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View Full Version : The reason you are about to whine...



The_Mensan
03-04-2017, 11:32 PM
Before you whine about anything... Think about WHY you are whining first. Are you whining because you have some corrupt sense of entitlement or have misjudged your own abilities?

So imagine you are getting owned with your favorite hero and he's clearly underpowered cause you are getting manhandled... Now in that moment, back up and think about it this way. This is a COMPETITIVE game. It's not a hand-holding game of everybody wins. 50% of the population will lose more often than win, THIS IS EXPECTED AND MATHEMATICALLY NECESSARY.

If you are losing, chances are VERY GOOD that you simply deserved to lose. This is like real life. Not everyone is good looking, smart, wealthy, successful... Are you going to whine about not having the best things in life? You could, but ain't nothing going to change for you, silly.

Just accept your inferiority. Not everyone is designed to win. 50% of any competitive game will have losers. Just cause you lost it doesn't mean something isn't working. IN FACT, it means something IS WORKING because we need 50% losers.

ThePollie
03-04-2017, 11:39 PM
Think about this - Maybe their concerns are legitimate and your refusal to accept this game isn't 100% perfect is preventing necessary balance changes.

This post sounds like it came from a guy who got pitted against someone just starting the game, 3-0'd his way with Ubisoft matchmaking, and is furiously trying to defend his token victory.

The_Mensan
03-04-2017, 11:51 PM
Think about this - Maybe their concerns are legitimate and your refusal to accept this game isn't 100% perfect is preventing necessary balance changes.

This post sounds like it came from a guy who got pitted against someone just starting the game, 3-0'd his way with Ubisoft matchmaking, and is furiously trying to defend his token victory.

The point is 50% of the player are supposed to lose. Without introducing new evidence or new variables, Occam's Razor tells us that the current winner is probably the intended winner. Yes, you might be right. There is a possibility that the whiner is correct that some element of this game is currently imbalanced... But why can't you simply analyze and play the game as it is designed to win within the system? If I like dogs but owning cats makes me successful in life then I will simply... switch to owning cats. How hard is it to figure a closed system where most variables are KNOWN to you? Anyone with a 3 digit IQ should be able to figure out how to win in a simple video game.

Again the idea isn't that whiners are ALWAYS wrong, it's that they are LIKELY wrong due to the fact that, with zero evidence one way or another, reality favors the status quo. What I mean is that. You can argue that "I am actually a better player despite having bad stats.", but that's LESS LIKELY than someone with good stats (a winning player) to claim that he's a better player because evidence points to such. So the act of WINNING itself in a vacuum is the tie-breaker in a he said she said situation. He who won deserves to win unless proven otherwise. The onus of proof lies with the whiner not the winner.

Anubis9
03-04-2017, 11:59 PM
Before you whine about anything... Think about WHY you are whining first. Are you whining because you have some corrupt sense of entitlement or have misjudged your own abilities?

So imagine you are getting owned with your favorite hero and he's clearly underpowered cause you are getting manhandled... Now in that moment, back up and think about it this way. This is a COMPETITIVE game. It's not a hand-holding game of everybody wins. 50% of the population will lose more often than win, THIS IS EXPECTED AND MATHEMATICALLY NECESSARY.

If you are losing, chances are VERY GOOD that you simply deserved to lose. This is like real life. Not everyone is good looking, smart, wealthy, successful... Are you going to whine about not having the best things in life? You could, but ain't nothing going to change for you, silly.

Just accept your inferiority. Not everyone is designed to win. 50% of any competitive game will have losers. Just cause you lost it doesn't mean something isn't working. IN FACT, it means something IS WORKING because we need 50% losers.

What a load of BS, mate maybe next time before you post... back up and think about it this way, The game is broken #FACT.

(more than enough videos proving this)

ThePollie
03-05-2017, 12:02 AM
Fun fact - Just because 50% of the game is losing, doesn't mean they lost fairly.

Anubis9
03-05-2017, 12:03 AM
Fun fact - Just because 50% of the game is losing, doesn't mean they lost fairly.

His maths is off.

AkenoKobayashi
03-05-2017, 12:07 AM
Skill means nothing when you are a fresh player with no gear score going up against a full team of 108s, two of which are Peacekeepers or Berserkers who double up on you most of the game.

Skill is a minor factor in most of the gameplay. I can and have beaten people with higher gear score IF they don't have anyone helping them. I fought a Warden who was in the gold gear area, and I beat him 1v1. Granted I pushed him into spike walls, but he pushed me off of a bridge first so it's even.

The_Mensan
03-05-2017, 12:33 AM
Fun fact - Just because 50% of the game is losing, doesn't mean they lost fairly.

lol... Do you have reading comprehension issues?

I didn't say they all lost fairly. I said it's MORE LIKELY than not.

Go google what Occam's Razor is.

