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View Full Version : Feathering the Prop in P38.......... ???



Locust_
04-17-2004, 10:10 AM
Ive tryed feathering in almost all of the ac seems like it does nothing imo.

But I herd someone in HL saying that the FTR works ver well in the p38Lightnin....

Can anyone explain in laymans terms what FTR does & How to utilize it in the p38

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Locust_
04-17-2004, 10:10 AM
Ive tryed feathering in almost all of the ac seems like it does nothing imo.

But I herd someone in HL saying that the FTR works ver well in the p38Lightnin....

Can anyone explain in laymans terms what FTR does & How to utilize it in the p38

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Fighter Sweeps is here come join the fun.....
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LA_Crop_Duster
04-17-2004, 10:15 AM
When you feather the prop, it will stop spinning because it is now streamlined. Kinda like a blade on a sword. it reduces the drag from the prop and helps you keep you speed up. You only want to do this if that engine is dead or bout to die. Hope this helps.

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S 8
04-17-2004, 11:00 AM
Would you conserve fuel if you feathered and run on one engine? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/35.gif

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mortoma
04-17-2004, 11:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Superluminal:
Would you conserve fuel if you feathered and run on one engine? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/35.gif

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/113_1080237361_supersig2.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>In a lot of real twin aircraft, not only will you save fuel, you'll save your life!! The drag is so great from an unfeathered prop you absolutely must feather the prop before the engine totally dies. Otherwise the plane will not be able to stay aloft. At least most twin engined planes anyway. Some modern turbo prop planes have enough power they conceivably could stay up and fly without feathering, but still you'd be crazy to not feather. Also a lot of newer planes have an auto-feather capability. Also in real life in most piston engine planes, you have to do it before the engine totally quits or you can't feather it at all. As you need pressurized oil to get the blade pitch to change. Of course in FB, this real life scenario stuff is not modelled. As far as saving virtual fuel in FB, I have no idea. But planes fly well on one engine in this game. They don't even model assymetrical thrust very strongly in FB, otherwise you'd have to have a lot of opposite rudder booted in or rudder trim if the plane has it.

Kasdeya
04-17-2004, 11:52 AM
Well in FB, I am rather sure that the fuel is burned off no matter if you have your engine runing or not. Now you might be able to slow it down by reducing mix and throttle but I am not completely sure about this either. I have burnt my engine(109's http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ), landed in a coops where I hadnt even seen the enemy, turned off my engine and then got the out of fuel message while watching everyone else get busy with fighting. You tell me. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/35.gif


Cheers,
Kas

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Locust_
04-17-2004, 07:46 PM
So then feathering the prop in the 38 in a dive would probly be unwise ?

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Black Sheep
04-17-2004, 08:31 PM
It would be if you wanted to pull up on completing the dive http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Feathering the prop is a one way street in FB; once it's done you can't unfeather.

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paradoxbox
04-17-2004, 10:31 PM
In real life feathering a prop while it's still power on and spinning (especially at 3000rpm) would be VERY dangerous and may destroy the reduction gears in the engine, or damage other critical parts of the proppeler assembly resulting in a prop you cannot un-feather if you have to later.

If you need to feather your engine in AEP, reduce the power, then reduce RPM to 0%. Once the RPMs have dropped down you can feather the engine, verify that the propeller is no longer spinning.

Do NOT attempt a single engine landing if an engine isn't feathered unless you absolutely have to. It's very dangerous, and if you go below the single engine safe speed you'll crash.

For single engine operations your fuel economy is reduced by about 20 percent and your maximum speed will be about 250 to 255mph up to 20,000 feet. It's not recommended to feather an engine in flight unless for training or safety purposes.

Cheers

paradoxbox
04-17-2004, 10:32 PM
And by the way you CAN unfeather in FB. Just press the feathering key again.

Black Sheep
04-18-2004, 04:30 AM
Fair enough, my mistake.

That's one of the things I like about these boards, you learn something new every day http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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WUAF_Co_Hero
04-18-2004, 06:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Locust_:
Ive tryed feathering in almost all of the ac seems like it does nothing imo.

But I herd someone in HL saying that the FTR works ver well in the p38Lightnin....

Can anyone explain in laymans terms what FTR does & How to utilize it in the p38

http://img20.photobucket.com/albums/v61/AFJ_Locust/161sig.jpg

Fighter Sweeps is here come join the fun.....
http://alloutwar.com/IL2FS/<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Unlike what some have posted here, the P-38's props can be feathered at any time... 110%, idle... whatever. However, from my experience, it isn't terribly easy to get the props spinning again once you've feathered them. I would not reccomend feathering unless the engine has taken on critical damage, or is on fire. If you're losing oil on one engine, try cutting pitch and power, to about 70 / 60 respectively, to elongate the life of it.

