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VMF114_Spyder
07-18-2004, 01:28 PM
What in the movie did you find the most inaccurate and why? I think throughout the whole movie the most realistic scene is when the p40s are dogfighting the zeros above the clouds, high up. Keep this topic going.

VMF114_Spyder
07-18-2004, 01:28 PM
What in the movie did you find the most inaccurate and why? I think throughout the whole movie the most realistic scene is when the p40s are dogfighting the zeros above the clouds, high up. Keep this topic going.

Chuck_Older
07-18-2004, 01:33 PM
I think the most unrealistic part was the beginning, and unfortunately I'm told it lasted throughout the entire film.

*****************************
Killers in America work seven days a week
~ Clash

MEGILE
07-18-2004, 01:44 PM
To echo what Chuck_Older said, there were three main areas which I found to be unrealistic... the beginning, middle and end http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/35.gif

j/k..

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Countdown to 1337 post count = P minus 174

Udidtoo
07-18-2004, 01:46 PM
I believe in the credits they spelled most of the peoples names correctly.

..............................
I always have just enough fuel to arrive at the scene of my crash.

Chuck_Older
07-18-2004, 01:55 PM
Touche!

*****************************
Killers in America work seven days a week
~ Clash

IIJG11_Spreckels
07-18-2004, 02:06 PM
The movie was not only unrealistic, but it was a disgraceful Hollywood sham that discredited the brave men who died there. Almost as bad as revisionist historians or maybe one and the same.

Red_Storm
07-18-2004, 02:07 PM
The part where Danny (or whatever his name was) said "Our P40's are slower than the zero, but we're much more manoeuverable!" was good for a few laughs. This was the climax of the movie for me. I keep replaying that scene. Priceless.

---
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Jirozaemon
07-18-2004, 02:16 PM
it`s a Buckheimer production, so what to expect ? nothing...

Tim Burton would have been better...

Regards

Jiro

http://www.japancollection.com/pages/reproductions/lg/239.jpg

"Feb 16 1978:

The first computer bulletin board system goes live on an S-100 motherboard and CP/M, and a Hayes 300 baud modem. Ward Christensen and Randy Seuss's Computerized Bulletin Board System still kinda runs to this day, but the Internet has taken the place that BBS's used to have.

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Sienikeitto
07-18-2004, 02:30 PM
When that spitfire crashed in to the sea and pilot survived... Not even a scratch...

VF-17_Jolly
07-18-2004, 02:49 PM
No the most unrealistic bit was when they jump that big canyon on the asteriod.........other than that totaly on the money http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://www.skyknights.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/jolly.jpg

TheJoyStick
07-18-2004, 02:54 PM
When he was barrel rolling with the chick in the cockpit..

Totally fake

Mitlov47
07-18-2004, 03:10 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VF-17_JOLLY:
No the most unrealistic bit was when they jump that big canyon on the asteriod.........other than that totaly on the money http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But at least Armegeddon had a cool cast, including Bruce Willis, Owen Wilson, Steve Buschemi, and best of all, LIV TYLER!!!

Pearl Harbor had...Ben Affleck? Let me punch myself in the groin...

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

ASM 1
07-18-2004, 03:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mitlov47:
But at least Armegeddon had a cool cast, including Bruce Willis, Owen Wilson, Steve Buschemi, and best of all, LIV TYLER!!!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Mmmmm Liv Tyler..... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/heart.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Pearl Harbor had...Ben Affleck? Let me punch myself in the groin...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Owtchie - http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/cry.gif thats gotta hurt....

S!

Andrew

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v299/asm016/WW2%20Stuff/Sig_Pic.jpg

[This message was edited by ASM 1 on Sun July 18 2004 at 02:50 PM.]

Obi_Kwiet
07-18-2004, 04:14 PM
Well, most of the movie, + the romance made me want to puke. I wanted to die and end it all. It was that bad. Realy.

CowboyTodd41
07-18-2004, 04:18 PM
I basically consider Pearl Harbor to be like the hottest girl in the remidial english class, she's incredibly good looking but so dumb you don't want to have anything to do with her.

http://mywebpage.netscape.com/Tgan92/vote.jpg

PBNA-Boosher
07-18-2004, 04:43 PM
Hated the whole of it. The Thompson SMG's that they were using were 20 years outdated, the plane types and models were wrong. (For example they were flying P-40N's!) And, yeah, "Our P-40's are more maneuverable," was one hell of a laugh. I pissed off the whole theater when I started cracking up at the idiots who made this insult of a film.

Boosher
_____________________________
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-Gandalf

Dunkelgrun
07-18-2004, 04:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PBNA-Boosher:
Hated the whole of it. The Thompson SMG's that they were using were 20 years outdated, the plane types and models were wrong. (For example they were flying P-40N's!) And, yeah, "Our P-40's are more maneuverable," was one hell of a laugh. I pissed off the whole theater when I started cracking up at the idiots who made this insult of a film.

Boosher
_____________________________
"So do all who live to see such times, but that is not for them to decide. All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you..."
-Gandalf<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


LOL Boosher, it wasn't just the tech stuff that was wrong, as if that wasn't enough, but the whole film was drivel from beginning to end.
Even if you'd never seen a plane (or even film) before, it was still crapp.
Cheers!

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Dunkelgrun aka 242Sqn_Cat

PS Crapp with two ps gets through the filter!

LEXX_Luthor
07-18-2004, 05:22 PM
I knew from the beginning the movie would be as described in this thread (I know hollywood), so I never bothered to see it, and never will.

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Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

No601_prangster
07-18-2004, 05:22 PM
I liked the RAF base that was operating from the front lawn of a stately home! Could only sit through half the movie before the inane dialog finally got to me.

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http://www.tangmerepilots-raf.co.uk/

Dolemite-
07-18-2004, 05:30 PM
Did you see the part where that one guy (not Afleck) and that girl are flying in a P-40, with the cockpit open, at like 15,000ft, with no gas masks. And I think they do a barrell or something.

Im pretty sure Pearl Harbor was supposed to be a comedy.

___________________________________________
Flying on HL as {Dolemite}
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VF-10_Snacky
07-18-2004, 05:34 PM
You guys are a little too harsh. Why not just enjoy a movie for what it is, entertainment. It wasn't meant to be a documentary.

In honor of you folks I am going to pop the DVD in right now.

http://www.x-plane.org/users/531seawolf/belushi_1941_4.jpg

LeChuck59
07-18-2004, 06:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by .Seawolf.:
You guys are a little too harsh. Why not just enjoy a movie for what it is, entertainment. It wasn't meant to be a documentary.

In honor of you folks I am going to pop the DVD in right now.

http://www.x-plane.org/users/531seawolf/belushi_1941_4.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Obvious inaccuracies and general cheese distract and dilute the experience. They're immersion killers. Pearl Harbor isn't a situation that can be responsibly turned into a comic book.

As for Tim Burton directing, I don't know where Jiro got that idea. He does what he does well enough, but he works with what is essentially a fantastical and absurd style and as such his general aesthetic isn't suited for a war movie.

