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View Full Version : @Ubisoft: Please look into PK's revenge mode zone attack spam



WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 12:08 PM
PK's have seemed to be picking this up lately.

Once a PK is in revenge state (which is really not hard to do with heroic gear) he can spam zone->feint with no stammina costs. It is unblockable because of its speed. Basically PK gets invincible during revenge.

Is this something thats beeing looked at?

Cheers

Flippin_Finch
03-06-2017, 12:26 PM
Guard right.

guor6800
03-06-2017, 12:28 PM
PK's have seemed to be picking up this lately.

Once a PK is in revenge state (which is really not hard to do with heroic gear) he can spam zone->feint with no stammina costs. It is unblockable because of its speed. Basically PK gets invincible during revenge.

Is this something thats beeing looked at?

Cheers

Sssh man dont even mention this. Ubisoft probably will go and ninja-nerf Kensei again because thats whats invicible. Not stupid PK and Nobushi za in revenge!

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 12:48 PM
Guard right.

Doesn't work. Recovery of the first block is too slow for followup attack

Flippin_Finch
03-06-2017, 01:01 PM
Doesn't work. Recovery of the first block is too slow for followup attack

Keep distance or parry then.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 01:25 PM
Keep distance or parry then.

Cannot parry them as already stated: Recovery of the first block is too slow for followup attack....

Regarding your "keep distance". What you are basically saying is: PK becomes invincible because of the zone spam so just walk away once you see the revenge pop. Besides, the revenge knockdown also prevents you from "keeping distance" (Good PK's know how to bait for revenge knockdown).

What other hero becomes invincible when in revenge so I have to "keep distance"?

Exaclty....that's my point.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 02:55 PM
You could say this about many characters.
Raider will spam the unblockable zone attack in Revenge mode.
You're kinda describing what Revenge Mode is all about and nothing more.
Don't let the PK hate cloud your judgement.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 03:04 PM
so just walk away once you see the revenge pop



This is the correct thing to do with anyone in Revenge state, PK or otherwise. If you are still just trying to fight someone in Revenge Mode as if they are normal, you are doing it wrong. Especially if they have a 108 Revenge build and their attack / defence is now through the roof + unlimited Stamina. Not a fan of Git Gud type advice, but honestly ... you need to play smarter than this.

RLTygurr
03-06-2017, 03:07 PM
Doesn't work. Recovery of the first block is too slow for followup attack

Are you certain? I can block them all as Lawbringer. Besides, zone attack and light attacks are really the only tools that PK has against a good opponent. Everything else is predictable and easily parried for a huge punish.

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 03:17 PM
You could say this about many characters.
Raider will spam the unblockable zone attack in Revenge mode.
You're kinda describing what Revenge Mode is all about and nothing more.
Don't let the PK hate cloud your judgement.

But then you're not taking into account the fact the PK isn't parryable or blockable as the recovery is too slow.. Perhaps read the op post again for clarity.
The raiders unblockable is also one of the most parryable attacks in the game, and once parried said raiders generally stand there with an air of "Oh he parried my unblockable, wtf do i do now"?!?!?!?

Cyb3rR4ptor
03-06-2017, 03:26 PM
you mean this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUaoXj9aO4g

Hard to deal with. Let's not just look at the damage. let's look at it's uses. PK can spam an attack that you best only block. Attempting to parry which, you can can, lead in easily two hits. so your best bet is to parry. Also she's on revenge so even if you parry she retains her stamina. If opponent has revenge gear this is going to last for a while. Also can push you on a very long distance. So if you're pushed to a ledge and you fail to notice becasue "OMGPKREVENGEGEAR***DAMMITBLOCKBLOCKBLOCK!" well you can be easily be thrown off. It had only been used against me only once on Brawl and the dude killed me and my teammate with that thing only. Not sure of how deep this neat trick can be. I don't that it is OP as it is, it's more or revenge gear making it last longer, and deal significant more damage.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 03:32 PM
You could say this about many characters.
Raider will spam the unblockable zone attack in Revenge mode.
You're kinda describing what Revenge Mode is all about and nothing more.
Don't let the PK hate cloud your judgement.

Your are totally missing the point here....

How on earth can you compare Raiders zone and PK's zone....Its like saying beef and chicken taste the same because both are meat.....


This is the correct thing to do with anyone in Revenge state, PK or otherwise. If you are still just trying to fight someone in Revenge Mode as if they are normal, you are doing it wrong. Especially if they have a 108 Revenge build and their attack / defence is now through the roof + unlimited Stamina. Not a fan of Git Gud type advice, but honestly ... you need to play smarter than this.

