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View Full Version : new patch made FB like old il-2???



XyZspineZyX
08-16-2003, 10:16 PM
my opinion of this new patch makes me feel that im flying old il-2 again,meaning the stalls are the same ,and all planes are moded in a bias way again!!maddox also desrtoyed the hurricanne big time no combat flaps all kinds,they hacked it apart!!fb i found was fine and yes it needed a few mod tweeks,but they changed the whole game!!like i said its like old il-2 ,maddox should have sold FB as exspansion pack NOT AS A NEW GAME!!!!!!also they did not tell all on new patch,it still studders when pilots join and leave game!! yaaa thx MADDOX for zip!!!

XyZspineZyX
08-16-2003, 10:16 PM
my opinion of this new patch makes me feel that im flying old il-2 again,meaning the stalls are the same ,and all planes are moded in a bias way again!!maddox also desrtoyed the hurricanne big time no combat flaps all kinds,they hacked it apart!!fb i found was fine and yes it needed a few mod tweeks,but they changed the whole game!!like i said its like old il-2 ,maddox should have sold FB as exspansion pack NOT AS A NEW GAME!!!!!!also they did not tell all on new patch,it still studders when pilots join and leave game!! yaaa thx MADDOX for zip!!!

XyZspineZyX
08-16-2003, 10:58 PM
No. looks similar, but actually totally different.

If you still feel that way, go back to IL-2. No one cares. We'll enjoy FB. Can't compare to original.


--------------------------------------
I hate angry, yelling 'new user'

XyZspineZyX
08-16-2003, 11:04 PM
Why the heck you don't rerturn to 1.0 , and fly that beloved UFO Hurricane,instead posting this $hit here?? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

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Hunter82
08-16-2003, 11:51 PM
OK let me explain....


IT is an OPEN BETA....what part of this don't you yo yo's get?


Don't like it go back to the box version....... it is a test version...half the people here thought they could do such a damn good job and whinned about the beta testers for the game and how it should be an open beta....we see how well that works right now...... Now you get what you wanted and you whine...submit bug reports and shut your yap or install the boxed version and wait for those who ARE testing it and submitting to finish so you can enjoy the game and point fingers again!

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XyZspineZyX
08-17-2003, 02:45 AM
Hunter82 wrote:
- OK let me explain....
-
-
- IT is an OPEN BETA....what part of this don't you yo
- yo's get?
-
-
- Don't like it go back to the box version....... it
- is a test version...half the people here thought
- they could do such a damn good job and whinned about
- the beta testers for the game and how it should be
- an open beta....we see how well that works right
- now...... Now you get what you wanted and you
- whine...submit bug reports and shut your yap or
- install the boxed version and wait for those who ARE
- testing it and submitting to finish so you can enjoy
- the game and point fingers again!


ROFLMAO........../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif You tellem Hunter!!! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif


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XyZspineZyX
08-17-2003, 03:59 AM
Bearcat99 wrote:
-
- Hunter82 wrote:
-- OK let me explain....
--
--
-- IT is an OPEN BETA....what part of this don't you yo
-- yo's get?
--
--
ahhh-ohhh somebody touched a nerve...LOL

You tell em Hunter!

"We make war that we may live in peace."

Aristotle

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 08:54 AM
i would like to go back to the 1.0 version but seems that UBI won't allow u to host a 1.0 version now /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif I may try HL or say feck it and play IL-2 cause in my mind its still wins first prize. (Just wish more peoples played my fav)

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:24 AM
Ehh.... What's an open beta????

rgds

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:28 AM
What's the world record for stupid threads? I think this forum has a good shot at it.

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:36 AM
I'm not a programmer nor am I a genious when it comes to computers, selftaught would be the word.

I still don't know what a open beta is?

rgds

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:37 AM
THE HURRICANE IS MORE LIKE THE PLANE IT SHOULD BE NOW.
Don't slate FB. Your talking about the woman I love/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
I fart in your genral direction.

