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View Full Version : Devs do not buff kensi please



A4einboy
05-24-2017, 10:07 PM
he has the range , unblockables , strong feats and he can feint 5-6 heaveys without running out of stamnia plus his gaurd switch stance is fast just leave kensi the way he is

BeefMan_
05-24-2017, 10:13 PM
He is the worst character in the game right now

XxHunterHxX
05-24-2017, 10:33 PM
They buffed raider..now he 2 hits you...they buffed valkiri now she spamms light atacks at mach 14 while making you fall on your *** cant w8 for the next buff....i for one dont relly care anymore i just love how much they break the game apart thill no one will play it ...they dont even ask why do people afk in the game whell as much fun as it is to ghet 50 take downs in elimination to ghet a ****ty ammout of xp the game is a grind fest and its not fun

l8knight347
05-24-2017, 10:45 PM
he has the range , unblockables , strong feats and he can feint 5-6 heaveys without running out of stamnia plus his gaurd switch stance is fast just leave kensi the way he is

this. no buff please!!

sif084
05-24-2017, 11:09 PM
what class do you play? yes he has range....but even his lights are easily parried. if you struggle with them, learn to parry. his unblockable is sooo easy to parry it is suicide to throw out against an even average player.

Antonioj26
05-24-2017, 11:12 PM
They buffed raider..now he 2 hits you...they buffed valkiri now she spamms light atacks at mach 14 while making you fall on your *** cant w8 for the next buff....i for one dont relly care anymore i just love how much they break the game apart thill no one will play it ...they dont even ask why do people afk in the game whell as much fun as it is to ghet 50 take downs in elimination to ghet a ****ty ammout of xp the game is a grind fest and its not fun

Raiders damage is the same aside from his light attacks, he is still mid tier at best and valk all risk with little reward. You play on PC for gods sake, she's not even close to being a problem there.

UbiJurassic
05-24-2017, 11:18 PM
I'm not aware of any specific changes coming to buff Kensei. We know that the team is looking to adjust some of the main samurai classes, but we don't have any information to share yet regarding in what way.

BeefMan_
05-24-2017, 11:36 PM
Raiders damage is the same aside from his light attacks, he is still mid tier at best and valk all risk with little reward. You play on PC for gods sake, she's not even close to being a problem there.

Raider is top 5, easily.

Antonioj26
05-24-2017, 11:40 PM
Raider is top 5, easily.

I'll be honest and I'm not trying to insult you but that is the dumbest thing I've read on this board, easily.

Hillbill79
05-24-2017, 11:43 PM
and he can feint 5-6 heaveys without running out of stamnia

No he cant. Trust me on that.

BeefMan_
05-24-2017, 11:59 PM
I'll be honest and I'm not trying to insult you but that is the dumbest thing I've read on this board, easily.

What's a weakness of raider? Slow lights and bad GB punish is the only thing I can think. From day 1 Reddit did nothing but push this stupid "raider is bad" meme when he was perfectly balanced before is, at worst, above average now.

l8knight347
05-25-2017, 12:00 AM
what class do you play? yes he has range....but even his lights are easily parried. if you struggle with them, learn to parry. his unblockable is sooo easy to parry it is suicide to throw out against an even average player.
sure if you stand around and wait for a parry, and if he don't feint at all, and if you aren't already fighting someone else.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 12:08 AM
What's a weakness of raider? Slow lights and bad GB punish is the only thing I can think. From day 1 Reddit did nothing but push this stupid "raider is bad" meme when he was perfectly balanced before is, at worst, above average now.

Slow lights, slow guard change, no openers, his heavy soft feint stunning tap mixup can only go far, quick to run oos. Who is he better than aside from kensei, zerk, and arguably nobu?

CaptainPwnet
05-25-2017, 01:10 AM
sure if you stand around and wait for a parry, and if he don't feint at all, and if you aren't already fighting someone else.

Kensei is not only one of the 2 worst characters but he is also one of worst characters to have in a 2v1 lol. If you can't external parry his unblockable reliably then you aren't at a high enough skill level to be discussing balance.

All he can do is feint into top light that is the only thing he can do that is decently fast. You can literally just not even bother risking a parry and hold your block top and react to everything else and he should never touch you.

Knight_Raime
05-25-2017, 01:14 AM
Kensei is not only one of the 2 worst characters but he is also one of worst characters to have in a 2v1 lol. If you can't external parry his unblockable reliably then you aren't at a high enough skill level to be discussing balance.

All he can do is feint into top light that is the only thing he can do that is decently fast. You can literally just not even bother risking a parry and hold your block top and react to everything else and he should never touch you.

...to be fair he also has that unlock tech that you whiff a hit. :p

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 01:14 AM
You need to fight a decent Kensei then.


Kensei is not only one of the 2 worst characters but he is also one of worst characters to have in a 2v1 lol. If you can't external parry his unblockable reliably then you aren't at a high enough skill level to be discussing balance.

All he can do is feint into top light that is the only thing he can do that is decently fast. You can literally just not even bother risking a parry and hold your block top and react to everything else and he should never touch you.

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 01:16 AM
That's not unlock tech dude.

That's just starting a chain early as a gap closer.


