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View Full Version : Poll: Kensei fine as is? (1.06, 1.07)



Herbstlicht
05-15-2017, 07:58 AM
I'd say you know a countermove is broken when he does like nothing at all?
But even worse:

https://media.giphy.com/media/9AB8zfdVjBEju/giphy.gif
https://youtu.be/Kw9-YZW9zoU
(with credit to mathi4s)

What you see here, is that you can maybe use Kenseis dodge attack against heavy attacks for the block not to recover in time. But this guy dodged a warlords headbutt, just to get blocked, punished and thrown down a ledge. His comments towards the Kensei really, really get the point. He may be somewhat easier then the Raider to play, but still suffers on so many fronts.

I sum it up (in my opinion, not the most experienced Kensei (Nobushi main) as best as i can:

- incredible hard to open anyone up, light attacks not fast enough besides top light maybe.
- all dodge property attacks are very punishable
- mixup game uses a lot of stamina
- misux effectiveness varies greatly against different classes (assassins use side attack to mostly negate it, gb doesn't work in this case, valkyrie sideattacks too, some heavys can simply trade (Kensei only 5 more health then assassin class) and a backroll negates it with a high probability)
- vanguard with lowest health pool (though i personally like this, differentiating the vanguards is fine in the end)
- very hard to use range to advantage aside from maybe team games
- easily readable

So for Ubi to read our opinions on this, I created a poll too. The people seriously convinced he is op can of course post too, I always try to make stuff as fair and unbiased as I am able too. Of course, this video is somewhat extreme, but in this case, i really wanted to catch some attention. And i honestly feel better not doing this for my main kinda ^^

Oupyz
05-15-2017, 08:28 AM
kensei , don't need a buff or nerf

warlord/warden/lb/conqueror

needs to be punished heavily after a fail charge/bash , they need more recovery time , they are just 2 safe and that's the biggest problem and that''s why u see people spaming this **** , once u fix the recovery and make them open to gb after a fail headbut or shoullld charge or anything , voila people wont spam it , it's a universal fix , though warden wont be effected much cause he can cancel his sb

Herbstlicht
05-15-2017, 09:17 AM
Well, Ubi already statet they'd dislike any more nerfes. "Warlord is fine as is, others might need buffing to his level" is more or less what they implied. Though i too feel those moves are too safe for what they give you, i do not see any changes soon on those mechanics.

Oupyz
05-15-2017, 09:25 AM
so the game willll still broken

actually they do have 2 solution to this problem

1) it''s either those bashes cost a lot of stamina thus wont be spammed

2) keep them as is but increase recovery time thus a failed one will be punished (which i find logical )

3) keep the game broken

your choice Ubisoft

Tomas_Jari
05-15-2017, 09:39 AM
kensei is so weak against warlord and others. Sad that Ubi not go to buff him. You just have to block sloowest move in the game - swift strike and you have free GB. So bul****.

SenBotsu893
05-15-2017, 09:48 AM
Kensei definetly needs some love. His only good part is the Heavy-Finisher Mix up but its way to hard to even get there in a duel.
Thats why the better Kensei Users have to use Unlock techniqes. But using those unintended game mechanics to make a fighter somewhat viable is definatle not the way to go.

maybe if he had something similar to the pommelstricke of the raider he may have some more opening options. Like throwing out a heavy and canceling it into a Helm Splitter.

DrinkinMyStella
05-15-2017, 09:52 AM
i'm rep 5 kensei and at first he was good but as players got much better he is no no longer viable in high level plays, his feint game is good and his side dodge attacks are ok but this is all he has. the only mix up he has is when you manage to get a GB and you can switch up the top finisher into another attack or another GB but this can be countered

Jasado
05-15-2017, 12:13 PM
We have no idea as of yet when they put in whatever changes they intend to fix the turtle meta where Kensei will land.

He hits like a truck, so if they change what they say they wanted to change (attacks will create opening to attack more) - then he will easily slide into a much stronger position.

Let's see where that lands before making any assessments. I don't disagree that in a turtle meta, he isn't the best - very few people are. But that is more indicative of a core problem versus a Kensei problem.

Sorry to say, but Conqueror and Nobushi both need a lil bit of love before Kensei, anyways.