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XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:43 AM
The game is not biased, it is the most accurate available simulation. Unless you can demonstrate with actual performance data that what you think is right, the developers are right to assume you are _wrong_. The P47 fans have done this with roll-rate data.

The patch affected several things in the FM, which are energy retention (heavier planes hold energy better), energy bleed (you lose more speed in turns), stalling effects (related to energy bleeding), dive performance, and the onset of flutter effect. If you are not happy with the flight or damage model, play on easy, it's clearly made for you.

In the russian campaign, I can defeat german fighters and bombers with either advantage, better tactics, or playing the strengths of my aircraft.

In the german, hungarian and finland campaigns, I can defeat russian fighters and bombers with either advantage, better tactics, or playing the strengths of my aircraft.

Online, the better pilot wins. I guess this is not you.

(added note: the real hurricane only had two flap settings: up and down. Down is for landing only. Since you're talking about using flaps to turn, you are probably bleeding off all your energy and stalling all the time, aren't you? Ease up on the stick a bit.)


Message Edited on 08/18/0308:46AM by Bnej_03

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:45 AM
it's a version of a particular piece of software that is put out for testing and anyone who uses the software can put comment in to developer.

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She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:49 AM
bazzaah2 wrote:
- it's a version of a particular piece of software
- that is put out for testing and anyone who uses the
- software can put comment in to developer.

Thanks, I actually thought the "B" in the name was just eyecandy...

rgds

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 10:45 AM
It can't be wrong, everyone says it's modeled correctly now. All planes are correct, and to stop the whinin. But then you get.... "oh yeah the Yak is a bit off IMHO".....Well what is it?...../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Zayets
08-18-2003, 10:48 AM
Hunter82 wrote:
- OK let me explain....
-
-
- IT is an OPEN BETA....what part of this don't you yo
- yo's get?
-
-
- Don't like it go back to the box version....... it
- is a test version...half the people here thought
- they could do such a damn good job and whinned about
- the beta testers for the game and how it should be
- an open beta....we see how well that works right
- now...... Now you get what you wanted and you
- whine...submit bug reports and shut your yap or
- install the boxed version and wait for those who ARE
- testing it and submitting to finish so you can enjoy
- the game and point fingers again!

What a guy /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif !
Kick their arses Hunt if you see they don't stop whine!


Zayets out

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 10:54 AM
Anyone considered banning ppl for stupidity?/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

"degustibus non disputandum"

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XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 11:01 AM
carguy_ wrote:
- Anyone considered banning ppl for stupidity?

We're sorry to see you go carguy. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif


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XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 02:35 PM
Bnej_03 wrote:
- (added note: the real hurricane only had two flap
- settings: up and down. Down is for landing only.
-
- Message Edited on 08/18/03 08:46AM by Bnej_03

This gets quoted a lot, but isn't quite true. Maybe true of the Mk.I, but not the Mk.II unless the Pilot's Notes are all wrong. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif You could set whatever setting you wanted. Pre-patch the Mk.II was correct; now it isn't.

BTW, the rest of your post was impeccable /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:19 PM
Widowmaker has the right to express his own opinion about the game or the patch without being insulted I think.
That s a right we all have and that's what foruns were created.
Beside, I think it's indeed deeply funny how you Gentlemen change so quickly your opinion.

Let's see:

First version of IL2 - "Oh yeah, this is THE SIM, everything is perfect, Oleg is THE MAN.

Second Version of IL2 - OK, now this is great, the previous was wrong but now it's just perfect

Third Version - FANTASTIC!!! OUTSTANDING!!!! WONDERFULL!!! everything is so marvelous now... Oleg is a GOD!!!

Forth Version - ....

Fifth Version - ....


First Version of FB - I will never be able to fly again IL2, this time Oleg hit the Bullseyes, this game is beyond perfection, Thank you, thank you, thank you Oleg, I ll build a church for you...


Second Version of FB - I swear, I can't believe how good this sim is, everything is so so great, FB is like a mystical and religious experience... can't be more perfect...


Well, if any thing needs to be corrected that means that something was wrong, Right??