...to be fair he also has that unlock tech that you whiff a hit. :p

p00k.
05-25-2017, 01:27 AM
Who is he better than aside from kensei, zerk, and arguably nobu?

orochi
all you have is top light and zone
side lights are slow. heavies are slow. attack chains are slow.
moves super telegraphed
have to deal with reflex guard.
low hp.
no openers. no unblockables.
bad GB range. bad throw range

CoyoteXStarrk
05-25-2017, 01:29 AM
I have admitted multiple times that Kensei is my Krytonite and no matter what happens I almost ALWAYS lose to them and even I admit the Kensei needs some love. He is thoroughly average compared to pretty much any other class besides the Conqueror and thats just because the Conqueror was nerfed into the ground by the Devs is still waiting to be fixed.

Knight_Raime
05-25-2017, 01:30 AM
That's not unlock tech dude.

That's just starting a chain early as a gap closer.

not sure if you know what im saying or.

Pestilence1X
05-25-2017, 01:30 AM
LOL! If you think Kensei is in a good, SOLID spot, then you honestly probably just got schooled by a Kensei, which had nothing to do with the hero, but the player using him. Sure, Kensei can kick some ***, but then again, ANY hero can do so. It just depends on the skill of the player. The thing is though, just because a player can do good with Kensei does not mean he's in a good spot.

Kensei's main game is feinting, which EVERY OTHER HERO IN THE GAME can do, with the exception of Conqueror. You can tell me that his feinting game is stronger, but I can also call BS. The only time it's stronger is through his chain finisher mixup, but that's only because they turn into soft feints. Even if it was slightly stronger, feinting doesn't guarantee you damage. Feinting only works against those who can't seem to stop falling for it. You don't fall for it and you shutdown Kensei.

Kensei has nothing that everybody doesn't already have. Range? Really? You're going to tell me that Kensei's range gives him an advantage in combat? What is his range going to do when he can't hit you because you block everything he throws out? He's basically forced to turtle because he has no offensive options, so how exactly is his range helpful?

Kensei is NOT in a good spot. He is really just a basic hero without anything special aside from his finisher, which isn't even that impressive.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 01:47 AM
orochi
all you have is top light and zone
side lights are slow. heavies are slow. attack chains are slow.
moves super telegraphed
have to deal with reflex guard.
low hp.
no openers. no unblockables.
bad GB range. bad throw range

Orochi only has those two attacks but they are enough to keep him above raider by a long shot. I'd take a 500 ms 32 damage attack and a 400ms 20 damage zone over raiders kit. The one thing raider has going for him is he's able cgb when dashing.

Side lights are the same as raiders so neither of them have the advantage there
Heavies are faster than raiders so that's not an advantage for raider
Attack chains are slow but Who cares because no one who is worth a damn does attack chains since they are free parries
Moves are no more telegraphed than raiders
Reflex guard isn't an issue for decent players
Low hp that is the same or close to the same at 70% of the cast but okay I'll give you that.
Gb range is pretty comparable to everyone else, I've never had an issue where I thought if I was using someone else I would have got the gb.

If a 500ms and 400ms attack aren't good openers then raider is still at a disadvantage since he has neither of those. No unblockables. The only good thing about raiders unblockable is oos mixups, other than that they are easy to parry or dodge. Bad throw range, really what would he even need it for? His wall stun would still be 35 damage either way and if you are talking about real fights where people don't throw eachother off then I wouldn't even throw that in as a factor. Roach coaches two attacks are way superior to raiders entire kit. Raiders parry punish is another thing he has but it's much harder to pull off with his grandma guard stance

CeIasun
05-25-2017, 02:03 AM
Well I don't mind that he gets new combos or something like that. I even wish this for most heros. But he doesnt needs a damage buff. and that auto lock **** really needs to go a way from game, as he has way to much range . but what do i know I onley play against him.

SirCorrino
05-25-2017, 02:13 AM
Yeah, Kensei could use some love. The only reason I lose to Kenseis is that most of his attacks have weird parry timing so I keep messing up my parries, but that's all on me, when I manage to defend myself they die super easy.

BeefMan_
05-25-2017, 02:18 AM
...to be fair he also has that unlock tech that you whiff a hit. :p

Which is a free parry since 99% of Kensei players don't feint it

dekot11
05-25-2017, 02:45 AM
Which is a free parry since 99% of Kensei players don't feint it

It's pretty useless after someone sees it a total of one time, they can stop you with just a single light. Unless you're talking about the 360 spin no scope swing, which I don't think is parry-able. And hard to pull off consistently.


You need to fight a decent Kensei then.

You need to fight a decent turtle.

Helnekromancer
05-25-2017, 04:31 AM
It's pretty useless after someone sees it a total of one time, they can stop you with just a single light. Unless you're talking about the 360 spin no scope swing, which I don't think is parry-able. And hard to pull off consistently.



You need to fight a decent turtle.

Oh you can parry his zone, you just have to wait a while since he twirls his sword for 2 secs before it hits you.

BeefMan_
05-25-2017, 04:39 AM
Oh you can parry his zone, you just have to wait a while since he twirls his sword for 2 secs before it hits you.

Nah man you gotta get fancy with it
Unlock, turn 90* to the right, hit him once, cancel into top light

l8knight347
05-25-2017, 05:09 AM
Kensei is not only one of the 2 worst characters but he is also one of worst characters to have in a 2v1 lol. If you can't external parry his unblockable reliably then you aren't at a high enough skill level to be discussing balance.