TheJoyStick
07-18-2004, 07:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by .Seawolf.:
You guys are a little too harsh. Why not just enjoy a movie for what it is, entertainment. It wasn't meant to be a documentary.

In honor of you folks I am going to pop the DVD in right now.

http://www.x-plane.org/users/531seawolf/belushi_1941_4.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



Well, that's easy...

Pearl Harbor isn't entertainment.. Nothing about the actual Pearl Harbor was funny, except the japs getting their asses kicked in the end, but even that really isn't at all funny..

That's not entertainment, it's torture with popular faces on a bigass theatre screen.

Steaky_361st
07-18-2004, 07:08 PM
And was it just me or in the BoB scene where Affleck gets shot down (finally...and gladly) did the fighters escorting the He111s look more like 109F or Gs, what with the curved wing tips and nose armnament...

Steaky

Hairball_1
07-18-2004, 07:18 PM
My favorite part was how Ben Affleck took out a half dozen trained Japanese infantry with his .45 at a full sprint. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/smileys-gun2.gif

Owlsphone
07-18-2004, 07:25 PM
Favorite part about the movie was how all the U.S. needed to do in the first place was send a few mechanics into towers with shotguns. When the Zeros fly by, blast away! I mean, who needs pilots or AAA guns to shoot down planes? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif

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Vertically challenged since 1984.

SeaFireLIV
07-18-2004, 07:27 PM
Ok, I said I`d watch that movie so that I`d finally know what everyone was talking about.

Now I finally know...



Now did someone mention Liv Tyler? she was in Lord of the Rings... She must be a robot, put together in some secret lab - no woman could be THAT beautiful and be human! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/heart.gif
Wonder if she`d pose for me if I asked her..? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


SeaFireLIV...

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/Yakgirlgo.jpg
Time to Escape!

Want to see more? go here: http://seafire.dreyermachine.com/
(Fantasy sections for mature viewers only).

TheCrux
07-18-2004, 07:55 PM
Long Island sure looked a lot like southern California to me........

Worst movie ever...absolutely. Had to wait till it came out in video so I could fast-fwd it. Was still a total waste of 2 hrs or so of my life...and for that I'm smoked.

FDR getting out of his chair and standing as he angrily demanded a response...was that a cheeseball moment or what? ( I half expected a virtual John Wayne to come swinging in on a chandelier as well )

I hadda laugh at them getting the P40/Zero thing 180 degrees out too though..........

StellarRat
07-18-2004, 08:02 PM
Well, the bit where the Japanese bombed and strafed the hospital was totally inaccurate and politically incorrect. Granted they did horrible things all through the war, but they didn't target anything but military installations at Pearl Harbor.

VW-IceFire
07-18-2004, 08:11 PM
Let me first say that I liked Pearl Harbor. In terms of its filmic qualities...it was fairly well done, it had a huge budget, and it made me sad a number of times. It displayed the desperation present on the Western front with the RAF pilots, the losses they encountered, the terrible hardship, and the possible feeling of being alone in a hopeless fight. Emotionally, the movie is very charged and thats worth it in my view. Its not so totally inaccurate to ruin every single scene.

Infact, the whole Spitfire V against the 109F's (and E's too) wasn't badly done. I believe it was ILM behind the visuals so it was fairly good. Obviously the main character was probably way too good but it was exciting and very visceral to the audience. I did give a feeling of the speed at which things happen in combat such as this.

The innacuracies. Well there everywhere. The Val's seem to lack their eliptical wings, the P-40's were the wrong version, the Zero's appear to be A6M5's and not M2's and they are painted green instead of the white/eggshell that they were in when they attacked Pearl Harbor.

Obviously the comments about relative performance were way off. They should have said it the other way around and that would be a little better.

The Zero's also appear to have huge ammo drums for that fight. Still, pretty exciting.

The ship scenes were pretty good most of the time. There were some modern frigates and cruisers in some scenes...which was a bit annoying. But we'll leave that alone.

Overall...I wished they had spent a bit more time to get the real details down. It would bug our sort of crowd less. I think overall the movie was fairly well done...I own the DVD, I enjoy the movie when I watch it...but if they had gone the extra mile it would have been worth it.

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RCAF 412 Falcon Squadron - "Swift to Avenge"

TheJoyStick
07-18-2004, 08:16 PM
Can't forget Cuba Gooding Junior on that .50.. Man, he didn't even lead the target...

WTE_Galway
07-18-2004, 09:13 PM
well ...


a 1920's crop duster with electric start

BoB happening at virtually the same time as Pearl

Zero's with ARMY paint schemes flying from carriers

the whole head on collision nonsense

i all am sceptical about whether anyone that had kills over Pearl later flew on the Doolittle Raid .. as a transfer from fighters to bombers seems unlikely but i have never checked this one

heaps more but its a while since i saw it

Dolemite-
07-18-2004, 09:23 PM
Ben Affleck's character was a joke, first he goes to Britain to fend off the Germans and protect the Queen, then he arrives in Pearl Harbor just in time to shoot down all the Japs and save the island.
THEN he jumps into a B-25 and bombs Tokyo! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

___________________________________________
Flying on HL as {Dolemite}
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Burnin_777_AVG
07-18-2004, 10:25 PM
Hey fellas,

Someday we'll get a director or film studio that wil make an accurate war movie. What kills me is Hollywood has such a crazy view of things. Every war movie has to have a love story and every war movie has to have a couragious ethnic minority figure. Just make a solid, accurate and well shot war movie. The death and destruction will provide enough drama for everyone. After Saving Private Ryan I was hoping Hollywood would do more realistic types of war movies, but none have been greenlighted.

Here is my partial list of good and bad war movies that I am old enough to have seen in the theatre:

Good:
Saving Private Ryan
Band of Brothers (I know a mini-series)
We Were Soldiers
Hunt for Red October (I know fictitious)
Platoon
Glory
Gettysburg
Gods and Generals
Das Boot

Bad:
Pearl Harbor
Enemy at the Gates
U-571
Thin Red Line
Windtalkers

So many movies so little time to analyze them all. There should be a War Movie website that analyzes them all and makes recomendations.

BTW even I can act way better then Ben Affleck. He is indeed a BAD actor.

BV

Mitlov47
07-18-2004, 10:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
Now did someone mention Liv Tyler? she was in Lord of the Rings... She must be a robot, put together in some secret lab - no woman could be THAT beautiful and be human! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/heart.gif
Wonder if she`d pose for me if I asked her..? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You like Liv Tyler? Check out some 90s-era Aerosmith videos. She's the daughter of the lead singer Stephen Tyler, so she got some roles in the videos. For "Crazy," she plays a teenage rebel who takes off with her buddy Alicia Silverstone for a wild roadtrip. Which includes dancing on go-go poles.

DAYMN.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Burnin_777_AVG
07-18-2004, 10:31 PM
BTW one of the greatest stories of the real Pearl Harbor is the USS Nevada's failed attempt to fight her way out of the harbor. She got her boilers up and running in record time and was underway when she had to run aground so she would not sink in the entrance to the harbor and block it. She was heavily damaged and finally gave up, but not without a tough fight.