If something was wrong, that means it wasn't perfect!!! are you following so far???

This leads me to a conclusion or two:

Either 90% of you Gentlemen are nothing more than Oleg's @ss lickers, who feel obliged to praise and honor everything he does...


Or you are just plane and simply STUPIDS...

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:27 PM
Nice one Skyghost, that's lit the blue touch-paper /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Hunter82
08-18-2003, 09:28 PM
HE got what he deserved after his multiple posts crying....

You may want to edit your post ....you don't want to look plane stupids in front of the a$$ lickers /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

AFJ-Skyghost wrote:
- Widowmaker has the right to express his own opinion
- about the game or the patch without being insulted I
- think.
-
- Or you are just plane and simply STUPIDS...
-
-



<center><FONT COLOR="white">[/i]</FONT>
<center><FONT COLOR="white">Hunter82 wrote:
"I did not have technical relations with that question"
[/i]</FONT>
<center> Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>

Message Edited on 08/18/0304:28PM by Hunter82

XyZspineZyX
08-18-2003, 09:54 PM
AFJ-wdwmkr wrote:
- my opinion of this new patch makes me feel that im
- flying old il-2 again....BLA BLA Yadda yadda, etc, etc...whining, whining...


I must be broken but I didn't stall a plane in this beta, they (the stalls) were rare in FB and omnipresent in Il-2...



What I felt changed in 1.1 beta:

-the sound...they really try to make more immersive but in the process they've must messed up something...I can hear the difference in sound but also the rig can feel it and stuters from time to time due to the ammount of chit-chat. I never thought the WWII pilots were such chater boxes...
Also, when the AA starts to fire or I fire and the ground targets explodes...immediately the "weapon sounds/engine sound" goes down a LOT...only the chatter boxes remain at the same volume as before.

- AAA...not anymore the deadly SAM-like precision. Now I can swoop low on an airfield and clean it proper with an Il-2, including the AA. In fact, they made an compromise...they kept the FB's 20mm flak, just botched the aiming a little and brought back the heavy AAA from Il-2. The light flak is still off...they are not gatlings...nor individual weapons...meaning the area saturation from 2-3 light flaks is UFO and the traverse speeds for aiming the gun are VERY HIGH...
Oh, one more thing...the 20mm never had proximity fuses and I doubt it ever had "timed" ones...Amazing how the light flak "explodes" arround you sometimes...and yes...WHAT IS WITH THAT "LASER LIKE" TRAJECTORY? I goes big distances without droping an inch in trajectory...it's really a 20mm flak?

- weapons effect...augmented...I had last night to make sure I am not on "arcade" mode after cleaning four transport columns, 3 trains and 4 tanks plus 2 109F's in my beloved Il-2 (the first series...I can't wait to put my hand on the field mod).
Odly enough...the 109F tried to stall fight me...in a Il-2...never had a change...


- 109 is not the matchbox anymore...nor the Il-2 radiator...got hits on both and they never cough any smoke at all...


Now...what the heck is this 1.1b flight model? I reduce the throtle, NOTHING, reduce the mix to 20-30%...nothing...the engine still runs at max rpm...no change in speed...
WHO ASKED FOR THE Me-262's flight model to be patched into all the planes?


Can I have a buton to kill the noise of those chater boxes? I really hate when I am in a battle to hear some suckers screaming that they are under atack (when no one is near them) or tell me 4-5 times what an atack he has just made...it makes the rig to stuter and sometimes I kiss the ground...well, my gound atack scheme has a bit of guilt; I go in shallow dives and revocer under 3-5 meters...just above the target...I know it suxors, and it's way off what should be...but where is the fun if u shoot an BRS-182 from 500-600m, and then break hard...I like to see them pophttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif)

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 12:34 AM
At least their keeping it in the same squad.

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 02:08 AM
WAAAAAAAA!, WAAAAAAA!, WAAAAAA! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif


*****Only left handed people are in their right minds.*****

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ZG77_Nagual
08-19-2003, 02:24 AM
Actually - Oleg did specifically request that we not complain about flight models unless we were able to back it up with actual data - read his post about the beta.

