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broganpro
04-25-2017, 12:19 AM
This is not a hate message to Ubisoft, nor do I care to read negative feedback regarding my claim. I play a character that doesn't rely on throw distance, in fact, couldn't rely on it whatsoever. With this being said, it is nearly impossible to beat a team full of players that jump on you and spam their light attacks. It doesn't matter how many parries or deflects I can pull off, there is absolutely nothing I can do against 3 or more skilled players jumping on me and stun-locking me until I die. I understand that in cases like this in the past, one could just pop off revenge and spam zone attacks; however, for players like myself that legitimately fought and outplayed multiple people at once, it is now nearly impossible to defend yourself against more than one person. Two people isn't terribly hard depending on which characters you're up against, but any more than that and you have no chance whatsoever. I've seen some replies on other threads of people responding with a form of this statement, "I love this revenge nerf, I guess it will actually take skill to fight in a 1v2+ circumstance.". I can't completely disagree with it, but it would actually take a robot with perfect AI programming to win. I understand there needs to be some sort of realistic aspect of this game and for one person to take on multiple people isn't realistic at all. It is a game after all and now, even the most skilled players do not stand a chance if their entire team is dead in a game of elimination for example, and the round is left up to that one person. I do believe there needed to be some soft of nerf, such as only allowing X number of the same attack in a row, which would eliminate zone attack spamming in revenge mode. However, the way the update has changed the game, it encourages players to use feat cooldown reduction and throw distance rather than the previous revenge build. This sort of play style, in my opinion, defeats the purpose of combat in the game. In a player vs player combat game, I don't see how throwing a grenade at someone in a 1v1 every 15 seconds is fun at all. I do believe that the attack power in revenge mode, being stacked with your normal attack power was a bit much, but the stacked defense is most definitely a must. The way the old revenge system worked was much better in my opinion, if you were in a 1v1 with someone and another player on the enemy team decided, "hey they're 1v1ing, I'd rather win than fight it out like a man, so I'm going to spam lights and guard breaks until they're dead." then they would quickly learn that it was a terrible idea after all, getting punished by feeding revenge to the other player and upsetting your teammate. This was not always the case, because a lot of players couldn't handle fighting more than one person at a time, actually it took a very skilled player to do so (in most cases). Now, there is no hesitation about jumping on someone and double, triple or even quadruple teaming someone and it takes the exhilarating adrenaline rush out of taking on multiple people (which is something every player should look forward to when they become that good). I understand that Ubisoft is standing on thin ice when it comes to reviving the game and bringing back its most dedicated players, but this is not a good way to go about this. The best way to do so would be to either fix the connection issues or just switch to dedicated servers. That is no doubt the number one reason this game has died down so rapidly. Please take my advice and make revenge a useful tool again rather than just giving someone unlimited stamina for a short duration.

With kind regards,
A truly dedicated For Honor player

Gray360UK
04-25-2017, 12:26 AM
it is nearly impossible to beat a team full of players

:rolleyes:

broganpro
04-25-2017, 12:29 AM
:rolleyes:

it is nearly impossible to beat a team full of players that jump on you and spam their light attacks.
Darn trolls and your ability to quote out of context. lol

Gray360UK
04-25-2017, 12:50 AM
it is nearly impossible to beat a team full of players

When you see the problem with this part we can talk about the rest. As long as this is the kind of logic that underpins your argument for wanting Revenge to be more powerful again, rolling my eyes is about as good as you're going to get, and better than you deserve.

Gray360UK
04-25-2017, 01:18 AM
You rolled with your Eyes!

Now get the **** outta Here!
If you cant explain why you want that 4vs1 is impossible to win for the one!

Be quiet child, the adults are talking.

kweassa1917
04-25-2017, 01:19 AM
Is there supposed to be something wrong with "nearly impossible to beat a team full of players"? :confused:

kweassa1917
04-25-2017, 01:22 AM
Be quiet child, the adults are talking.



https://youtu.be/tzOCxnszcvA

Don't address him, no talking, no eye-contact until he becomes calm and submissive. Cesar's always right! :D

broganpro
04-25-2017, 01:31 AM
Is there supposed to be something wrong with "nearly impossible to beat a team full of players"? :confused:

I'm sorry, let me rephrase that, it IS impossible to beat an entire team on your own. Before the nerf, it was near impossible. so no, there isn't anything wrong with it whatsoever.

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 01:36 AM
I'm sorry, let me rephrase that, it IS impossible to beat an entire team on your own. Before the nerf, it was near impossible. so no, there isn't anything wrong with it whatsoever.

Ah, so the game is working as intended then? All is well with the world again.

broganpro
04-25-2017, 01:39 AM
Ah, so the game is working as intended then? All is well with the world again.

It seems as though all you read was my comment and not my post. Let me guess, you're one of those people that like to jump in a 1v1 because your precious win is more important than having fun and allowing others to have fun as well.

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 01:41 AM
Actually Dominion is my favorite game mode. I just don't waltz into those matches and go pick a fight with the entire enemy team at the same time and expect to win like that.