Kitsune..
05-15-2017, 12:24 PM
Kensei definitely needs attention. I feel bad looking at Centurion/Shinobi kits while I'm supposed to top light my way to victory.
While I agree that good anti-turtle meta decisions might address some of his issues, still his attacks need rework.

mathi4s
05-15-2017, 12:27 PM
First of all it would be nice if the Kensei was at least bug free. Despite what the developer sayd the swift strike beying unsafe on block just has to be a bug because its just so utterly nonsensical. The GIF there is just the pathetic cherry on top. SWIFT STRIKE is a super slow attack that's basically a free parry to any somewhat skilled opponent. How is it deemed punishable by GB on block only god knows and maybe not even he does.

Warlords headbut should be nerfed as well, surely.

Afterwards Kensei should still be buffed also Nobushi, Berserker and Raider AKA the trash tier.

Draghmar
05-15-2017, 12:55 PM
But is it Kensei that needs buff or are some moves/characters that needs nerf? I think Kensei is quite good in terms of balance. Same thing with Nobushi. They probably needs some little tweak but that's all.
The problem is that there are classes that has much easier moves to pull off that grants at least good outcome (vide Warlod's headbutt or Warden's SB). And because of this it may seem that others needs buff.
Unfortunately I don't think Ubi will do anything about this. I don't know is it because of lack of good tools to analyze data or small amount of data to begin with or maybe something entirely else (engine, QA etc) but I think they have problem with global balancing. I really wonder what will happen now when there two new classes introduced. I'm afraid they will be OP because that's the industry standard - make new chars better so it would look like it worth investing in them and to prevent people saying that they are nothing special and then nerf them when people complain too much.

guor6800
05-15-2017, 12:55 PM
Imo Ubisoft has 2 options.

1) Fix the turtle meta.

2) Delete the Kensei

And according to the "fixes" i have seen in those 3 months they probably make the game even more broken.So lets just move straight to option number 2.With new champions coming out who has the time for an obsolete champion like Kensei.

MasterChiefPON
05-15-2017, 01:07 PM
kensei , don't need a buff or nerf

warlord/warden/lb/conqueror

needs to be punished heavily after a fail charge/bash , they need more recovery time , they are just 2 safe and that's the biggest problem and that''s why u see people spaming this **** , once u fix the recovery and make them open to gb after a fail headbut or shoullld charge or anything , voila people wont spam it , it's a universal fix , though warden wont be effected much cause he can cancel his sb

Before the patch you could see Lawbringers actually fight. Now the majority of them are just block>shove block>shove. When they buffed him it was because Lawbringer was lacking, but it was still going to be a fun and creative character...until they gave him a spammable move to use instead of 70% of his kit.

lllWARCHILDlll
05-15-2017, 02:18 PM
kensei , don't need a buff or nerf

warlord/warden/lb/conqueror

needs to be punished heavily after a fail charge/bash , they need more recovery time , they are just 2 safe and that's the biggest problem and that''s why u see people spaming this **** , once u fix the recovery and make them open to gb after a fail headbut or shoullld charge or anything , voila people wont spam it , it's a universal fix , though warden wont be effected much cause he can cancel his sb


kensei , don't need a buff or nerf

warlord/warden/lb/conqueror

needs to be punished heavily after a fail charge/bash , they need more recovery time , they are just 2 safe and that's the biggest problem and that''s why u see people spaming this **** , once u fix the recovery and make them open to gb after a fail headbut or shoullld charge or anything , voila people wont spam it , it's a universal fix , though warden wont be effected much cause he can cancel his sb

Much respect to everyone for their opinions btw. Sharing feedback "respectfully" garnishes respect. It's no surprise that when you hop into a forum for a game you are playing that somewhere someone has the opinion based on their experience, to nerf something you are using in the game.

Orochi/Conqueror move set comparison image:
http://i911.photobucket.com/albums/ac314/lllwarchildlll/FOR%20HONOR%20ALBUM/FBD249B8-ED8B-404E-81EA-404C5CF84C67.jpg

While I can understand most opinions when voiced appropriately, in regards to the Conqueror needing a nerf, I'm simply of a different opinion. Especially on the bashing. By default the Conquerors move set is built 50% on shield tactics. It's undeniably unique in regards to the design of the character. When designing the conqueror its comprehensive shield tactics are undeniably making up for 50% of the Morning Star attacks that were not put into the game. I wouldn't penalize half of the Orochi's move set, or half of any other characters move set, especially under the circumstances of it being half of the moves in total. And while the "ADVANCED peer-to-peer" on a good day works as Ubi Monteal intended I can admit being bashed around by good Conqueror mains.

