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XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:45 AM
...or at least it used to be!! In the UK this day used to be remembered with enormous pride.However over the past few years its got gradually forgotten,they're not even showing the film on TV.
For me The Battle Of Britain is the proudest moment in my countries history and should be remembered in the most respectful way.However under the Blair junta its no longer condsidered Politically Correct to remember these things.Say what you like about the Americans they still honour their veterans and remember their sacrifice.I wonder how much longer November 11th will be kept as Rememberance Day.
So if you pass a Cenataph in the UK today and see an elderly Gentleman laying a wreath go over and say thanks to him,because if this country had gone under in 1940 Europe would not have been liberated.


Sorry if this sounds like a rant but I'm rather ashamed of what my country has become.

Bo_Nidle

Get my skins at: www.mudmovers.com (http://www.mudmovers.com) and www.il2skins.com (http://www.il2skins.com)

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"You've got to treat your kite like you treat your woman! Get inside her 10 times a day and take her to heaven and back!"Lord Flashheart RFC 1917.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:45 AM
...or at least it used to be!! In the UK this day used to be remembered with enormous pride.However over the past few years its got gradually forgotten,they're not even showing the film on TV.
For me The Battle Of Britain is the proudest moment in my countries history and should be remembered in the most respectful way.However under the Blair junta its no longer condsidered Politically Correct to remember these things.Say what you like about the Americans they still honour their veterans and remember their sacrifice.I wonder how much longer November 11th will be kept as Rememberance Day.
So if you pass a Cenataph in the UK today and see an elderly Gentleman laying a wreath go over and say thanks to him,because if this country had gone under in 1940 Europe would not have been liberated.


Sorry if this sounds like a rant but I'm rather ashamed of what my country has become.

Bo_Nidle

Get my skins at: www.mudmovers.com (http://www.mudmovers.com) and www.il2skins.com (http://www.il2skins.com)

http://www.orangeneko.com/rik/thumbs/flashbn.jpg

"You've got to treat your kite like you treat your woman! Get inside her 10 times a day and take her to heaven and back!"Lord Flashheart RFC 1917.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:51 AM
bo dont be ashamed of your country i for one am proud to call yall a friend .........rule britania!

U.S. infantry 84-91

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:09 AM
It was such a different generation. May those who valiantly fought in the Battle of Britain be remembered forever. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

---------------------------------------
http://www.swafineart.com/images/30.4.02/spitfire.jpg


I'm still a 109 fan but you've gotta love the Spitfire!

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:28 AM
BoB was some tough time for you guys. Having read countless accounts of what the Eagle Squadrons did over there, I guess I could say that it took a lot of weight off you guys?

Boosher-PBNA
----------------
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XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:48 AM
Boosher-PBNA.............the eagle squadren was a VERY small part of the RAF......... sure every thing helps but dont make it out like our guys did sustantial work there( relatively) at that time...


U.S. infantry 84-91

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:58 AM
Why has this battle been ignored in my country??

It was fought with 'honour' on both sides...

It took place in 1940.The battle included pilots from many nations.

(American pilots were members of the Eagle Squadron in the R.A.F. and joined before the US entered the war in 1941).

Should it not be remembered?

I think so. There were no clear winners on either side but it should be remembered as the first major air battle of the 20th century.


MB_Avro

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 02:32 AM
MB_Avro wrote:
-
There were no clear winners on either
- side...

I agree with your sentiments generally, but I don't think I'd go so far as your statement above. Perhaps in terms of statistical results (planes lost, etc) it may not have been a lopsided affair (I'm not sure - haven't checked the stats lately), but winning or losing battles rarely hinges on just the stats anyway - the Allies were clear winners and the Germans clear losers in the Battle of Britain, and its outcome changed the course of the war (and therefore the nature of our world today) radically.

I too am disappointed to hear the Brits have begun to forget/neglect to celebrate it - I believe it was, indeed, as Churchill predicted, "their finest hour". Besides, it spawned one of the most memorable quotations of all time: "Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." (Churchill again, of course).





Wir sind die schwarzen Husaren der Luft,
Die Stukas, die Stukas, die Stukas.

... "Stuka-Lied"

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 04:49 AM
~S~ A turning point in world history....