I'm pretty sure my Win/loss stats are pretty crap by now anyway since I don't need to win anything to have fun.

broganpro
04-25-2017, 01:51 AM
Actually Dominion is my favorite game mode. I just don't waltz into those matches and go pick a fight with the entire enemy team at the same time and expect to win like that.

I'm pretty sure my Win/loss stats are pretty crap by now anyway since I don't need to win anything to have fun.

I can definitely see your point as far as the Dominion game mode goes. As long as you're playing as a team, there's not many circumstances where you are trying to fend off the whole team other than breaking. On the other hand, I love playing elimination and I constantly find myself being ganked not long after the round has started due to someone either perfecting their opponent in a short amount of time or said player just running away and finding the nearest player to double team. Also, when your entire team dies, I don't believe you should be punished for it. You should be able to stand even the slightest chance against 3 people, which is how it was before, but now is literally impossible. Keep in mind that getting an execution is nearly impossible in a 1v3+ which allows the enemies to constantly revive each other and harass you with light attacks until you're taken down (which takes 0 skill to do since the update).

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 01:59 AM
I can definitely see your point as far as the Dominion game mode goes. As long as you're playing as a team, there's not many circumstances where you are trying to fend off the whole team other than breaking.

Well, I appreciate you conceding at least one point. All these Revenge nerf threads I've been reading never seems to get even that far, so thanks.


On the other hand, I love playing elimination and I constantly find myself being ganked not long after the round has started due to someone either perfecting their opponent in a short amount of time or said player just running away and finding the nearest player to double team.

While I understand your frustration when that happens, you have to remember than, everything your enemies do, you can do to.
First opponent takes off? You can either give chase, or go find one of your own teammates to help out, picking up boosts along the way.


Also, when your entire team dies, I don't believe you should be punished for it. You should be able to stand even the slightest chance against 3 people, which is how it was before, but now is literally impossible. Keep in mind that getting an execution is nearly impossible in a 1v3+ which allows the enemies to constantly revive each other and harass you with light attacks until you're taken down (which takes 0 skill to do since the update).

The reason people like me and Gray disagree with this notion, is that logic defies it. There's no scenario in the world where someone is expected to win a 1v4 fight. It simply doesn't add up. If you end up in a 1v4 fight, you're fighting against 4 times as many weapons, 4 times the positions, 4 times the feats and abilities. You're just not supposed to win such fights.
If 4 bulls started charging at you, no one would expect you to survive. Even if you had a gun, you couldn't shoot all of them in time.

We don't even have to use fighting metaphors for this, imagine you go to a restaurant and order 1 steak, waiter brings you 4. No normal human can finish 4 steaks, maybe 2-2½.

And no normal For Honor player can kill 4 enemies alone. It is a 4v4 game mode after all, not a 1v1v1v1v1v1v1v1.

broganpro
04-25-2017, 02:16 AM
Well, I appreciate you conceding at least one point. All these Revenge nerf threads I've been reading never seems to get even that far, so thanks.



While I understand your frustration when that happens, you have to remember than, everything your enemies do, you can do to.
First opponent takes off? You can either give chase, or go find one of your own teammates to help out, picking up boosts along the way.



The reason people like me and Gray disagree with this notion, is that logic defies it. There's no scenario in the world where someone is expected to win a 1v4 fight. It simply doesn't add up. If you end up in a 1v4 fight, you're fighting against 4 times as many weapons, 4 times the positions, 4 times the feats and abilities. You're just not supposed to win such fights.
If 4 bulls started charging at you, no one would expect you to survive. Even if you had a gun, you couldn't shoot all of them in time.

We don't even have to use fighting metaphors for this, imagine you go to a restaurant and order 1 steak, waiter brings you 4. No normal human can finish 4 steaks, maybe 2-2½.

And no normal For Honor player can kill 4 enemies alone. It is a 4v4 game mode after all, not a 1v1v1v1v1v1v1v1.

I agree that it would not make sense for the 1 person to be the victor, but when a highly skilled player is the last player alive up against 3 or even 4 new or just plain terrible players, it should be possible to come out on top. Even before the nerf, it was almost a 1 in a million chance for one player to beat four due to constant reviving. In fact, I searched youtube for quite awhile and only found two videos in which one person beat four. I myself need only 5 fingers to count the amount of times I have done it before the update, keep in mind these players were extremely bad and didn't understand how to properly team up against someone. Due to the update, any players no matter how bad or skilled they are, don't need to use any strategy whatsoever other than spamming lights and guard breaks, which before could be punished with a dodge/ deflect / parry followed by a light. Any skilled players could easily team up against someone, give them revenge and still manage to beat them. I'm not sure if you've ever heard of the Battle of Thermopylae, but if you don't believe it should be possible to beat seemingly overwhelming odds, you should really consider reading about it. It's actually very interesting!

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 02:35 AM
I agree that it would not make sense for the 1 person to be the victor, but when a highly skilled player is the last player alive up against 3 or even 4 new or just plain terrible players, it should be possible to come out on top.

Technically speaking, there is nothing in the game preventing 1 person beating 4. The odds are just naturally strongly stacked against the 1. As I believe it should be, but it isn't impossible.
Those 3 or 4 players you say are bad/new were still somehow good enough to kill the rest of the team, either due to good dueling skills, or better tactics. Either one is a completely valid way to put the odds in your favor, and win.