After gaming over 30 years I still wouldnt call for a nerf on it. In my personal experience from the days of Karateka on a five and a quarter inch floppy disc to now, nerfing is only a solution when all else has failed. And as of right now, the shield bashing is not 100% full proof, hence no nerfs are necessary.

No, I'm not a Conqueror main. I'm a Nobushi main, Orochi secondary. And I'd say I use the Conqueror 1/3 of the time I'm playing and 2/3 of the time is dedicated to either of the other two more so.
Peace.

The_B0G_
05-15-2017, 02:34 PM
People who turtle are the bane of kensei, I played him a lot on the weekend and would dominate right up until I got up against player who would only counter attack, never leading with an attack, it was usually wardens doing this.

When that started happening more and more I realized there is no real way to open anyone up besides feints, even then you could only get one light in and the second would be blocked and punished if you trued for a heavy. GB's would just get countered, he really has no answer to people who turtle.

Herbstlicht
05-15-2017, 05:14 PM
Imo Ubisoft has 2 options.

1) Fix the turtle meta.

2) Delete the Kensei

And according to the "fixes" i have seen in those 3 months they probably make the game even more broken.So lets just move straight to option number 2.With new champions coming out who has the time for an obsolete champion like Kensei.

Please not option 2 ... I'd say Kensei is one of the stylistically best heroes in the game, so I'd be happy if we keep him :)
Anyway, i think this discussion is rather interesting. I did not expect so many people to say that Kensei is rather fine. Well, some have said that it is other heroes that should be nerfed instead of him being buffed, but still.

Guess it will be rather interesting very soon. With Season 2 kicking of and turtling meta still in place, people complaining might really have reason to do so. But .. we'll see.

dekot11
05-15-2017, 05:23 PM
We have no idea as of yet when they put in whatever changes they intend to fix the turtle meta where Kensei will land.

He hits like a truck, so if they change what they say they wanted to change (attacks will create opening to attack more) - then he will easily slide into a much stronger position.

Let's see where that lands before making any assessments. I don't disagree that in a turtle meta, he isn't the best - very few people are. But that is more indicative of a core problem versus a Kensei problem.

Sorry to say, but Conqueror and Nobushi both need a lil bit of love before Kensei, anyways.

Then why is raider getting a buff? kensei and raider had generally the same disadvantages, mainly slow attacks and the lack of an easy to initiate/spam unblockable unparriable opener. if they're waiting on a nerf to the turtle meta (coming soon™) why does kensei have to be the only one who waits? the only thing kensei had over raider was guard switch speed.

dekot11
05-15-2017, 05:31 PM
Please not option 2 ... I'd say Kensei is one of the stylistically best heroes in the game, so I'd be happy if we keep him :)
Anyway, i think this discussion is rather interesting. I did not expect so many people to say that Kensei is rather fine. Well, some have said that it is other heroes that should be nerfed instead of him being buffed, but still.

Guess it will be rather interesting very soon. With Season 2 kicking of and turtling meta still in place, people complaining might really have reason to do so. But .. we'll see.

I think the only people who think kensei is fine are people who haven't really played against him, which isn't surprising since there aren't too many of them around. All the top streamers know kensei is useless against anyone who knows how to defend properly.

Jasado
05-15-2017, 05:36 PM
First of all it would be nice if the Kensei was at least bug free. Despite what the developer sayd the swift strike beying unsafe on block just has to be a bug because its just so utterly nonsensical. The GIF there is just the pathetic cherry on top. SWIFT STRIKE is a super slow attack that's basically a free parry to any somewhat skilled opponent. How is it deemed punishable by GB on block only god knows and maybe not even he does.

Warlords headbut should be nerfed as well, surely.

Afterwards Kensei should still be buffed also Nobushi, Berserker and Raider AKA the trash tier.

The entire point of moves unsafe on block is to use them in situations that blocking doesn't happen.

Properly superior guard dodging into an attack and do swift strike at the same time.

Then, because of the buff he received, you can immediately cancel that guaranteed hit into a combo ender mixup.

You aren't SUPPOSED to throw out swift strikes like a moron from neutral. That works on people who have yet to realize his dodge attacks come from the opposite side he moves, (lazy design to give the illusion of power by forcing a players conditioned reflex to work against them, since most dodge attacks come from the direction the enemy dodges) but anyone who knows it's unsafe on block will punish it.

Stop assuming all your enemies are chumps and use the move right, don't just throw it out there then wonder why you get pooped on.