<CENTER>http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg <marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"Straighten up.......Fly right..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee> http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat

<CENTER><FONT COLOR="ORANGE">vflyer@comcast.net<FONT COLOR>
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XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 05:10 AM
Though i am an American Will still remember What the British Commonwealth did in 1940!!...as Winston said IF THE BRITISH EMPIRE LAST A THOUSAND YEARS THIS WILL STILL BE THEIR FINEST MOMENT.

Its up to you and your countrymen to see thats never forgotten!!!

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 05:44 AM
I'll be traveling to England today from the U.S. , my first time over the pond . I plan on going to Duxford as well as some other points of interest . I'm a huge aviation fan (aren't we all ?). Coincidently it's Battle of Britain day . I'm really looking forward to this trip . The only drawback is I have to wait two weeks to get back home and fly Forgotten Battles !! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<center>http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/images/mash_trapper.jpg (http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/)</center>

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 09:27 AM
Sturmtrooper, if you get time in the U.K, head for Birmingham and to an area called Castle Vale. This was the area where the bulk of all Spitfires (including the last) were built. They have a fantastic memorial to it with an 80ft tool sculpture showing three spitfires flying.

The best pic of it is here, but it is so much better in the morning sun.

http://www.cvhat.org.uk/art4-2.jpg


There is a venue called Millennium Point in the city centre which also has full size versions to view plus a huge history of the plane in the area.

I'll just add that I too think it's a travesty that the Battle of Britain is forgotten by our Government and broadcasters.

S! them all.

fluke39
09-15-2003, 09:53 AM
i for one remember and honour the memory of those who fought in our "finest hour"

"The battle for France is over, I expect the battle of Britain is about to begin.. Upon this battle depends the very survival of Christian civilization. ."

" Hitler knows that he must break us in this island or lose the war. If we can stand up to him, all may be free and the life of the world may move forward into broad sunlit uplands. But if we fail, then the whole world, including the United States, including all that we have known and cared for, will sink into the abyss of a new dark age...."

"Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves that, if the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour'."

still almost brings tears to my eyes /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

i am not patriotic by nature - but there is something about churchills speechs and the "heroic" nature of those dark few months - that make me proud to be british

a hefty S! to all those british AND other nationalities who fought in BoB and especially to those who exchanged their lives for a small step towards freedom......

<center><img src=http://mysite.freeserve.com/Angel_one_five/flukelogo.jpg>

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 09:58 AM
There will be street collections for the RAF Association wings appeal on saturday in every major uk town. Please donate, as the work they do for all ex RAF servicemen is very important. If everyone gives a little then we will riase lots of money for a good cause.

fluke39
09-15-2003, 10:02 AM
Boosher-PBNA wrote:
- BoB was some tough time for you guys. Having read
- countless accounts of what the Eagle Squadrons did
- over there, I guess I could say that it took a lot
- of weight off you guys?

not to belittle the achievements of the eagle squadrons but
am i to take it that that was an see-through attempt at trolling?

as was said above the eagle squadrons formed a tiny percentage of units in BoB.

i have always heard that of the non-british squadrons or pilots (to which we are all indebted) those which fought with particular noteworthiness were the Canadians and Poles.


(edit - please note " non british squadrons - to which we are all indebted" means every nationality which fought.. americans included) upon second reading of my post i felt this may have not been clear /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
<center><img src=http://mysite.freeserve.com/Angel_one_five/flukelogo.jpg>


Message Edited on 09/15/0310:19AM by fluke39

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 11:03 AM
For anyone visiting the London area, make sure you get a chance to visit the RAF Museum at Hendon, its free and well worth a day of your time.

On the subject of remembering the Battle of Britain, it may interest you to know that RAF Officers and Sergeants Messes all over the world will be holding dinners to remember the battle. Most stations also have a Battle of Britain cocktail party where local dignitaries are invited to sample the hospitality of the RAF and remember the victory that was the BoB.

S!

WB.

http://mysite.freeserve.com/whiskeysftp/IL2Pics/Mysig.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 11:14 AM
Every single pilot was vital to the Battle of Britain regardless of nationality.So here's to the British, Australian, New Zealanders, Canadians, South Africans, Rhodesians, Jamaicans, Irish, Americans, Polish, Czechs, Belgians, Free French and Palestinians who fought and defended freedom in that summer of 1940.
S!

This is the Roll of Honour.
http://www.raf.mod.uk/bob1940/roll.html

-----
In memory of 'The Few'
<img src=http://www.lima1.co.uk/Sharkey/spitfire.jpg>
The Tangmere Pilots - http://www.tangmerepilots-raf.co.uk/
Know your enemy and know yourself; in a hundred battles, you will never be defeated.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:14 PM
I have to agree one-hundred percent with this.