All he can do is feint into top light that is the only thing he can do that is decently fast. You can literally just not even bother risking a parry and hold your block top and react to everything else and he should never touch you.
I can discuss anything I want snob. clearly you feel that your opinion doesn't have any merit. so you need to silence me by questioning my credibility. so you get a buff for your favorite hero.

BeefMan_
05-25-2017, 05:14 AM
so you get a buff for your favorite hero.

Good
He needs it

dekot11
05-25-2017, 05:33 AM
Oh you can parry his zone, you just have to wait a while since he twirls his sword for 2 secs before it hits you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV-bf8xen8k&t=1s

i wasn't joking, it's actually a 360 spin (720) no-scope (unlock) swing

That_guy44
05-25-2017, 05:37 AM
Kensei is hot garbage right now. You could spend all your stamina just to open someone up for one attack lol

Kitsune..
05-25-2017, 07:48 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV-bf8xen8k&t=1s

i wasn't joking, it's actually a 360 spin (720) no-scope (unlock) swing

Shouldn't it be parryable by now?
Even if it is, sweet Alpha Spin looks badass af, one of the most classy Kensei tricks :cool:

A bit offtopic, is it even considered as heavy? I haven't managed to finish my opponents with it, but from what I've seen at Alpha's old streams it never gave him any executions after finishing opponents... So in case if Alpha Spin is parryable, is it rewarded as a light attack parry or a heavy attack parry? :confused:

mathi4s
05-25-2017, 08:44 AM
Shouldn't it be parryable by now?
Even if it is, sweet Alpha Spin looks badass af, one of the most classy Kensei tricks :cool:

A bit offtopic, is it even considered as heavy? I haven't managed to finish my opponents with it, but from what I've seen at Alpha's old streams it never gave him any executions after finishing opponents... So in case if Alpha Spin is parryable, is it rewarded as a light attack parry or a heavy attack parry? :confused:

It is Parryable by now.

But back to topic. I bet there is like a small dedicated base of kensei players that have a awesome reaction time and know the game like theyr boots also they can read the opposing player like a book. These few players play every day. They will whoop your *** even when kensei is an utter **** class and you play with a warden against him because they know what they are doing. On the other side of the fence we got the console players who don't even know how to react to a simple helm splitter because 30fps or get confused by a swift strike. They also fall for every parry bait because they don't realise that blocking is enough against kensei. So these people are like kensei is OK or even OP.

My kryptonite is the raider but all my problems with Raider come from not beying able to parry his super slow heavy attacks. The timing just throws me off every time. Still, I think Raider needs a buff as well. I mean just look at his moveset or play him for a while.

DrinkinMehStella
05-25-2017, 09:33 AM
kensei just needs an opener, his dodge game is good and so is his feint game but needs an opener.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 09:52 AM
No matter what they do.

They will do it based on PC data. It is highly possible, that it is going to screw up console gameplay in the process.

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 10:11 AM
Try doing that on a mouse and keyboard :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV-bf8xen8k&t=1s

i wasn't joking, it's actually a 360 spin (720) no-scope (unlock) swing

Kitsune..
05-25-2017, 12:15 PM
Try doing that on a mouse and keyboard :)

It's doable if you press ASD fast enough (at least I've seen someone stated it was), absolutely doable with Razer Nostromo or the like device if you bind your movement directions to the stick.

PDXGorechild
05-25-2017, 01:15 PM
I'll be honest and I'm not trying to insult you but that is the dumbest thing I've read on this board, easily.

Yes.

EnderVex
05-25-2017, 01:30 PM
Anyone suggesting that Kensei is fine or is overpowered has no idea what they are talking about, sorry.

He has hardly any stamina, hardly any health.

Yes, Kensei hits like a ****ing truck. 40 damage side heavies (as much as Raider), and the highest damage lights in the game (20). However, nobody gets hit by a Kensei if you play properly.

Range? Doesn't matter. Everything is easy as hell to parry, so you'll never get surprised by sudden ranged attacks.

Keep your guard in top, don't react to feints, CGB, and you will never lose to a Kensei ever.

If you lose to a Kensei, you got seriously outplayed and should rethink your strategy.

He's among the worst classes in the game, dare I say the worst, and you guys are asking for no buffs? If you are consistently losing to Kensei, you need to get better as a player. That's all I can say.

DrinkinMehStella
05-25-2017, 02:12 PM
i mained kensei up to rep 5 before switching and i find him the easiest to parry in the entire game apart from the helm splitter sometimes i cant predict that.

Kitsune..
05-25-2017, 02:28 PM
Kensei is the embodiment of unrewarded efforts in this game. Still ppl somehow think that countering all his efforts while lying on the couch and playing with left foot is quite fine...

I wonder if there is some kind of statistics that shows the average amount of stamina spent per 1 damage i.e. stamina usage efficiency or something like that that devs might be using. My guess that Kensei is among the most unefficient ones.

Randy_Kamikaze
05-25-2017, 04:35 PM
The Kensei is easily the weakest class in the game. Yeah he has good feats and range, but none of that matters when he is so slow that it's impossible to get even a single hit to land. I played the Kensei and i played against him and i rarely get hit by his attacks or hit anyone unless we're ganking. He has a unblockable heavy yeah, but you already need two heavies before that AND it's easily the most heavily telegraphed attack in the game. If you are in a 1v1 and get hit by that then really, you simply suck.