Even before the nerf, it was almost a 1 in a million chance for one player to beat four due to constant reviving. In fact, I searched youtube for quite awhile and only found two videos in which one person beat four. I myself need only 5 fingers to count the amount of times I have done it before the update, keep in mind these players were extremely bad and didn't understand how to properly team up against someone. Due to the update, any players no matter how bad or skilled they are, don't need to use any strategy whatsoever other than spamming lights and guard breaks, which before could be punished with a dodge/ deflect / parry followed by a light.

But, I think that's how the game is meant to be played. Revenge shouldn't be a God mode, there to gift you a win over impossible odds, It's a boost allowing you to do 2 things; Try your best to win a bad situation, or grant you a few seconds to make a tactical retreat/call for backup.


Any skilled players could easily team up against someone, give them revenge and still manage to beat them. I'm not sure if you've ever heard of the Battle of Thermopylae, but if you don't believe it should be possible to beat seemingly overwhelming odds, you should really consider reading about it. It's actually very interesting!

The thing about Thermopylae, is that the Spartans had 1 key factor on their side; Location. The place where the battle took place meant that the Persians could never deploy more soldiers to fight than the Spartans could. Didn't matter than the Persians had tens of thousands against 300 (the Spartans did have backup as well, but we'll ignore those for the sake of argument), at any given time only a fraction of that could fight.
There's very few places in For Honor where that sort of tactic could be utilized to the same effect.

The Spartans beat the odds through superior arms, training and most importantly, location. They didn't have a Revenge mode to double their strength. Of course in the end, they all died anyway.

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 02:39 AM
They wont accept it becouse they cant deal with a Real Nig*A they wont just!
They know we r right that in a G A M E near everything can be possible they dont like FairPlay they just Fu****UP against TruE Warriors !
All they can do is fight outnombered vs 1
Loutsher s in My Eyes
You see that you are L O U T S H E R S
yall aint know the meaning Fighting
FOR HONOR becouse you simply are tra**!

OOOH DID YALL FU**** UP against 1guy yes?
Is it Unfair yeees?

Ubisoft imply in the next Update that everytime 3of a team die the team who is winning get s unlimited Stamina please!
Becouse they acctually where too Dumb ganking with strategy!

Well damn son, when you put it like that I can totally see where you're coming from. You were right all along!

Sarcasm aside, I'm totally gonna report your posts. Damn kid, It's only a game after all.

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 02:46 AM
U said it Mo******* its only a Game after all!
Thatswhy i cant understand why you wont let be there to win a 1vs4?

...Because that sounds like a really really bad game.

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 02:49 AM
What sounds like a really bad game?
To give someone a chance to win vs4?
Thatwhy most people are leaving elimination matches before they end?

Like I said before, the game doesn't actively prevent you winning a 1v4 fight, the odds are just all stacked against you. As they should be.

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 02:51 AM
Heh, damn that was fast, I reported him like 4 minutes ago.

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 03:21 AM
It seems like its been acctually now a Really really bad game becouse many players are leaving Matches before it ends!
Becouse they Know theres no hope to win anymore!
When facing mutiple opponents!
Before Revenge nerf most players attended the end of a match becouse there was suspense!
Now its Hopeless!

broganpro
04-25-2017, 03:37 AM
It seems like its been acctually now a Really really bad game becouse many players are leaving Matches before it ends!
Becouse they Know theres no hope to win anymore!
When facing mutiple opponents!
Before Revenge nerf most players attended the end of a match becouse there was suspense!
Now its Hopeless!

Welcome to For Honor, where our title contradicts the way we intend the game to be played!

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 03:41 AM
Cant understand why people is against the idea of implementing back the only one chance of comeback for the team who is Loosing!

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 03:50 AM
Cant understand why people is against the idea of implementing back the only one chance of comeback for the team who is Loosing!

The modes where ganking is possible, Dominion, Elimination and Skirmish, are long games, you're given the exact same options as the opposing team to deny them the victory.

In Dominion for example, if a team decides to group up, all 4 of them, and just roam the map to kill players, you shouldn't try to solo them, or even 2v4 them. If a team has a gank train going, they can only occupy 1 objective at a time, whereas your team can theoretically occupy 2, and gain more points, giving you the first chance to win.

Elimination is a 5 round game mode, even against a good team you're given 3 rounds to prove you're better, through tactics or dueling. If you end up being the last one standing, your team failed. They were either tricked by a group tactic, or lost 3 duels, why should Revenge magically save you and your team here, when the enemy team just performed admirably and killed over half your team?
If they manage that, why shouldn't they deserve a win?

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 04:08 AM
The modes where ganking is possible, Dominion, Elimination and Skirmish, are long games, you're given the exact same options as the opposing team to deny them the victory.

In Dominion for example, if a team decides to group up, all 4 of them, and just roam the map to kill players, you shouldn't try to solo them, or even 2v4 them. If a team has a gank train going, they can only occupy 1 objective at a time, whereas your team can theoretically occupy 2, and gain more points, giving you the first chance to win.

