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View Full Version : Should I feel bad for LITERALLY running the clock out for a win?



CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 12:24 AM
Just got out of a Dominion match with my PeaceKeeper where we had a massive point lead, but we couldn't close the deal and the other team made an epic come back.


We had 1400pts vs 1000 and their LawBringer landed a perfect catapult shot and killed all 3 of my teammates and I couldn't revive them due to their team leaving a Warlord their to guard their bodies.


So their team consisted of

- Warlord

- LawBringer

- Lawbringer

- Conqueror


(Which is why we had a hard time closing the deal. They just turtled up)


None of them could catch me because lol PeaceKeeper so I just ran around for the final 2:45 to deny them the win and we won by default due to the point lead.



Part of me feels bad because it WAS an excellent comeback.


The other part feels like I made a tactical decision and went for the win.


I am conflicted. Would you have run for the win or given them the comeback?

corazondedelfin
04-16-2017, 12:29 AM
That is playing truly dishonorable. You should have fought to your last end, or theirs.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 12:30 AM
That is playing truly dishonorable. You should have fought to your last end, or theirs.

I know!

And whats worse is I am one of those guys who DOES wait for the 1v1 and salutes etc etc


But I saw the win and I wanted it :(

CandleInTheDark
04-16-2017, 12:31 AM
By the rules of the game you did nothing wrong, though I would say that I would have felt uncomfortable doing it and I am not one of the With Honour! crowd as you seem to be.

Karma_Ghost
04-16-2017, 12:35 AM
I don't see a problem with it. Unless they're willing to fight you 1v1 until the end, no one is being "honorable" anyway. Also, if there are 4 people chasing you and they couldn't trap you anywhere, that's a failure on their part.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 12:38 AM
I don't see a problem with it. Unless they're willing to fight you 1v1 until the end, no one is being "honorable" anyway. Also, if there are 4 people chasing you and they couldn't trap you anywhere, that's a failure on their part.

That......is actually a good point.


No point in honor if they aren't showing any either

Epoqx
04-16-2017, 01:03 AM
This shouldn't happen. That game lacks a lot of little fixes like that any competitive game has. Winning should ALWAYS be given to the team with more people/hp. Period. Already made a thread about that stuff tho.

On an Elimination match today, did a good round where i killed the 3 of them. The 4th player took all boosts, then 1v1'd me, i raped him, he ran back with 1 bar to take some health and boosts. He came back again, i rape him until 1 bar, he ran back, trying to avoid fighting me and focusing the timer. End of time. Draw.

These **** things happens to me everyday, and it should NOT happen this way.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:04 AM
Winning should ALWAYS be given to the team with more people/hp. Period.


No it shouldn't lol


Its an objective based game mode.


It should go to the team who plays the objective the most.

Epoqx
04-16-2017, 01:05 AM
No it shouldn't lol


Its an objective based game mode.


It should go to the team who plays the objective the most.

So who should win in my example ? What can i do if i cannot catch him back huh ?

Btw it's a Deathmatch mode, with boosts, not an objective based mode.

EDIT : Winning should ALWAYS be given to the team with more people/hp, when time run out. Forgot to right this.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:09 AM
So who should win in my example ? What can i do if i cannot catch him back huh ?

Btw it's a Deathmatch mode, with boosts, not an objective based mode.

Yeah and one of those boosts is a speed boost.


Use it.

Epoqx
04-16-2017, 01:12 AM
If i tell you there is a map where there is no speed boost ? And it was that map.

Same goes in 2v2, had some games where we where 1v1 left, the guy had one bar, and just ran around pylons. Not catchable. So what ?

Like in any competitive games, you do not reward the passive, with less hp, with less kills, with more deaths teams/players at the end of time. Basics.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:13 AM
If i tell you there is a map where there is no speed boost ? And it was that map.

Oh well. Tough I guess.


The game should always go to those who have the most points in an objective based game mode.

Epoqx
04-16-2017, 01:17 AM
Oh well. Tough I guess.


The game should always go to those who have the most points in an objective based game mode.

In an objective based mode yeah, aka Dominion and skirmish. The rest of modes are kill based mods, with boosts, that's why team A wins when team B is killed.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:20 AM
In an objective based mode yeah, aka Dominion and skirmish. The rest of modes are kill based mods, with boosts, that's why team A wins when team B is killed.