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 04:47 PM
The Kensei is easily the weakest class in the game. Yeah he has good feats and range, but none of that matters when he is so slow that it's impossible to get even a single hit to land. I played the Kensei and i played against him and i rarely get hit by his attacks or hit anyone unless we're ganking. He has a unblockable heavy yeah, but you already need two heavies before that AND it's easily the most heavily telegraphed attack in the game. If you are in a 1v1 and get hit by that then really, you simply suck.

You don't need 2 heavies before the unblockable. You can go straight into it from a dodge attack. Have guard at top, dodge attack then hit heavy and it goes straight into the unblockable. upto you then whether to let it fly, feint into uninterruptable side heavy or GB.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 04:55 PM
You don't need 2 heavies before the unblockable. You can go straight into it from a dodge attack. Have guard at top, dodge attack then hit heavy and it goes straight into the unblockable. upto you then whether to let it fly, feint into uninterruptable side heavy or GB.

By "dodge attack" do you mean free parry? It's insanely slow and telegraphed

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 04:56 PM
Timing my dear fellow, timing.

You'd be surprised just how effective Kensei's dodge is. Because the attack comes from the opposite side to the way he moves, it throws a lot of people off.

Not fought many who could consistently parry it.


By "dodge attack" do you mean free parry? It's insanely slow and telegraphed

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 05:04 PM
Timing my dear fellow, timing.

You'd be surprised just how effective Kensei's dodge is. Because the attack comes from the opposite side to the way he moves, it throws a lot of people off.

Not fought many who could consistently parry it.

Whelp maybe it's me then because I'm rarely ever hit with it.

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 05:11 PM
A decent Kensei will only use it while you're attacking, all in the timing. You commit to an attack, you cant really avoid or block it if its timed well


Whelp maybe it's me then because I'm rarely ever hit with it.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 05:26 PM
Well.

The kensei is not that week on console. He might not be top tier but he is certainly not week. His light strikes are evil and the dash attacks can be fatal.

What he does not have, is an exploitable loop attack. Without the shoulder bash follow up, the warden would be low tier reduced to top light and an exhausting zone attack.

On console, the kensei does not need a buff. The warden (and every other hero with an exploitable loop attack) need a propper adjustment - emphasis on adjustment not nerf.

Temjinyuy
05-25-2017, 05:30 PM
he has the range , unblockables , strong feats and he can feint 5-6 heaveys without running out of stamnia plus his gaurd switch stance is fast just leave kensi the way he is

This is a platform issue,

PC he needs a buff

Console he his fine.

dekot11
05-25-2017, 05:39 PM
Well.

The kensei is not that week on console. He might not be top tier but he is certainly not week. His light strikes are evil and the dash attacks can be fatal.

What he does not have, is an exploitable loop attack. Without the shoulder bash follow up, the warden would be low tier reduced to top light and an exhausting zone attack.

On console, the kensei does not need a buff. The warden (and every other hero with an exploitable loop attack) need a propper adjustment - emphasis on adjustment not nerf.

I play on console and after a certain level you start fighting people who can block everything you do. He has the slowest lights in the game and all people need to do is keep their guard on top and react to the slowest attacks in the game.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 05:45 PM
I play on console and after a certain level you start fighting people who can block everything you do. He has the slowest lights in the game and all people need to do is keep their guard on top and react to the slowest attacks in the game.

You wasted too much time. You could simply write l2p ...

Btw. I don't buy it. Blocking every move on console is bs and everyone knows is. It is possible to block a lot of attacks and if you use your xbox as a pseudo PC with a gaming monitor, it might even be possible to blick nearly everything but you might not be everybody or average.

Balancing a game for the top 0.5% kills games, because the majority can not hold up anymore, loses the interest and leaves.

Kensei does not need a buff on console.

dekot11
05-25-2017, 05:53 PM
You wasted too much time. You could simply write l2p ...

Btw. I don't buy it. Blocking every move on console is bs and everyone knows is. It is possible to block a lot of attacks and if you use your xbox as a pseudo PC with a gaming monitor, it might even be possible to blick nearly everything but you might not be everybody or average.

Balancing a game for the top 0.5% kills games, because the majority can not hold up anymore, loses the interest and leaves.

Kensei does not need a buff on console.

Wow, it's hard to block 500ms lights on console but kensei doesn't have those man. And we're not talking about top 0.5%, my kensei account has a mid 60s winrate, and that is at a level where nothing gets through on most opponents. Just play kensei yourself, you are bound to run into somebody who can block everything you do. If you don't, then I'm sorry but you are not the majority. You are at the lower end of the bell curve.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 05:54 PM
You wasted too much time. You could simply write l2p ...

Btw. I don't buy it. Blocking every move on console is bs and everyone knows is. It is possible to block a lot of attacks and if you use your xbox as a pseudo PC with a gaming monitor, it might even be possible to blick nearly everything but you might not be everybody or average.

Balancing a game for the top 0.5% kills games, because the majority can not hold up anymore, loses the interest and leaves.

Kensei does not need a buff on console.

It's really not that difficult I think the average human regactions are like 250-275 so even with display and input lag being 150-200 you can easily block/parry 600ms attacks

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:00 PM
Wow, it's hard to block 500ms lights on console but kensei doesn't have those man. And we're not talking about top 0.5%, my kensei account has a mid 60s winrate, and that is at a level where nothing gets through on most opponents. Just play kensei yourself, you are bound to run into somebody who can block everything you do. If you don't, then I'm sorry but you are not the majority. You are at the lower end of the bell curve.