The Battle of Britain was a major turning point for this country - if England had failed to gain air supremacy over the Luftwaffe, then Hitler's planned invasion of Britain - Operation Sealion, would no doubt have gone ahead. Then where would we be now?

I for one am ashamed of how this country has developed since those times. We never look back with pride at our achievements. I'm sure you have all heard the stories from parents and grandparents about how proud they were to be a part of England and what it stood for - King and Country.

Not any more, as you say they can't even show a single programme on the television about such a historical and defining moment in history.

Patriotism is practically dead in this country. I've travelled to the USA, and parts of Europe and everywhere you go you see the national flag - how many Union Jacks, or English crosses do you see in London? - not many I can assure you.

I live in London itself, and our local newspaper had a recent story about a guy in a quiet street who flew a Union Jack flag in his back garden - he was subsequently asked by the local council to take it down as it was upsetting nearby residents as they did not recognise the flag as theirs. And as the Union Jack is also the symbol for the Nationalist Party here they felt it was a racist symbol - hence the removal order. How pathetic can you get!

England has a proud history if you look into it - I for one am fascinated with the Second World War in particular. Yes we owe a lot to the Americans for their support - but as Churchill himself once said we stood alone for a year facing the might of Germany.

We should be rightly proud of what this country has achieved, and we should celebrate it. The Battle of Britain day is one part that should be recognised, alas it isn't.

I remember a history tutor of mine at school (years ago now) saying "Never forget the past. There you will find many mistakes, but you will also find many victories of this fine country." At the time an odd thing to say to a bunch of kids, but now I'm in the thirties I still remember that.

Anyway, that's my view on this. I don't intend upsetting anyone with this view - it's just a shame our government fails to understand that England should remember such events as the Battle of Britain, and preserve this history for future generations to come.

Phoenix

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:16 PM
Mysticpuma2003 wrote:
- I'll just add that I too think it's a travesty that
- the Battle of Britain is forgotten by our Government
- and broadcasters.

Either that or they just choose to ignore it. It is they who should be ashamed. Rest assured the people involved in that battle are not forgotten, and I salute them.

DeerHunterUK wrote:
- Every single pilot was vital to the Battle of
- Britain regardless of nationality.So here's to the
- British, Australian, New Zealanders, Canadians,
- South Africans, Rhodesians, Jamaicans, Irish,
- Americans, Polish, Czechs, Belgians, Free French and
- Palestinians who fought and defended freedom in that
- summer of 1940.
- S!

Well said DeerHunterUK! Had it not been for the pilots of the other nations you mentioned, then the outcome of the battle may have been very different.

Rivet

<center>http://www.poprivet.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Forums/Sig/ALTERNATE2.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:24 PM
I too am disappointed to hear the Brits have begun
- to forget/neglect to celebrate it

Believe me.....no one has forgotten or neglected anything. We just don't shout so load. There are always comemerations every year.


<center><img src= "http://homepage.ntlworld.com/n.bulger/Emil_Bug.jpg">

AKA JG5_Emil

"I wish we all had the courage to confine our defence to three simple words....LICK MY A*S!" Herman Goering

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:27 PM
Boosher-PBNA wrote:
- BoB was some tough time for you guys. Having read
- countless accounts of what the Eagle Squadrons did
- over there, I guess I could say that it took a lot
- of weight off you guys?
-

You will be glad to see that the only american to die in the BoB will be imortalised by Tom Cruise in a new movie.

http://breaking.tcm.ie/2003/09/10/story112892.html

Interestingly enough the Palistinians also lost one person in the BoB....extrodinary.


<center><img src= "http://homepage.ntlworld.com/n.bulger/Emil_Bug.jpg">

AKA JG5_Emil

"I wish we all had the courage to confine our defence to three simple words....LICK MY A*S!" Herman Goering

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:50 PM
HAPPY BATTLE OF BRITAIN DAY MY BRITISH NATION!!!!

May we remember the dead, and lest we forget the living

S!

BoB is one of the most corragous and determing events of the war imo, as people have rightly mentioned, we stood alone for a year or two against the whole entire German army. That is why the Spitfire is considered the best fighter of the war because although its numbers were small, it helped fend off an entire airforce.