I know but this whole conversation started off with you ignorantly saying that obejectives shouldn't matter in objective based modes lol You have gotten WAY off topic

Remnancy1
04-16-2017, 01:21 AM
Frankly I view this as a no win sort of gray area impasse

.On one hand
1. "why should I fight honorably when they used a cheesy no skill feat to get my teammates"?
2. "Is it even realistic to think that provided they fought honorably that the clock wouldn't simply have runout anyway"?
3. "What were the odds that they would promise a fair fight but then gank during the 1v1"?
4. "Is it not extremely unfair to demand to defeat four opponents just to win"?

.On the other hand
1. You basically won by engaging in the same variety of mechanically yielded cheese tactics that they did.
2. You were running one of the most hated and overpowered characters which is the reason you won
3. you abandoned the tenets and precepts of honor and principal regardless simply to get an extremely cheap win

4. Finally by doing these things you robbed a great deal of enjoyment and satisfaction from the match by dishonoring your teammates with these tactics and willfully frustrating and arguably griefing the enemy solely for one mostly meaningless win

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:25 AM
4. Finally by doing these things you robbed a great deal of enjoyment and satisfaction from the match by dishonoring your teammates with these tactics and willfully frustrating and arguably griefing the enemy solely for one mostly meaningless win

My teammates were the ones that pointed out that I could just run for the win lol

Epoqx
04-16-2017, 01:25 AM
I know but this whole conversation started off with you ignorantly saying that obejectives shouldn't matter in objective based modes lol You have gotten WAY off topic

I really think you missread me, i never said that. You said that Elimination is an objective based mod, it is not. It's a primary kill based mode, with some secondary objectives, which are the boosts.

And nothing was really off topic, all about how the win should be given at the end of time. But nvm.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:28 AM
I really think you missread me, i never said that. You said that Elimination is an objective based mod, it is not. It's a primary kill based mode, with some secondary objectives.

And nothing was really off topic, all about how the win should be given at the end of time. But nvm.

No I didn't lol


I was getting the thread on track. YOU are the one that brought up elimination. Idc about elimination.


This thread is about Dominion.


You said that the win should "Always go to the team with more players / HP"

escacleo
04-16-2017, 01:30 AM
Why the game doesn't end when the team has 1000 points in Dominion/Skirmish is beyond me. Skirmish Kill all enemies to 1000 and then kill everyone? Dominion capture the points to 1000 and then kill everyone? This only makes sense in Elimination where there are no points, just round wins.

Epoqx
04-16-2017, 01:31 AM
No I didn't lol


I was getting the thread on track. YOU are the one that brought up elimination. Idc about elimination.


This thread is about Dominion.


You said that the win should "Always go to the team with more players / HP"

Yeah, i thaught you bounced back from my story. Misunderstanding there.

For dominion, yeah you did a good job to win by time. Tho they where really bad, 1400 to 1000, assuming your team had the 3 flags. With the 3 flags captured it would've been 1100 to 1300, with some minion killed, even more so they could fairly easily take back the lead.

Karma_Ghost
04-16-2017, 01:41 AM
1. You basically won by engaging in the same variety of mechanically yielded cheese tactics that they did.
- If everyone is playing by the same rules, it's a fair game.

2. You were running one of the most hated and overpowered characters which is the reason you won
- He won because his team had more points. Running out the timer won't win the match by itself.

3. you abandoned the tenets and precepts of honor and principal regardless simply to get an extremely cheap win
- Everyone does. Dominion isn't about individual skill, that's what duels are for.

4. Finally by doing these things you robbed a great deal of enjoyment and satisfaction from the match by dishonoring your teammates with these tactics and willfully frustrating and arguably griefing the enemy solely for one mostly meaningless win
- Perhaps. Personally, I think it's funny when someone does this. Games have no meaning beyond entertainment. Winning by a hair is always more exciting than winning by a mile.

TheLastPandaa
04-16-2017, 01:46 AM
I think you made a valid decision acording to the rules of the game, but I am in favor of fighting until the end.

Im not saying that you should had let your self killed, but you could have fight and give a good show to every one.

Here comes an anecdote of today (you can skip it if you like but im very proud if it so i want to share it:D )

I just ended a dominion match in Citadel Gate where i was the last man standing with all my team executed and with no hope of wining.