If his Forum name matches his gamer tag then he has a less than 100 games played. My guess is he's weak against kensei so he is able to rationalize how bad kensei is. I'm afraid it's just you doc

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 06:05 PM
If his Forum name matches his gamer tag then he has a less than 100 games played. My guess is he's weak against kensei so he is able to rationalize how bad kensei is. I'm afraid it's just you doc

Because I play vs. bots.

Why? Because i want to actually play the game. Playing vs. humans is either dominated by cheesy crap or bad connection. In my case, bad matchmaking and really bad connection. My matchmaking goes like this: Waiting half a century for a game and then, not finishing it.

But off course bors use different attacks.

But yeah. This forum only consists of the same people, posting the same ******** over and over again. Only pros here. :rolleyes:

Maybe, only the pro players are left on all platforms, because the average players were already mobbed away.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:08 PM
Because I play vs. bots.

Why? Because i want to actually play the game. Playing vs. humans is either dominated by cheesy crap or bad connection. In my case, bad matchmaking and really bad connection. My matchmaking goes like this: Waiting half a century for a game and then, not finishing it.

But off course bors use different attacks.

But yeah. This forum only consists of the same people, posting the same ******** over and over again. Only pros here. :rolleyes:

Well then your input on kensei should be disregarded then if you only play against bots. Bots are terrible in this game and do the same predictable attacks over and over. Using them to decide what needs balancing and what doesnt is asinine. Don't need to be a pro to block a 600ms attack, just don't have grandma reactions.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:15 PM
Because I play vs. bots.

Why? Because i want to actually play the game. Playing vs. humans is either dominated by cheesy crap or bad connection. In my case, bad matchmaking and really bad connection. My matchmaking goes like this: Waiting half a century for a game and then, not finishing it.

But off course bors use different attacks.

But yeah. This forum only consists of the same people, posting the same ******** over and over again. Only pros here. :rolleyes:

Maybe, only the pro players are left on all platforms, because the average players were already mobbed away.

There's nothing wrong with being average but average players have no idea how to Balance the game correctly especially ones that can't consistently block 600ms attacks. If you wanted someone's input on how to kick a ball would you ask a soccer mom or a guy that's been playing soccer For his entire life?

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 06:15 PM
Well then your input on kensei should be disregarded then if you only play against bots. Bots are terrible in this game and do the same predictable attacks over and over. Using them to decide what needs balancing and what doesnt is asinine. Don't need to be a pro to block a 600ms attack, just don't have grandma reactions.

Well. That's pretty damn arrogant.

But its fitting to this community. Why do I come back here? Must be pure masochism.

But you have actually proven my point. Only heroes with exploitable loop attacks are viable in this game. (btw. bots don't fall for loops and charges - if they have a one frame window to dodge stuff they do it)

But yeah ... he only plays vs bots, because this games netcode is utter crap so he must be bad.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 06:22 PM
There's nothing wrong with being average but average players have no idea how to Balance the game correctly especially ones that can't consistently block 600ms attacks. If you wanted someone's input on how to kick a ball would you ask a soccer mom or a guy that's been playing soccer For his entire life?

Your first statement wad made meaningless by your second one.

Being average or not a pro means, that you are treated like a poor peasant, who can be thankful, that self proclaimed pros take the time to tell them, hoe the game works. Until only 2k players are left.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:22 PM
Well. That's pretty damn arrogant.

But its fitting to this community. Why do I come back here? Must be pure masochism.

But you have actually proven my point. Only heroes with exploitable loop attacks are viable in this game. (btw. bots don't fall for loops and charges - if they have a one frame window to dodge stuff they do it)

But yeah ... he only plays vs bots, because this games netcode is utter crap so he must be bad.

Then you aren't doing it right, every oos ai will dodge if you prolong wardens shoulder barge and eat a gb. Every single time. Seriously try it. You are bad because you can't block 600ms attacks not because you play against AI. No one was arguing that the best characters have exploitable loop attacks, you claimed that kensei is fine. He is not.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 06:26 PM
Then you aren't doing it right, every oos ai will dodge if you prolong wardens shoulder barge and eat a gb. Every single time. Seriously try it. You are bad because you can't block 600ms attacks not because you play against AI. No one was arguing that the best characters have exploitable loop attacks, you claimed that kensei is fine. He is not.

I claimed, that kensei does not need a buff - especially not in the speed department. I also stated, that loop attacks need an adjustment.

I can actually block the first light a bot throws at me (except. Shinobi and pk side lights) - the ones coming after them are the problem. But that's a different thing.

The general problem is, that you guys here are entering a buffing spiral of epicness. Buff everything, until we can not block attacks anymore and every strike is fatal. The kensei is ****ing fine. Most other heroes are not.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:32 PM
I claimed, that kensei does not need a buff - especially not in the speed department. I also stated, that loop attacks need an adjustment.

I can actually block the first light a bot throws at me (except. Shinobi and pk side lights) - the ones coming after them are the problem. But that's a different thing.

The general problem is, that you guys here are entering a buffing spiral of epicness. Buff everything, until we can not block attacks anymore and every strike is fatal. The kensei is ****ing fine. Most other heroes are not.

