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Gunner_361st
03-02-2004, 10:24 AM
Afternoon gentlemen.

My question is... were the P40 and P39 slow-speed stall characteristics reduced in the newer patches?

I remember in early versions of Forgotten Battles, if you man-handled the P39 or P40 roughly at low speeds you could easily go into a stall, or even worse, a spin.

It seems with the newer patches this is very much reduced. I have also talked to people who flew the original IL2 Sturmovik and they have said the P39 doesn't stall like it used to.

Am I just handling them right? Am I crazy? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Hehe... Any enlightenment would be appreciated.

Captain Gunner of the 361st vFG

http://home.comcast.net/~smconlon/wsb/media/245357/site1039.jpg

Gunner_361st
03-02-2004, 10:24 AM
Afternoon gentlemen.

My question is... were the P40 and P39 slow-speed stall characteristics reduced in the newer patches?

I remember in early versions of Forgotten Battles, if you man-handled the P39 or P40 roughly at low speeds you could easily go into a stall, or even worse, a spin.

It seems with the newer patches this is very much reduced. I have also talked to people who flew the original IL2 Sturmovik and they have said the P39 doesn't stall like it used to.

Am I just handling them right? Am I crazy? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Hehe... Any enlightenment would be appreciated.

Captain Gunner of the 361st vFG

http://home.comcast.net/~smconlon/wsb/media/245357/site1039.jpg

Gunner_361st
03-02-2004, 10:34 AM
Bump. To be sure. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Captain Gunner of the 361st vFG

http://home.comcast.net/~smconlon/wsb/media/245357/site1039.jpg

crazyivan1970
03-02-2004, 10:36 AM
Be sure! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/10.gif

V!
Regards,

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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

zugfuhrer
03-02-2004, 10:58 AM
Good planes come and bad planes go.
The P40 is much better today, and the I-16 isnt so good anymore.
Before in dogfight servers the firs to log in grabbed tha I-16 24, nowdays it is not so popular.
The P40 has seen a renessaince, many pilots favours it before the Mustang.
That is what make this so fun, that things changes

03-02-2004, 11:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gunner_361st:
I remember in early versions of Forgotten Battles, if you man-handled the P39 or P40 roughly at low speeds you could easily go into a stall, or even worse, a spin.

It seems with the newer patches this is very much reduced. I have also talked to people who flew the original IL2 Sturmovik and they have said the P39 doesn't stall like it used to.

Am I just handling them right? Am I crazy? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Hehe... Any enlightenment would be appreciated.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

None of the planes stall like they used to. The current FM feels OK most of the time, except for accellerated stalls and snap rolls.

For instance, you can "trip" the FM into throwing your plane into a snap roll and hold it there simply by applying back pressure. Rudder input is not necessary to enter the snap. You don't have to pull fast like in real life, just hard. A slow hard pull would normally cause a mush or at best a sloppy roll, but there's only one kind of snap roll in the sim.... one that's essentially a horizontal spin.

To exit the spin/snap all you have to do is center the stick and apply a little opposite rudder. Strangely, ailerons are effective even at high AoA.

In earlier versions the FM varied a LOT from one plane to another, and some of the worse aircraft required more drastic stall recovery techniques. The P-39 required pro-spinning the aircraft before beginning a standard recovery, and sometimes the I-16 wouldn't come out unless you cranked the flaps down. I can't say if that is any more realistic, though.

BfHeFwMe
03-02-2004, 12:53 PM
Stick force limiters have been added, and they are rather effective. Your not going to have it both ways. Either you want your viscious stalls without limiters or have limiters that tend to nix the effect. Seems limiters have won the day.

PzKpfw
03-02-2004, 01:09 PM
The P-39, generaly stalled @ 105mph IAS, flaps up, and 90mph IAS flaps down. Another aspect was as the 37mm ammunition was expended, the P-39s Center of Gravity moved rearward and altered the P-39s flight to that of a tail heavy craft.

Their was also no stall warning as, their was no buffeting control or otherwise, which often led pilots going into flat spins etc.

The P-40 typicly stalled @ 84mph, 'dirty' and @ 90mph IAS 'clean' (though this varied with model). The stall was gentle and the pilot felt the stall comeing. Low speed 1g stalls were considered 'safe'.

If the P-40 was in an accelerated stall, Ie, high speed tight turn, their was an shudder warning, and if ignored it could easily go into a snap spin.

Pilots of the P-40C stated it was almost impossible to spin, as it would just skid from side to side, while the P-40E would stall and go into a violent spin.

Regards, John Waters

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03-02-2004, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by BfHeFwMe:
Stick force limiters have been added, and they are rather effective. Your not going to have it both ways. Either you want your viscious stalls without limiters or have limiters that tend to nix the effect. Seems limiters have won the day.

That sounds good and it makes sense. Aircraft still stall out at low speed just like they always did cause stick force isn't an issue.

What about structural limits? Plenty of aircraft in this sim fall apart if you overSPEED, yet I've never seen one snap in half if you pull too many G's.

As an extreme example, take the BI-1 beyond critical Mach and let it "tuck under". The airframe is probably experiencing well over 10 negative G's but it doesn't fall apart.