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View Full Version : Unblockables that take an hour and a half to swing should not be able to be parried..



CoyoteXStarrk
04-05-2017, 10:11 AM
Just saying.


I finally just got around to leveling the Kensei to prestige 1 and I gotta say his overhead unblockable should not able to be parried. Nor should any Unblockable that takes forever to swing and is telegraphed.



Any half dead drunk child with 3 fingers and one arm can parry them.


They are literally useless against anyone who has the slightest idea of how to play.


I mean why even bother? Am I missing something?

Herbstlicht
04-05-2017, 10:15 AM
Just saying.


I finally just got around to leveling the Kensei to prestige 1 and I gotta say his overhead unblockable should not able to be parried. Nor should any Unblockable that takes forever to swing and is telegraphed.



Any half dead drunk child with 3 fingers and one arm can parry them.


They are literally useless against anyone who has the slightest idea of how to play.


I mean why even bother? Am I missing something?

Yes, you miss something. Parry timing is a little harder on console. Kensei can feint his unblockable into: uninterruptable heavy left/right, canel, gb, light - ah well say he can feint it into pretty much everything would be best. You can even go into sidestep attack. So it is an incredibly versatile tool. Not that Kensei is fine - he is mediocre at best because everything he does can be reacted to. But the mechanic of parrying unblockables is good. Because .. you know what a forced parry means if some one does it ... but you simply did a feint?

Going to Shugoki for example: If this freakin trunk hits you after you got knocked down .. well, i loose like 75% of my life. But guess i deserved it. Therefore, if i am not knocked down, i can parry it. If i fail, i still loose 75% of my health. So these attacks all have their use and value, it just differs for classes and situations.

Eclipsedmoon86
04-05-2017, 10:17 AM
As a kensei main I can just go ahead and tell you that you aren't playing him correctly if you're relying on that overhead swing.. lol. kensei is a master of feinting so with that learn to cancel the top heavy into a side heavy and mix up attacks once you get your opponent confused in what your actually going to do then you can start using the top heavy because they won't know what the hell your gonna do

CoyoteXStarrk
04-05-2017, 10:20 AM
Yes, you miss something. Parry timing is a little harder on console. Kensei can feint his unblockable into: uninterruptable heavy left/right, canel, gb, light - ah well say he can feint it into pretty much everything would be best. You can even go into sidestep attack. So it is an incredibly versatile tool. Not that Kensei is fine - he is mediocre at best because everything he does can be reacted to. But the mechanic of parrying unblockables is good. Because .. you know what a forced parry means if some one does it ... but you simply did a feint?

Going to Shugoki for example: If this freakin trunk hits you after you got knocked down .. well, i loose like 75% of my life. But guess i deserved it. Therefore, if i am not knocked down, i can parry it. If i fail, i still loose 75% of my health. So these attacks all have their use and value, it just differs for classes and situations.


It must not be that hard.


Out of the last 7 duels I played just now it was parried regularly in 6 of them lol


Yeah no. It needs to be harder than that.

xmelesiox
04-05-2017, 10:31 AM
Feel the very same about the raiders because it always comes from the same direction. Even if I daze someone he YELLS what he's about to do and they can parry it if they've played enough to know the timing. It sucks.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-05-2017, 10:33 AM
Feel the very same about the raiders because it always comes from the same direction. Even if I daze someone he YELLS what he's about to do and they can parry it if they've played enough to know the timing. It sucks.

THIS




Make excuses for this people.



I'll wait :)

cragar212
04-05-2017, 10:35 AM
Yes they should!

Parry baiting with unblockables is a huge part of gameplay. I get a ton of kills on raider by letting a cancelled unblokable rip vs an exhausted opponent. They goto parry it but do a heavy attack instead which is then parried into raiders 90 damage combo.

Kenseis have a few nice options with a baited parry off their unblokable.

Yarzahn
04-05-2017, 10:46 AM
Just saying.


I finally just got around to leveling the Kensei to prestige 1 and I gotta say his overhead unblockable should not able to be parried. Nor should any Unblockable that takes forever to swing and is telegraphed.



Any half dead drunk child with 3 fingers and one arm can parry them.


They are literally useless against anyone who has the slightest idea of how to play.


I mean why even bother? Am I missing something?