If you say the you are supposed to win but you lost because your hero is gimped and I say no, I am supposed to win, and I won because the heroes are not gimped (or if they are, maybe mine is gimped but I won regardless). Without any God-like entity judging the validity of the statements. The simplest fact remains. Who actually won? The winner probably is the objective winner without any opposing evidence.

It's similar to the common law idea of "innocent until proven guilty". Your hero is not magically gimped because you lost with it. Your lost is expected (50%). You need a greater volume of supporting evidence to prove otherwise.

The_Mensan
03-05-2017, 12:35 AM
His maths is off.

I would be very surprised to find any zero sum competitive game that can achieve a different overall win/loss ratio than 1:1 (50%) for all players. Where did the magical win/loss go? It's a zero sum game, every win come from a loser. In order for one player to win another must lose. Thus there's ALWAYS a 50% loser in the game (overall). Chances are if you are losing, you probably deserve to be there. It's ok to lose. 50% of the population do.

Anubis9
03-05-2017, 12:40 AM
Chances are if you are losing, you probably deserve to be there. It's ok to lose. 50% of the population do.

Keep talking trash my friend, this game alllows cheap *** move , I know as I use them to win.

Valtaya
03-05-2017, 01:01 AM
Before you whine about anything... Think about WHY you are whining first. Are you whining because you have some corrupt sense of entitlement or have misjudged your own abilities?

So imagine you are getting owned with your favorite hero and he's clearly underpowered cause you are getting manhandled... Now in that moment, back up and think about it this way. This is a COMPETITIVE game. It's not a hand-holding game of everybody wins. 50% of the population will lose more often than win, THIS IS EXPECTED AND MATHEMATICALLY NECESSARY.

If you are losing, chances are VERY GOOD that you simply deserved to lose. This is like real life. Not everyone is good looking, smart, wealthy, successful... Are you going to whine about not having the best things in life? You could, but ain't nothing going to change for you, silly.

Just accept your inferiority. Not everyone is designed to win. 50% of any competitive game will have losers. Just cause you lost it doesn't mean something isn't working. IN FACT, it means something IS WORKING because we need 50% losers.

maybe you should have taken your own advice first before posting that
a) complaining is not whining
b) speaking something out, which quite often becomes obvious when one experiences it, is not whining

if both is whining to you, so are you whining yourself, since you are complaining about whiners or speaking something out that bothers you after you experienced it (the whiners), well, looks like you defeated yourself or in other words, you shot yourself in your own knee, well done

untchable704
03-05-2017, 01:19 AM
I played a game once where 2 people have n the losing side lost so only 33% lost and 66% won.
Even if you count the guys who left as losing there was a time 2 people quit off the losing team and were replaced later by 2 other people. So in that game 60% of people lost and 40% won. Does this prove the whole system is rigged? I will leave that for you to decide.

Valtaya
03-05-2017, 01:22 AM
The point is 50% of the player are supposed to lose. Without introducing new evidence or new variables, Occam's Razor tells us that the current winner is probably the intended winner. Yes, you might be right. There is a possibility that the whiner is correct that some element of this game is currently imbalanced... But why can't you simply analyze and play the game as it is designed to win within the system? If I like dogs but owning cats makes me successful in life then I will simply... switch to owning cats. How hard is it to figure a closed system where most variables are KNOWN to you? Anyone with a 3 digit IQ should be able to figure out how to win in a simple video game.

Again the idea isn't that whiners are ALWAYS wrong, it's that they are LIKELY wrong due to the fact that, with zero evidence one way or another, reality favors the status quo. What I mean is that. You can argue that "I am actually a better player despite having bad stats.", but that's LESS LIKELY than someone with good stats (a winning player) to claim that he's a better player because evidence points to such. So the act of WINNING itself in a vacuum is the tie-breaker in a he said she said situation. He who won deserves to win unless proven otherwise. The onus of proof lies with the whiner not the winner.

Many years ago I were playing League of Legends, after some time I droped to 400 elo, way below bronze, the lowest, league. I claimed all the time the LoL ELO system is broken and not working, the matchmaker is not working, nothing is working, everything is a feast of RNGesus and all depends on your luck with your teammates. Well, I gues you know the result, the reputation as a sore looser and whiner was inevitable. That is... until a friend I was just chatting with, who also thought I am a very lousy and bad player, invited me to a fun match of his platinum friends, they were one person too short so... well, since I was on his team, he thought they will lose it... They thought as jungler I could do nothing wrong, and well, I did quite well and we won. In rematch, I got the upper lane. Long story short, after both games his buddies were complaining, that he invited an unknown diamond player and thus the games were unfair. Short after my friend gave me the control over his secondary platinum account and did raise it close to diamond. Short after I stopped playing LoL because the ELO and MM systems are so utterly broken and noone wanted to listen.

Here is the same. Am I a great For Honor player? Definitely not. But I am not that bad either.