It is to all our advantage to do this - this is one of the most abusive forums related to IL2/FB - if you look around this really is the pits in terms of the kinds of stuff people feel free to say.

Just trying for a little change of tone.

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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 02:52 AM
AFJ-wdwmkr wrote:
- ,and all planes are moded in a bias way
- again!!maddox also desrtoyed the hurricanne big time
- no combat flaps all kinds,they hacked it apart!!fb i
- found was fine and yes it needed a few mod
- tweeks,but they changed the whole game!!


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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 03:26 AM
Not again!



BPO5_Jinx
C.O. Replacement Air Group
Birds of Prey. 16th GvIAP

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 03:27 AM
Before anyone can say "hey this sim is realistic" you have to know what realistic is .. how many of you that say this sim is or is not has any type of hours flying in various types of planes? How many of the Beta tester's out side of data read or proved, has actual flown and knows about the Physics of aironotic's?

One thing for sure this Open Beta FM's are still not right but close according to data. I hope that the Prop Pitch controls are fixed for one becuase it is no where close to what it should be in any plane how ever the box install of the Prop pitch was so close to real then took a major step back in Open Beta.

I don't believe the Hurri handled that crappy seeing how it WAS the most adversed plane in WWII. I have info from an english WWII vet who flew several missions in a Hurri and P-40 that this sim desires a little more work on the FM. I would be more than happy to share written documents but I'm sure Maddox and beta testers will figure it out with out my in/out put.

The energy managment is run away which I do not understand on the German side of this. The 109's (later Models) were built for greater energy control but yet it seems so hard to control it. Again I have written proof in diaries and documents from Vets on this as proof.

This is a GAME. It was created for fun not realism or perfection.If so then it would fall under Microsoft Flight Sim 2000 to 2004. This was suppose to recreate the eastern front as not seen by many but it also was designed to put you in an atmosphere of getting in an actual WWII plane and fly.

How many have seen a P-51 take off pull straight up and climb to an elevated 2000 feet before leveling out? I have. Who has seen a Hurri out wit a 109 in a dog fight or a Spit with a 109. WDWMAKER has and I have seen the spit work against a 109.

I have seen many planes, historicle planes fly in my day and recently at Air Force Base's and I have to say that even though FB is close it still misses the mark of REALISM and will never be a REALISM sim. It is a game to have fun and be competitive with. So have fun with it and stop hating others for there oppinions based on what they have seen or actualy know.

BH.

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 03:37 AM
noway in il2 sturmovik you can fly with just trim as an elevator and it was faster then the actual elevator use without stalls

the fb 1.1b is the the closest thing to realism any wwii flight sim has ever achieved, theres a few fm that can do some strange manuevers becuase of the super roll and quick elevator moves but its very minor and most the planes seem like they should be


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Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 03:51 AM
There are documents to see what the climb rate should be on the Hurricane. You don't have to be a WW2 ace to see that the pre patch Hurricane was wrong.

Seeing some mock up dogfight in an air show doesn't make you an authority either.

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 05:00 AM
OH I see so you know everything in Flight Physics or aironotics.

As for a Mock air show it was an Air Museum not a show. Hail almighty BUZZU who is knower of all ( Yeah RIGHT ).

I see that is the only querm you have is a flight show? I must have offended you in some way. Let me be the first to apologize over a GAME.

You want real then make it to the standards of flying realisticaly! Me personally it is a Good sim with a few small flaws that could or could not be corrected I could careless I have fun either way. Flamming people for there thoughts is not right. Prove them wrong with your data , flight statistics, physics, aironotical knowledge or even ledgers of WWII vets would suffice in my book, not your ignorant rants or put downs which only really makes yourself look bad.

BH.