If you think you cannot beat an opponnent (except for zone spamming PK) while in revenge mode you are wrong. It appears to me that you have never actually encountered a PK spamming zone so I'de suggest you head back into the game and check it out first before commenting.

I also hate to be the guy but I think this may rather suit you


Not a fan of Git Gud type advice, but honestly ... you need to play smarter than this.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 03:33 PM
But then you're not taking into account the fact the PK isn't parryable or blockable as the recovery is too slow.. Perhaps read the op post again for clarity.
The raiders unblockable is also one of the most parryable attacks in the game, and once parried said raiders generally stand there with an air of "Oh he parried my unblockable, wtf do i do now"?!?!?!?

I don't need to re-read anything for clarity thanks, you patronising git. The point is, every class can spam every zone attack / any other move in Revenge mode with potentially far greater damage / better defence and if you are still trying to fight them like normal then you shouldn't be. You know the one guaranteed solution to anyone spamming anything in Revenge mode? Not standing in front of them. A Raider will not stand there with an air of 'wtf do I do now" when in Revenge mode (unless dumb), he will spam it and spam it, and anything else he wants to spam. Everyone can spam everything they want, every class, in Revenge Mode, because no Stamina limit. Kinda think you and the OP are missing the whole point of Revenge Mode. Revenge gear people love opponents like this that are dumb enough to stand there and attempt to counter the limitless spam. People need to play a lot smarter before calling for nerfs.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 03:36 PM
I also hate to be the guy but I think this may rather suit you

This is your whine thread, not mine, you have the issue. Try to flip it back onto me to disguise your own incompetence all you like, you have the problem.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 03:36 PM
you mean this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUaoXj9aO4g

Hard to deal with. Let's not just look at the damage. let's look at it's uses. PK can spam an attack that you best only block. Attempting to parry which, you can can, lead in easily two hits. so your best bet is to parry. Also she's on revenge so even if you parry she retains her stamina. If opponent has revenge gear this is going to last for a while. Also can push you on a very long distance. So if you're pushed to a ledge and you fail to notice becasue "OMGPKREVENGEGEAR***DAMMITBLOCKBLOCKBLOCK!" well you can be easily be thrown off. It had only been used against me only once on Brawl and the dude killed me and my teammate with that thing only. Not sure of how deep this neat trick can be. I don't that it is OP as it is, it's more or revenge gear making it last longer, and deal significant more damage.

Yes i mean that one, except that it's executed poorly in the video. If you time the feint correctly it becomes unblockable.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 03:47 PM
This is your whine thread, not mine, you have the issue. Try to flip it back onto me to disguise your own incompetence all you like, you have the problem.

?

I never whined, I was trying to make a point and simply wanted to ask whether Ubisoft is looking into this. Why are you beeing so offensive?

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 03:48 PM
I don't need to re-read anything for clarity thanks, you patronising git. The point is, every class can spam every zone attack / any other move in Revenge mode with potentially far greater damage / better defence and if you are still trying to fight them like normal then you shouldn't be. You know the one guaranteed solution to anyone spamming anything in Revenge mode? Not standing in front of them. A Raider will not stand there with an air of 'wtf do I do now" when in Revenge mode (unless dumb), he will spam it and spam it, and anything else he wants to spam. Everyone can spam everything they want, every class, in Revenge Mode, because no Stamina limit. Kinda think you and the OP are missing the whole point of Revenge Mode. Revenge gear people love opponents like this that are dumb enough to stand there and attempt to counter the limitless spam. People need to play a lot smarter before calling for nerfs.

lol caught some feelings there did you? How sweet.

Revenge mode was put in place to level the playing field when facing multiple opponents btw, not for your spammy fingers.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 03:58 PM
Revenge mode was put in place to level the playing field when facing multiple opponents btw, not for your spammy fingers.


See this sentence, together with the fact that Revenge Mode intentionally gives you unlimited Stamina, actually explains why there is nothing wrong with any class spamming anything at you when in Revenge Mode. You just can't quite see past the desire to 3 vs 1 gank that guy you almost killed who now maybe stands a chance of killing / fighting off 2 or 3 or 4 opponents who are trying to mercilessly batter the crap out of them. And all you have to do to counter it is step away instead of playing like a pack of bloodhounds that have just cornered a fox.

Like I sad, Revenge mode is designed for use against dumb opponents.

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 04:05 PM
The dumb opponents part was pretty much aimed at you in case you didn't get that first time, shouldn't need repeating. Now rather than try to explain the dumb to you, I'll show the wisdom of someone who steps away from a Revenge Mode opponent, and step away from your limitless verbal spam. Best you figure out why you're dying to Revenge Mode spam for yourself. Or you can just keep dying if that's too hard for you.