Btw Occams Razor does not account for lag and cheats (using macros is cheating).
So, just because someone wins, it does not mean he is supposed to win. Of course you can come and say "well hell, use macros yourself", you are right, I could, but should I? Using macros is like not playing at all, I rather play vs ai lvl 3 bots then using macros. And btw, I do not think this game was designed to be won the way it is won recently, by exploiting mechanics and design oversights. You speak about 3 digit IQ, I wonder if yours is above body temperature.

I would love to see a real whiner.

The_Mensan
03-05-2017, 02:27 AM
Many years ago I were playing League of Legends, after some time I droped to 400 elo, way below bronze, the lowest, league. I claimed all the time the LoL ELO system is broken and not working, the matchmaker is not working, nothing is working, everything is a feast of RNGesus and all depends on your luck with your teammates. Well, I gues you know the result, the reputation as a sore looser and whiner was inevitable. That is... until a friend I was just chatting with, who also thought I am a very lousy and bad player, invited me to a fun match of his platinum friends, they were one person too short so... well, since I was on his team, he thought they will lose it... They thought as jungler I could do nothing wrong, and well, I did quite well and we won. In rematch, I got the upper lane. Long story short, after both games his buddies were complaining, that he invited an unknown diamond player and thus the games were unfair. Short after my friend gave me the control over his secondary platinum account and did raise it close to diamond. Short after I stopped playing LoL because the ELO and MM systems are so utterly broken and noone wanted to listen.

Here is the same. Am I a great For Honor player? Definitely not. But I am not that bad either.

Btw Occams Razor does not account for lag and cheats (using macros is cheating).
So, just because someone wins, it does not mean he is supposed to win. Of course you can come and say "well hell, use macros yourself", you are right, I could, but should I? Using macros is like not playing at all, I rather play vs ai lvl 3 bots then using macros. And btw, I do not think this game was designed to be won the way it is won recently, by exploiting mechanics and design oversights. You speak about 3 digit IQ, I wonder if yours is above body temperature.

I would love to see a real whiner.

I am a Mensan, sweetheart ;)

I don't think anyone actually understood the post, which is disheartening...

Do you understand the entire concept behind objectivity / subjectivity? Just because you CLAIM some is using marco's to win or is using an OP class or whatever, it doesn't make it true. Similarly, JUST because the other guy claimed that he DIDN'T use marco or an OP class it doesn't make it TRUE neither. But fact remains, instead of looking for some random excuses (which COULD be correct, I can't stress this enough since none of you read...), it doesn't mean you are correct. IN FACT, without any evidence one way or another, you are LESS likely to be correct due to Occam's Razor. The simplest answer for why a losing player is losing... is that he suck at the game.

Why is that concept hard to grasp? Are you not aware that the simplest explanation that someone sucks at something is because... well he sucks at it? Sure, there's a chance there's a legit reason overriding it, it's possible. But the SIMPLEST explanation is still that maybe HE JUST SUCKED.

If you still don't get it, re-read the last sentence a few times.

Also whining is not the same as providing information. Whining is an emotional appeal about something over and over. If I said, "Bring an umbrella if it's raining." that's not whining. If I said, "OMG, the rains are so annoying, I have to like bring an umbrella everywhere, umbrellas are heavy, make it not rain, rain is so OP..." That's whining. Please learn to appreciate the difference.

If you win, you win. If you lose, learn your place and know that it's ok to be a loser. Not everyone wins, period. You are not a special snowflake, lol...

This mentality doesn't just reflect in gaming. People often complain about not having a well paying job and went to a nice school and have nice things... Fact is. Some people do have them. Do you whine about why doctors are doctors and wish they nerf their pay and maybe give the street sweepers more pay instead? lol... Life is unfair. Some win, some lose. Accept it.

Hogmin
03-05-2017, 03:18 AM
Inclined to agree with OP.

A lot of people crying about stuff on the Forums seem to be delusional and terribly unaware of the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Valtaya
03-05-2017, 10:08 AM
I would be very surprised to find any zero sum competitive game that can achieve a different overall win/loss ratio than 1:1 (50%) for all players. Where did the magical win/loss go? It's a zero sum game, every win come from a loser. In order for one player to win another must lose. Thus there's ALWAYS a 50% loser in the game (overall). Chances are if you are losing, you probably deserve to be there. It's ok to lose. 50% of the population do.

That is only true for an even and fair, perfect, environment. This game suffers from lag, cheating/macroing, cheap moves, gear discrepancies and well... mm and teams, and yours 1:1 is also only true for 1vs1.

SiewcaRaka
03-05-2017, 01:22 PM
That is only true for an even and fair, perfect, environment. This game suffers from lag, cheating/macroing, cheap moves, gear discrepancies and well... mm and teams, and yours 1:1 is also only true for 1vs1.

From things that you mentioned only lag and cheating is wrong. There is no such thing as cheap move as it helps you win. It is your responsibility to learn how to deal with those. Gear discrepancies? Just do your best to get same gear. To get prestige 3 and best gear you don't have to pay:) Teams? It is team game, but unless you play with your mates, you need to remember that they may suck so you have to carry them. There are no excuses in battle, you win or you die trying.