Elimination is a 5 round game mode, even against a good team you're given 3 rounds to prove you're better, through tactics or dueling. If you end up being the last one standing, your team failed. They were either tricked by a group tactic, or lost 3 duels, why should Revenge magically save you and your team here, when the enemy team just performed admirably and killed over half your team?
If they manage that, why shouldn't they deserve a win?

Ehhm?? Becouse it would be FUN ?
As before!
Becouse its just a GAME and people where Fascinating and excited of it before?
If the team Wont Unleash The Dragon they just could get 4chances to deal with him in a 4times 1vs1
Or meanwhile one fights him one keeps attention and the other two go get some Buffs like shields attack power etc.! Go back and deal with him!
There are many many options to deal with The Dragon!
Shieldbash him down!
Guardbreak him meanwhile hes stunned 3buffed players could attack!
Now All these tactics to deal with an Strong Rager are still there!
But the Ragemode is No challenge now no more!
Revenge was too strong? Nerf a bit the damage!
Revenge gain was too fast? Nerd the GainBuild!

Now its not even challenging nomore to deal VS Revenge!

broganpro
04-25-2017, 04:10 AM
The modes where ganking is possible, Dominion, Elimination and Skirmish, are long games, you're given the exact same options as the opposing team to deny them the victory.

In Dominion for example, if a team decides to group up, all 4 of them, and just roam the map to kill players, you shouldn't try to solo them, or even 2v4 them. If a team has a gank train going, they can only occupy 1 objective at a time, whereas your team can theoretically occupy 2, and gain more points, giving you the first chance to win.

Elimination is a 5 round game mode, even against a good team you're given 3 rounds to prove you're better, through tactics or dueling. If you end up being the last one standing, your team failed. They were either tricked by a group tactic, or lost 3 duels, why should Revenge magically save you and your team here, when the enemy team just performed admirably and killed over half your team?
If they manage that, why shouldn't they deserve a win?

I can see where you're coming from, but revenge doesn't magically give you the win. There were certain instances where for example, a peacekeeper would spam zone attack repeatedly and it did about 1/3 of your health each time you were hit, that is taking full advantage of revenge, which could have been nerfed in different ways. It takes an extremely skilled player to win a 1v3 or 4 even with revenge other than the zone spams from the peacekeeper, shield bash heavy from the conqueror, but even those are easily beaten because if you have a player constantly harassing you, especially shugoki with his back crack and law bringer with his overhead throw then there's literally nothing you could do. with defense nerfed in revenge, it takes shugoki one grab along with a team wailing on you because you can't do anything for 5 seconds to kill you. There needs to be some sort of way one player can make a huge comeback without throwing people off ledges and spamming feats.

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 04:26 AM
I think many People cant understand What Honor is and Fighting FOR iT really means!
If i Think of myself as one Warrior from The coolness in the game!

I think theyself Would not GoGankspam The **** out of an Last SAMURAI KNIGHT or Viking like many people do in the game!
Im not so sure about The Viking but however......

Thinking of myself being one of them with 3Companions of me we are 4who survived
On the other side theres One Last Warrior standing Who Fought for Honor too like us! god im crying thinking of these scenario!

I would say to my Companions:
“Dont even Think to Interfer ! I FIGHT HIM ALONE!“

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 04:28 AM
*

broganpro
04-25-2017, 04:32 AM
I think many People cant understand What Honor is and Fighting FOR iT really means!
If i Think of myself as one Warrior from The coolness in the game!

I think theyself Would not GoGankspam The **** out of an Last SAMURAI KNIGHT or Viking like many people do in the game!
Im not so sure about The Viking but however......

Thinking of myself being one of them with 3Companions of me we are 4who survived
On the other side theres One Last Warrior standing Who Fought for Honor too like us! god im crying thinking of these scenario!

I would say to my Companions:
“Dont even Think to Interfer ! I FIGHT HIM ALONE!“

Great scenario! lmao
I've seen suggestions of implementing an increased revival time, reviving someone with only a % of your full hp, etc. All of which would fix our dilemma of having a 0% chance of beating a team full of gankers and spammers. If only Ubisoft would have came out with something like this before just nerfing revenge so hard that it's practically useless in certain situations that would have been great! I love this game, it's one of the most addicting combat, strategy games I've played since the old school Call of Duty games, but since this last update, the characters that have taken the biggest hits are the ones that don't rely on throws and feats, but more revenge in said situations.

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 04:38 AM
Any Great Warrior that Fought FOR HONOR in hes Life would i think Cut my Head off if i Go Gang Bang an LAST SAMURAI!
Immagine the scenario of your own Senpai getting The News How you killed an Last Knight Standing!
Hhhhhh i think really he would Exile me for that!

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 05:28 AM
I think many People cant understand What Honor is and Fighting FOR iT really means!
If i Think of myself as one Warrior from The coolness in the game!

I think theyself Would not GoGankspam The **** out of an Last SAMURAI KNIGHT or Viking like many people do in the game!
Im not so sure about The Viking but however......

Thinking of myself being one of them with 3Companions of me we are 4who survived
On the other side theres One Last Warrior standing Who Fought for Honor too like us! god im crying thinking of these scenario!