WTE_Galway
07-18-2004, 10:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Burnin_777_AVG:
Hey fellas,

Someday we'll get a director or film studio that wil make an accurate war movie. What kills me is Hollywood has such a crazy view of things. Every war movie has to have a love story and every war movie has to have a couragious ethnic minority figure. Just make a solid, accurate and well shot war movie. The death and destruction will provide enough drama for everyone. After Saving Private Ryan I was hoping Hollywood would do more realistic types of war movies, but none have been greenlighted.

Here is my partial list of good and bad war movies that I am old enough to have seen in the theatre:

Good:
Saving Private Ryan
Band of Brothers (I know a mini-series)
We Were Soldiers
Hunt for Red October (I know fictitious)
Platoon
Glory
Gettysburg
Gods and Generals
Das Boot

Bad:
Pearl Harbor
Enemy at the Gates
U-571
Thin Red Line
Windtalkers

So many movies so little time to analyze them all. There should be a War Movie website that analyzes them all and makes recomendations.

BTW even I can act way better then Ben Affleck. He is indeed a BAD actor.

BV<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



Its really odd, but one of the more accurate WWII movies in terms of background is "Kelly's Heros"

the movie is a comedy has an outragous plot and some deliberate anachronisms liek Donny Sutherland's sherman tank commander who is actually straight out of the 60's and 'nam HOWEVER the stuff going on in the background is one of the most realist portrayals of the war in europe i have come across

huggy87
07-18-2004, 11:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Burnin_777_AVG:
Hey fellas,

Someday we'll get a director or film studio that wil make an accurate war movie. What kills me is Hollywood has such a crazy view of things. Every war movie has to have a love story and every war movie has to have a couragious ethnic minority figure. Just make a solid, accurate and well shot war movie. The death and destruction will provide enough drama for everyone. After Saving Private Ryan I was hoping Hollywood would do more realistic types of war movies, but none have been greenlighted.

Here is my partial list of good and bad war movies that I am old enough to have seen in the theatre:

Good:
Saving Private Ryan
Band of Brothers (I know a mini-series)
We Were Soldiers
Hunt for Red October (I know fictitious)
Platoon
Glory
Gettysburg
Gods and Generals
Das Boot

Bad:
Pearl Harbor
Enemy at the Gates
U-571
Thin Red Line
Windtalkers

So many movies so little time to analyze them all. There should be a War Movie website that analyzes them all and makes recomendations.

BTW even I can act way better then Ben Affleck. He is indeed a BAD actor.

BV<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I like your list except I thought "Gods and Generals" was some of the worst drivel ever made. 9 out of 10 professional movie critics would back me on that one.

Mitlov47
07-18-2004, 11:15 PM
That's a pretty good list, but Black Hawk Down deserves to be on the good list. Not 100% perfect, but still fricking good.

Speaking of movies about Clinton-era waras, Behind Enemy Lines is possibly the worst "war film" ever. Owen Wilson should be slinging six-guns and cracking jokes alongside Jackie Chan. He should NOT be an action hero. EVER.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Burnin_777_AVG
07-18-2004, 11:20 PM
I can't believe I forgot Black Hawk Down considering I own that DVD. Yes that deserves to be on the Good List. With regards to Gods and Generals I actually didn't see it. I read enough about it and knew it was a sequel of sorts to Gettysburg so I figured it was accurate and good. Guess not. I'll make sure to rent it now. So much for my research.

BV

Mitlov47
07-18-2004, 11:26 PM
Three Kings also deserves a mention. In terms of military tactics, it's horrifically inaccurate. But in terms of depicting Iraqi society and politics immediately after the first Gulf War, it's unbeatable, thought-provoking, and heartbreaking. It was marketed as an adventure-comedy, but it's NOT.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Zayets
07-19-2004, 01:11 AM
Also I think Enemy at the gates was pretty good film. Ones who saw Stalingrad knows.

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

Mitlov47
07-19-2004, 02:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Zayets:
Also I think Enemy at the gates was pretty good film. Ones who saw Stalingrad knows.

Zayets out<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

For entertainment value, I thought it was awesome. Compelling plot, great acting, and Rachel Weiss can sleep next to me in a bunker ANYDAY. But if you compare it to the life of the real Vasili Zaitsev (included in the book Enemy at the Gates, a non-fiction text about the entire battle of Stalingrad), you'll be blown away by the "artistic license" the film took. That Soviet WWI-style charge at the beginning never happened. Tanya Chernova was a sniper, not a translator (she had 80+ kills credited to her). There was no love triange with a political commissar. That ruse with raising-the-helmet was what actually killed Koenig (there was no dramatic final confrontation). While Sasha Filipov (the kid) was indeed hung for spying, Koenig had nothing to do with it. And so on and so on. Zaitsev and Chernova don't get back together after the battle--Vasili thought she was dead (she was hit by a booby-trap while training a new sniper, not by an artillery shell while bringing civilians to the Volga), and they both married other people and lived happily ever after, never seeing each other again. Really, the ONLY historically accurate part was simple fact that there were two snipers named Vasili Zaitsev and Maj. Koenig, and the former shot the latter.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Zayets
07-19-2004, 02:29 AM
Don't know the whole story but I liked the film.I'm trying to compare it with Stalingrad, the German movie and probably here's my mistake.And to be honest , all I have retained was that there was a sniper called Zaitsev and a major Koenig. And that the former killed the latter.Seriously.Until then I didn't knew there were sniper heroes in the WW2.I knew that sniping was perfected then,but I didn't knew there are sniper heroes.maybe is for that I liked the movie.

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

Ob.Emann
07-19-2004, 02:30 AM
Well, seeing totally modern radio antennaes mounted on the B-25's was interesting, enabling HQ to pick up plane-to-plane comms 4,000 miles away, as well as the Zero's casting a 6 o'clock shadow at 8am.

Then they're was also the post-war ships everywhere, and I also thought Ben Afleck's dyslexic character barely passing an eye-test for his pilot's liscense, suddenly being able to eloquently read his girlfriend's letters in A-grade English was definately interesting. Oh yeah, did I mention the whole Zero/P40 comparison?

Der Oberst von schlechten Piloten

DaBallz
07-19-2004, 02:38 AM
Realistic war movies would bore you to death.
99% of any combat action is the drudgery of
every day millitary life.

Pearl Harbor, the movie, was very poor on all counts
except for some decent acting.

If you want a high intensity film with a fair
sense of realism, try "12 oclock High" with
Gregory Peck.
Good film, great acting, reasonable historical
accuracy. The film is more or less paraphrasing
the US 8th air war from Britian and is NOT
attempting to tell the story of any particular
men or unit, it does a good job entertaining
without butchering history.

Da...

Arms1
07-19-2004, 03:00 AM
Zayets said
"Also I think Enemy at the gates was pretty good film. Ones who saw Stalingrad knows."

read the book "War of the Rat's" by David L Robbins, that was what the story was originally titled before Hollywood decided that the American audience would never go to see a movie with that title and renamed it; thus enabling another group of moviegoers to enjoy the watered down version of a great book hollywood style, only saw a few bits and pieces of the film and am curious to know if they also inserted some kind of american superhero into the mix just to keep the audience interested

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v258/idcflashman/flashsig2.jpg

Menthol_moose
07-19-2004, 03:06 AM
where he tells the chick the reason he cant see the eye chart properly is that he cant read or something like that, and that pilots dont need that sort of skill.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

totally puke worthy.