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 05:09 AM
But you did just that-ranted and pouted and piissed about how the fm is messed up with the patch-BUT YOU DIDN"T GIVE US ANY DATA TO SUPPORT YOUR CLAIM-much like and uneducated person would do, or a youth.

rogo

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Hunter82
08-19-2003, 05:22 AM
How would you knwo what the beta team is comprised of? You seem to have passed judgement of their knowledge already, would it surprise you MANY are private or commercial pilots? There are ! I'm not going into anyone elses qualifications but your first comment already labeled yourself as a person helping a pal out of a problem he started. Admirable but not a basis for this discussion..... seeing an airplane fly overhead hardly qualifies anyone to speak of the FM of a Hurri.


AFJ_BLACKHART wrote:
- Before anyone can say "hey this sim is realistic"
- you have to know what realistic is .. how many of
- you that say this sim is or is not has any type of
- hours flying in various types of planes? How many of
- the Beta tester's out side of data read or proved,
- has actual flown and knows about the Physics of
- aironotic's?
-
- One thing for sure this Open Beta FM's are still not
- right but close according to data. I hope that the
- Prop Pitch controls are fixed for one becuase it is
- no where close to what it should be in any plane how
- ever the box install of the Prop pitch was so close
- to real then took a major step back in Open Beta.
-
- I don't believe the Hurri handled that crappy seeing
- how it WAS the most adversed plane in WWII. I have
- info from an english WWII vet who flew several
- missions in a Hurri and P-40 that this sim desires a
- little more work on the FM. I would be more than
- happy to share written documents but I'm sure Maddox
- and beta testers will figure it out with out my
- in/out put.
-
- The energy managment is run away which I do not
- understand on the German side of this. The 109's
- (later Models) were built for greater energy control
- but yet it seems so hard to control it. Again I have
- written proof in diaries and documents from Vets on
- this as proof.
-
- This is a GAME. It was created for fun not realism
- or perfection.If so then it would fall under
- Microsoft Flight Sim 2000 to 2004. This was suppose
- to recreate the eastern front as not seen by many
- but it also was designed to put you in an atmosphere
- of getting in an actual WWII plane and fly.
-
- How many have seen a P-51 take off pull straight up
- and climb to an elevated 2000 feet before leveling
- out? I have. Who has seen a Hurri out wit a 109 in a
- dog fight or a Spit with a 109. WDWMAKER has and I
- have seen the spit work against a 109.
-
- I have seen many planes, historicle planes fly in my
- day and recently at Air Force Base's and I have to
- say that even though FB is close it still misses the
- mark of REALISM and will never be a REALISM sim. It
- is a game to have fun and be competitive with. So
- have fun with it and stop hating others for there
- oppinions based on what they have seen or actualy
- know.
-
- BH.
-
-



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<center><FONT COLOR="white">Hunter82 wrote:
"I did not have technical relations with that question"
[/i]</FONT>
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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 05:32 AM
I... I don't even know where to start. Post like these are pathetic.

The hurricane performed nothing like real life in 1.0. There is a reason it was outclassed after the Battle of Britian. It's like you don't read history books. Or you AFJ people just like being smacktards.

If you actually provide some hard data (i.e. charts and WWII manuals) you might be taken seriously. But as Buzz said, watching mock dogfights and listening to an 80 year old vet's foggy memory holds no value in actual aircraft modelling.

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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 05:34 AM
If they are so educated then why are the prop pitches not according to Data I would love to share with you Hunter as you have stated maybe I have passed judgement but I see it as I see it. As for supporting a team members bad thoughts no I am only supporting the fact that Flamming is not the answer .. yes I was very smug to BUZZU to prove a point it solves nothing but like I said nothing I would say would influence you or Maddox. Many of your beta testers fly yes I see the improvements in some but drastic flaws in others you wanted open thoughts here they are. I have yet to see there supported data in what they produced so that I could counter it with my Data I have offered OLEG personally many times for IL-2 but Ignored.

Prove to me that the FM's are hard Data and I will share with you Hunter, no flames no hassles the hurri is no issue for me at all. I dont fly it at all.