To britian the spitfire represents courrage, detirmination, pride, and above all valour. She is the the thing that any Brit with any amount of historic knowledge would be proud to see. She is a true reflection of the british people. At Duxford legends i have never experienced a crowd that has hushed to a plane before, when you have a whole fleet of spitfirescream by, the is near silence, mostly out of respect and the reasons i have mentioned. For me the spit is unbeatable in this respect, i know this as it is the only plane that makes me go cold, and realise how lucky the british nation is.

If therre has to be a best plane, it will be the spit for me, not only because of elogance, speed and all of what people look at, but also the massive odds stacked against it

Let us not forget the hurricane either. We owe the UK to these aircraft. May we never forget them as part of our history, for they are some of the finest examples of history we have

I salute them and the pilots, and i salute the UK


S!

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 12:55 PM
Victory remembered!

As a Canadian loyal to Her Majesty, I for one will celebrate and remember today.

And tonight, I'll watch Battle of Britain, drink a ******ss or two and do some reading afterwards. And thank those who fought for the lazy comfort I enjoy today.



"Official Lancaster Whiner"

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:02 PM
I did not see Boosher's 'word' as a troll but meant that the defeat of the LW in BoB took a heavy weight of GB.

-------

BoB Day does not seem to have the same reverance to-day as it did a few years ago./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

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"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:02 PM
Phoenix2020 wrote:
- I have to agree one-hundred percent with this.
-
- The Battle of Britain was a major turning point for
- this country - if England had failed to gain air
- supremacy over the Luftwaffe, then Hitler's planned
- invasion of Britain - Operation Sealion, would no
- doubt have gone ahead. Then where would we be now?
-


I'd maybe substitute 'England' for 'Britain' there mate...it's rather insulting for those members of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to be referred to as 'English'.

I live in Brussels and there was a service attended by the British Ambassador and representatives of the RAF and the BAF, so it's not entirely forgotten.


"We want the finest wines available to humanity, we want them here, and we want them now!"

Withnail

-"Sir! The Natives are revolting!!"

-"Oh I don't know, some of them are nice chaps!"

'The Red Fort'

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:07 PM
May they wear there Medals in pride and may all us in the U.K remember them..........

Hot Space

An Antelope is not just for Christmas - It's for putting in Sandwich's as well!!!

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:09 PM
There was no Eagle Squadron during BoB.

Three RAF units, Nos.71, 121 and 133 Squadrons, flew Hawker "Hurricanes" and Supermarine "Spitfires" in combat over Europe from February 5, 1941 to September 29, 1942.


http://a1276.g.akamai.net/7/1276/734/625ed428e022ef/www.harley-davidson.com/PR/MOT/2004/Softail/images/DOM/img_Softail_FXST.jpg

http://www.redneckengineering.com/photogallery/photo23581/curves-done-03.jpg


"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 01:36 PM
WE WILL NEVER FORGET!

"Tis better to work towards an Impossible Good, rather than a Possible Evil."

SeaFireLIV.
(Spitfire & Escape Whiner Member).

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 02:03 PM
Falcons_jooster feel free to substitute with whatever word suits, but as an Englishman that's the first word I use.

However, they may be commemorating this event in Brussels, but here in London there isn't anything going on! - that was my point. The government here just seems happy to brush all this under the carpet so as not to upset Europe.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 02:07 PM
Battle of Britain day is actually on Sunday. It is always commemorated on the Sunday on the week of the 15th. The Battle of Britain should never be forgotten. Unfortunately, as with the rest of WWII (and history in general,) the generation that lived through WWII is fading away. As a result, VE day is no longer celebrated in Britain (and has not been since 1995 I believe.) This is a tragedy, and if history is not remembered then what will stop us from repeating it. Countless brave souls gave their lives for us, and this should never, EVER, be forgotten.
I live near to Biggin Hill, and it has a lovely chapel which commemorates the people who died during the war. Although it is small, it is well worth a visit.


To be able to fare well,
To avoid the frustration of misfortune,
That, in this world, is happiness.
-Euripides' Electra

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 02:10 PM
S~ all.

I almost forgot as well that it was today. Glad that someone posted about it. It's been too long since I watched the World at War episode on BoB.

Indeed a very dark time for Britain with the blackouts, and bombings, and rationing.

Goering was a fool to ignore the airports, and go for London.