Arms1
07-19-2004, 03:08 AM
can't believe nobody had "The Train" 1964, with Burt Lancaster in thier list of favorites, for its time it has to be one of the best ever, not a true story but very plausible, and i'm sure everyone will agree that Lancaster is ten times the actor that affleck is and ever will be oh and btw in "Enemy at the Gates" did the german soldiers make soup out of thier dobermans like they did in the book?, that whole part was not only horrifying but also showed the grim reality of the life or death struggle that many faced in that battle

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v258/idcflashman/flashsig2.jpg

[This message was edited by Arms1 on Mon July 19 2004 at 02:20 AM.]

Nanuk66
07-19-2004, 03:10 AM
Personally the Pearl Harbor movie was generally **** and the only thing that can help it hold its head above water was the effects.

The part i personally hate the most about the movie and sticks out in my head and it maybe cause im english but when the CO of the squadron turns to affleck after a sortie of something and says something along the lines of 'If only we had more amercians like you over here'. It made me wanna kick someone in the nuts.It maybe is trying to show how we were up against it at that time and could do with any pilots that we could get our hands on, but i saw it as a little American flag waving exercise.If the youngsters dont think that america won the battle of britain after that movie then they sure will after Tom cruises next movie!! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

As for enemy of the gate, i personally thought it was a good movie. Having studied the ground war on the eastern front for some time now and obviously this encompasses Stalingrad id have to say that what i liked the most about the movie was the sets. The tractor factory and railyard were perfectly done and the whole 'feel' of the movie in that sense was applaudable. The story was so-so as someone else already pointed out.

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

NegativeGee
07-19-2004, 03:14 AM
Well, like all films those about war need drama and artistic license to work. Some use it more than others, some have so much there is not much else left *cough* Pearl Harbour *cough*.

I always liked Cross of Iron. Nasty, gritty movie that one. Just like the subject matter.

Oh, and Burnin, why did Thin Red Line make your bad list?

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Günther Rall

http://www.invoman.com/images/tali_with_hands.jpg

Look Noobie, we already told you, we don't have the Patch!

Zayets
07-19-2004, 03:17 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Arms1:
Zayets said
"Also I think Enemy at the gates was pretty good film. Ones who saw Stalingrad knows."

read the book "War of the Rat's" by David L Robbins, that was what the story was originally titled before Hollywood decided that the American audience would never go to see a movie with that title and renamed it; thus enabling another group of moviegoers to enjoy the watered down version of a great book hollywood style, only saw a few bits and pieces of the film and am curious to know if they also inserted some kind of american superhero into the mix just to keep the audience interested

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v258/idcflashman/flashsig2.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well,not quite,but he's a superhero in the movie because he knows everything http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif. He has eagle eyes,can anticipate (although this can be true in the real life).But,yes,general Holywood thema is respected since there's a love story,good beats bad and so on.But I still liked the film.
I have seen it on a bulk with Hart's war , or whatever the name was.

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

Mitlov47
07-19-2004, 03:30 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Arms1:
Zayets said
"Also I think Enemy at the gates was pretty good film. Ones who saw Stalingrad knows."

read the book "War of the Rat's" by David L Robbins, that was what the story was originally titled before Hollywood decided that the American audience would never go to see a movie with that title and renamed it; thus enabling another group of moviegoers to enjoy the watered down version of a great book hollywood style, only saw a few bits and pieces of the film and am curious to know if they also inserted some kind of american superhero into the mix just to keep the audience interested
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, there are no American characters in either the book or the movie Enemy at the Gates.

About The War of the Rats's relation to the movie, which the above poster mentioned. Here is the BOOK Enemy at the Gates, which is a fantastic read:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0345258851/002-6283527-0368039?v=glance

The sniper-on-sniper battle in the movie only occupies 6 pages of the 455 page book (I had read the book before I saw the movie; this really confused me when I saw the movie). Many now realize that the movie Enemy at the Gates was based off of War of the Rats (like the above poster said) not the book Enemy at the Gates. I have NO idea why they used such a title for the movie then.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Arms1
07-19-2004, 03:42 AM
cross of iron was very good, kept waiting for jc to say "schlitz lite" but he never did http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, never saw Thin Red Line because of the fact that the real "Thin Red Line" was Sir Colin Campbells boy's who stopped the Russian cavalry at the battle of Balaclava and the fact that they stole the name kinda teed me off, i'll check it out but if it's like any recent hollywood film other than the speiberg ones it will probably be another few hours that i will never get back

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v258/idcflashman/flashsig2.jpg

trail_of_dead
07-19-2004, 03:46 AM
I think they used the term 'enemy at the gates' as it sums up the situation at stalingrad. also right at the beginning of the battle, I also think it was shown as a flier on the ground at the start of the movie, then it pans from the flier to the barges or summat, there was a communique from stalin which had the term 'the enemy is at the gates and must be repelled, not one step across the volga should be taken' (that is probably terrible butcherd and remembered on my account)



has anyone seen the chapters on the blokes website that were omitted from war of the rats?

http://www.azupload.com/displayImage.php?setid=108.png

Sturm_Williger
07-19-2004, 04:54 AM
Hey, the Great Wave ! Love the sig, Jiro !

Personally, I thought Thin Red Line was pretty good. Can't say from realism though, but I thought the way the dreamlike non-combat scenes were juztaposed with the horrible combat was well done - especially as combat is always described as 90% boredom 10% terror.

ElektroFredrik
07-19-2004, 05:07 AM
I recently got Tora tora tora and Dark blue world
on DVD and liked both. Tora tora tora is like
Pearl Harbor without the yucky love story and
(I assume) a lot more historically accurate plot.
Dark blue world is like Pearl Harbor moved to
BoB with a (non-yucky) love story and Czech pilots.
And (I assume again) rather historically accurate.

War of the worlds and Fritz the cat are also
very good movies. Very accurate http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.scarysquirrel.org/ksk/tuftycard3.jpg
"What I study is sex and squirrels" - Jane Waterman, Ph.D.
Flying online as Furvert_Elektro

Salfordian
07-19-2004, 06:38 AM
My best bit is Alec Baldwin as Col Doolittle(hope I got the rank correct). BTW this film is older than I thought, didn't the Canadians bomb the Baldwins in '99 http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif (South Park the movie)

Indianer.
07-19-2004, 06:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by .Seawolf.:
You guys are a little too harsh. Why not just enjoy a movie for what it is, entertainment. It wasn't meant to be a documentary.

In honor of you folks I am going to pop the DVD in right now.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


You bought the film?!?....lmfao.

http://www.fighter-collection.com/film/img/dark_blue_world.jpg

"Wer auf die preussische Fahne schwort, hat nichts mehr, was ihm selber gehort"

Burnin_777_AVG
07-19-2004, 09:30 AM
Thin Red Line is on my bad list because the damn movie has no plot really and all the ridiculous voice overs that distract from whatever plot it has. I know it was based on a book, but I learned absolutely nothing about the Battle of Guadalcanal other then it took place in a jungle. I haven't seen it in a while so I'm not going to go into detail, but I did not enjoy it at all. It had a whole meta-physical hippie feel about it that I thought was out of step with WWII.

