dealing with turtles is a tall order, considering the trend of balance changes we've seen this far.

Naturally, some heroes will have a harder time trying to break through defenses because of the variety of their movesets and playstyles, but giving offensive play in general an edge to tackle the overly strong defensive meta should be a step in the right direction for all classes.

Vingrask
05-27-2017, 12:54 AM
Shinobi can't open a full turtle, reason why we need make block cost something and parry reward less. What he can do is make people leave the comfort zone. Against someone who just wait to punish, Shinobi can't do much. All the finishers are easy to counter. Shinobi is, in fact, the best counter attacker of the game. Just it.

The only true weapon is the double dodge kick guessing game, where you can land a grab, until your enemy figure how to grab you before that or trade. So the guessing passes for Shinobi's side. I faced some players who did nothing but wait to punish my moves, and I'm not even saying mistakes, because Shinobi can be punished directly. He can't feint, and I miss this a lot.

Some matches I could have had a chance if the parry wasn't so strong with the free GB, because parry Shinobi's lights looks easy. If block had a cost too, since some matches enemies just block, block, block, until they throw a safe parry. After the enemy parry your lights and ranged heavies and deny everything you try, you back to the 50/50 of the double dodge, then the game back to where it was.

So, I will say again, Ubi, do not mess with the heroes before change the defensive rewards! The player who is trying, really trying not just throwing random moves, shouldn't be hard punished as happens today. Just wait to punish the attacker should have a great cost, should have riskies too! Today the balance is favoring just the passive gameplay.

For Odin's sake remove the free grab after a parry!

Mythic MK II
05-27-2017, 02:14 AM
To be quite ffair, Shinobi Has made actually turtle up.... I haven't done that since I stopped being a complete noob and am now an average player. Opening up with any attacks if just punished by Shinobi.
For me, shinobi is just a dodge fest on my part, and trying to parry to get any attacks it.

Might just be that I play LB and thaat his attacks are slow. Also, a LOT of shinobi players just stay out of range, which is pretty darn understandable as he is mainly a ranged character.
The ones up close are still very hard to fight against if I take the initiative to open up. Most just punish all my attempts. Their dubble dodge makes it so :/

Maybe someone can tell me how to properly open/engage a shinobi as a LB and I might change my playstyle against them... but for now, I turtle and live longer.

Vingrask
05-27-2017, 03:04 AM
To be quite ffair, Shinobi Has made actually turtle up.... I haven't done that since I stopped being a complete noob and am now an average player. Opening up with any attacks if just punished by Shinobi.
For me, shinobi is just a dodge fest on my part, and trying to parry to get any attacks it.

Might just be that I play LB and thaat his attacks are slow. Also, a LOT of shinobi players just stay out of range, which is pretty darn understandable as he is mainly a ranged character.
The ones up close are still very hard to fight against if I take the initiative to open up. Most just punish all my attempts. Their dubble dodge makes it so :/

Maybe someone can tell me how to properly open/engage a shinobi as a LB and I might change my playstyle against them... but for now, I turtle and live longer.

Against Shinobis who random dodge, throw random attacks. Lwabringer's range can counter it.
Against Shinobis who fight at close range, feint and grab. You can grab the second dodge as the first.
Against Shinobis who fight fair and use everything, only you can do is react, feint and grab. It's normal a slow hero have a hard time to reach a fast hero. Even so, against long range heroes like Nobushi, Kensei, Lawbringer and Raider, I have a hard time. They throw random chains, where I cannot pass, and I lost some fights because we did moves at the same time, and Shinobi always lose a trade at the same time.

When you manage to react and punish to everything, the only move Shinobi can do is use the double dodge guessing game.
Do not walk back, corner them. It is a nightmare be cornered. Always walk front, don't be scared. When you corner a Shinobi, grab the double dodge is easy, specially if you feint and lure one.

KnifeInUrNeck
05-27-2017, 05:28 AM
This is true. I main Shinobi now and long range characters can be brutal. I never had a problem with kensei or raider before but now they're *******s. But then again, I play in and out and use the full kit.

Draghmar
05-27-2017, 02:16 PM
What i have noticed is that some turtle heroes (don't want to name them), instead to go below the rock and wait for attack are actually forced to open and fight, what a nice refreshment that is for the gameplay. Before it was "i will wait, i will wait some more, yep he attacked me lets block/parry and repeat my move and strike that i learned" and all over again 24/7. Game is much more intense now and its not all about defense 100% like it was before. Very nice indeed.

GJ UBI!
I mean...lol? Both classes only enforced turtling. I mostly play quite aggressive but with both Shinobi and Cent I don't because it's to risky. Especially against Cent.
Range attacks? Wait, parry/CGB = free heavy. Kick needs specific timing but can be dodged so wait and...do noting because it's not punishable (at least I didn't find a way yet). Normal attacks? Block and try to parry = free something depending on class.
In contrast try be aggressive and you're gonna eat some damage for sure the same way as other classes tend to do that...only on little better level (Cent).

kweassa1917
05-27-2017, 02:28 PM
I mean...lol? Both classes only enforced turtling. I mostly play quite aggressive but with both Shinobi and Cent I don't because it's to risky. Especially against Cent.
Range attacks? Wait, parry/CGB = free heavy. Kick needs specific timing but can be dodged so wait and...do noting because it's not punishable (at least I didn't find a way yet). Normal attacks? Block and try to parry = free something depending on class.
In contrast try be aggressive and you're gonna eat some damage for sure the same way as other classes tend to do that...only on little better level (Cent).

FYI, Shib kick is really weak to rear dodge - GB.

Shib-kick catches side-dodges quite well, and since side-dodges have longer travel/recovery than rear dodge, usually it's hard to find timing to punish. But with a rear dodge, the likelihood of Shib kick just whiffing your head is really high, and by the time he lands from kick your GB fires off during recovery frame.


Just practice it a bit -- if you think you have no way to counter it, then there's no harm in trying what I've said.