Yes, you are missing a couple of things

1) It's safely used after a wall throw combo. As in guardbreak(1), wall throw (2), top heavy (3) for free nearly half the enemy hp. This is why Kensei's guardbreaks can initiate combos.
2) It can be feinted into whatever you feel like, mostly. Parry baiting is a thing. And Kensei's feints are extremely fast, compared to most of the roster.

chiller2k3
04-05-2017, 11:00 AM
Kensei is a mindgamer with feints, you have to do that or you will get wrecked. If you do right you will wreck them (and also will hit the unblockable because of reasons you already got told).


Cheers

CoyoteXStarrk
04-05-2017, 11:06 AM
Yes, you are missing a couple of things

1) It's safely used after a wall throw combo. As in guardbreak(1), wall throw (2), top heavy (3) for free nearly half the enemy hp. This is why Kensei's guardbreaks can initiate combos.
2) It can be feinted into whatever you feel like, mostly. Parry baiting is a thing. And Kensei's feints are extremely fast, compared to most of the roster.


Kensei is a mindgamer with feints, you have to do that or you will get wrecked. If you do right you will wreck them (and also will hit the unblockable because of reasons you already got told).


Cheers

So basically what I am getting here is that the Unblockable is entirely pointless unless I have them against a wall or unless I feint out of it?

chiller2k3
04-05-2017, 11:13 AM
When you have feinted (using the soft feint) them like twice/three times into a heavy side you can start let the unblockable through once in a time, because they want to react to the side heavy/doge GB instead and . It's mostly not happening in the first round.
Feinting the right way (and playing with the peoples mind, mindgames) is a piece of art by itself and is the most powerful tool in this game. If you are a step ahead of the enemy you will reck a lot of people with Kensei.

I can recommend the For Honor Hero School from Klyka (Kensei as EnderVex):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4qycZA9Uyo

Maybe you can then imagine what the unblockable from Kensei is all about.

Cheers

chiller2k3
04-05-2017, 11:14 AM
First it doesn't show the post, then it double posts and let me look like an idiot - thanks ubi (JK) :P

CoyoteXStarrk
04-05-2017, 11:24 AM
First it doesn't show the post, then it double posts and let me look like an idiot - thanks ubi (JK) :P

All disagreements aside this has happened to me SO many times these past few days lol

DrExtrem
04-05-2017, 12:07 PM
I actually have big problems parrying (or better counter striking) the kenseis upper heavy uninterruptible, because it is so f******g slow. Normal heavy attacks are not a problem. I conditioned myself accordingly but the upper heavies of the kensei ans zerker are tough.

Same with the shugoki ...


In addition, the upper unblockible of the kensei is hard to detects, because the glow from the indicator and the parry indicator melt.

x_Senduko_x
04-05-2017, 12:29 PM
Yes they should!

Parry baiting with unblockables is a huge part of gameplay. I get a ton of kills on raider by letting a cancelled unblokable rip vs an exhausted opponent. They goto parry it but do a heavy attack instead which is then parried into raiders 90 damage combo.

Kenseis have a few nice options with a baited parry off their unblokable.

Exactly that is the point. This tool is just usabable vs untrained players. Every good player will dodge ur UB (Raider/kensei) and not to try Parry it. Its a shame that the only way u can do ur most devastating attacks when the enemy hit on a wall or is exhausted what is a rly rare thing against skilled players...

DrExtrem
04-05-2017, 12:44 PM
What do trained wardens do?

I would go for a crushing counter (if it comes from above(, because a light attack is very difficult to parry.

Herbstlicht
04-05-2017, 01:00 PM
-.-
Kensei has such a nice toolset and he is described as easy because it in fact is easy to understand. I don't speak of class mastery, only of the general way of playing. Kensei's unblockable is maybe even the best designed one in the whole game. It opens up a ton of options. It is threatening on it's own. Yet, it is theoretically possible to counter everything the Kensei does - though that is not easily done. Besides, you know you can't punish Kensei if you only block or dodge this attack? You would need to deflect side attack or parry to do so. Doable, of course, but even harder then not getting hit at all.

Just wait for the upcoming Kensei buffs. I like him very much too (Prestige 6 or so ..) but you need to look at the whole potential to realize it's strength.