BV

JG53Frankyboy
07-19-2004, 09:50 AM
anyone knows "Die Brücke" ?

a german b/w film , some german 16/17 year old boys have to defend a bridge against US forces !
dodnt know if its available international - also impressive !

hughlb2
07-19-2004, 10:07 AM
WOW! we've hit page four already, this thread is kicking the Saving Private Ryan thread. Man, I would hate to be somebody that believed in this film, let alone somebody that worked on it. But I guess it made its money.

Inadaze
07-19-2004, 10:10 AM
The Cruel Sea, 1956 BW, based on the book of the same name by Nicholas Monserrat.

I think it's brilliant film, especially for its time. It follows the Corvette Compass Rose through the war in the Atlantic Ocean. The scene where the Captain has to choose whether to depth charge a suspected U-boat even though there are English sailors in the water still gets me each time I see it. A very powerful movie.

S! Inadaze

http://www.apws62.dsl.pipex.com/inadazesig.gif
Crests courtesy of RAF Marham - http://www.rafmarham.co.uk

leadbaloon
07-19-2004, 10:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Red_Storm:
The part where Danny (or whatever his name was) said "Our P40's are slower than the zero, but we're much more manoeuverable!" was good for a few laughs. This was the climax of the movie for me. I keep replaying that scene. Priceless.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's my favourite scene too, and don't forget "Stay as low as you can..." http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

horseback
07-19-2004, 10:59 AM
Most disgraceful inaccuracy in Pearl Harbor was Alec Baldwin playing Jimmy Doolittle-I can imagine the late General spinning in his grave at the news-what a step down from Spencer Tracy!

cheers

horseback

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

WWSensei
07-19-2004, 11:11 AM
Picking the inaccuracies in Pearl Harbor is too easy. Find the accurate parts. I'll go first:

1) Dude 1 goes off to war. Dude 2 steals his girl.

horseback
07-19-2004, 11:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Burnin_777_AVG:
I can't believe I forgot Black Hawk Down considering I own that DVD. Yes that deserves to be on the Good List. With regards to Gods and Generals I actually didn't see it. I read enough about it and knew it was a sequel of sorts to Gettysburg so I figured it was accurate and good. Guess not. I'll make sure to rent it now. So much for my research.

BV<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I saw the movie (own the DVD, in fact), and it is a realistic and historically accurate portrayal of Stonewall Jackson's wartime career. The problem many modern persons have with it is with the uncritical portrayal of Jackson's sincerely held religious beliefs (plus the lead actor's varying Southern accent-American Southern accents are almost as specific as British accents;few actors are able to 'do' them, and they couldn't get Meryl Streep for the part-she insisted that the beard itched too much) and the sentimentality.

Since they have little or no appreciation for the influence or power of religion in human affairs and history prior to the explosion of cynicism post WWI, they have a hard time accepting it as a virtue in a 'bad guy', or the concept that Southerners at the time actually thought of the Union as an alliance of sovereign states, that their States were their native countries, and that that was as much of a root cause of the Civil War as slavery.

Way OT, but I liked Gods and Generals, and I've studied some history outside the narrow subject of WWII aviation.

cheers

horseback

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

Waldo.Pepper
07-19-2004, 11:39 AM
JG53Frankyboy

mentioned .... anyone knows "Die Brücke" ?

Seen it translated as The Bridge. - it is excellent. You should all see it.

Inadaze - mentioned .. The Cruel Sea.

It too is excellent and you should all see it, and then watch Das Boot afterward.

Capt._Tenneal
07-19-2004, 12:08 PM
I've read where The Bridge is the precursor to (if not a direct influence on) the final scenes of Saving Private Ryan. Other excellent flicks I've heard mentioned are the German Stalingrad and Winter War (?) from Finland.

And speaking of "war" movies, they are more fiction than fact, but what about good Cold War movies ? The Bedford Incident, Fail Safe, etc. any others ?

oh, and as for PH my contribution to the silly moments are the Vals and Kates that zip through the air at F-18 speeds during the attack. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

NegativeGee
07-19-2004, 12:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Burnin_777_AVG:
Thin Red Line is on my bad list because the damn movie has no plot really and all the ridiculous voice overs that distract from whatever plot it has. I know it was based on a book, but I learned absolutely nothing about the Battle of Guadalcanal other then it took place in a jungle. I haven't seen it in a while so I'm not going to go into detail, but I did not enjoy it at all. It had a whole meta-physical hippie feel about it that I thought was out of step with WWII.

BV<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah, fair enough. I was just interested as TTRL seems to be a bit of a love/hate movie depending who you ask.

I agree it does not have a plot like, say, Saving Private Ryan does. But I did like how the film portrayed the experience of war through the eyes of several characters over a fairly long period of time (all though all those cameos were not needed lol!).

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Günther Rall

http://www.invoman.com/images/tali_with_hands.jpg

Look Noobie, we already told you, we don't have the Patch!

ASM 1
07-19-2004, 12:24 PM
Gratuitous picture post, for those who werre on about Ms Tyler....http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://digilander.libero.it/virtualcyrano/tyler/lvt7.jpg

much better viewing than PH.... sorry but.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif

S!

Andrew

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v299/asm016/WW2%20Stuff/Sig_Pic.jpg

boxmike
07-19-2004, 12:26 PM
WWSensei http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif Gotta wipe that beer outta floor damn....

In a movie sense, best part is Affleck and gal saying goodbyes in front of hotel. Why? There it is at it's best, a 1940's war movie remake. After seeing that you can expect only unlimited heroism everywhere regardless of reality.
Only thing the movie does not show in this genre is that apart from planes, I found none smoking. Cigarettes, that is. Remember those old movies, hero is lighting up girls *-model cigarette and telling that he is bound to most dangerous mission http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

It's a threehour music video. What goes wrong here is that only small fraction has read about stuff there, rest are forming their history lesson according the movie http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif
I do not blame movies, I do not blame evening news. I think we ourselves must be able to see what goes wrong there.

- boxmike -

Da_Godfatha
07-19-2004, 12:34 PM
Man, you guys forgot my favorite film, 'Apocalypse Now (Redux)'.

Lets face it, Pearl Harbor(the film) was just food for the masses. If they ever did a factual account of the attack (Tora, Tora, Tora is the best) or any other battle, it would be boring and would not make any money.

As for the P-40's, there are not that many air worthy P-40E's and NO P-40B's around. The Zero's paint scheme was all wrong tho. The best scene was when the USS Arizona blew up. A master of FX's.

Does any one know were I can get Dark Blue World her in Germany, I have not seen it in the stores??