Valk jump stab is punishable on block.

Most jump in attacks are super telegraphed and easily parried, too.

Dodging attacks are not supposed to be openers, because they are telegraphed and linear. They are reaction/re-positioning moves during a combo or after a feint to force it.

It's not a bug. Dev stated quite clearly on stream the free GB on block for swift strike is intended. Use it right. At least you have that option, compared to Valk, who is basically relying on cheese light spam because her only gap closing option is terrible for her against anyone good.

This is why I can't stand Kensei criers. His buffs were decent and his damage is good, most of his problems are due to the turtle meta and less of Kensei. Other characters have actual issues, like Nobushi/Conq.

guor6800
05-15-2017, 05:39 PM
Please not option 2 ... I'd say Kensei is one of the stylistically best heroes in the game, so I'd be happy if we keep him :)
Anyway, i think this discussion is rather interesting. I did not expect so many people to say that Kensei is rather fine. Well, some have said that it is other heroes that should be nerfed instead of him being buffed, but still.

Guess it will be rather interesting very soon. With Season 2 kicking of and turtling meta still in place, people complaining might really have reason to do so. But .. we'll see.

Yeah but currently he is all out of style.

And devs stated clearly that right now both warlord and kensei are fine no changes planned.

I really feel sorry for the kensei s mains trying so hard to achieve something when most of the roster has nuclear weapons at their disposal to exploit.

dekot11
05-15-2017, 05:41 PM
The entire point of moves unsafe on block is to use them in situations that blocking doesn't happen.

Properly superior guard dodging into an attack and do swift strike at the same time.

Then, because of the buff he received, you can immediately cancel that guaranteed hit into a combo ender mixup.

You aren't SUPPOSED to throw out swift strikes like a moron from neutral. That works on people who have yet to realize his dodge attacks come from the opposite side he moves, (lazy design to give the illusion of power by forcing a players conditioned reflex to work against them, since most dodge attacks come from the direction the enemy dodges) but anyone who knows it's unsafe on block will punish it.

Stop assuming all your enemies are chumps and use the move right, don't just throw it out there then wonder why you get pooped on.

Valk jump stab is punishable on block.

Most jump in attacks are super telegraphed and easily parried, too.

Dodging attacks are not supposed to be openers, because they are telegraphed and linear. They are reaction/re-positioning moves during a combo or after a feint to force it.

It's not a bug. Dev stated quite clearly on stream the free GB on block for swift strike is intended. Use it right. At least you have that option, compared to Valk, who is basically relying on cheese light spam because her only gap closing option is terrible for her against anyone good.

This is why I can't stand Kensei criers. His buffs were decent and his damage is good, most of his problems are due to the turtle meta and less of Kensei. Other characters have actual issues, like Nobushi/Conq.

Did you watch that clip in the OP where kensei dodges a headbutt and still gets his swift strike blocked? And again, why is raider getting a buff?

Mudflaaaps
05-15-2017, 05:54 PM
I main kensei and tbh he doesn't need a buff.

It's the turtle meta in general that makes him useless in any scenario where the opponent is equally matched or better skill wise.
Kenseis problem is he relies on pure attacks. No fast unblockable attacks, no quick stuns, no unblockable shoves, he relies on hitting alone.
This paired with his low attack damage is a terrible combination alone.

All that would be fine, if it were possible to make any attacks hit. but the turtle meta means EVERY move he makes can very easily be countered and punished, by any character (he's obviously useless against warlords but who isn't).

If kensei were to receive yet another buff, the only one I would encourage would be a massive damage increase. As the character in the game with the lowest damage per second, lowest speed and lowest amount of options, he would benefit from a huge damage increase.

A more reasonable, smaller change which would put him on par with the raider would be more stuns. His second light hit should always apply a stun, therefore opening up his options to attack.

mathi4s
05-15-2017, 06:28 PM
The entire point of moves unsafe on block is to use them in situations that blocking doesn't happen.


And when is that?

I mean blocking is the most easy thing to do in the game. You can whif a light attack and still block a kenseis swift strike.
A warlord can whif a headbut and still block a swift strike.
The few times you can actually use the swift strike reliably is on a heavy or a shoulderbarge. But if it was a feint you get blocked and GBed again. You have to start it before you know if its a feint and I don't know on what level you play but after a certain skill treshold feints happen a lot. Overall the only one who gets to be punished for most of the time by a kensei swift strike is kensei himself.

