PDA

View Full Version : What if......



Jaws2002
01-11-2004, 01:23 PM
What if Japan would have attacked Russia in 1941 instead of attacking the United States. Do you guys think that this would have changed the history in a dramatic way?

Jaws2002
01-11-2004, 01:23 PM
What if Japan would have attacked Russia in 1941 instead of attacking the United States. Do you guys think that this would have changed the history in a dramatic way?

christopher65
01-11-2004, 01:39 PM
Dont think that the Russians could have managed to fight effectivaly on 2 fronts in late 41 early 42.America probably wouldnt have entered the war for quite a while if at all.This more than likely would result in an Axis victory and I dont want to tink about the horrors that would come with that!! The world would certianly be a very differant place!

Belzeebub
01-11-2004, 02:05 PM
Hmmm,

"The world would certianly be a very differant place!"

Would it?? One of the results of WWII was that the eastern block got a communist leadership whish in turn lead to the cold war "east-west" tension with the western alliances. I would not go so far so I would compare different regimes but this might need some good thinking.

But then again, "what if" is always inpossible to tell.

Just my thoughts...

SkyChimp
01-11-2004, 02:06 PM
Had the Japanese never attacked the US...hmmm.

That's a hard question because the Japanese took and occupied the areas of the Pacific that were most strategially important to them AFTER the attack on Pearl Harbor occurred.

Nevertheless, here's my take...

My understanding was that Stalin maintained rather substanial forces in the east to oppose such aggression, which Stalin apparently anticipated. But the force he kept there was substantially smaller than what he placed there in March 1945 for the anticipated invasion into Manchuria.

Conversely, the Japanese Kwantung Army was a much bigger threat in 1941 than it was in early 1945. In 1941, it had not been sapped of experienced officers, troops, weapons and supplies that would eventually bolster forces in the Philippines, Borneo and such.

But the Japanese army, even in 1941, was ill equipped for such a campaign against the Soviet Union. The Kwantung army existed more to preserve Japanese interests in Manchuria than to advance them into Russia. In other words, the Kwantung army was a defensive army, and an army of occupation.

The Japanese never had sufficient armor, anti-armor, or artillery assests to really pose a huge threat to the Soviets. The reason they fared well against the Chinese and Manchurians was because both of these were in even worse shape than the Japanese.

The Japanese were fearsome fighters in the jungles and islands where their limited heavy assests could be concentrated - and were less necessary - and where they had sufficient naval assests to ensure adequate resupply. They performed very well in the interior of Southeast Asia where the "front" was broken by terrain - again where their limited heavy assest could be concentrated and well establish supply lines existed. But they were not a army equipped to prosecute a war across the Asian frontier along a 4,000 kilometer front against a modern army like the Soviets had.

Japan was starving for oil, rubber and other resources in 1941.

Had the Japanese attacked the Soviets from the east in 1941, they would have been defeated, and they would have had to use assests to fight the Soviets that were needded to fight the war in the Pacific, which they felt was much more important, and held bigger benefits if won - the resources they needed in the first place.

Regards,
SkyChimp
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/skychimp.jpg

fightwithflight
01-11-2004, 05:33 PM
I was watching a show on the history channel called "Stealing the Superfortress." It was about how the Soviets were able to copy a damadged B-29 that landed in the Soviet Union after it got hit by flak over Japan. Anyway, the Soviet Union did not want the B-29s to land there because it might make the Japanese decide to attack them. After three B-29s landed there, they woul not allow anymore because of this. The Japanese had a large force in Manchuria, on the eastern side of Asia. From here, they could launch a large attack on the Soviets. The Soviets were counting on remaining neutral with Japan, and concentrated their forces in the western Soviet Union to keep the Germans out. If the Japanese decided to attack, it is my opinion that they would have had no trouble taking over. If this happened, the Soviets would have to move their forces east to counter this attack, leaving their western border more vunerable allowing the Germans to attack. Between the two countries, oone would have been able to take over. Germany and Japan were trading information and materials to build a nuclear missle to reach the United States. In fact, When the United States dropped the Atomic Bomb, Japan was 8 days away from having a nuclear missle that could reach Los Angeles. Scary. It is my feeling that if Germany and Japan would have become more of an alliance, that the war would wave been totally different.

jensenpark
01-11-2004, 05:42 PM
Japan 8 days from having a nuke and being able to reach LA?

I'm sorry, but someone is either pulling your leg with that info, or you're smoking something good and should share it.

And Japan and Germany cooperating more would have had the same net effect...total, unconditional surrender by both of them...no different from what happened.

http://images.ucomics.com/images/doonesbury/strip/thecast/duke2.jpg

"Death before unconsciousness" - Uncle Duke

p1ngu666
01-11-2004, 07:01 PM
dont think there was anything in eastern russia the japs wanted
think the russians would have shrunk back into russia, and then pushed em back