Thnx, DaGodfatha

Dunkelgrun
07-19-2004, 12:49 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ElektroFredrik:

War of the worlds and Fritz the cat are also
very good movies. Very accurate http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.scarysquirrel.org/ksk/tuftycard3.jpg
"What I study is sex and squirrels" - Jane Waterman, Ph.D.
Flying online as Furvert_Elektro<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Damn, Fredrik, first Tufty and now Fritz the Cat! I haven't heard of that film for aeons. Of course, now we both know how old we are. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

http://premium.uploadit.org/igmusapa/fritz.jpg

Cheers!

http://www.uploadit.org/igmusapa/tft2.jpg
www.nightbomber.com (http://www.nightbomber.com)

Dunkelgrun aka 242Sqn_Cat

Mitlov47
07-19-2004, 12:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Da_Godfatha:
Man, you guys forgot my favorite film, 'Apocalypse Now (Redux)'.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The funny thing about that film. I've met plenty of Vietnam Vets, and NONE of them have ever mentioned smoking pot and having sex with French plantation owners. None of them ever mentioned coming across an Aztec-esque temple complete with animal sacrifices and loincloth-clad, spear-throwing natives either. The movie may or may not be an insight into the human soul (I didn't get anything out of it personally), but it is NOT acutally a movie about the Vietnam War. At all.

Now Full Metal Jacket, THAT was a good Vietnam film.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Black Sheep
07-19-2004, 01:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Da_Godfatha:

If they ever did a factual account of the attack (Tora, Tora, Tora is the best) or any other battle, it would be boring and would not make any money.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm not so sure of this myself... having read the book and the apendicies that go through how the book was researched, I've always understood Black Hawk Down to be as realistic a portayal of what happened in a specific battle as is possible, and that did well at the box office. One of my favorite films, parts of it bring tears to my eyes.

One of my all time favorite war films is Ice Cold In Alex - I kinda like some of those cheesie old black and whites http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/ilsigs/Nachtjaeger.jpg

PapaSmurf630
07-19-2004, 01:01 PM
Memphis Belle was a good film I thought. Been a while since I last saw it though...what do you guys think of it?

Inadaze
07-19-2004, 01:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
The funny thing about that film. I've met plenty of Vietnam Vets, and NONE of them have ever mentioned smoking pot and having sex with French plantation owners. None of them ever mentioned coming across an Aztec-esque temple complete with animal sacrifices and loincloth-clad, spear-throwing natives either. The movie may or may not be an insight into the human soul (I didn't get anything out of it personally), but it is NOT acutally a movie about the Vietnam War. At all.

Now _Full Metal Jacket_, THAT was a good Vietnam film.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've met a vet who was at Hamburger Hill, he stayed with a friend of mine for a few days. I didn't ask him about Vietnam, it didn't seem an appropriate subject.

But he smoked ALOT of pot http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif He was a kewl guy, quiet, very hippy, intelligent and polite.

I agree with Full Metal Jacket, I saw it when it first came out and can still watch it if I'm bored. The Drill Sergeant is classic!

S! Inadaze

ElektroFredrik
07-19-2004, 01:37 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dunkelgrun:

Damn, Fredrik, first Tufty and now Fritz the Cat! I haven't heard of that film for aeons. Of course, now we both know how old we are. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have no idea how old you are but I'm 20
(that's physical age, mental age is more along 4-5)
Watership down is also a very good movie,
though a lot of details present in the book are
gone in the film http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif
Live long and prosper http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.scarysquirrel.org/ksk/tuftycard3.jpg
"What I study is sex and squirrels" - Jane Waterman, Ph.D.
Flying online as Furvert_Elektro

Mitlov47
07-19-2004, 02:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Inadaze:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
The funny thing about that film. I've met plenty of Vietnam Vets, and NONE of them have ever mentioned smoking pot and having sex with French plantation owners. None of them ever mentioned coming across an Aztec-esque temple complete with animal sacrifices and loincloth-clad, spear-throwing natives either. The movie may or may not be an insight into the human soul (I didn't get anything out of it personally), but it is NOT acutally a movie about the Vietnam War. At all.

Now _Full Metal Jacket_, THAT was a good Vietnam film.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've met a vet who was at Hamburger Hill, he stayed with a friend of mine for a few days. I didn't ask him about Vietnam, it didn't seem an appropriate subject.

But he smoked ALOT of pot http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif He was a kewl guy, quiet, very hippy, intelligent and polite.

I agree with Full Metal Jacket, I saw it when it first came out and can still watch it if I'm bored. The Drill Sergeant is classic!

S! Inadaze<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I mis-typed. Plenty of troops in Vietnam smoked pot. But in the movie the main character smokes high-grade opium with a 30-something Frenchwoman. On a plantation. THAT'S what I meant to type, and that's what I think didn't happen. I don't know why I wrote "pot," that wasn't what I meant.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Afreaka
07-19-2004, 02:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
I knew from the beginning the movie would be as described in this thread (I know hollywood), so I never bothered to see it, and never will.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Agree. As with so much hollywood just watch the trailer. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/10.gif

Rex Kramer(Airplane, 1980): Do you know what it's like to fall in the mud and get kicked... in the head... with an iron boot? Of course you don't, no one does. It never happens. It's a dumb question... skip it.

huggy87
07-19-2004, 03:30 PM
@Burnin regarding Gods and Generals,

I could see it being a good book. Here is what the critics had to say about it.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/gods_and_generals/

[This message was edited by huggy87 on Mon July 19 2004 at 02:43 PM.]

huggy87
07-19-2004, 03:37 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:

The part i personally hate the most about the movie and sticks out in my head and it maybe cause im english but when the CO of the squadron turns to affleck after a sortie of something and says something along the lines of 'If only we had more amercians like you over here'. It made me wanna kick someone in the nuts.It maybe is trying to show how we were up against it at that time and could do with any pilots that we could get our hands on, but i saw it as a little American flag waving exercise. -<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm american and I have to agree with you completely on that one. I actually saw the movie in a portsmouth, england movie theater while my ship was docked there. I sank a little further in my seat when that drivel was uttered.

huggy87
07-19-2004, 03:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Burnin_777_AVG:
Thin Red Line is on my bad list because the damn movie has no plot really and all the ridiculous voice overs that distract from whatever plot it has. I know it was based on a book, but I learned absolutely nothing about the Battle of Guadalcanal other then it took place in a jungle. I haven't seen it in a while so I'm not going to go into detail, but I did not enjoy it at all. It had a whole meta-physical hippie feel about it that I thought was out of step with WWII.

BV<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I agree completely. And it is really too bad because the movie did have some good action scenes and an excellent cast. It really wasted its potential. But then, most of you, like me, wanted a gritty WW2 movie, not some touchy feely cr@p.

I think of it as a movie an english professor would like more than a history professor.

Baron_Kiptofen
07-19-2004, 03:53 PM
[/quote]The movie may or may not be an insight into the human soul (I didn't get anything out of it personally), but it is NOT acutally a movie about the Vietnam War. At all.[/quote]

No it isn't: Because it's based (loosely) on Joseph Conrad's novel, Heart Of Darkness, which is set in the Congo during the British Colonial period. There are genuine connections with Vietnam in the film (which has been described as the first Rock and Roll war, and AN makes many references to that genre, as well as heavy use of music in general, for instance), but it's real soul is in using the Vietnam backdrop to illustrate wider issues about war and mankind's nature;

Kurtz: We train young men to drop fire on people. But their commanders won't allow them to write "****" on their airplanes because it's obscene...

marmossel
07-19-2004, 04:42 PM
Das Boot was an awesome movie.

