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View Full Version : Why do people have trouble with Kensei?



CoyoteXStarrk
04-22-2017, 04:27 AM
I am a Beserker main, but I like switching it up every now and then to keep things fresh and lately I have been using Kensei and more often than not I will win 1v1 in Dominion without getting touched or just taking a few hits. I would say this happens around 60-70% of the time.


The overhead feint + the dodge R1 + a R1 combo thrown in every now and then and its like you blew their mind. They can't block accurately, they can't parry consistently and then they seem to almost not know what to do.


I am by no means claiming I am some Kensei god or something its just that when I am on my Beserker I can tell my opponent knows what they are doing and knows how to fight me, but most times its like the Kensei is alien to them.



Is it because she doesn't get used that much so people are used to her?


Is it that her kit is just different from everyone elses?



I am genuinely confused as to why this seems to be the case. PS4 player here btw.

escacleo
04-22-2017, 08:07 AM
Kensei dodges left and attacks to the right. It trips up some new players. You can defensively win a fight with just dodge attacks at times just waiting for an attack and dodging over and over. But that only works against newer players as well. I'm rep 11 kensei and the higher I go the more difficult it is for me to win some fights. Playing against a newer player is completely different from playing an experienced one. Seems newer players can't handle overly aggressive kensei play where a experienced player seems to tear that strategy apart.

Rikuto01.tv
04-22-2017, 11:32 AM
There are two kinds of kensei's.

The kind who use the class's attacks and generally aren't anything that special, and the kind of abuse high-level glitching to the extreme and are terrifying as hell.

The second kind are definitely something special.

Mudflaaaps
04-22-2017, 02:45 PM
This is spot on.

I'm a kensei main and I'm the first type. I play properly, utilise feints, rely on the overhead UB feint to the side. It's difficult playing anyone with any sense really, even post patch kensei is lacking in openers. I have to play extremely defensively at first then switch it up and confuse people, only way.

The ones who abuse feint exploits and 'tech' as they call it are scum, dude above was right to say they make for a terrifying kensei.

Still, it's near impossible to fight certain characters, regardless of skill.
Can't fight peacekeepers or shield characters. As I said, no openers.

TheLastPandaa
04-22-2017, 02:59 PM
This is spot on.

I'm a kensei main and I'm the first type. I play properly, utilise feints, rely on the overhead UB feint to the side. It's difficult playing anyone with any sense really, even post patch kensei is lacking in openers. I have to play extremely defensively at first then switch it up and confuse people, only way.

The ones who abuse feint exploits and 'tech' as they call it are scum, dude above was right to say they make for a terrifying kensei.

Still, it's near impossible to fight certain characters, regardless of skill.
Can't fight peacekeepers or shield characters. As I said, no openers.

Wow! that surprised me! As a kensei, for me the most easy fights are vs Pks. :confused:

CandleInTheDark
04-22-2017, 03:06 PM
As a PK, kensei is my worst matchup and if I remember correctly, he is one of the few PKs have less than 45% victories against in regular and high level play on the devs' data. I like to parry, the attack suddenly changes direction, I like to deflect, I suddenly get guardbroken, everything I do that normally works seems to play into their hands, i think I need to play against them more or put time into playing them.

kweassa1917
04-22-2017, 03:13 PM
As a PK, kensei is my worst matchup and if I remember correctly, he is one of the few PKs have less than 45% victories against in regular and high level play on the devs' data.

It's similar with all assassins. Their first instinct is to light-spam. Not necessarily nonstop, but at least use lights in fast succession at close ranges to shut the opponent down and pressure them to become passive -- which is at that point the initiative goes to the assassin, as the assassins are now free to mixup GBs in, and are granted freedom of movement whereas the opponent, fearing lights, cannot use their light to check the assassin, and have their feet planted because they fear their dodges getting GBd.

Kensei, while (frankly) gimpy as hell, have their side-dodge light attacks which, mechanic wise, are actually double-dodge attacks. The dodge angle is wide enough to evade almost anything, and since its an attack, despite the huge and long arc of the dodge, cannot be GBd. So when a Kensei mixes up few side dodging attacks and feints the assassins classes are somewhat counter-pressured in that they can't spam lights easily, which is that point, when the assassin attacks loosen up, the Kensei can control the range and retake the initiative.

That, and the fact Kensei attacks are pretty strong even with light hits.