Frappenstain
04-05-2017, 01:18 PM
Would you like to get us naked and lie the ground? Did you know how much punishing well placed overhead with kensei?

CandleInTheDark
04-05-2017, 01:32 PM
I played a good kensei in brawl once, he 6-0'd us with those unblockable into feints. It was an achievement to get him into critical when he started one of the rounds with me.

chiller2k3
04-05-2017, 01:33 PM
Exactly that is the point. This tool is just usabable vs untrained players. Every good player will dodge ur UB (Raider/kensei) and not to try Parry it. Its a shame that the only way u can do ur most devastating attacks when the enemy hit on a wall or is exhausted what is a rly rare thing against skilled players...

But for the Kensei, against good players that doge the unblockable you will adapt and cancel into doge GB, and get a free GB. The next time this guy probably will not doge the unblockable (or he get's GBed again) and the mindgame begins ;)

Kensei has so many options, BECAUSE the unblockable is parrieable..

Prophit618
04-05-2017, 01:52 PM
All of Kensei's attacks are slow and seen from a mile away, which is why the best Kensei's (not to be confused with me) feint a ton and use that predictability to try and goad reactions out of you that they can then counter to their advantage. The overhead unblockable is no different from the rest of their kit this way.

AKDagriZ
04-05-2017, 02:34 PM
So basically what I am getting here is that the Unblockable is entirely pointless unless I have them against a wall or unless I feint out of it?

basically yes . or you do the entire unblocakable after you baited your opponent couple time.His assets are fine as he is.I don't main him good kensei beat me up to 8/10.He dodge left and strike other side . If you dodge the unblockable and he cancel it your are getting a heavy or a free GB.You have to understand while a wall throw guarantee a unblockable at least the regular unblocable is easy to parry it goes hand in hand with it

Phallicmenace
04-05-2017, 02:34 PM
Parry in general just needs nerfing. I am almost positive at some point parry with receive a huge hit, but it might take a long time.

AKDagriZ
04-05-2017, 02:43 PM
Parry in general just needs nerfing. I am almost positive at some point parry with receive a huge hit, but it might take a long time.

Parry is fine it's the reward out of it .Its too much i suggest a faster recovery time after being parryed

DrExtrem
04-05-2017, 03:06 PM
Parry is ok - on console, it is not totally easy to parry heavy strikes and damn hard to parry light ones.

Atm, the reward is a bit high - it would be totally ok, if we add easier, real fainting to the game. The kensei is actually the only swordfighter, who faints the way, fainting should be. He uses it to alter the attack window.
If actual fainting would be possible for the heroes, parry could stay the way it is.

Btw. The fainted opponent should always have the chance to adjust the guard in time and block the strike without chipping damage - but it has to be difficult.

atac56
04-05-2017, 04:59 PM
not only can they be parried, they can be interrupted. any kensei who even thinks about booting up the unblockable I hit him with 2 lights and hes knocked out of it. regardless if he's going for the feint. instead of dodging or parrying you can just attack them with lights. I dont believe they should be called unblockable attacks if they can be parried, a parry is a block

RatedChaotic
04-05-2017, 05:40 PM
So basically what I am getting here is that the Unblockable is entirely pointless unless I have them against a wall or unless I feint out of it?

Deception bro. It plays a significant role in this game. No dont feint it every time, geez. Sorry but you said you just got him to prestige 1. In my opinion thats not enough time to learn a class and make an accurate assessment of that class. In other words....."git gud".

Vingrask
04-05-2017, 06:54 PM
Dammit! You want an unblockable and unparriale move?! Want to add an undodgeble too? Or better, we could save devs work and not even need animation: you press the button and the enemy get the damage already! Fantastic! I loved the idea!

SAVAGE_CABBAGE1
04-05-2017, 07:09 PM
Here I am thinking that if you want to do that, the entire Lawbringer kit would be unparriable lol.

xmelesiox
04-05-2017, 07:14 PM
Dammit! You want an unblockable and unparriale move?! Want to add an undodgeble too? Or better, we could save devs work and not even need animation: you press the button and the enemy get the damage already! Fantastic! I loved the idea!

I have that button. It's called my Raider's fire bomb. Think I hit 4 but I'm a dumb barbarian and not sure... But I have that move and I throw fire after I hit with my Axe.