Other ww2 movies you didn't said anything about: Kelly Heroes and Guns of Navarrone

DaBallz
07-19-2004, 05:42 PM
Full Metal Jacket?

R Lee Ermy gets an academy award nomination
for playing himself.....

Excellent basic training scenes for the most part.
I got very vivid flashbacks from the basic training
scenes.
The effort to re-create Saigon was good
but not perfect.
very unrealistic combat scenes.

But not a bad film.

Da...

Burnin_777_AVG
07-19-2004, 06:53 PM
I also forgot Full Metal Jacket. My memory is slipping. FMJ goes on the good list for the basic training half in and of itself. And R. Lee got a Golden Globe nomination not an Oscar nom. And it was the city of Hue not Saigon that was the setting.

BV

[This message was edited by Burnin_777_AVG on Mon July 19 2004 at 06:01 PM.]

Burnin_777_AVG
07-19-2004, 07:00 PM
I also forgot Memphis Belle. I put that one on the Good list. I have seen it several times and does a decent job of explaining what it was like in the Air War. I just wish they had the CGI effects they have now when it was made. Could be so so so much more visibly better. There are some model shots that make me cringe.

BV

WTE_Galway
07-19-2004, 07:23 PM
full metal jacket is probably the closest movie to a realistic version of 'nam from the soldiers prespective

my personal aviation favorite is DBW of course

otherwise Bridge to Far rates highly

Zayets
07-20-2004, 12:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ASM 1:
Gratuitous picture post, for those who werre on about Ms Tyler....http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://digilander.libero.it/virtualcyrano/tyler/lvt7.jpg

much better viewing than PH.... sorry but.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif

S!

Andrew

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v299/asm016/WW2%20Stuff/Sig_Pic.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

She does look better in Lord of the rings.She's really beautiful.I still preffer Anastacia http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

Mitlov47
07-20-2004, 12:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Zayets:
She does look better in Lord of the rings.She's really beautiful.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah, though she was hot in Armageddon as well. She can just REALLY pull off that "sweet girl next door" thing (man, I sure wish MY next-door neighbors were like her).

As for Lord of the Rings, Eowyn is hotter than Arwen any day. Sorry, but it's true. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

Mitlov47
07-20-2004, 12:25 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WTE_Galway:
full metal jacket is probably the closest movie to a realistic version of 'nam from the soldiers prespective
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

My high school history teacher was an Army Ranger who saw combat in Vietnam. he never talked about the war, but his wife (who was a scandalous, overly-talkative lush...and also a history teacher) mentioned that FMJ is the only Vietnam War movie he thought was worthwhile.

They're also the only two people I know who sat through Stanley Kubrick's Barry Lyndon in the theaters. That's ALSO a good war movie, in the Prussian sense http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/387_1090057401_zero2.jpg

PikeBishop
07-20-2004, 02:13 AM
I would just lik to throw in one of my favourite quotes which was actually said. It was a bridge to far when the Germans came to ask for the English to surrender.
The reply was along the lines of: "I'm sorry, we'd really love to take you all prisoners but we really hav'nt got the facilities.....................Will there be anything else???"
Oh one thing good about Pearl Harbour.........Kate Beckinsale!

regards,
SLP

Salfordian
07-20-2004, 02:20 AM
Black Hawk Down is one of my favourite films, its even better after reading In The Company Of Heroes by Mike Durant. Makes you think about him alot when he is shot down and what he went through after, and the bravery of the two delta snipers.

Monson74
07-20-2004, 02:26 AM
Afleck gets a dead pilots plane in England - there's a hole in the canopy about the size of a football - how on earth did the pilot make it back to base when he had taken a 20mm in his guts?

S!

Monson


"The Zerst¶rers will form an offensive circle." - G¶ring

wayno7777
07-20-2004, 03:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

I always liked Cross of Iron. Nasty, gritty movie that one. Just like the subject matter.



Look Noobie, we already told you, we don't have the Patch!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Finally someone else who saw the movie, Cross of Iron. Still see the flying torso. That and Kelley's Heros were great. Thin Red Line was strange. FMJ is great, And for some reason I liked The Deer Hunter.

http://img74.photobucket.com/albums/v224/wayno77/FB%20shots/Aircraft/heinkel_219.jpg
Any landing you can walk away from is a good one!

Atzebrueck
07-20-2004, 03:45 AM
Has Platoon been mentioned, yet ?

my skins:
http://c.f.hahne.bei.t-online.de/skin.jpeg (http://www.vow-hq.com)

Rab03
07-20-2004, 04:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Its really odd, but one of the more accurate WWII movies in terms of background is "Kelly's Heros"

the movie is a comedy has an outragous plot and some deliberate anachronisms liek Donny Sutherland's sherman tank commander who is actually straight out of the 60's and 'nam HOWEVER the stuff going on in the background is one of the most realist portrayals of the war in europe i have come across<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agreed 100%, Kelly's heroes is one great movie. When it comes to grim war reality, Cross of Iron is No1.

Liked Enemy at the gates, despite knowing it's highly inaccurate.

As of Pearl Harbor, liked the planes and nothing else.

Beware, had been anounced that Hollywood moviemakers intend to make a movie about Battle of Britain (working title The Few), in which Tom Cruise would be Bill Fiske. In short, expect that Tom would be reorginizing the RAF and leading them to victory over Germans.

At least once moviemakers showed care, Bruce Willis didnt't star in Titanic. The reason: He would have saved them all http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

Nanuk66
07-20-2004, 05:49 AM
Apart from all the very good movies already written in this thread, and that we are talking war movies and not just WW2 war movies, id have to say i enjoyed 'All quiet on the Western front' both the B/W and the colour.

My favourite all time war movie has to be 'Zulu', ive loved that since i was a kid.

And another war movie that really interested me and i have on DvD is 'Europa Europa'. A non-english speaking movie following the life of a young Jewish boy split from his family over the course of the War. The luck that he had to survive the war is simply remarkable. I recommend it.

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

IIJG11_Spreckels
07-20-2004, 06:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Burnin_777_AVG:
I also forgot Memphis Belle. I put that one on the Good list. I have seen it several times and does a decent job of explaining what it was like in the Air War. I just wish they had the CGI effects they have now when it was made. Could be so so so much more visibly better. There are some model shots that make me cringe.

BV<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Memphis Belle is on par with Pearl Harbor, but w/ somewhat better acting. Books like "A Mighty Fortress - Lead Bomber Over Europe" by Charles Alling (DFC, AM) give you a more realistic picture of B-17 crews.

Desriptive Review of the book:

A Mighty Fortress is the personal account of the Captain and crew of a lead bomber in the enormous formation raids made by the 8th Airforce during the last few months of the Second World War.
It is an extraordinary tale of heroism and bravery on the part of the entire crew of just one B-17 amongst hundreds - but the one B-17 that meant the most to them.