BH

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 06:42 AM
Blackhart,

Read wdwmkr's post again. Keep in mind that this is the second thread on this same subject. Would you be taking his side if he wasn't in your squad?

What proof of anything he said did he offer? It's just the same old whining about some overmodeled plane that doesn't perform as he thinks it should. Well prove that it doesn't. You guys backing him up, makes you look just as bad as him. I think everybody agreed that the pre patch Hurricane was not right. Why are you surprised that it was changed?

I don't claim to know everything. I don't claim to know anything. I don't whine either.

Have you noticed that the only people agreeing with wdwmkr are AFJ members?

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 06:58 AM
English is not my natural language, I'm portuguese and I don't think the fact of writing one or two spelling errors makes me stupid... or are you able to reply me in portuguese giving the same number of spelling errors I did??

English is not my natural language, sorry for any spelling mistake.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 07:06 AM
TallMoose wrote:

- (snip) The hurricane performed nothing like real life in
- 1.0. There is a reason it was outclassed after the
- Battle of Britian.(snip)-

You're absolutely right. The Hurricane was WAY overmodeled as the Brewster B-239 is now with the release of the patch. The Brewsters were actually rather unsuccessful aircraft and quickly discarded by the USN (yes, I know the Finns flew them...). While realizing that this release is a beta release, it's amazing that this level of overmodeling (and undermodeling in the case of the P-47) occurs.

GR142-Pipper

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 07:06 AM
1. Hurricane is still a killer, its not the bank and yank plane it was before and i fly it on many occasions and i think the plane IS more realistic, I mean cmon, who can say a plane that can turn in a 100 foot radius 4 or 5 times and lose very little airspeed is "realistic"?

2. Has any of us ACTUALLY flown a BF, FW, Yak, P40, P47, I16, I153, ect ect?, I know I havent and suffice to say, all the flight models are a PROGRAM, it can never be as random as real life theres sooooooooooo many random things that can affect plane preformance which i doubt anyone wants to read nor do i want to spend the time trying to think it up cause im tired. Point is, noone should rag on other people on how realistic or unrealistic the planes are in this game cause its all a moot point. These threads are getting pretty redundant and imo a waste of ubi's webspace.

Just a thought

By the way, most of the Hurricane's kills were bomber kills, why do u think the majority of their sorties were escorted with spitfires? So they wouldnt get butchered by the BF109



Message Edited on 08/19/0306:08AM by WUAF_MJ_Prop

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 07:07 AM
First, this is not a squad issue

Second I never said Hurricane or any other plane flight model was correct of incorrect and you'll never will because I'm not a pilot or a flight engineer who had studied the flight physics to know if it's incorrect or not.

What made me get mad was the arrogance that some here showed through a post of someone who disagree with your own opinion.

I just ask what makes you better than him? Who said you are right?



English is not my natural language, sorry for any spelling mistake.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 07:10 AM
The point is. Who says he's right? He started it by starting two threads with nothing backing up his claims.

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 07:48 AM
OH GOD......................cough................quac k?

www.fighterjocks.net (http://www.fighterjocks.net) home of the 11 time Champions Team AFJ. 6 Years Flying http://www.world-data-systems.com/aerofiles/albums/userpics/p47-22.jpg 47|FC=

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 11:08 AM
GR142-Pipper wrote:

- You're absolutely right. The Hurricane was WAY
- overmodeled as the Brewster B-239 is now with the
- release of the patch. The Brewsters were actually
- rather unsuccessful aircraft and quickly discarded
- by the USN (yes, I know the Finns flew them...).
- While realizing that this release is a beta release,
- it's amazing that this level of overmodeling (and
- undermodeling in the case of the P-47) occurs.