I would say to my Companions:
“Dont even Think to Interfer ! I FIGHT HIM ALONE!“

I'm terribly sorry, not trying to be a smartass here, but I genuinely cannot decipher what meaning or point you're trying to make here. Any chance I can get you to slow down a bit, and type as coherently as possible?

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 06:13 AM
Ah I think I understand now.

The thing is though, It's a game. People, largely, play it for fun. Not everyone has time, nor any interest in partaking in the rituals of vague concepts like honor.
Most people also want to win, at any cost. If the choice is between engaging in protracted duels, or claiming a victory, why wouldn't you choose victory?

Personally I find it just as honorable to take on 4 people, giving it your best, and die trying, as a team engaging the last survivor one by one.

kweassa1917
04-25-2017, 06:40 AM
Personally I find it just as honorable to take on 4 people, giving it your best, and die trying, as a team engaging the last survivor one by one.

Sometimes its an admirable trait -- if they keep to it themselves and still follow the code despite numerous defeats. IMO, ultimately futile, but still if someone has the will to see it through, I can respect that as it is.


Unfortunately, many others, just come running straight to these boards the moment they die from being focused, and then start a rage tantrum demanding people play by their rules of honor, and ridicule and belittle people who beat them.

I don't see these types as 'honorable' at all. These types are just fakers. To them, the concept of "honor" is basically a nice excuse to cover their egos, and usually only applies when they benefit from it.

Real men of honor DON'T COMPLAIN ABOUT THE CONSEQUENCES OF THEIR ACTIONS. It's their faith, their code. So whatever the result, they bite it down. Instead of throwing a shi-fit in open forums.

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 06:48 AM
Ah I think I understand now.

The thing is though, It's a game. People, largely, play it for fun. Not everyone has time, nor any interest in partaking in the rituals of vague concepts like honor.
Most people also want to win, at any cost. If the choice is between engaging in protracted duels, or claiming a victory, why wouldn't you choose victory?

Personally I find it just as honorable to take on 4 people, giving it your best, and die trying, as a team engaging the last survivor one by one.

I agree !
But why dont let the gameplay be a bit more exciting how it was before with strong revenge!
I mean Not that OP just a bit weaker it was before!
As so everyone would have a Chance winning!
But i think....

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 06:53 AM
Real men of honor DON'T COMPLAIN ABOUT THE CONSEQUENCES OF THEIR ACTIONS. It's their faith, their code. So whatever the result, they bite it down. Instead of throwing a shi-fit in open forums.

Well, It's hard to argue with that.

Honor is subjective. History is written by the victors.

We the players have no say in what constitutes honor in a game that is not ours. All we have are the same rules and conditions, It's up to each of us to use them as best we can.

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 06:57 AM
I thaught this is just a game?
Its about Fun having playing it!
Just like it was before!
They just could nerf the damage a bit to dont let it be op as before and slower in build! As the Community rewuested it!
Cant acctually understand Ubisoft why they done it nerf too much

Tundra 793
04-25-2017, 07:02 AM
I agree !
But why dont let the gameplay be a bit more exciting how it was before with strong revenge!
I mean Not that OP just a bit weaker it was before!
As so everyone would have a Chance winning!
But i think....

Everyone does have a chance of winning. I mentioned it earlier, with examples of how this worked both in Dominion and Elimination.

2 teams, even number of players, same rules. The game offers no advantage or disadvantage to either team, and In a Team based game mode, the scale should never tip toward 1 person, out of a team of four.
If you find yourself 1v4, It's because something went wrong, your team made mistakes and paid for them, It's not resting on any 1 person's shoulders to win over 4 other people.

I think arguments could be made to further adjust Revenge. Perhaps a boost to defense for example. Revenge however, is, was and should never be a tool that can allow you to prevail against an onslaught of 4 enemies. However much fun you might find such an engagement to win, It's 4 times as frustrating to those 4 players, who performed well enough that they killed your whole team.

marcoalpha1
04-25-2017, 07:54 AM
Everyone does have a chance of winning. I mentioned it earlier, with examples of how this worked both in Dominion and Elimination.

2 teams, even number of players, same rules. The game offers no advantage or disadvantage to either team, and In a Team based game mode, the scale should never tip toward 1 person, out of a team of four.
If you find yourself 1v4, It's because something went wrong, your team made mistakes and paid for them, It's not resting on any 1 person's shoulders to win over 4 other people.

I think arguments could be made to further adjust Revenge. Perhaps a boost to defense for example. Revenge however, is, was and should never be a tool that can allow you to prevail against an onslaught of 4 enemies. However much fun you might find such an engagement to win, It's 4 times as frustrating to those 4 players, who performed well enough that they killed your whole team.

It is not a matter of winning or loosing.

After adapting to the new revenge mode I score more o less the same kills as before and I win/loose about the same.

It is a matter of fun. With the new revenge people move in packs and run from the occasional 1v1. On respawn ypu neeed to group up and attack togheter. Fine.

The problem the the group attack is mainly spamming. There is no much skills involved.