Flying a total of 27 missions before the war came to an end in May 1945, Alling tells, with great restraint, the story of what it was like to be there, over the skies of enemy territory, constantly on the look out for German fighters; of the enormity of some of the raids they were part of and the consequences for those on the ground; of the planes around them that fell out of the sky under enemy attack, the horror and the determination to succeed. The book gives a unique insight into the lives of one crew of one plane as the war neared its end.

IIJG11_Spreckels
07-20-2004, 06:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Atzebrueck:
Has Platoon been mentioned, yet ?

my skins:
http://www.vow-hq.com&lt;HR&gt;&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt; (http://www.vow-hq.com<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>)

Speaking as a US Marine veteran of VN, "Platoon" was a farce in many regards. Pure Hollywood and I am sure that it misled and misinformed a lot of people

DONB3397
07-20-2004, 07:00 AM
Based on this thread, it doesn't look like "Pearl Harbor" was put together for ppl who know or care even a little about the event or WW II.

Who was the target audience?

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v243/DONB3397/SpitSig01b.jpg
"And now I see with eye serene/The very pulse of the machine;
A being breathing thoughtful breath,/A Traveller between life and death." -- Wordsworth

Kaesebrot.
07-20-2004, 07:14 AM
Bruckheimer Movies are quite fun when it comes to fictional easy action entertainment (The Rock, Bad Boys ect.). But he shouldnt have dealt with historical events that require some sense and knowledge of those. Worst Part is that they even statet the movie was historically correct and would honor those who fought.... yeah right! Even worse many people believe in that.

Asking about the most unrealistic scenes... its been a while since i had the "honor" to watch it... well, Afflek in his spit (or was it a hurri?) rolling wild (rollrate of F16 or something..) into a german bomber formation.

123-Wulf-JG123
07-20-2004, 08:00 AM
Can't believe no-one has mentioned Battle of Britain....its truly one of the best films on WWII airwar yet made (1969). Very few **** bits apart from the soppy love thing near the start with Chris Plummer and Sussannah York (in stockings}
It has superb aerial battle scenes (for the time) .
Just been released by MGM on DVD http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Da_Godfatha
07-20-2004, 09:18 AM
Yea, Aflecks acting was crappy in the movie. Why did he always say 'Hammer down' when he shot at the enemy??

To Mitlov47, you may be right about that. I joined the Army in 1976, and we had alot of Vietnam vets, and almost all told me pot smoking was normal after awhile. About the French plantaion owners, it might have happened. Who knows?

It still rates as my favorite movienext to Starship Troopers!!

DaGodfatha

VMF114_Spyder
07-20-2004, 10:23 AM
WOW, what have i done?!?!? Anyways, how did liv tyler get into this thread? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
I enjoyed reading all the posts. Keep it going!

VMF114_Spyder
07-20-2004, 10:24 AM
For PH, The real reason i watched it is because it came out in the special fx generation and I wanted to see what they can do, relating to WW2 air combat.

Hamush_Cro
07-20-2004, 11:35 AM
any of you people saw the film called The Beast?
i think that was the name of it. a russian soldier gets captured by afghanis and instead of killing him they treat him as guest due to the islam rules of mercy or something.

he ends up hanging out with them and later defects back... any1 seen this one?

IMHO Pearl H. was nice in some parts and i loved the cuba gooding scene... it was done in tora tora tora as well. but the inaccuracies have been displayed in the pages before me..its complete butchery in some parts...

speaking of vasilli zaytsev, i just saw the history channel doc. on the snipers... it told the story of konig and zaytsev... if u havent seen it i suggest dc++ docum hub... its out there...

Breeze147
07-20-2004, 11:46 AM
Just think, someday someone will make a totally ******* movie about 9/11. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/51.gif

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/air_power/ap16.jpg

VMF114_Spyder
07-20-2004, 12:23 PM
i watched the BEAST and i enjoyed it.

Bandit.426Cdn
07-20-2004, 05:46 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 123-Wulf-JG123:
Can't believe no-one has mentioned Battle of Britain....its truly one of the best films on WWII airwar yet made (1969). Very few **** bits apart from the soppy love thing near the start with Chris Plummer and Sussannah York (in stockings}
It has superb aerial battle scenes (for the time) .
Just been released by MGM on DVD http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was just about to mention that film, can't believe people haven't mentioned it til page 6. I remember my father smuggling us children in to the drive-in theatre under a blanket to see it when it came out those many years ago.

Excellent footage of many ex-Spanish Air Force licence-built HE111's and 109's of the time, a crying shame that they were all scrapped upon conclusion of the filming.

WTE_Galway
07-20-2004, 06:46 PM
ugly things the hispano 109's


Interestingly DB engines in hurricanes and Spitfires improved the performance but the merlin/109 hybrid was a monster

_VR_ScorpionWorm
07-20-2004, 07:22 PM
Memphis Belle, good movie overall but annoyed my as to why they had to change the whole thing. They depicted the crew as being the ones from the start till the end of the 25 mission requirement when it was not. And thier last mission to Bremen, inaccurate, they went to the subpens in Lorient, France and was a milk run. I have read "The Man who Flew the Memphis Belle: memoir of a WWII bomber pilot" by Col. Robert Morgan and Ron Powers. I guess they just wanted to add drama to the movie, I have read the makers didnt want it to look like a documentary.

Liv Tyler.....did any of you guys watch Late Night with Conan O'Brian? She mentioned she didnt wear any thing under those silk clothes while filming.

http://img55.photobucket.com/albums/v169/Scorpion08/Hurri-1.jpg

www.vultures-row.com (http://www.vultures-row.com)

GateKreeper
07-21-2004, 01:24 AM
Though the movie from a "historical standpoint" did quite suck, I enjoyed it for the computer generated aerial combat scenes. (Although the part where the two US pilots played chicken and destroyed 4 or 5 Zeros nearly ruined that for me)

Besides, KATE BEKINSALE made the movie worth the money I'd paid to see it. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Although, she looks a MUCH hotter in "Underworld" and "Van Helsing".

****Pops underworld into the DVD player and drools over Kate Beckinsale in skin-tight black vinyl bodysuit********

http://home.earthlink.net/~jj721/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/P40_Sig.jpg
Mitsubishi Zero...the other white meat.

....just my $0.02....give or take a quarter.

Hardware Specs:
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ASUS-ATI 9800XT 256MB
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Razor Boomslang 2000 mouse
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(I Love my toys http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif)

Feathered_IV
07-21-2004, 05:41 AM
Cor. So many posts.
can't read em all. I may be doubling up but here are a few of my impressions:

* Kate Beckinsale didn't read the back of the Dental White pack correctly. Its only supposed to be applied once per day. Not in between each take. I guess the Japanese pilots must have had tinted goggles, there is no way you could strafe her otherwise.

* That champagne cork that scored whatshisname on the beak didn't allow for enough deflection.

* All that money and they couldn't respray the Zeroes.

* P40 pilots bombing Tokyo.

And the biggest cheese of all:

The other whatshisname doing the "Taking a bullet for your Buddy while simulating a Christ on the cross dying for our sins" motif at the end.

I could have done better with a couple of Airfix kits and some sock puppets.