On the matter of dives: The 38 is one of the single fastest accelerating a/c in a dive.. shallow or steep. No help is neccesary. However, pulling back power to idle will noticibly help you pull out of the dive (particularly usefull in the 38J which has no dive brakes), since the blades will then cut pitch in an attempt to keep RPM's constant (ie: constant speed props).

Hope some of this helped.

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p1ngu666
04-18-2004, 07:50 AM
funny enuff the russian bear bomber (think cold war) ran nearly feathered all the time.
got a muntload of power hasnt it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

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paradoxbox
04-18-2004, 01:18 PM
I thought I would add to this post....

There was a test done on dive acceleration not too long ago on the SimHQ forums. It basically proved that dive acceleration is not a factor in IL2 AEP, so to be honest the P-38 has not a lot on other aircraft in a dive at the moment (and probably will not until the next 1C sim comes out with better physics)

On the topic of feathering, yes it's possible to feather at any setting in AEP, but for the sake of realism(!) it's better to reduce all the drag and actually caring about whether the engine can be unfeathered if you need to (not gonna happen if you feather the prop spinning at 3,000 rpm)

jcoulter
04-18-2004, 07:21 PM
I used to fly a lot in P-3 4 turboprop engine aircraft. It took 4 engines to takeoff, but once around 30,000+ ft., the #1 engine was turned off and feathered. It saved LOTS of fuel, and the engine could be restarted in the air for lower altitudes, where it mattered more.

One time we even landed it with the first engine off, since we could not restart it once.

worr
04-18-2004, 09:17 PM
Been working on my multi. Amazing what happens when you loose one engine on a light twin. Best wisdom I've heard is that the comfort of having two engines is that when the one goes the other one is guranteed to take you to the sceen of the accident. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Worr, out

Locust_
04-21-2004, 06:24 AM
Hey wor that p38 has got me home many times after a mud run & incountering bandits had them actualy shoot my right engine clean Off, I just trimed the right aleron heavy & made it home barely that was scary http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

also like someone else said if its on fire or smoking hard throttle that engine down to 60/70% power & lower the pp to 70 & it lasts a good long time.Not sure if any of that is historical but it gets ya home http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

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Locust_
04-21-2004, 06:29 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by paradoxbox:
I thought I would add to this post....

There was a test done on dive acceleration not too long ago on the SimHQ forums. It basically proved that dive acceleration is not a factor in IL2 AEP, so to be honest the P-38 has not a lot on other aircraft in a dive at the moment (and probably will not until the next 1C sim comes out with better physics)
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ya I just seen that test "It has not alot" Is an understatment realy no ac dives better than any other except for the critical speed part where u can lose a wing or elevator, that is sad because that realy detracts from this sim
ac like p47 & p38 need there dive speed

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NorrisMcWhirter
04-21-2004, 10:03 AM
Hi,

I've had no problems feathering/unfeathering the prop in the P38...irrespective of air speed or engine rpm.

Seems to work alright for me although I didn't notice a massive difference between having it feathered or otherwise.

Works for the Bf110, too, only more noticably, I think.

Cheers,
Norris

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Zeus-cat
04-21-2004, 10:09 AM
I was in a P-38 over the water and had all of my fuel tanks shot up by the submarine I was attacking. I kept up the attack unti I was out of rockets. On my way back to base BOTH my engines died for lack of fuel. I was still over the water and I ended up feathering both of my props. I think that action was the only thing that allowed me to glide back to base. If I hadn't feathered both props I would have crashed into the water instead of blowing up when I crash landed on the runway - LOL.

Zeus-cat

WUAF_Co_Hero
04-21-2004, 02:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by paradoxbox:
I thought I would add to this post....

There was a test done on dive acceleration not too long ago on the SimHQ forums. It basically proved that dive acceleration is not a factor in IL2 AEP, so to be honest the P-38 has not a lot on other aircraft in a dive at the moment (and probably will not until the next 1C sim comes out with better physics)

On the topic of feathering, yes it's possible to feather at any setting in AEP, but for the sake of realism(!) it's better to reduce all the drag and actually caring about whether the engine can be unfeathered if you need to (not gonna happen if you feather the prop spinning at 3,000 rpm)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's funny you mention that, because I've been doing testing myself, mostly online. I've noticed that the La-7 can catch the 38 at level topspeed at most alttitudes. However, I noticed that if you put the 38 into about a 10-20 deg. shallow dive, it will extend away from the La, 9 times out of 10. This would imply that there has to be SOME modeling of dive acceleration proportionate to mass.

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Locust_
04-21-2004, 04:03 PM
According to these tests there isint much Hero
http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=98;t=008691
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paradoxbox
04-21-2004, 04:54 PM
Hero, that is because you have the power on and the efficiency of two props is giving you slightly better acceleration in the shallow power dive. To get an accurate test result you must have the power off.

The sad truth is IL2 does not model dive acceleration based on aircraft weight, only pure acceleration based on the propellers, and in the P-38/P-51 they even got that wrong above 200mph. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif