PDA

View Full Version : Peacekeeper and Zone attack with Feinting issue.



YappysDaBeast
02-18-2017, 03:53 PM
This really needs a fix asap. Spam zone attack whilst spamming feint does insane fast swing and damage.

So for those who don't know, the zone attack for peacekeeper is two swings. First one is lightning fast when used with feinting you cancel the second hit and do the first hit over and over.
When used with revenge you can kill 4 people within 3 seconds if they're around you.

Anyone else seen peacekeepers spamming this? And then backing off to regen stamina to do it again over and over.

The issue is how fast the first attack goes off when spammed with feinting.

EDIT: Zone attacks are meant to clear the area and make people back off. Many classes have insane fast zone attack's. Others have slower zone attacks.
They are not meant to be high damaging spam skills. Only meant for making space so you can adjust your footwork.
The current way zone attacks are being spammed for a high damage source needs readjusting.

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 04:19 PM
PK's zone attack uses half your stamina bar (same as all of them) and the first hit does about a light's worth of damage. Under normal circumstances they can do it twice and they're out of stamina, doing comparable damage to their 2x light attack combo (which incidentally is also quite fast and uses much less stamina).

You're basically complaining about Revenge Mode, not PK's zone attack.

YappysDaBeast
02-18-2017, 04:23 PM
PK's zone attack uses half your stamina bar (same as all of them) and the first hit does about a light's worth of damage. Under normal circumstances they can do it twice and they're out of stamina, doing comparable damage to their 2x light attack combo (which incidentally is also quite fast and uses much less stamina).

You're basically complaining about Revenge Mode, not PK's zone attack.

Nope, complaining about zone attack spam with feinting.

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 04:27 PM
Then I don't know what to say. If this One Weird Trick(tm) is single-handedly letting PKs execute you, there's likely a bit more going on that might not be the PK's fault.

EDIT: just tested it to confirm I'm not an idiot. Yeah, the first hit of PK's zone does a bit more damage than a light, and since she's nearly guaranteed to get a second light in after a first, her zone does less damage than one of her light combos for many times the stamina cost.

So "high-damage spam skill" is quite misleading, to say the least.

YappysDaBeast
02-18-2017, 04:31 PM
Then I don't know what to say. If this One Weird Trick(tm) is single-handedly letting PKs execute you, there's likely a bit more going on that might not be the PK's fault.

It doesn't kill me, I'm saying what an issue it is. Zone attack spam with feinting is pretty broken, guess you've never seen a PK do it.
Especially with high damaging items on.

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 04:37 PM
With the stamina cost there is no "spam" going on outside of Revenge mode, and the damage as I've shown (if you don't believe me go test it in-game with a level 0 bot) is a lot less than her (also notoriously fast) light attack combo, which she actually CAN spam over and over from all directions.

If all a PK is doing is 2x zone feints and backing off to regen stamina, that is a slow way to kill anyone (not to mention very predictable) assuming you let it happen. Since you're talking about damage gear you're thinking about 4v4s, where taking your time to kill someone means time for others to interfere: that's very much a downside.

Hogmin
02-18-2017, 04:37 PM
Then I don't know what to say. If this One Weird Trick(tm) is single-handedly letting PKs execute you, there's likely a bit more going on that might not be the PK's fault.

EDIT: just tested it to confirm I'm not an idiot. Yeah, the first hit of PK's zone does a bit more damage than a light, and since she's nearly guaranteed to get a second light in after a first, her zone does less damage than one of her light combos for many times the stamina cost.

So "high-damage spam skill" is quite misleading, to say the least.

The issue is not how low damage it is, it's how fast that it comes out it can't really be stopped unless you know exactly what they're going to be doing, and since they're feinting, it's not likely and this isn't even just me complaining, it's ungodly fast, even faster than wardens. It's a free hit, essentially, that does the same damage as PK's Dash Forward heavy

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 04:46 PM
The issue is not how low damage it is, it's how fast that it comes out it can't really be stopped unless you know exactly what they're going to be doing, and since they're feinting, it's not likely and this isn't even just me complaining, it's ungodly fast, even faster than wardens. It's a free hit, essentially, that does the same damage as PK's Dash Forward heavy

It does less than a bar's worth of damage, slightly more than one of her lights. Her forward dash does about 1.5 bars with the bleed combo, roughly 2x the damage, again for a lot less stamina.

I don't dispute it's fast, because it really is; but anyone who claims this is a "high damage spam move" like the OP did is seriously misinformed, as it is neither high damage nor spammable under normal circumstances.

Also I feel PK's light attacks are a lot more concerning than her zone if "fast, high damage, spammable" is the issue. Her light spam can be difficult to block and if she gets one hit in the second is almost guaranteed, doing a lot more damage for a lot less stamina; and she can do it again right after. Even blocking her light spam doesn't necessarily interrupt it.

So I find complaining about her high cost, uni-directional and relatively low damage zone compared to her actually high damage, spammable and multi-directional light spam strange.

YappysDaBeast
02-18-2017, 04:49 PM
It does less than a bar's worth of damage, slightly more than one of her lights. Her forward dash does about 1.5 bars with the bleed combo, roughly 2x the damage, again for a lot less stamina.

I don't dispute it's fast, because it really is; but anyone who claims this is a "high damage spam move" like the OP did is seriously misinformed, as it is neither high damage nor spammable under normal circumstances.

Also I feel PK's light attacks are a lot more concerning than her zone if "fast, high damage, spammable" is the issue. Her light spam can be difficult to block and if she gets one hit in the second is almost guaranteed, doing a lot more damage for a lot less stamina; and she can do it again right after. Even blocking her light spam doesn't necessarily interrupt it.

So I find complaining about her high cost, uni-directional and relatively low damage zone compared to her actually high damage, spammable and multi-directional light spam strange.

You've clearly not played much if you don't think it does much damage.

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 04:52 PM
You've clearly not played much if you don't think it does much damage.

Just go test it in-game. You are talking about a feinted zone right? Just the first hit? Test it.

YappysDaBeast
02-18-2017, 04:53 PM
I don't have peacekeeper unlocked nor do I have high attack gear for her.

Hogmin
02-18-2017, 04:56 PM
It does less than a bar's worth of damage, slightly more than one of her lights. Her forward dash does about 1.5 bars with the bleed combo, roughly 2x the damage, again for a lot less stamina.

I don't dispute it's fast, because it really is; but anyone who claims this is a "high damage spam move" like the OP did is seriously misinformed, as it is neither high damage nor spammable under normal circumstances.

Also I feel PK's light attacks are a lot more concerning than her zone if "fast, high damage, spammable" is the issue. Her light spam can be difficult to block and if she gets one hit in the second is almost guaranteed, doing a lot more damage for a lot less stamina; and she can do it again right after. Even blocking her light spam doesn't necessarily interrupt it.

So I find complaining about her high cost, uni-directional and relatively low damage zone compared to her actually high damage, spammable and multi-directional light spam strange.

I agree with most of your points, but I still think the Zone needs adjusting. Either slowing, or less recovery on the cancel, I'm unsure. Perhaps PK just needs adjusting in all areas.

On that note, I find most of the Knight Heroes to be a pain in the *** to fight too, so maybe I'm just bad.

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 05:00 PM
Okay fine, I'll upload the evidence then. This is PK's zone attack, first hit:

http://i66.tinypic.com/mhtzxz.png

And this is one of her light attacks:

http://i64.tinypic.com/1118mm8.png

Notice that her zone attack's damage is only slightly higher than her light attack, for a humongous stamina cost. Also PK's almost guaranteed a second light attack hit if her first one lands, so the actual damage (and stamina cost: still minuscule compared to her zone) for her light attacks is doubled.

Did I mention that her lights are also really fast to begin with?

Knight_Raime
02-18-2017, 05:04 PM
PK isn't the only person who has a multi hit zone attack that can be feinted. The previous issue with her being able to do this was the lunge distance on it. they've since the beta nerfed it's lunge range. so imo as someone who complained about it a lot in the open beta it's fine now. it always comes from the same side. learn to read your opponent better.

That_Happy_Cat
02-18-2017, 05:04 PM
I agree with most of your points, but I still think the Zone needs adjusting. Either slowing, or less recovery on the cancel, I'm unsure. Perhaps PK just needs adjusting in all areas.

On that note, I find most of the Knight Heroes to be a pain in the *** to fight too, so maybe I'm just bad.

IMO the fact that PK's grab-triple shank bug didn't really dampen her effectiveness (well it did but she's still really good despite it) is a sign she was overtuned to begin with. I would be surprised if they fix the bug without making other changes, which may mean slowing down her zone and lights; I dunno.