The bigger the risk a move has the bigger the reward should be. Or the other way around the more effective the move the bigger the risk should be.

There is a buttload of risk with the swift strike and dimishing returns. What is your reward for a properly executet swift strike? like 20 dmg? afterwards you get to do the mixup combo but whatever you go for is still perfectly reactable so it does not count as guaranteed. On the other hand its far far more likely that you get blocked and GBed. That is not how moves are supposed to work.

TLDR: the risks of a swift strike outweight by far the usefullness of the move so it should be fixed.

Arekonator
05-15-2017, 06:54 PM
I main kensei and tbh he doesn't need a buff.

It's the turtle meta in general that makes him useless in any scenario where the opponent is equally matched or better skill wise.
Kenseis problem is he relies on pure attacks. No fast unblockable attacks, no quick stuns, no unblockable shoves, he relies on hitting alone.
This paired with his low attack damage is a terrible combination alone.

All that would be fine, if it were possible to make any attacks hit. but the turtle meta means EVERY move he makes can very easily be countered and punished, by any character (he's obviously useless against warlords but who isn't).

If kensei were to receive yet another buff, the only one I would encourage would be a massive damage increase. As the character in the game with the lowest damage per second, lowest speed and lowest amount of options, he would benefit from a huge damage increase.

A more reasonable, smaller change which would put him on par with the raider would be more stuns. His second light hit should always apply a stun, therefore opening up his options to attack.
Kensei got lot of problems, but "Low damage" isnt one of them.
20 dmg lights, 40 dmg heavy openers, 30 dmg from chain... He was buffed to basically raider levels of damage back in the beta, where for instance LB still used to hit for 8! dmg after his shove (if he ever landed it back then).
But i have have to somewhat agree that kensei will be fine in his current state once turtle meta is resolved. He got some pretty good mindgame potential, but mindgames are useless when opponent doesnt even have to try and parry and just blocks and uses safe move instead.

okaboy
05-15-2017, 07:01 PM
I insist, the unblockeable attack of Kensei can be cancelled only with a touch of your own mate or with a guardbreak (square button in PS4) or just with defense (right joystick). It's supposed that you can parrish it with R2 but, in my experience, that attack can be cancelled in any way and with any button (except with R1), I've recorded videos.

Sometimes I am only playing with R1 because is very predictable the R2 attack and easy to block.:mad:

mathi4s
05-15-2017, 07:29 PM
I main kensei and tbh he doesn't need a buff.

It's the turtle meta in general that makes him useless in any scenario where the opponent is equally matched or better skill wise.


So watching the poll it seems this is where we are at at the moment. We relly on the magic of breaking the turtle meta despite the fact we don't know exactly what it is going to involve to somehow fix the Kensei and the other trash tier classes and maybe bring world peace? This is not how it works. Ubisoft is not counting on kensei beying fixed by it. They actually think Kensei in the current state of the game is fine now. OK? That's the reallity in which Ubisoft currently lives in. I personally don't even believe they are doing anything about the meta. I believe it when I see it. Untill then demanding change is what we have to do.

SURESHOT22
05-15-2017, 07:34 PM
I must just suck against him.
He is probably the char i have the hardest time against.
His lights are so fast and switches sides so fast i always guess wrong before he pokes me to death.

Im not a noob except against him.
Rank 5 warden
5 conq
5 pk
4 lawbringer
4 orochi
Few other rank 1s

I HATE going up against kensei.

Give me tips please and thanks.

Mudflaaaps
05-15-2017, 07:39 PM
His damage compared to everyone else is awful. Lawbringers damage was low and rightly so, now he's got stupid damage and a stupidly overpowered amount of combos whereas kensei has zero viable combos.

As I said, kensei relies on just attacks. Other characters have a special attack, raider has a very easy top stun. Imagine raider with no grab mechanic, no free unblockable and no stunning tap and there you have the kensei. Raider is getting a huge buff which will take him into the middle tier, kensei got a buff which made him slightly more viable. Hardly fair.

Brologna_Xeno
05-15-2017, 08:23 PM
LB and Valk get buffs that give them combo change-ups and variety even more creative than Kensei's possibilities. Zerker got Armor on any desired combo increment. Raider is getting a change-up on any desired combo increment.

For Kensei, they got the second attack of their combo string removed,

and that's considered a buff.

Pretty much sums it all up.

Rep21 Kensei.