My first plan was very simple:
* Go to the small room where "Zone A" is and hit with my sword to everyone who try to cross the bottle neck in order to get inside the room (remember 300?)

That worked. For 15 seconds more or less, so i had to proceed with my back-up plan:
* Defensive mode>revange spam (i play on ps4 and the patch nerfing it isnt here yet)>ocasional hit combo to distract>Gb>pull them out the cliff.

It was not easy to deal with 4 high rep players spaming at you on a tiny room at the same time (surely if they had more space to move, they would have been more careful not to pop up my revange so easily, but that was part of my plan) but i was able to kill the entire team the first time they came and also managed to kill two more of them the second time they came.

At the end i was the one who got pulled out the cliff, but i want to believe that taking 6 players with me was a good way to die.

End of the anecdote.

In conlusion i just want to say that, like there is not any ranked modes yet where victories and looses really matters, the most important thing for me is to have a good time playing no matter the results. Now i ask you: Did you have fun runing across the entire map for around 3 minutes?

kweassa1917
04-16-2017, 01:56 AM
Maybe a little bit in "bad taste" since it leaves the rest of your team's players to wait a dull period of time, but it is by definition a totally legit way to win.

Doing whatever is necessary to win is completely normal, and if your decision in the matter was that the only way for you to survive and still win the game is to run and buy time, then by definition it counts as a result of initial class choices made in terms of strategy -- and you were simply using its unique advantages in your favor.

Your opponents were completely free to consider the possibility of such a situation happening (while admiitedly a rare occurence) and include a fast-moving assassin class during class selection phase. Your opponents were also free to use sprint-speed gear. If they couldn't hunt you down then it's their lack of foresight.

If they failed in catching you DESPITE having same PKs with speed gear then it's their lack of skill.


You've done nothing wrong. That's one way to win the game, nothing more, nothing less.


(ps) The only possible 'complaint' with this episode would be your 'double standard' in accordance to your promotion of "honor" in game. I've always pointed out "honor" is a self-serving pile of krapshi* people make up to excuse their lack of necessary "mental" skills in game, and you've basically proven my point. You would demand others follow the code of 'honor' in combat, and yet, when the situation arose and it was up to you to win the game, you simply dumped 'honor' and did what you had to do to win. Simply, when faced against a dire situation, your brains started working correctly again.

Think it through, and then re-assess how bullshi* 'honor' is, and you're fine. 'Honor' in PvP games is just another excuse for stupidity.


What people don't realize, is that hHonor' in games comes AFTER the match is over, recognizing the opponent's skill, congratulating the winners, accepting your losses and admitting defeat. That's what it means to act honorably and show class.

Instead, the honor-ranting folk have this completely backwards.They rant about 'honor' in the game and promote stupid and idiotic gameplay -- which they themselves don't hesitate to ignore should the need rise... and then, after the match is over, act completely dishonorably and swear, cuss, whine, complain, ridicule, their opponents.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 01:57 AM
1. You basically won by engaging in the same variety of mechanically yielded cheese tactics that they did.
- If everyone is playing by the same rules, it's a fair game.

2. You were running one of the most hated and overpowered characters which is the reason you won
- He won because his team had more points. Running out the timer won't win the match by itself.

3. you abandoned the tenets and precepts of honor and principal regardless simply to get an extremely cheap win
- Everyone does. Dominion isn't about individual skill, that's what duels are for.

4. Finally by doing these things you robbed a great deal of enjoyment and satisfaction from the match by dishonoring your teammates with these tactics and willfully frustrating and arguably griefing the enemy solely for one mostly meaningless win
- Perhaps. Personally, I think it's funny when someone does this. Games have no meaning beyond entertainment. Winning by a hair is always more exciting than winning by a mile.

I already responded to you on the previous page.....

pancakerz
04-16-2017, 02:32 AM
I know!

And whats worse is I am one of those guys who DOES wait for the 1v1 and salutes etc etc


But I saw the win and I wanted it :(

Based on the evidence provided, this is not true. But say whatever you have to tell yourself in order to protect your ego.

The only reason I think what you did is dumb is because it's incredibly boring for the 3 people who had to sit there and watch you run around for 2 minutes. In my opinion I would rather play than win. Sitting there doing nothing for the sake of a win is boring. Playing, and having fun is better, even if it results in a loss. Forcing 3 people to watch you run around for 2 minutes is just rude. Unless there was agreement between them that you should have done that. But often when I see things like that happen, even the guys' own teammates are berating him for being boring and just running out the timer.