If you want to have realistic 1v4 then damage on own team members should be fully enabled so that at least you need to be careful where you hit instead of go berserker!

(Eg no more shugoki lifting you and the rest of the team smashing you while locked in the elimination??!)

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 09:14 AM
It is not a matter of winning or loosing.

After adapting to the new revenge mode I score more o less the same kills as before and I win/loose about the same.

It is a matter of fun. With the new revenge people move in packs and run from the occasional 1v1. On respawn ypu neeed to group up and attack togheter. Fine.

The problem the the group attack is mainly spamming. There is no much skills involved.

If you want to have realistic 1v4 then damage on own team members should be fully enabled so that at least you need to be careful where you hit instead of go berserker!

(Eg no more shugoki lifting you and the rest of the team smashing you while locked in the elimination??!)

It really is just a matter of Fun and suspense

S0Mi_xD
04-25-2017, 11:45 AM
You guys are really something (those who want the old revenge back / a strong revenge.

All of your statements are inconsistent and spongy . . .

Oh, it's about honor that's why it is called For Honor. . .
Ohh it's about "fairness" and not running away and group up . . .
Ohhh so unfair when i don't have a good chance of winning a 1v4 . . .
Ohhhh it's about realism, real Knights and Samurai had Honor and fought fair, mh vikings maybe but they are much to barbaric . . .
Ohhhhh it's just a game, we wanna have fun but the fun is gone . . .

At first, throw off your romanticized thoughts of Honor, Fairness, Knights, Samurai (and their fairness) and Vikings.

Honor is just a word, that implies a Status in a society (you can go back to knights or stay in our time with fanatic terrorists who "fight for the honor of a god, a dictator or my Butt" )
You can assimilate Hornor with Religion.
For their own folk they been heros (at least in stories or legends), for other folks they have been bloodthirsty killer.
But knights and Samurais, it was their job, they have been payed to defend or conquer. They used every advantage they had to kill or conquer the enemy.
Nowdays the are soldiers. This is war!
All is fair in love and war!!

I do not think and it wasn't fun to lose against the last one standing with a clear advantage in numbers, it was annoying.
And it wasn't fun to 1 or 2 shot people.

About winning a 1v2, 3, 4, it was a cool moment and a great feeling, but with the new revenge it is even more rewarding.
I do still have fun in 4v4s.

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 11:58 AM
.
I do still have fun in 4v4s.

Yes i can imagine that! And its good for you!
But better for all i think it is to find a midway balance!
Before it was to strong
And now people are stating that its too weak!

Just Calibrate it a bit and im sure both sides are happy!

Gotta accept that!
And stop Trolling!

S0Mi_xD
04-25-2017, 12:33 PM
Yes i can imagine that! And its good for you!
But better for all i think it is to find a midway balance!
Before it was to strong
And now people are stating that its too weak!

Just Calibrate it a bit and im sure both sides are happy!

Gotta accept that!
And stop Trolling!

I do not troll, it's just you need to see beyond one's own nose.

Let's see into the Gear Stats.

Revenge mode Attack:
+ maximum bonus decreased from 48.2% down to 24.1%
Revenge mode Defence:
+ maximum bonus decreased from 48.2% down to 32.1%

Attack:
+ maximum 18%
Defence:
+ maximum 30 %

So in revenge you stiill get 6 % + in attack and 2 % defence. In short it still makes you better, even if the increase isn't really noticeable.

More of a problem, i do think is the Revenge Mode duration.
+ maximum bonus decreased from 54.0% down to 25.0%
And that is what i really notice in a fight/gank.

Now about your suggestion to buff revenge abit.
Ubisoft / the Devs statet themselfes, the current revenge mode is NOT the final version = there will be adjustments.
But do not hope for that much, because they said it is for escape or to have a small chance and not to be equal or stronger to 4 people.

If they buff revenge it will be not much different from how it is now.
You need to make the revenge mode how it is now usefull for yourself.

So please, stop posting every day a NEW Thread about this topic.

S0Mi_xD
04-25-2017, 12:39 PM
And now about GANKING.

This problem is not related to the new revenge, i have been Ganked befor aswell.
The problem her is, that you can just attack into your own teammates and it doesn't matter.

How to solve ganks then? It's simple, FriendlyFire. If you hit your teammates with 50% of your damage this will really hurt.
This also solves Shugoki Ganks.
You need to look for an opening to attack or your team will be really pissed of you.

Currently i already play this way when i fight with my teammates against an enemy i do not just attack, i go behinde the enemy, attack or GB him if he is open or to open up him for my teammates.

I do even raged on my own friends to be more cautios because they allways interrupted my attacks or GBs.
Now they do pay more attention.
And with raising the FF every idiot will understand that just spamming into a group is a bad idea.

Sure there will be trolls who will abuse it, they will always exist and find a way to troll teammates.

marcoalpha1
04-25-2017, 12:43 PM
You guys are really something (those who want the old revenge back / a strong revenge.

All of your statements are inconsistent and spongy . . .