Mudflaaaps
05-15-2017, 08:34 PM
Without sounding rude, you must be having a fundamental problem if you're struggling against kenseis.
Admittedly, I find kensei players (me included) are often very good and will mind game the sh it out of you.

As a kensei, I rely on my opponents stupidity. Throw out a few heavys, let them get parried. Get punished dramatically. Then hit them with a feint and GB, top unblockable.
They'll likely be fazed and play either more aggressively or more defensively.
If it's the latter, 9/10 times that's game over. Kensei has zero openers and no chance at beating a turtler.
If they get offensive, ill probably win. Kensei is very good at handling overly offensive players, at least I am anyway.

Suggestions?
Block his predictable top light, free GB for you.
Block his heavys, free GB for you.
Parry his hilariously predictable sidestep attack, free GB or heavy for you.
He's easily punished.
Just watch out for the top light and he's screwed.

SURESHOT22
05-15-2017, 10:24 PM
My problem with him is his light attacks are so damned fast and from far away. He hits me with them before i have a chance to guard them. His heavies are easy. His side step attacks confuse me because they hit opposite direction. That part i just need to get use to.

Just too fast. Pain in my ***. Gets me sooo frustrated when im up against that char.

Prob right. Mind f's me and gets me frustrated and i lose.

mathi4s
05-15-2017, 11:03 PM
My problem with him is his light attacks are so damned fast and from far away. He hits me with them before i have a chance to guard them. His heavies are easy. His side step attacks confuse me because they hit opposite direction. That part i just need to get use to.

Just too fast. Pain in my ***. Gets me sooo frustrated when im up against that char.

Prob right. Mind f's me and gets me frustrated and i lose.

If that is all that troubles you then you should do the following:
Start a custom game.
Set map canyon or some other map where there is no enviromental kill option.
Set no damage.
Turn gear stats off.
Put bot lv3 kensei in it.
Turn off the time limit.

Now you can train with him without interuptions as long as you please. You'll learn his moveset as fast as possible and how to react to it 100%.

Be aware that human players do use kenseis moveset somewhat differently but still this will help you.

Arekonator
05-16-2017, 09:17 PM
I have to ask again, how is his damage low? Talkin about raw damage numbers here.
Highest light attack damage across the board. Heavy attack damage is pretty average - not great but not bad either. Yes there is problem with getting the damage in, but thats different issue entirely.
(Not counting centurion and shinobi since i dont saw their damage numbers yet.) Saying his damage is awfully low is simply not true.

AkenoKobayashi
05-16-2017, 09:25 PM
I honestly do fine with the Kensei as is...but I still feel there is a need for an attack speed increase.

Alchemist..
05-16-2017, 09:44 PM
I main kensei and tbh he doesn't need a buff.

It's the turtle meta in general that makes him useless in any scenario where the opponent is equally matched or better skill wise.
Kenseis problem is he relies on pure attacks. No fast unblockable attacks, no quick stuns, no unblockable shoves, he relies on hitting alone.
This paired with his low attack damage is a terrible combination alone.

All that would be fine, if it were possible to make any attacks hit. but the turtle meta means EVERY move he makes can very easily be countered and punished, by any character (he's obviously useless against warlords but who isn't).

If kensei were to receive yet another buff, the only one I would encourage would be a massive damage increase. As the character in the game with the lowest damage per second, lowest speed and lowest amount of options, he would benefit from a huge damage increase.

A more reasonable, smaller change which would put him on par with the raider would be more stuns. His second light hit should always apply a stun, therefore opening up his options to attack.

I think u are wrong. With turtle meta change he will suck even more because parry baiting stop working, nobody will bother about his feints, just dodge/roll out/block his slow attacks and u are golden. Cheap dmg wont give him win. He is just to slow and predictable. There is compleatly no pressure from him in neutral.

DeLatv
05-16-2017, 10:00 PM
He doesnt need stright up buff. He needs more starting moves, maybe make top attack an combo finisher, like berserker, so he has some mixup. The dodge attack isnt enough.

DeLatv
05-16-2017, 10:04 PM
@very_oni what ur talking about, u dont do doged against kensei, his slow attacks will hit you all the ****ing time.

Alchemist..
05-16-2017, 10:17 PM
@very_oni what ur talking about, u dont do doged against kensei, his slow attacks will hit you all the ****ing time.

Pk can 1 dodge back his full combo, just dodge back after his helm splitter and his "good range" top finisher into side heavy (step ahead each attack) miss her and u are fully open to punish (recover time) nobushi is compleatly safe because she's also long range