If you block the first one then it goes through the superior block animation and you have frame advantage. They would reset back to neutral so there wouldn't be a second one. He's terrible, dude. He has nothing to open a proper turtle and that's what you see past the novice scene. I don't know what else to tell you except your experience against bots doesn't translate to pvp

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 06:40 PM
If you block the first one then it goes through the superior block animation and you have frame advantage. They would reset back to neutral so there wouldn't be a second one. He's terrible, dude. He has nothing to open a proper turtle and that's what you see past the novice scene. I don't know what else to tell you except your experience against bots doesn't translate to pvp

Because why?

If you can not open up a turtle (still rarely seen on console ), let the other guy act. If you play Kensei and you know that you have problems opening them up, don't try it. What do you want? A faster attack? An exploitable loop? What is your imagination of the Kensei, without making it op or toxic?

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:47 PM
Because why?

If you can not open up a turtle (still rarely seen on console ), let the other guy act. If you play Kensei and you know that you have problems opening them up, don't try it. What do you want? A faster attack? An exploitable loop? What is your imagination of the Kensei, without making it op or toxic?

Not sure what to do but saying he's fine is wrong. Me Not having an answer on how to fix him doesn't mean he's good. The best turtles have a way to open you up where as kensei can't so he will lose that staring contest. Just because you rarely have seen someone who knows how to turtle doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I shouldn't even have said turtle Ad much as someone who is even half decent at defense since again he has turtle speed light attacks aside from the top.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 06:55 PM
So the Kensei is not fine, because he does not have an easily exploitable move with guaranteed damage?

That's saying a lot.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 06:58 PM
So the Kensei is not fine, because he does not have an easily exploitable move with guaranteed damage?

That's saying a lot.

He sucks because his unblockable is trash, his attacks are slow, his heavies do terrible damage, and all of his attacks are telegraphed and easy to block/parry.

Also what do you define as exploitable? What attacks specifically?

dekot11
05-25-2017, 07:21 PM
Your first statement wad made meaningless by your second one.

Being average or not a pro means, that you are treated like a poor peasant, who can be thankful, that self proclaimed pros take the time to tell them, hoe the game works. Until only 2k players are left.

If you mainly play against bots, you are not average. You are far below average because you are not even playing the game as it was meant to be played (against other people). You haven't progressed because you have all these excuses for why you shouldn't play against other people instead of actually playing the game and getting better. Nobody is instantly good at the game the first time they play. You haven't even really played, you only make excuses.

Nobody here is pro except maybe EnderVex, most of us are average. And most of us say kensei sucks. You are definitely not the majority. I'm just throwing this number out there but you are probably in the bottom 5%, if all you really do is mostly play bots. You shouldn't be talking balance. Just stop please.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 07:23 PM
the real cancer are Valkyries who should be beaten with the nerf bat.

Kensei is **** because all he can do is spam top heavies, his top heavies need a nerf while buffing everything else.

She's actually probably the most balanced class in the game.

Fast lights with great mixup potential but has low damage and highly punishable.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 07:35 PM
leg sweep spam is nowhere near balanced, all she does is spam leg sweep.

i called one out once and he decided to quit the game than play a real hero that takes skill, what a *****.

Just dodge it dude it always come out after the second hit so just be ready dodge after the second hit connects. Even if you only do this 50% of the time you come out on top since her sweep follow up is only a heavy of 25 damage. Just about everyone can get more than that off a gb sometimes double if there's a wall nearby

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 07:55 PM
If you mainly play against bots, you are not average. You are far below average because you are not even playing the game as it was meant to be played (against other people). You haven't progressed because you have all these excuses for why you shouldn't play against other people instead of actually playing the game and getting better. Nobody is instantly good at the game the first time they play. You haven't even really played, you only make excuses.

Nobody here is pro except maybe EnderVex, most of us are average. And most of us say kensei sucks. You are definitely not the majority. I'm just throwing this number out there but you are probably in the bottom 5%, if all you really do is mostly play bots. You shouldn't be talking balance. Just stop please.

So ubisoft being **** at nearly everything (especially netcoding) makes me a bad player? Sure.

Oh man. I could easily say, that your fainting game needs improvement, because you can not break the turtle. What's your gaming tag btw. you are flaming and branding me as bad, while trying to shut me down with silly 5% statements, while not even releasing how good you really are - or giving propositions on how to improve things.

I might be bad but you have no idea what you are talking about.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 08:00 PM
So ubisoft being **** at nearly everything (especially netcoding) makes me a bad player? Sure.

Oh man. I could easily say, that your fainting game needs improvement, because you can not break the turtle. What's your gaming tag btw. you are flaming and branding me as bad, while trying to shut me down with silly 5% statements, while not even releasing how good you really are - or giving propositions on how to improve things.

I might be bad but you have no idea what you are talking about.

I don't know how he plays but at least he knows what he's talking about. Everything you are saying about kensei is wrong. He's garbage, he has nothing really going for him. He's basically a long ranged slow zerk. The netcode sucks but it's good enough for everyone else to get matches so stop using that as an excuse

dekot11
05-25-2017, 08:48 PM
So ubisoft being **** at nearly everything (especially netcoding) makes me a bad player? Sure.

Oh man. I could easily say, that your fainting game needs improvement, because you can not break the turtle. What's your gaming tag btw. you are flaming and branding me as bad, while trying to shut me down with silly 5% statements, while not even releasing how good you really are - or giving propositions on how to improve things.

I might be bad but you have no idea what you are talking about.