That_guy44
04-16-2017, 02:37 AM
The only thing that matters is that you won. If I was a teammate id be glad you did want you did. Hell, I would have grabbed a beer and watched. The only stat that matters is W/L ratio.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-16-2017, 02:48 AM
Based on the evidence provided, this is not true. But say whatever you have to tell yourself in order to protect your ego.



Yes clearly this one instance tells you everything you need to know about how I play the game lol

TheNinefingers
04-16-2017, 03:27 AM
You did what you had to do, good on ya!

I'm pretty sure you and your team played hard for a win. Why would anybody disregard everybody's effort and disrespect your own teammates and throw it away. THAT would have been the true crime in all of this, THAT would have been what a traitor would do.

Helnekromancer
04-16-2017, 04:31 AM
From that 4 man only outcome if you stood your ground was the Lawbringer flip ride, followed by Conq bashes while a Warlord uses his super armored swings to chunk you. Either that or they constantly shove you off a cliff. Either way you die dishonorably as they dance and teabag over your corpse, I onl.y saw 2 people wait out the clock a Warlord who sat in a corner huddled behind his shield and a Orochi who popped Revenge like pimpils. Other than that people ran or got killed by projectiles trying to stand their ground.

Butonfly
04-16-2017, 11:22 AM
Just got out of a Dominion match with my PeaceKeeper where we had a massive point lead, but we couldn't close the deal and the other team made an epic come back.


We had 1400pts vs 1000 and their LawBringer landed a perfect catapult shot and killed all 3 of my teammates and I couldn't revive them due to their team leaving a Warlord their to guard their bodies.


So their team consisted of

- Warlord

- LawBringer

- Lawbringer

- Conqueror


(Which is why we had a hard time closing the deal. They just turtled up)


None of them could catch me because lol PeaceKeeper so I just ran around for the final 2:45 to deny them the win and we won by default due to the point lead.



Part of me feels bad because it WAS an excellent comeback.


The other part feels like I made a tactical decision and went for the win.


I am conflicted. Would you have run for the win or given them the comeback?

They had a catapult, you had speed.

They used their tools and lost, you used your tools and won.

Don't play to fight honorable, play to win.

They should have brought a speedy char to counter you. Their fault, not yours.

Supercool5150
04-17-2017, 05:55 PM
First off did you bow afterward. JK... just giving you crap Coyote. Secondly if I was your teammate I would have been cheering you on all the way. Despite the come back, your team earned the lead and you were the only one left that could secure the victory. So in my humble opinion....RUN FOREST RUN

Supercool5150
04-17-2017, 06:01 PM
Based on the evidence provided, this is not true. But say whatever you have to tell yourself in order to protect your ego.

The only reason I think what you did is dumb is because it's incredibly boring for the 3 people who had to sit there and watch you run around for 2 minutes. In my opinion I would rather play than win. Sitting there doing nothing for the sake of a win is boring. Playing, and having fun is better, even if it results in a loss. Forcing 3 people to watch you run around for 2 minutes is just rude. Unless there was agreement between them that you should have done that. But often when I see things like that happen, even the guys' own teammates are berating him for being boring and just running out the timer.

My problem here is you probably would not of even have gotten into a game in 2:45...Sit back , relax and enjoy the show!

Rikuto01.tv
04-17-2017, 08:30 PM
Should you feel bad?

I mean the fact you're playing like a little girl isn't really up for debate. You are.

But as for whether or not you feel like a little girl is entirely up to you. Nobody can tell you how to feel.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-17-2017, 08:50 PM
Should you feel bad?

I mean the fact you're playing like a little girl isn't really up for debate. You are.

But as for whether or not you feel like a little girl is entirely up to you. Nobody can tell you how to feel.

This genuinely made me chuckle lol

I get that it was in poor taste, but my teammates were yelling at me to run so I made like Forest and ran.

Knight_Gregor
04-18-2017, 02:46 PM
Should you feel bad?

I mean the fact you're playing like a little girl isn't really up for debate. You are.

But as for whether or not you feel like a little girl is entirely up to you. Nobody can tell you how to feel.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kmv3WlKa6U8

I'll let myself out...