Oh, it's about honor that's why it is called For Honor. . .
Ohh it's about "fairness" and not running away and group up . . .
Ohhh so unfair when i don't have a good chance of winning a 1v4 . . .
Ohhhh it's about realism, real Knights and Samurai had Honor and fought fair, mh vikings maybe but they are much to barbaric . . .
Ohhhhh it's just a game, we wanna have fun but the fun is gone . . .

At first, throw off your romanticized thoughts of Honor, Fairness, Knights, Samurai (and their fairness) and Vikings.

Honor is just a word, that implies a Status in a society (you can go back to knights or stay in our time with fanatic terrorists who "fight for the honor of a god, a dictator or my Butt" )
You can assimilate Hornor with Religion.
For their own folk they been heros (at least in stories or legends), for other folks they have been bloodthirsty killer.
But knights and Samurais, it was their job, they have been payed to defend or conquer. They used every advantage they had to kill or conquer the enemy.
Nowdays the are soldiers. This is war!
All is fair in love and war!!

I do not think and it wasn't fun to lose against the last one standing with a clear advantage in numbers, it was annoying.
And it wasn't fun to 1 or 2 shot people.

About winning a 1v2, 3, 4, it was a cool moment and a great feeling, but with the new revenge it is even more rewarding.
I do still have fun in 4v4s.

How is this a reply to what i wrote? Fun, or my fun at least, is in fighting with skills that involve blocking parrying GB digging combos etc.. after the patch this is gone from 4v4 game modes since people move in packs and spam.

I personally don't like it and it is not only me.

You and a couple of others are very good a winding people up, which is indeed a form of trolling. You want, and try hard, to outsmart people as a form of trolling.

What is wrong with damage enabled within the same team? That will stop some group spamming.

I asked you this question in different chats but you always seem to avoid the question and start you form of smart trolling...

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 12:47 PM
And now about GANKING.

This problem is not related to the new revenge, i have been Ganked befor aswell.
The problem her is, that you can just attack into your own teammates and it doesn't matter.

How to solve ganks then? It's simple, FriendlyFire. If you hit your teammates with 50% of your damage this will really hurt.
This also solves Shugoki Ganks.

I M starting Liking you!?
And about revenge back
I hope they make it a little threat to 4vs1 to let elimination match be more balanced excited forceing to play with just a lilbit more honor when 4vs1 dont know like implementing penaltys for exagerating spamganking maybe?!

Would just like it!

Besides where did you get the news about it is not final version of Revenge im curious becouse i dont know that!!

S0Mi_xD
04-25-2017, 12:53 PM
How is this a reply to what i wrote? Fun, or my fun at least, is in fighting with skills that involve blocking parrying GB digging combos etc.. after the patch this is gone from 4v4 game modes since people move in packs and spam.

I personally don't like it and it is not only me.

You and a couple of others are very good a winding people up, which is indeed a form of trolling. You want, and try hard, to outsmart people as a form of trolling.

What is wrong with damage enabled within the same team? That will stop some group spamming.

I asked you this question in different chats but you always seem to avoid the question and start you form of smart trolling...

I am sorry but the comment of me you qouted, wasn't just for you it is in general about Revenge whiners.

And sorry i do not saw you saying that Team dmg shoud be enabled to stop ganking.
I never said anything against FF, i do think it would be a good way to stop ganking in a spammy way.

S0Mi_xD
04-25-2017, 12:59 PM
I M starting Liking you!?
And about revenge back
I hope they make it a little threat to 4vs1 to let elimination match be more balanced excited forceing to play with just a lilbit more honor when 4vs1 dont know like implementing penaltys for exagerating spamganking maybe?!

Would just like it!

Besides where did you get the news about it is not final version of Revenge im curious becouse i dont know that!!

Yeay a better powerup than just 6% attack and 2% in revenge would be sure better,
The duration is what fu-cks me up more in a gank.
But me and onther can still work with it, its just a question of your own mentality, if you think it is useless and you will lose anyway, that will also be the result.

Oh, would give you the source of this info, but i do not remember well, i heard this in a video about for honor news, maybe it is from a Dev Stream?
I am sorry ....

Tydeelee
04-25-2017, 01:00 PM
To Shrink daaamn Now they are arguing
Acctually with HONOR HEEERREEE
praise the sun!

(Still cant beat that moeffuggin black dragon in darksouls3 the ringed city)

broganpro
04-25-2017, 11:35 PM
Skilled players shouldn't be punished for finding a bad team in this terrible matchmaking system. Anyone else notice that elimination went from high to very high activity to medium to rarely high? Anyone try to play elimination since the revenge nerf? Unless you're a bad player and are constantly getting rocked by skilled players in revenge mode because you idiotically decided to jump in on a 1v1 then there should be no reason for anyone to argue that revenge wasn't nerfed way too hard. At least give us our defense and revenge gain back! Figure out a way to remove revenge in 1v1s, that definitely unfair i can't argue that.... but come on ubisoft, before you make the game even worse, focus on the connection issues. A combination of connection issues and being punished for finding a garbage team due to lack of players is really encouraging me to finally get a life and quit playing this addictive games. If it weren't for players that respect a 1v1 like myself, the game mode would be ruined altogether. Thank you to those of you who have self respect and respect for others.

lordFRZA
04-26-2017, 04:10 AM
I am not a fan of the new revenge mode. It used to be great. I didn't have a problem with the old revenge mode.
It used to be when you had a gang of ruffians all over you you would hit revenge mode and you could at least take a beating long enough to fight them off and get them to back off long enough for you to get away or your teammates to show up. Now revenge mode is over before you even get started and the enemies don't even hesitate.