I never said I was good, I said I was average. I said you are bad, very bad. I play on multiple accounts.

justtfaded, somewhatfaded, dekot, HEMAisghey.

I am on tonight at 9 pst. let's play, it won't be a real fight because I know I will beat you, instead I'm just going to show you how bad kensei is. you use him and I'll just stand there and block most of what you throw out

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 08:52 PM
I never said I was good, I said I was average. I said you are bad, very bad. I play on multiple accounts.

justtfaded, somewhatfaded, dekot, HEMAisghey.

I am on tonight at 9 pst. let's play, it won't be a real fight because I know I will beat you, instead I'm just going to show you how bad kensei is. you use him and I'll just stand there and block most of what you throw out

Since I am very bad, I won't waste your precious gaming time.

Btw. this game is sinking, because of players like you and your attitude towards others. Have fun cleaning the silverware.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 08:55 PM
Since I am very bad, I won't waste your precious gaming time.

Btw. this game is sinking, because of players like you and your attitude towards others. Have fun cleaning the silverware.

This is such a chicken s hit card to pull. You made a claim about kensei being fine and lights being difficult to block so prove it. Why are you so afraid of backing up your word?

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 09:01 PM
This is such a chicken s hit card to pull. You made a claim about kensei being fine and lights being difficult to block so prove it. Why are you so afraid of backing up your word?

Cause I can.

In addition, I said that the Kensei is fine and that the other heroes need to be brought to his level but you decided to ignore that.

I am tired if this game, this community and the way the devs try to handle the situation.

Time to focus on something new.

dekot11
05-25-2017, 09:16 PM
Cause I can.

In addition, I said that the Kensei is fine and that the other heroes need to be brought to his level but you decided to ignore that.

I am tired if this game, this community and the way the devs try to handle the situation.

Time to focus on something new.

you never really played this game. you never even really tried to play this game.

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 09:18 PM
Cause I can.

In addition, I said that the Kensei is fine and that the other heroes need to be brought to his level but you decided to ignore that.

I am tired if this game, this community and the way the devs try to handle the situation.

Time to focus on something new.

If characters need to be brought to his level then he's not fine. You just implied he is lesser than them so you just disproved yourself. I don't get why people are so afraid to back up their words here but whatevs, makes it easier to find the players who are and aren't worth a damn.

DrExtrem
05-25-2017, 09:19 PM
you never really played this game. you never even really tried to play this game.

I tried ... but I got disconnected in 95% of my games.

SAVAGE_CABBAGE1
05-25-2017, 09:34 PM
Timing my dear fellow, timing.

You'd be surprised just how effective Kensei's dodge is. Because the attack comes from the opposite side to the way he moves, it throws a lot of people off.

Not fought many who could consistently parry it.

It threw me off, the first two times I fought one... 2 days after the game came out.

Hillbill79
05-25-2017, 10:44 PM
Funny how everyone on forums are masters of the game. Or masters of talking ****

I've got close to 700 hours in this game. Reckon that's enough for me to know what I'm talking about. On pc anyway.

It threw me off, the first two times I fought one... 2 days after the game came out.

ScottJund
05-25-2017, 10:53 PM
Wait this thread isn't a joke?

Antonioj26
05-25-2017, 10:55 PM
Funny how everyone on forums are masters of the game. Or masters of talking ****

I've got close to 700 hours in this game. Reckon that's enough for me to know what I'm talking about. On pc anyway.

Doesn't take a master to avoid block or Parry a slow telegraphed attack just because it comes from the opposite side. Like he said it only takes a day maybe 2 to adapt to that with kensei

Vingrask
05-25-2017, 11:03 PM
The guy has some points.

Kensei isn't that bad as who main the hero want us to believe, and any change may be done with a lot of attention. Kensei has damage and range, with good tools for fool the enemy. The big problem is the game's defense system, which reward too much the passive gameplay. Just removing the GB after a parry the attackers will be benefited.

I'm a main Berserker and I know what I'm talking. Even after the armor buffed to the second hit, Berserker suffer the same as Kensei, and nobody is saying "oh, Berserker is the worst hero". Work to open a turtle with Berserker looks like a day at work, and I imagine Kensei pass for the same situation. It's not rare my opponent parry my lights, free GB me and drain I my will during a match, making me stay hopeless trying figure what to do next.

Damn, today a Kensei hit me far, far away with 2 moves!! And did a damn lot of damage!

Before change any hero, Ubi need to fix the turtle problem, the high reward the passive gameplay offer for any hero. I already met a Shinobi who did nothing but parry to GB. All he did was fishing parries. How do you get the hero with the most extense movelist and demote him to something like that? What about the Centurions who are the ultimate turtle right now?!

So, again, the guy has a point. Buff Kensei like the mains ask and we will have a big problem. Imagine buff Berserker the same way.

SAVAGE_CABBAGE1
05-26-2017, 12:24 AM
Funny how everyone on forums are masters of the game. Or masters of talking ****

I've got close to 700 hours in this game. Reckon that's enough for me to know what I'm talking about. On pc anyway.

It is the most parry bait move in the game, you don't need to be a god at the game to parry that.

BeefMan_
05-26-2017, 01:42 AM
Funny how everyone on forums are masters of the game. Or masters of talking ****

I've got close to 700 hours in this game. Reckon that's enough for me to know what I'm talking about. On pc anyway.

