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hop2002
03-07-2004, 10:40 AM
A few weeks ago, someone at SimHQ (iirc) posted data from IL2 compare for AEP, showing a rather low speed for the Spit V. I'd like to know if that's borne out in the game.

As I don't have AEP yet, and won't for a couple of weeks, could someone do a quick test of the 2 non clipped wing Spits. At sea level, with full boost/wep etc. If possible, note the rpm and boost level as well as the speed. I think the Crimea map will give the most accurate results.

Thanks to anyone who can help.

hop2002
03-07-2004, 10:40 AM
A few weeks ago, someone at SimHQ (iirc) posted data from IL2 compare for AEP, showing a rather low speed for the Spit V. I'd like to know if that's borne out in the game.

As I don't have AEP yet, and won't for a couple of weeks, could someone do a quick test of the 2 non clipped wing Spits. At sea level, with full boost/wep etc. If possible, note the rpm and boost level as well as the speed. I think the Crimea map will give the most accurate results.

Thanks to anyone who can help.

Hunde_3.JG51
03-07-2004, 10:55 AM
I did this a few days ago but my speed test always yields the same result. I fly off dogfight 1 map where land becomes flat. Anyway here is what I get for the Spits at sea-level with radiator closed, WEP enabled, and 110% throttle.

Spitfire V & V(CW): 455km/h

Spitfire LF.V & LF.V(CW) 515km/h

http://www.brooksart.com/Icewarriors.jpg

Formerly Kyrule2
http://www.jg51.com/

03-07-2004, 11:24 AM
Hi! Interesting thread! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif

Boosts:

for
1941 MkVB : ~463 kph, +16lbs
Tha gauge is incorrect, at this time only +9 was allowed. However speed matches very well : British results on W3134 is 468 km/h at SL..

1943 MkVB (clipped) : +16. Speed is about ~475+. There was some sideslip during tests, so add a few kph for a perfect flight.
It`s seems a bit slow, British measured 510 km/h on AA 878. Unless if there`s a boost gauge problem again.. However I can neither find trace of the reduced WEP time due to the higher boost, to 3 min only.

1943 MkVB LF : +18. Measured 518 km/h. The LF version seems to agree nicely with British results (523 km/h).

RPM as usual 3000.

BTW, the max boost works rather silly, you have to engage W for WEP to go for the maximum boosts.. I dont think there was such separate system after Mk I-II for emergency boost.

[This message was edited by VO101_Kurfurst on Sun March 07 2004 at 10:50 AM.]

Bogun
03-07-2004, 12:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VO101_Kurfurst:
BTW, the max boost works rather silly, you have to engage W for WEP to go for the maximum boosts.. I dont think there was such separate system after Mk I-II for emergency boost.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

There was an emergence boost control in the cockpit which, if you got into trouble and needed a lot of the extra engine power, you could engage with the throttle. Use of this small red painted lever, which permitted you to exceed normal boost, was called "puling the teat".
If you had occasion to use emergency boost, the engine gave a roar and a surge o power for about five minutes, and then youâ'd better throttle back before the engine blew up.

William R. Dunn about Rolls-Royce Merlin engine of a Spitfire.
"The First American Ace of World War II" p.209

Regards,

http://bogun.freeservers.com/609_bogun.jpg
"The best fighters I met in combat were the American P-51 Mustang and Russian Yak-9U. Both of those types obviously exceeded all Bf109 variants in performance, including the 'K'. The Mustang was unmatched in altitude performance, while the Yak-9U was champion in rate of climb and maneuverability."

- Walter Wolfrum (137 victories)

Hunde_3.JG51
03-07-2004, 12:04 PM
Just a quick question, what year did the Sitfire LF.V first see service?

http://www.brooksart.com/Icewarriors.jpg

Formerly Kyrule2
http://www.jg51.com/

03-07-2004, 12:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hunde_3.JG51:
Just a quick question, what year did the Sitfire LF.V first see service?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

About early summer 1943, apprx. parrellel to the G-6/G-6Late and Fw 190 A-5.

Bogun, I think it only worked this was on the early Mk I. Spitfires, later ones simply advanced the throttle to its limit to get maximum boost. I can see no mentioning of the special switch in alter Mark`s flight manual such as the Mk V or IX.

hop2002
03-08-2004, 05:22 PM
Thanks for the tests and replies.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Spitfire V & V(CW): 455km/h
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's certainly too low for even the earliest Spit Vs. The speed should be 10 mph (15 km/h) faster even at 9 lbs boost.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Spitfire LF.V & LF.V(CW) 515km/h<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's close, about 5 mph of the speed of a Merlin 50m Spit.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>for
1941 MkVB : ~463 kph, +16lbs
Tha gauge is incorrect,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hopefully. I'll do some full tests when I get the game. If it's really modelled at 16 lbs, then FTH will be a lot lower so it shouldn't be too hard to tell. I'll also try dropping the rpm a bit, 2850 rpm 9lbs boost was allowed for 1 hour, so we'll see what the overheating is like.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>1943 MkVB (clipped) : +16. Speed is about ~475+. There was some sideslip during tests, so add a few kph for a perfect flight.
It`s seems a bit slow, British measured 510 km/h on AA 878. Unless if there`s a boost gauge problem again.. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

475? Is that a typo? 475 is barely faster than a 9lbs boost Spit V, and certainly nowhere near 1942 performance. Did you have the rads open? By summer 42 boost had gone up to 16 lbs, which should give 315mph (510 km/h) at sea level. That makes it 20 mph 35 km/h too slow.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>However I can neither find trace of the reduced WEP time due to the higher boost, to 3 min only.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the 3 mins limit is probably a mistake. The manual says the limit for 16 lbs 3000 rpm is 5 mins. 5 minutes is the more usual time for a wep setting on a Merlin.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>1943 MkVB LF : +18. Measured 518 km/h. The LF version seems to agree nicely with British results (523 km/h).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That looks about right.

On a totaly different topic, Isegrim, do you know the radiator exit area for the 109, both open and closed? Was closed fully closed, or still partially open?

Koohullin
03-08-2004, 06:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hunde_3.JG51:
Just a quick question, what year did the Sitfire LF.V first see service?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Some nice person posted the Spitfire production dates over at SimHQ


Supermarine Aviation(Vickers)

2cd order built as
Mk VA, VB
April - Oct '41

3rd order built as
Mk V
July '40 - Jan '41

4th order built as
PR MkIV, F VB, VC, F IV
Aug '41 - Feb '42

5th order built as
PR Mk IV, F VB, VC, F VI, F VII, F IX
Feb '42 - Nov '42

6th order ???

7th order built as
PR IV, VC, F VI, F VII, F IX, PR XI, F XII
Nov '42 - Aug '43


Vickers Armstrong(Castle Bromwich)

1st order built as
Mk IIA, IIB, VA, VB
June '40 - July '41

2cd order built as
Mk VB
July '41 - Nov '41

3rd order built as
Mk VB
Nov '41 - May '42

4th order built as
VB, VC
Apr '42 - Aug '42

5th order built as
VB, VC
Aug '42 - Dec '42

6th order built as
VC, Mk IX
Dec '42 - Apr '43

7th order cancelled

8th order built as
VC, Mk IX
Mar '43 - Jun '43

9th order built as
VC, Mk IX, XVI
Jul '43 - May '44


Westland Aircraft

1st order built as
Mk I, VB, VC
Jul '41 - Sept '42

2cd order built as
Mk VC
Sept '42 - Feb '43

3rd order built as
Mk VC
Feb ' 43 - Nov '43