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Atomic_Marten
06-27-2004, 08:55 AM
Is it going to be implemented in this game? After all wonderful features this one will be great to see...

I don't see any previous posts regarding this important matter so I'll have to bring it on http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/93.gif

Atomic_Marten
06-27-2004, 08:55 AM
Is it going to be implemented in this game? After all wonderful features this one will be great to see...

I don't see any previous posts regarding this important matter so I'll have to bring it on http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/93.gif

Latico
06-27-2004, 09:01 AM
Could you elaborate a bit on this?

I've seen references to shared kills between pilots in air combat. That is, 2 pilots that engaged a bandit would split the kill between them, each counting it as a half kill.

Atomic_Marten
06-27-2004, 12:20 PM
No problem... example of what I exactly mean is this: when two pilots shoot at the same enemy A/C and both of them hit it, and shot it down, they BOTH achieve an aerial victory. (they are each accounted for 1/2 victory). If there were three guys, then 1/3 for each of them etc.

What we see in IL-2 is this: zillion guys puts lead inthe same enemy A/C, and only last one who hit it is accounted for kill. Not to mention that when flak blow enemy A/C, you just have to be close to fire a short burst in already mortally damaged A/C to be accounted with a kill.

Instead of whole lot of "cosmetical" features in PF I think they should work on this instead to make it real as it gets. It is pretty obvious that we are not getting this in IL-2.

If you by any chance obtain any WW2 book regarding this matter (like OSPREY's ACES series)you'll see that shared kills were common in WW2.

Latico
06-27-2004, 02:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Atomic_Marten:
No problem... example of what I exactly mean is this: when two pilots shoot at the same enemy A/C and both of them hit it, and shot it down, they BOTH achieve an aerial victory. (they are each accounted for 1/2 victory). If there were three guys, then 1/3 for each of them etc.

What we see in IL-2 is this: zillion guys puts lead inthe same enemy A/C, and only last one who hit it is accounted for kill. Not to mention that when flak blow enemy A/C, you just have to be close to fire a short burst in already mortally damaged A/C to be accounted with a kill.

Instead of whole lot of "cosmetical" features in PF I think they should work on this instead to make it real as it gets. It is pretty obvious that we are not getting this in IL-2.

If you by any chance obtain any WW2 book regarding this matter (like OSPREY's ACES series)you'll see that shared kills were common in WW2.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I thought this was what you were referring to. I don't know if we'll see this in PF. It seems that in all the combat sim that I've flown it is always the last plane to score a hit on an enemy plane that gets the kill.

In Janes FA, there is always *****in and moaning over "stolen kills" after guns matches because of this. I've also noticed during FB gun matches that some pilots will go after planes that seem to be crippled and just trying to get away, so they can add the final round to finish the lame plane off and score the kill.

Offline I normally peal off a bandit if I feel that it is no longer a threat, and hunt for another target. I don't have to see my target blow up.

In real life I'm sure that the combat pilots used the honor system when reporting kills, and they did have gun cameras to verify their attacks. Let's say that a pair of CAP fighters were on patrol and came upon an enemy recon plane. The leader of the pair would begin his approach, with the wingman following a distance behind. The winleader gets a few good hits in and sets an engine on fire. The wingman makes his pass and disables the other engine. They both know that plane ain't goin home so the break off and watch it go down. When the return home they share the kill. Now if the wingleader had shot a wing off of the enemy pane, the wingman wouldn't have fired and the whole kill would have been given to the wingleader.

In a sim game, especially during a coop mission I don't care about how many kills I get credit for. Getting a mission Accomplished is all that matters. So what if I get more kills than everyone else, if we get a mission failure. Ya know what I mean?

Atomic_Marten
06-27-2004, 04:30 PM
I see your point. However because I never play online I do not whine about stolen kills by other human players. I only point that shared kills are very important piece of puzzle in WW2 air war.

WW2 pilots were often faced a scramble mission against bombers situation (this is maybe the best example). And wing leader takes aim at specific bomber, wingman of corse follow. Next thing: wing leader open fire at bomber and damage it but unsuficiently to bring it down. Wingman follow and he shoots another burst in bomber and he's going down. It is way simplier to do it this way instead of repeating passes and expose themselves to bomber defence fire.

And all this matter when I'm playing campaign. I prefer campaign mode of playing this game, so this will be nice to have.

I'm not one of those guys who are whining that AI planes stole their kills, 'cause I often let AI planes finish enemy A/C's. Like yourself Latico, I do not see the point of shooting down 4-5 enemy A/C's per mission and still lose it. And if u want u can always steal AI kills as well. My point by no means goes that way.

At the moment, I'm playing RU Leningrad campaign '41 in 'Tchaika' on 'realistic' mode. I finished 30 missions. I haven't score a single kill, only 11 ground kills, not because I do not have opportunity to shoot 'em down, that's because I play it safe... I do not want to repeat the same mission 4-5 times-no reality there. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif But hey, I'm way off topic now http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Latico
06-28-2004, 10:43 AM
"At the moment, I'm playing RU Leningrad campaign '41 in 'Tchaika' on 'realistic' mode. I finished 30 missions. I haven't score a single kill, only 11 ground kills, not because I do not have opportunity to shoot 'em down, that's because I play it safe... I do not want to repeat the same mission 4-5 times-no reality there. But hey, I'm way off topic now "

I flying the same Campaaign myself except I don't have mine set to full realism. So far, I've got in 80+ sorties with about 104 air kills and aabout 50 ground kills. By reflying the missions until I aat least survive and return to base or able to bail ovwer friendly territory, I'm developing my combat skills and tactics. I'll probably refly the carreer thing again with upgraded realism and see if the practice round has done me any good. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Atomic_Marten
06-29-2004, 07:31 AM
If you switch to 'full real' campaign I bet that u find it to be very satisfying to play campaign this way. Big difference makes playing with icons on off, on map and in-game with cockpit always on. Another difference is that u must stick with your mission objectives, 'cause u rarely get an opportunity to hit enemy elsewhere. I intentionally take 'Tchaika' because with it u get almost exclusively ground-busting missions. For my second plane I take Hurricane Mk.IIb.

BTW, RU Leningrad fighter subcampaign '41 takes exactly 38 missions after that u switch to next subcampaign '42.

I'm already finished this campaign from '41, but on 'custom settings'. I've been wounded twice('42 & '43), flown over 170 missions and shot down over 150 enemy planes. But it's way better on 'realistic' mode...