You're actually ******ed if you think Ken's dodge attacks are "good" in any sense of the word
It's literally a free GB if they block it. No parry required.

kweassa1917
05-26-2017, 02:06 AM
It is the most parry bait move in the game, you don't need to be a god at the game to parry that.

Actually, it's not even worth a parry bait...

Why try a parry which might fail, when you can just block and get a free, scrumptious GB=heavy a much safer way?


That Kensei side-dodge attack is a double edged sword. It has the best evasion angle/distance of all dodge-attacks, but at the same time slowest to land and deadliest when even just blocked.

Frankly, in terms of efficiency, even a standard side-dodge attack like the PKs or Orochis are way better. The Kensei side-dodge arc/distance is almost as much as the Shinobi dbl-dodge... which is an overkill. You don't need that much movement. Just a plain assassin side-dodge attack is all you need to evade and counter 99% of attacks in the game.


The Kensei side-dodge attack and the Nobushi side-attack.. is at the opposite ends of extremes, both suffering from similar evils. The former dodges too much and lands too slow to be a useful dodge attack, the latter dodges too little and hits too fast to be a useful dodge attack. :D

Antonioj26
05-26-2017, 03:07 AM
Actually, it's not even worth a parry bait...

Why try a parry which might fail, when you can just block and get a free, scrumptious GB=heavy a much safer way?


That Kensei side-dodge attack is a double edged sword. It has the best evasion angle/distance of all dodge-attacks, but at the same time slowest to land and deadliest when even just blocked.

Frankly, in terms of efficiency, even a standard side-dodge attack like the PKs or Orochis are way better. The Kensei side-dodge arc/distance is almost as much as the Shinobi dbl-dodge... which is an overkill. You don't need that much movement. Just a plain assassin side-dodge attack is all you need to evade and counter 99% of attacks in the game.


The Kensei side-dodge attack and the Nobushi side-attack.. is at the opposite ends of extremes, both suffering from similar evils. The former dodges too much and lands too slow to be a useful dodge attack, the latter dodges too little and hits too fast to be a useful dodge attack. :D

Can give you a free top heavy with warden so an extra 10 points at least to me is worth the risk when playing as him, plus the stamina loss is nice. Other characters too like raider or LB can benefit off of doing that rather than just a gb, lb gets a full 15 more damage from doing his top parry unblockable instead of gb side heavy. There are others too but I think you get the point.

nufrancis
05-26-2017, 03:34 AM
Im also a Kensei main.

In my opinion the current Kensei only good to fight nubie or below 4 rep player, above that I believe they already have much experience to time and parry Kensei attack or just blocking by minimum.

I have my own trick to start an attack with Kensei: Before your enemy is in your attack range do a swift strike, after you do this it is almost guaranteed the enemy already in your attack range then continue to his unblockables top heavy or other attack and feint, So this method can be use for an opener.

kweassa1917
05-26-2017, 03:46 AM
Can give you a free top heavy with warden so an extra 10 points at least to me is worth the risk when playing as him, plus the stamina loss is nice. Other characters too like raider or LB can benefit off of doing that rather than just a gb, lb gets a full 15 more damage from doing his top parry unblockable instead of gb side heavy. There are others too but I think you get the point.

But anyone ham-fisted like I am :D would just choose the safer and easier route to free damage.

I know, I know, it's lazy. :rolleyes:

Antonioj26
05-26-2017, 03:51 AM
But anyone ham-fisted like I am :D would just choose the safer and easier route to free damage.

I know, I know, it's lazy. :rolleyes:

Lol well understandable sometimes safety is the better way to go especially when it's final bar vs final bar, no point in a parry then.

Kitsune..
05-26-2017, 04:43 AM
I have my own trick to start an attack with Kensei: Before your enemy is in your attack range do a swift strike, after you do this it is almost guaranteed the enemy already in your attack range then continue to his unblockables top heavy or other attack and feint, So this method can be use for an opener.
Suicide Strike carries you across half of the map, I fail with the distance needed to successfully whiff it while locked.
There was a way to unlock and whiff it, not sure if it works now though. It was tricky before 1.7, after the patch I haven't managed to do it right even once but it might be me being completely handless. :(

kweassa1917
05-26-2017, 04:44 AM
Lol well understandable sometimes safety is the better way to go especially when it's final bar vs final bar, no point in a parry then.

Except the irony is that when that happens, for some reason I always react with a parry... and then fail... and then give the other guy the win for free with stupid mistakes like that ;) :p

nufrancis
05-26-2017, 08:34 AM
Suicide Strike carries you across half of the map, I fail with the distance needed to successfully whiff it while locked.
There was a way to unlock and whiff it, not sure if it works now though. It was tricky before 1.7, after the patch I haven't managed to do it right even once but it might be me being completely handless. :(

I come up with this trick after patch 07, so Im confident this trick works. You only have to work your spacing and timing. Should be not hard in 1vs1, I rarely use it in Skirmish and Dominion.

mathi4s
05-26-2017, 12:40 PM
Kensei is bad because the whole game is bad. For honor is designed so that everything should be reactable but that is not how fighting games work. The few attacks that are really hard to react to are the instant zone attacks that are broken af. Did you notice that the bots never use them? That's because they are not meant to be used in duels in the first place. Incidentally those are the moves that are the most effective. Kensei is **** because he works as intended so everything he does is easily reactable. The whole game needs an overhaul. Make attacks of all classes hard to react to so people would need to predict what the opponent does next. Just like in any other fighting game.