Verbal spam? This is place of conversation and differed opinions yet you go uber offensive at the first sign of a disagreement. You initially took my comments as patronising due to your own issues and then proceeded to insult the two people trying to have a conversation with you.

I can parry very well thank you, i have no issues with fighting people in revenge but you keep assuming the world is against you and continue with your insulting ways. What i do have issues with is the spammy tactics of the majority of hack and slash PK users and the fact the system allows them to win with little skill.

P.S Nice edit, makes you a little less of an asshat.

Simi_Xiamara_
03-06-2017, 04:15 PM
Doesn't work. Recovery of the first block is too slow for followup attack

Huh? Unless your a assassin this should not be a problem

Simi_Xiamara_
03-06-2017, 04:16 PM
Have you seen a nobushi revenge spam?

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 04:17 PM
See this sentence, together with the fact that Revenge Mode intentionally gives you unlimited Stamina, actually explains why there is nothing wrong with any class spamming anything at you when in Revenge Mode. You just can't quite see past the desire to 3 vs 1 gank that guy you almost killed who now maybe stands a chance of killing / fighting off 2 or 3 or 4 opponents who are trying to mercilessly batter the crap out of them. And all you have to do to counter it is step away instead of playing like a pack of bloodhounds that have just cornered a fox.

Like I sad, Revenge mode is designed for use against dumb opponents.

You are still comparing apples with pairs....

I'll try to put it as simple as possible for you:
A Raiders zone attack is not the same as a PK's zone attack because the Raiders zone attack is alot slower than the PK's.

No other hero can spam cancle zone as fast as PK. The thread is not about beeing able to spam zone but having one certain hero beeing able to chain spam it at a speed which becomes unblockable.

God, please let this guy understand now....

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 04:21 PM
Have you seen a nobushi revenge spam?

Yes, I main Nobushi and PK and it's no where near as fast as PK's.


Huh? Unless your a assassin this should not be a problem

I cant block it with PK neither have I encountered an opponnent that can. Same issue when I'm on my Nobushi.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 04:21 PM
You are still comparing apples with pairs....

I'll try to put it as simple as possible for you:
A Raiders zone attack is not the same as a PK's zone attack because the Raiders zone attack is alot slower than the PK's.

No other hero can spam cancle zone as fast as PK. The thread is not about beeing able to spam zone but having one certain hero beeing able to chain spam it at a speed which becomes unblockable.

God, please let this guy understand now....

You're stuck on Raider for some reason and that was just an example.
My entire point is about the nature of Revenge Mode, the situation it is designed to counter and the very easy way to avoid your problem, regardless of the class you face.
You are either deliberately feigning ignorance or actually unable to comprehend what I am saying.
Either way, I know when I am on to a loser.
I will leave you to stand in the Revenge Mode spam with your 2 friends and wonder why you're dying, I am not a tutorial mode.

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 04:21 PM
Have you seen a nobushi revenge spam?

Again the nobushi zone is very slow and comes from the same direction each time.

Simi_Xiamara_
03-06-2017, 04:22 PM
You are still comparing apples with pairs....

I'll try to put it as simple as possible for you:
A Raiders zone attack is not the same as a PK's zone attack because the Raiders zone attack is alot slower than the PK's.

No other hero can spam cancle zone as fast as PK. The thread is not about beeing able to spam zone but having one certain hero beeing able to chain spam it at a speed which becomes unblockable.

God, please let this guy understand now....

It's not unblockable tho >.<!? I block it all time and I see ppl blocking it when I do it.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 04:30 PM
You're stuck on Raider for some reason and that was just an example.
My entire point is about the nature of Revenge Mode, the situation it is designed to counter and the very easy way to avoid your problem, regardless of the class you face.
You are either deliberately feigning ignorance or actually unable to comprehend what I am saying.
Either way, I know when I am on to a loser.
I will leave you to stand in the Revenge Mode spam with your 2 friends and wonder why you're dying, I am not a tutorial mode.

Don't worry, I understand your point, however you are still missing mine.

There is NO OTHER CLASS in the game which needs to be disengaged while they are in revenge mode other than PK.

Your are justifying your comments on the obvious. Of course i can back off, and yes, that is what I am doing. But why do I only have to back off from PKs revenge and no other class? It is so easy to beat people in revenge mode because they become predictable. You cannot beat PK because of unblockable game mechanics.

But I can see that you are unable to understand the point of this thread so I'll just let you to it.

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 04:31 PM
It's not unblockable tho >.<!? I block it all time and I see ppl blocking it when I do it.