A big SALUTE to all of those pilots who kept the 111's at bay, and to their families who have great reason to be proud! Today is your day!

lil'

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 02:51 PM
DKP wrote:
-
- Boosher-PBNA wrote:
-- BoB was some tough time for you guys. Having read
-- countless accounts of what the Eagle Squadrons did
-- over there, I guess I could say that it took a lot
-- of weight off you guys?
--
-
- You will be glad to see that the only american to
- die in the BoB will be imortalised by Tom Cruise in
- a new movie.
- Interestingly enough the Palistinians also lost one
- person in the BoB....extrodinary.
- AKA JG5_Emil

Maybe it's because he was the first American pilot to killed in the war........ and his is an interesting story.

<CENTER>http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg <marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"Straighten up.......Fly right..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee> http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat

<CENTER><FONT COLOR="ORANGE">vflyer@comcast.net<FONT COLOR>
<Center><div style="width:200;color:red;font-size:18pt;filter:shadow Blur[color=red,strength=8)">99th Pursuit Squadron

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 02:56 PM
Oh man.

Tom Cruise as a fighter pilot? Could he even reach the rudder pedals?

lil'

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 03:04 PM
lilseed wrote:
- Oh man.
-
- Tom Cruise as a fighter pilot? Could he even reach
- the rudder pedals?
-
- lil'
-

They gonna give him a small aircraft to make up for his stature...probably an I-16. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


-----
In memory of 'The Few'
<img src=http://www.lima1.co.uk/Sharkey/spitfire.jpg>
The Tangmere Pilots - http://www.tangmerepilots-raf.co.uk/
Know your enemy and know yourself; in a hundred battles, you will never be defeated.

fluke39
09-15-2003, 03:05 PM
lilseed wrote:
- Oh man.
-
- Tom Cruise as a fighter pilot? Could he even reach
- the rudder pedals?
-
- lil'


he flew very well in "top gun" if i remember rightly /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

perhaps he had wooden blocks on his shoes like that kid in "temple of doom"

<center><img src=http://mysite.freeserve.com/Angel_one_five/flukelogo.jpg>

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 03:22 PM
For those who have access to cable... There is a Battle of Britain week this week on Discovery channel.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 04:03 PM
fluke39 wrote:

-
- he flew very well in "top gun" if i remember rightly
- /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


Oh damn fluke, you're right. I can see him fine as the fighter jock new guy, but as a wwii pilot, I don't know?

My problem though.

lil'

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 04:07 PM
Never forget !!!!

Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few....

I will rember altho I am only 35 my family has had its Vetrans in differant Wars and I will rember.

Respect !!! To all who fought in the BoB and Thankyou.

<center> http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_109_1063229517.jpg </center>



Message Edited on 09/15/0310:16AM by cozmo_d

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 04:16 PM
The RAF's official Battle of Britain site is:

http://www.raf.mod.uk/bob1940/bobhome.html

It has a chronology giving the actions of each day, squadron diaries and much more.

There is a complete roll of honour listing all those who flew in the battle, and those who lost their lives in it. I am always surprised and moved by how many different nationalities helped defend Britain in 1940.

-------------------------------------

In January 1945 German officials from the Ministry of Armaments assessed what might have been produced in 1944 without the bombing. They estimated that German industry turned out 35% fewer tanks, 31% fewer aircraft and 42% fewer lorries than would have been possible otherwise.All the officials interviewed (after the war) stated that bombing was the factor responsible for the declining gains from rationalisation and for the eventual collapse of the economic structure after January 1945

Professor R.J. Overy, 'War and Economy in the Third Reich'

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 05:14 PM
Re: Tom Cruise.....

The link gives more detail about the American pilot he is due to portray in the film.


http://www.fiske.clara.net/billy_fiske.htm

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 06:38 PM
Right chaps, time to spike the awful Fritz...TALLY HO!!!

http://www.planetboredom.net/pix/data/media/6/Family_Guy_Evil_Monkey.gif

"M@ss genocide's the most exhuasting activity one can engage in, next to soccer."
~Loki

RichardI
09-15-2003, 06:49 PM
As Winston Churchill said in 1940:

"Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves that, if the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.' "

It was, indeed, their finest hour.....

Rich /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


<Center>http://www.ghosts.com/images/postimages/THUNDERBOLT.jpg <Center>I've got 140 109's cornered over Berlin!

Message Edited on 09/15/0301:49PM by RichardI

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 07:06 PM
Out of interest.....

UK History is running this week the "finest hour" program.