IMO it's still not enough to say Kensei has an advantage on assassin classes, but for that strange reason, somehow has things going slightly better for him than most other classes do when they fight assassin classes.

matt89connor
04-22-2017, 03:21 PM
the problem to fight kensei, isn't the Kensei but the turtle players, not dodge, simple parry and heavy.
Dodge attack, if is predict, can be parry well and you can punish kensei,
the samurai with long sword has big problem vs warden because he has fear to the top punish and the vortex, and vs Law and Warlord and Conqueror,for the push attacks ....the others heroes can be fight well with good expirience,and patience ( like Tokugawa Ieyasu say: patience is the key for victory ). :)

Epoqx
04-22-2017, 03:28 PM
Kensei main really high rep. I consider myself in the high tier of players, and stats can prove it. Mostly 1v1 and brawls, and some 4v4 to when i am in a lazy mood. Anyways i'm not posting to sell myself, but to support he fact that my arguments have been thought for a long time, and that i know my class by heart.

@CoyoteXStarrk Generally speaking, you don't have the same mindset when you play 4v4 and 1v1. In 4v4 modes, you got a lot of things to think about, not only the opponent you are vs, so it can be easier for characters like the kensei : big range, easy to learn and making huge damage on each hit, especially with his combo ender. You have an easier time throwing your full combo in 4v4 modes because of ennemies who takes care of all their surrounding constantly.

While in 1v1, you can fully concentrate on the ennemy, making the fight much more intense, and much more "turtle". Giving the fact that Kensei has no opener, vs the defensive meta, he has a hard time opening people up. For example, how do you want to punish someone out of stamina without any opener ? GB feints. Each one of your opening tries is a risk, by feinting, by some slow side lights, by the side dodge light (which is over risky), by trying the lights/GB feints... Each of your tools are a risk for you, than most of any other chars.

Meaning that you need to use EACH (risky) tools you can at high level to actually be efficient... Making the Kensei a real pain to master and to fight with, against good opponents.


And for me, even on consoles, when i play with Kensei, pk's aren't my nightmare. We got the advantage of a really fast guard switch, which helps a lot with the light spam, we got the range, which helps a lot against low range assassin's, and some super armor on the 4th hit, helping a lot with the spam dodging characters. So yeah, i think Kensei is a sort of natural counter to assassin's.

AKDagriZ
04-22-2017, 04:17 PM
i always have very bad time fighting a good kensei he is one of my worst since beta . even if he don't play feint game he's attack over catch everything i try to do if we attack same time he always connect

zide-
04-22-2017, 04:21 PM
The problem I have with Kensei when playing as a slower class like Lawbringer, is that Kensei can cancel his overhead unblockable so late that I am being punished for reacting to it by trying to parry.

It goes like this

-Kensei goes for overhead unblockable (starts spinning in the air)
-Sword is coming towards you
-Do upward parry
-Kensei cancels and switches to sideway heavy/light
-Your failed attempt to parry changes into overhead heavy and Kensei lands a sideway hit

CandleInTheDark
04-22-2017, 04:28 PM
The problem I have with Kensei when playing as a slower class like Lawbringer, is that Kensei can cancel his overhead unblockable so late that I am being punished for reacting to it by trying to parry.

It goes like this

-Kensei goes for overhead unblockable (starts spinning in the air)
-Sword is coming towards you
-Do upward parry
-Kensei cancels and switches to sideway heavy/light
-Your failed attempt to parry changes into overhead heavy and Kensei lands a sideway hit

Yeah I feel that, though I do something similar as the peacekeeper, her three hit chain, a topheavy has her spin around and hit you, I get a kick out of feinting, watching people block top, and she stops then casually moves her dagger to the side and whips them across the face with a side light.

Ryumanjisen
04-22-2017, 04:54 PM
The answer to the OP is really simple: usually, the people who play dominion doesn't play duels. So, they doesnt' know their opponents and rely more on spam the same attack over and over. As soon as they face a decent player, one who knows his stuff, they're screwed.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-22-2017, 10:24 PM
The ones who abuse feint exploits and 'tech' as they call it are scum, dude above was right to say they make for a terrifying kensei.


Okay come on now you have to be joking. There is no way you are being serious.

In the other thread you said that top tier heroes have NO combos. (They do)


Now you are saying that Feints are exploits?


You can't be serious lol

MasterChiefPON
04-23-2017, 12:07 AM
Okay come on now you have to be joking. There is no way you are being serious.

In the other thread you said that top tier heroes have NO combos. (They do)


Now you are saying that Feints are exploits?


You can't be serious lol

I think they are talking about the gb faint (exploit) and the light attack feint which is also an exploit (basically when you fight someone who uses this exploit you see him/her do a light attack in one direction and it suddently turns into a light or heavy in another direction and if you tried to parry that light you eat the next attack)