Vids or it didnt happen :-p

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 04:34 PM
It's not unblockable tho >.<!? I block it all time and I see ppl blocking it when I do it.

What class do you play? If this really is the case then it may actually be due to recovery times of certain classes or related to latency.

Gray360UK
03-06-2017, 04:36 PM
Don't worry, I understand your point, however you are still missing mine.

There is NO OTHER CLASS in the game which needs to be disengaged while they are in revenge mode other than PK.

Your are justifying your comments on the obviouse. Of course i can back off, and yes, that is what I am doing. But why do I only have to back off from PKs revenge and no other class? It is so easy to beat people in revenge mode because they become predictable. You cannot beat PK because of unblockable game mechanics.

But I can see that you are unable to understand the point of this thread so I'll just let you to it.

Then in my opinion, and forget anything else said, I'm happy if we don't agree, we don't have to .... all classes should be able to do what the PK can do.
They shouldn't nerf PK, they should boost the rest.
It should not be 'so easy' to beat people in Revenge Mode.
All classes should make you think twice about engaging them when they are in Revenge Mode.
You make Revenge sound like a joke and from experience, it mostly is (although I have no pure Revenge Mode build characters).
If your opponent is in Revenge Mode because 3 of you are mercilessly trying to batter the crap out of one guy, then give all characters a fighting chance I say.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 04:39 PM
Then in my opinion, and forget anything else said, I'm happy if we don't agree, we don't have to .... all classes should be able to do what the PK can do.
They shouldn't nerf PK, they should boost the rest.
It should not be 'so easy' to beat people in Revenge Mode.
All classes should make you think twice about engaging them when they are in Revenge Mode.
You make Revenge sound like a joke and from experience, it mostly is (although I have no pure Revenge Mode build characters).
If your opponent is in Revenge Mode because 3 of you are mercilessly trying to batter the crap out of one guy, then give all characters a fighting chance I say.

Thank you, I agree.

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 04:44 PM
Thank you, I agree.

See kinda funny how after all that we all agree on the actual issue. For me revenge builds are ruining the dominion and deathmatch modes but then its needed because of the Gank nature of humans.

Revenge in 1v1 is aids

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 04:52 PM
See kinda funny how after all that we all agree on the actual issue. For me revenge builds are ruining the dominion and deathmatch modes but then its needed because of the Gank nature of humans.

Revenge in 1v1 is aids

True, thank god they already said they were looking into revenge gear on their livestream last week.

Revenge mode is generally a very good idea It's damage output is just way to high and you get it way to soon with the appropriate gear. Sometimes i catch myself hoping for a 1v2 or 1v3. It makes killing so much easier...

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 05:03 PM
True, thank god they already said they were looking into revenge gear on their livestream last week.

Revenge mode is generally a very good idea It's damage output is just way to high and you get it way to soon with the appropriate gear. Sometimes i catch myself hoping for a 1v2 or 1v3. It makes killing so much easier...

Exactly that, i now spend most of my time in the enemy's home capture point (a or c) as i know revenge will proc and I'll 8/10 survive once multiple enemies come. Again for this purpose i agree its great, but the attack values, and shield regen are broken. I think it should proc only when mulitple people are attacking you and once you are out of that situation the meter should reduce to 0 and you start again.

I can't help thinking if they'd dedicated some time in the betas for heroic only gear some of these issues would've been ironed out... Wishful thinking i guess.

WheepingSong
03-06-2017, 05:26 PM
Exactly that, i now spend most of my time in the enemy's home capture point (a or c) as i know revenge will proc and I'll 8/10 survive once multiple enemies come. Again for this purpose i agree its great, but the attack values, and shield regen are broken. I think it should proc only when mulitple people are attacking you and once you are out of that situation the meter should reduce to 0 and you start again.

I can't help thinking if they'd dedicated some time in the betas for heroic only gear some of these issues would've been ironed out... Wishful thinking i guess.

That is exactly what i tried with my PK just before I made this thread. Camping enemy's spawn point to get revenge proccs and just zone spam them until they leave.

A **** move on my end which I wanted to try out after having seen someone else do it.

Kaijudub
03-06-2017, 05:33 PM
That is exactly what i tried with my PK just before I made this thread. Camping enemy's spawn point to get revenge proccs and just zone spam them until they leave.

A **** move on my end which I wanted to try out after having seen someone else do it.

It's a tactic thats for sure :-p

I wonder if the matchmaking was character rank based rather than profile rank based would people be that bothered by it? I mean if everyone in the lobby was getting revenge in 2 hits then its the norm. Where as a prestige 1 character is going to feel pretty hard done by when they come up against a 78+gs character, especially when they should never even be in the same match!!