In all seriousness, though... the other team pretty much gave you the win. They should have spent the last 2:45 boosting zones to try and beat you in points instead of a futile attempt to chase you down. I don't know exactly how quick the point gain is, but I'm guessing 165 seconds of holding all three zones equals around 800 points.

Ubisoft could easily circumvent this playstyle by adding an exponential point gain to holding and boosting multiple zones. Forcing the runners to actively engage a point or risk falling behind.

Then again - they still have the "Kill 300 Soldiers In Dominion," order circulating, encouraging players to be a detriment to their team.

Prophit618
04-18-2017, 03:28 PM
I kind of wish there was a milder option than the two you made for the post. As it stands, I went with the "You are literally the worst" option, but that doesn't really capture how I really feel.

My personal opinion is that: yes, you should feel bad for doing it. However, that doesn't mean it was the wrong move. It was the right move to secure the win, and you were only using the tools at your disposal to do it. Yeah, you were using a cheap and highly annoying tactic to do so, but that doesn't mean it's not viable, and in that situation it was probably your only chance to win.

So yeah, don't get hung up on it, but do feel a little bad :)

Dude_of_Valor
04-18-2017, 03:34 PM
You are not the worst. However it would have been more entertaining to have come up with a better plan than avoiding the fight. In For Honor, you play to fight otherwise why else are you here?

Still your opponents should have caught you, or at least make a video and play some funny music as they chase you around the map!

RatedChaotic
04-18-2017, 04:10 PM
Guess that team that lost shouldve communicated better and trapped you. They were not prepared for it. Their mistake. Marvel in your excellence. I would.

Plan for the worst, hope for the better...

Clearly that team didnt plan at all. They hoped twice without plans. Hoped you would fight them all (didnt plan on you running)and hoped they could catch you by chasing you like a pack of dogs(didnt plan on how to stop you). Their stupidity, their loss. IMO

SlashingElbow
04-18-2017, 06:05 PM
You are one of the least honorable dirtbags in this whole game. First u make a thread about how big of a soft cvnt you are ragequitting when you lose and then you are one of those annoying peacekeepers that just runs away like a ***** until someone catches them with a hit in the back after 4 minutes of ppissing your teammates off. What a guy you are! Everytime i see a viking character doing the same as you i die a little inside.. Stand and fight please dont run away like a *****. I understand grabbing a powerup or something but just running for running is lame.. good luck

xLeapingLizardx
04-18-2017, 06:30 PM
To me there is a difference of running to win then running just to run even though you are gonna lose...

I have a problem with the people who run in elimination when they are the last one vs. our 4... The runner is going to lose either way so why run just to run just to be an annoying runner, ya know?

You ran to win, in my opinion that's completely different. You actually had a solid reason/goal. (Even though I still wouldn't want to promote that playstyle, but if it's a one time off, not frequent thing, what the heck?)

Plus the enemy team had 2 Lawbringers! They are the catch masters! If I was there you definitely wouldn't have gotten away lol; I would have cut you off and endlessly impaled you.

I say GG to you for the win and better luck next time to the scrubs who couldn't catch you.

Operch
04-18-2017, 06:56 PM
I say it's fair play in that mode. Certain modes are best served with honorable tactics and others require whatever works to win.

Alustar.
04-18-2017, 08:43 PM
IMO that's tactical. Someone once said discretion is often the better part of valor.
That's on them for being unable to close you in and pin you down.

AkenoKobayashi
04-18-2017, 09:27 PM
But you still won, right?

That's what counts.

Vordred
04-18-2017, 09:53 PM
i have no problem with that. your running would result in a win for your team.

only time i get annoyed with runners, when there is no point to it, and they are just wasting everyone's times.

Jobsalot
04-18-2017, 09:59 PM
You could argue that it is tactical but I can't help but find myself frowning upon such a victory because it is neither testament to anyone's skill or tenacity because you let the clock decide and at the same time you also rob the other team of the chance to earn their victory that way because they have that choice taking out of their hand and have an abstract concept like time decide who deserves the win and who doesn't. It's not my style and I find it annoying if opponents just run from me and then feel like they "won" if they just hold out till the time passes. Sure, a victory is a victory, if you only see it as a number on the screen but imo the quality of how it is earned also matters.

AmericanNinja3
04-19-2017, 01:27 AM
Even though I hate when I have someone run away from me. If they couldn't catch you, then congratulations.