Revenge mode used to be something to fear, now its just an afterthought...if that.

kweassa1917
04-26-2017, 09:10 AM
Revenge mode used to be something to fear, now its just an afterthought...if that.

That's usually because your own skill level is nothing to be feared, and therefore whatever you do in your revenge mode is just an afterthought.

People with higher base skill level do much better with revenge, because it's actually them fighting with their skills, assisted by revenge, not the other way around where the revenge mode fights for you, and you're just there to hitch the ride.

Just saying.

Tydeelee
04-26-2017, 09:23 AM
That's usually because your own skill level is nothing to be feared, and therefore whatever you do in your revenge mode is just an afterthought.

People with higher base skill level do much better with revenge, because it's actually them fighting with their skills, assisted by revenge, not the other way around where the revenge mode fights for you, and you're just there to hitch the ride.

Just saying.

However its just a bit too weak cmon man!
They cannot present a boomstick Revenge like it was and nerf it like this!

broganpro
04-28-2017, 03:47 AM
That's usually because your own skill level is nothing to be feared, and therefore whatever you do in your revenge mode is just an afterthought.

People with higher base skill level do much better with revenge, because it's actually them fighting with their skills, assisted by revenge, not the other way around where the revenge mode fights for you, and you're just there to hitch the ride.

Just saying.

Oh, really? I don't believe revenge was fair the way it was before, but the defense and duration was on point. The way it is now, all it takes is shugoki one grab and your entire health bar is gone before you can even get back up. Shugoki isn't even the worst of the problem, you the valk knock over spam combos are even worse than that! Do you have any idea how hard it is for you to dodge her charges and spam combos with the way the multi-combat system works? Try shifting players by letting go and pressing LT, you've got a 50%, 33% or 25% chance of actually locking onto the valk to dodge it, good luck! I've noticed that most people that are happy with the new revenge are actually very terrible players, because they can't manage to even make the old revenge useful, so to make it fair to them they have to complain and complain until ubisoft finally does something, congrats you whiny kids got your way! The only other players that hated the old revenge were noobs that spammed grabs/ throws and feats, which in my opinion, contradicts the entire point of the combat system.

kweassa1917
04-28-2017, 04:17 AM
Oh, really? I don't believe revenge was fair the way it was before, but the defense and duration was on point.

Gray360 testifies 8 revenge activations that last around 10 seconds within duration of 2 minutes, and most anyone coming clean and honest about this issue remembers it the same way, as do I. That's approx. 66% uptiime during combat, in an abnormal "power-up" mode that reduces incoming damage to around half or less, which in most cases people were lucky to get rid of the temp shield before revenge runs out, and you're calling that "spot on"???



"The way it is now, all it takes is shugoki one grab and your entire health bar is gone before you can even get back up.

Practice target switching, instead of make up excuses for your lack of awareness.



Shugoki isn't even the worst of the problem, you the valk knock over spam combos are even worse than that! Do you have any idea how hard it is for you to dodge her charges and spam combos with the way the multi-combat system works? Try shifting players by letting go and pressing LT, you've got a 50%, 33% or 25% chance of actually locking onto the valk to dodge it, good luck! I've noticed that most people that are happy with the new revenge are actually very terrible players, because they can't manage to even make the old revenge useful, so to make it fair to them they have to complain and complain until ubisoft finally does something, congrats you whiny kids got your way! The only other players that hated the old revenge were noobs that spammed grabs/ throws and feats, which in my opinion, contradicts the entire point of the combat system.

What you're saying is basically: "blablablablablablablablablabla... I've made the mistake of being surrounded by disablers without route of escape".

So no, I'm not sure why you're so angry about a consequence of your own mistake.

-Does that Shug or Valk mysteriously teleport behind you in stealth coating?
-Do they use hax to disable you with an undodgeable move?
-Did they somehow teleport you to a corner or a wall and block your escape route?
-Did they futz with your controls and disable you from scanning around you for incoming enemy icons?

If above cases happened, I'd be angry too, except it doesn't happen that way, does it. There are always warning signs everywhere, and you weren't paying attention to them. So ,what the hell were you thinking when you let them Shugs or Valks just join the fight and pile up against you?

Why did you let them do it? Because you were somehow hit with a MMORPG "immobilize" or "root" skill?


What's even funnier is you revenge whiney folk complain so much of being ganked and dying. Obviously the first few tries should adequately tell you it doesn't work like that anymore, and you can't face 3~4 enemies and expect to kill them without massively superior skills.

So you know you don't have the skills to do that, and you know meeting 3~4 enemies is a bad idea. And yet, you do the same shi* over and over and over again without adjusting any tactics, any of your behavior, thinking about any remedies or ways to defend yourself, and then get killed in the same way over and over again, and then come here and whine over and over again.


Evolve, dude.