Eh can you state what is overmodelled in the Brewster? IT was higly successfull fighter, claiming the best victory ratio in Any WW2- fighter. USS disregarded it because lack of speed, and that is true.. still it is very good fighter for early years of the war. Actually I think you are talking about F2A-3s and F2A-2s, which were much worse in terms of manouvarability compared to F2A-1s, that the Finns received (because of the much increased weight) .. they had increased armor, but flight speed did not increase at all... F2A-1 was instead very manouvarable, good firepower (4x .50call), and good diving speed, and excelent flying range.. and it was fast for a early war plane.. Finns had to use it up to year 1944, and they still were fairly successfull with it.. even when it was up to 200kmh slower than the enemy planes.. so surely it must not have been that bad.. IT did earn the reputation of beeing the "Pearl of the sky" because it was so delight to fly with it.


And about Hurricane and spitfire (arrording to Finnish ace):
"The Hurricane and Spitfire are slow and clumsy fighters at low altitudes. They seek dogfights at high altitudes (over 5,000 m.) where their characteristics are extremely good. Used these days as night-fighters by the enemy. The Spitfire is faster than the Hurricane. "

So Hurricanes were not really faster that Brewsters, and more sluggish at low altitudes.

And about Brewster vs. Hurricane:

"The easiest one to shoot down of the enemy fighters is the Hurricane. It is totally helpless against us below 3,000 meters. It is slow and very clumsy and unmanoeuvrable. Whenever you meet a Hurricane, engage it in a turn-fight, where it is totally at our mercy. It is best to shoot this plane in the forward part of the fuselage when it almost immediately bursts into flames. "

Message Edited on 08/19/0312:15PM by Vipez-

Hunter82
08-19-2003, 12:14 PM
Provide the data...fixed paper form not snippets of a pilots perspective.....it's what we all have to do...until then it's just hear say. Oleg has a room full of papered data /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

You are right that flaming is not the answer but as Buzz had stated you may want to do a search for Wdwmkr's posts to see why everyone has written him off.....

I'd love it for everyone to be right but it's not.




<center><FONT COLOR="white">[/i]</FONT>
<center><FONT COLOR="white">Hunter82 wrote:
"I did not have technical relations with that question"
[/i]</FONT>
<center> Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 03:21 PM
I think the Hurricane is more accurate now. The only problem I have is with the well documented flawed P-47 rollrate and turn rate and the Mk.2 Hurri's not having combat flaps.

I do wonder though; If Oleg has the correct data, then why the drastic FM changes over the years? Seems to me he is maybe just guessing as much as we all are.

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 05:58 PM
Get a grip bazzaah2


Look at his call sign AFJ, He knows how to fly better than you, you should take advice when given to you.

This beta sucks and thats all PERIOD.


Read up on the hurcs in the battle for Britan. 2700 german vs 520 hurcs and 337 spitfires, The Germans lost and the British controlled the Air for the remainder of the war.

FW and 109's ran when someone said Hurricane or Spitfire

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 06:21 PM
LastRights wrote:
- Read up on the hurcs in the battle for Britan. 2700
- german vs 520 hurcs and 337 spitfires, The Germans
- lost and the British controlled the Air for the
- remainder of the war.
-
- FW and 109's ran when someone said Hurricane or
- Spitfire
-
-

Hehe, I was wrong earlier; LastRights has lit the blue touch paper /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-19-2003, 11:53 PM
Look Gents I'm not trying to be a butt .. I am in no way supporting my fellow squad mate in this issue I personaly think that the Hurri is still over modeled according to Nasa Data which a friend has given me but wasn't there a model that had four flap settings?

I also would like to present a request to Hunter if he would take a look at the prop pitch when the Testers have a little time. According to what I have researched through various pilots I know and research I have done in engines on various WWII planes (online). I personaly went to an Air Force mechanic who takes care of our local P-51 trainers on Base. I told him how the engine responds to certain planes. He stated that he can not speak for each engine but the general idea was that the rpm's of the engine should stay the same while the prop increases or decrease's rotation or ratio per sec by oil preasure. EVOL might be able to express this better he flies I just like to ride and co- pilot lol in fact I get to fly in a P-51 trainer next weekend and am psyched BIG time. OH HELL YEAH. One more thing Hunter please??? I love flying closed cockpit at times but what erks me is there are not any seat adjustment up/down/left/right. Will that be in any future plans? The 190's really need seat adjustment to see over the dash.