So if you recieve digital either via sky or dvb there's some good accounts in it from all the Brit services.

Plus, some excellent colour in cockpit footage of the BOB.

programmes are shown 3 times a day 11.00am, 5.00 pm then 11.00pm.


I agree that a lot of our history in the UK tends to get pushed to one side. I would of expected my 8 year old nephew to have covered this at school by now in history class but NO!

Shame really he never met my Granparents.

My Grandad was a Brit infantryman who died during WWII.

After the war my Gran remarried. My Step-Grandad had been a German Pilot who was captured in France and held POW at a camp near to were I live now.

Like so many others he decided to make the UK his home after the War.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 07:28 PM
Yep and don`t forget there were
also many pilots from holland, france, poland etc...

Martin van Vuuren
Rotterdam/Holland
"hornetsting"

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 07:37 PM
What the hell have you got to be ashamed about, Btitain has always punched more than its weight and it still does.
If you've got digital its Battle of Britain week ALL week on the History channel.

Oh and what do they say about the Americans....

Tedious unoriginal wooly philoshophical statement the pith of which is lost in repetition.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 09:17 PM
Seems to me that although one could wish a greater historical awareness in people generally, the first and second world wars are the events that have had the most lingering and deepest impact on the British national psyche. I see no danger of people forgetting or failing to appreciate the sacrifice. I personally don't see it as a disgrace that Battle of Britain week isn't a massive national event any more. The sixtieth anniversary was very extensively covered and commemorated. The achievements of the Spitfire and its pilots are regularly remembered, and the BoB pilot remains a legendary and iconic figure.
I think there are people who fought for Britain who are forgotton much more unfairly - for instance, the British forces in Burma, those on the Atlantic and Arctic convoys, not to mention Korea.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 10:11 PM
We had a small parade with band in our Town. As a result of the parade the traffic was held up for 5 minutes. Those drivers were swearing and cursing far too busy to be held up by stupid parades. Billy Fiske was a hero died 160840 after returning from a mission in his burning hurricane. I think it is good they are making a film about him.I will be sure to watch it. On the day Billy died FL James Nicholson won a VC. On that Friday 45 German aircraft were lost and 22 Allied.

XyZspineZyX
09-15-2003, 10:28 PM
Hey Bo Nidle I think it was September 11th, Americans would never make a mistake with that date.

XyZspineZyX
09-16-2003, 12:57 AM
Bo_Nidle,

You must remember that with time all things fade. There have been many great days in the long history of your country. Many of those days have been forgotten and are no longer celebrated.

Each generation has its own special days that it comemerates. The generation that fought the Battle of Britain is fading. The memory of what they did and what they sacrificed is fading too; but so are the the things that caused that war.

Today, it is incomprehensible to the average Brit or Frenchman or German to consider attacking one of their neighbors. There has been peace in your part of the world for over 50 years. I think that is the best monument we can build for these brave men.

XyZspineZyX
09-16-2003, 01:33 AM
S! to all RAF and those who fought valiantly during the BOB.

Tonight I'll send up 16 HE111 and shoot them down in my Hurricane with RAF markings.

Speaking of Tom Cruise:

http://www.p51.mustangsmustangs.com/survivors/p51/44-12840.shtml

Check out the last statement on the Montana Miss. I don't think its a rumor because the LA Times had an article on his passion for flying recently and mentioned his ownership of a P51.

XyZspineZyX
09-16-2003, 02:48 AM
I always thought the BoB was a draw. Sept.15th the British totally overstated German losses. Postwar accounts state only 60 or less German aircraft were lost that day. While this is a substantial amount for 1940 its NOT the 185 Churchill claimed. In fact, its is entirely possible had Germany not attacked the Soviets in 1941, then the BoB would probably have been renewed and the luftwaffe equipped with the new 109s and FW 190s, probably would have won.

Something to think about

http://www.cbrnp.com/profiles/insignia/italy/incocca-tende-scaglia.jpg
Saluti!
<center>http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/images/mash_henry_blake.jpg (http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/)</center>

XyZspineZyX
09-16-2003, 09:57 PM
Of course you are correct in observing that RAF claims were inflated. However, the Battle of Britain was not a simple tot-em up numbers game, but a concerted attempt by the Luftwaffe to destroy Fighter Command, and thus achieve air supremacy. I don't know if you can say Britain won - but the essential thing was they didn't lose. And that is what turned the course of the war, and perhaps of history.