You have a point BUZZ I wouldn't have known this thread exhisted if wdw hadn't told me he had posted it. So I took a look and all I seen was people just rippin him for the most part. I don't agree with his post but I'm not going to rip him. I would rather have him underdstand why the Hurri was modeled like it is than just dog him out. So yes the negativity kind of hacked me because out of all the threads I didn't see a responsable explanation to his opinion with out flamming him. I we will do our best to educate him on this issue.

I apologize for upsetting anyone or starting an issue.That was really not my attempt at all I could have made a better attempt but was very upset at the time.

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 12:08 AM
BLACKHART

No problem. You must have missed his first thread on this same subject. We who read it were getting a little tired of the same thing over. If we didn't jump on him a bit, he would have gone on and on. I guess it's the way he tried to get his point across didn't help either.

I don't usually rag on someone for no reason. Unless it's a friend that i'm just fooling with. Some guys can't tell when i'm not serious, and just think I do nothing but flame people. Not true.

25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 12:09 AM
Wow, here we go again. Hunter said it exactly right and many are forgetting that allready. As I have even learned...ITS A BETA VERSION! Let the developers see all that needs to be done and make their changes. Try to be patient and just list the things you notice that seem wrong to you and stop this crying about how bad this or that is.

P.S. Don't you just love it when you see "new user" under their name and the first thing they are doing is crying. Makes me want to run right out and fly with 'em. Watch it, they'll want to sue you for flying in front of them and stealing their kill or some stupid thing.

Beware of the Flying Tigers /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 01:04 AM
LastRights wrote:
- Get a grip bazzaah2
-
-
- Look at his call sign AFJ, He knows how to fly
- better than you, you should take advice when given
- to you.
-
- This beta sucks and thats all PERIOD.
-
-
- Read up on the hurcs in the battle for Britan. 2700
- german vs 520 hurcs and 337 spitfires, The Germans
- lost and the British controlled the Air for the
- remainder of the war.
-
- FW and 109's ran when someone said Hurricane or
- Spitfire

AHAHAHAHAHahaha... woo! *wipes tear*

<center>http://mysite.freeserve.com/flying_moose/images/2-picture3.jpg?0.488377430005666 </center>

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:42 AM
um...lastrights. you dont read history do you? the brits lost the battle of britain to the germans . at the end hitler made one mistake that turned the tide for the brits. oh and another thing there were no fw190s in the battle of britain. NONE. the only reason hurris were able to shoot down 109s at all was due to goerings hamstringing the 109s by keeping it in formations with the bombers and not allowing it to run free and above. hitlers mistake made it worse by shifting the bombing and attacks from airfields to london. if not for that the brits would all be speaking german since with proper tactics the 109 was superior to hurricanes and spitfires.

www.fighterjocks.net (http://www.fighterjocks.net) home of the 11 time Champions Team AFJ. 6 Years Flying http://www.world-data-systems.com/aerofiles/albums/userpics/p47-22.jpg 47|FC=

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:45 AM
Yeah I missed it big time BUZZ again I apologize, I'm not really an ARSE hole unless I'm killin ya =))))

I don't normally post in UBI forums but just wanted to find out what the hub bub was all about staying out .... lol

See Ya's

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:48 AM
That and the Germans never rotated there Ace's and vetrens out like the American's and Brit's.....

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 03:51 AM
lol blackhart. your gonna get addicted like me an murdoc. this forum is like CRACK COCAINE. youll never be able to stop now...i see the first signs already...your dooomed doomed like the rest of us DOOMED i say !!!!

www.fighterjocks.net (http://www.fighterjocks.net) home of the 11 time Champions Team AFJ. 6 Years Flying http://www.world-data-systems.com/aerofiles/albums/userpics/p47-22.jpg 47|FC=

XyZspineZyX
08-20-2003, 04:41 AM
I NEEEEEEEEEEED AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIX

ROFL ........... POST POST POST POST