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View Full Version : Does cockpit-only view only get rid of WW?



Holycannoli
07-25-2004, 11:03 AM
Does it still allow external views? I've been hesitant to join servers with cockpit only because I thought you had no external views at all (and I like F2 and F3). But if it only gets rid of WW then it's definitely worth playing them!

I'm noticing a lot of people don't like cockpit only, and since I'm thinking it doesn't allow external views I can see why. But I'm not sure?

(sorry, I'm still a newbie to this sim! I'll learn)

Holycannoli
07-25-2004, 11:03 AM
Does it still allow external views? I've been hesitant to join servers with cockpit only because I thought you had no external views at all (and I like F2 and F3). But if it only gets rid of WW then it's definitely worth playing them!

I'm noticing a lot of people don't like cockpit only, and since I'm thinking it doesn't allow external views I can see why. But I'm not sure?

(sorry, I'm still a newbie to this sim! I'll learn)

steiner562
07-25-2004, 11:04 AM
Depends on the server settings most have a locked cockpit with those views disabled.

http://www.bf109.com/gallery/grayeagle/gallgray01sm.jpg

georgeo76
07-25-2004, 11:21 AM
External views and no-cockpit views are two separate realism settings.

Sweetiecakes
07-25-2004, 12:02 PM
You can set the difficulty level to lock the cockpit, but still allow for external views. The difficulty combos are interesting.

No limpeys please

BennyMoore
07-25-2004, 12:04 PM
Yes, and that's how I fly. I have no cockpit mode disabled (I call it noob cockpit mode) but externals enabled. My argument, which I'm not interested in arguing just now, is that externals make up for not being able to turn your head naturally or lean as you would be able to in real life.

I wish they would not have called it "no cockpit." New people (including myself when I was just starting) get the impression that you have to have this enabled to use externals. As for myself, I bound the noob cockpit mode to nothing, and have only used it once. That one time was when I was testing true airspeed of the P-38 Lightning and I did not feel like looking up my indicated airspeed in the chart.

wojtek_m
07-25-2004, 05:36 PM
But with externals you have F6 and F6 has nothing to do with air combat in WWII.

XyZspineZyX
07-25-2004, 06:19 PM
Benny, it's a training wheel. I know the views are restrictive: well, welcome to "closer to reality". they simply WERE a factor in combat.

Learn how to use your Situational Awareness to compensate; you do not need to have your eyes locked on an enemy 100% of the time.

For example, you will need to check behind you for a brief second even while you close in for a shot. You may need to reasses if that one enemy of interest is getting any help from above, or from the sides. All of these involve looking somewhere else for a second, then returning your attention to the bogie.

also, during maneuvers you must use your knowledge of what the bogie's energy state is, and where he's heading now, to make educated guesses as to where he's likely to be a few seconds from now; you want to maneuver to that spot instead of just blindly following his every move. Especially, if you use any maneuvers that roll you out of plane, like I used on that .ntrk file.

And, in a straight viewing environment, many people just don't wanna hear it, but, the best thing to do is just roll a couple of degrees, so that the momentary obstruction is not in the way any more. You can do that much faster than any "lean" keypress or kludge, and because it's temporary, by the time you figure out where to lean, or nudge your view, the bogie's likely moved anyway. Just roll a *tiny* bit: you'll often find you're going in that direction anyway.

Holycannoli
07-25-2004, 07:18 PM
Ok thanks guys! Then that's what I want, cockpit only with external views enabled till I get my TrackIR (and maybe even after cuz I like the cinematic flybys in F3).

Oh, and I never use padlocks.

Dawg-of-death
07-25-2004, 08:17 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
Benny, it's a training wheel. I know the views are restrictive: well, welcome to "closer to reality". they simply WERE a factor in combat.

Learn how to use your Situational Awareness to compensate; you do not need to have your eyes locked on an enemy 100% of the time.

For example, you will need to check behind you for a brief second even while you close in for a shot. You may need to reasses if that one enemy of interest is getting any help from above, or from the sides. All of these involve looking somewhere else for a second, then returning your attention to the bogie.

also, during maneuvers you must use your knowledge of what the bogie's energy state is, and where he's heading now, to make educated guesses as to where he's likely to be a few seconds from now; you want to maneuver to that spot instead of just blindly following his every move. Especially, if you use any maneuvers that roll you out of plane, like I used on that .ntrk file.

And, in a straight viewing environment, many people just don't wanna hear it, but, the best thing to do is just roll a couple of degrees, so that the momentary obstruction is not in the way any more. You can do that much faster than any "lean" keypress or kludge, and because it's temporary, by the time you figure out where to lean, or nudge your view, the bogie's likely moved anyway. Just roll a *tiny* bit: you'll often find you're going in that direction anyway.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

A training wheel for what?
Oh, for a game...............
Old f arts view is boaring. I like training wheels even after I've been trainedhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/sonar.gif
Much more action and fun..........


S~

Bad-MF(Mongrel Fighter) AKA .......Dawg-of-death

[This message was edited by Dawg-of-death on Sun July 25 2004 at 07:28 PM.]

XyZspineZyX
07-25-2004, 11:06 PM
No, it's a training wheel for a SIMULATION, which is supposed to try and recreate as much as possible, the real conditions of the subject matter at hand.

A gamer, used to having easy-to-find-on-the-Internet kewl cheats and other dross like that wouldn't understand the concept.

Gamers are irrelvant. I'm answering the question of a guy who's trying to get better at the SIMULATION.

Far as I know, no pilot in the history of flight could get a rotating viewpoint in back of his plane so he could see better. Case closed.

Alexander_Seil
07-25-2004, 11:36 PM
Ok, Stiglr, four points:

A&gt; This is a game. It being a game does not prevent it from being realistic, even ultra-realistic, but it is still a GAME, because you can WIN or LOSE in it. You cannot WIN or LOSE in MS Flight Simulator, hence MSFS is not a GAME, truly. Maybe you shouldn't be so adamant about bashing "gamers" and stressing their supposed inferiority to "sim flyers". I play with an equal degree of enjoyment hardcore wargames, strategies, FPSs, RPGs and, as you can see, Forgotten Battles. Similarity? They are all GAMES. You play to win and to enjoy in whichever way you want it. And, by the way, I play with all realism settings (except map path, due to low resolution and details) on a crappy low-end rig that artificially restricts my flying capacity even further, and still consider myself a GAMER.

B&gt; The guy paid for the game with his money and has the right to enjoy it in whichever way he wants. Case on that, at least, is truly closed. Realism settings are in there so that some people could switch them on or off at will.

C&gt; I don't know what leads you to believe that cheating=gaming...cheating is the bane of gaming. There's no point in using cheats, because then winning requires no skill, so what's the point? I like this game because it allows me to improve and hone my skills at it continuously, which is a relatively rare thing.

D&gt; A flimsy but nevertheless valid point is that in real life the pilot has a greater degree of freedom. On the other hand, he doesn't have the refly button like we do. If you, Stiglr, really want to be flying and not playing a game, you should enroll in your local Air Force (I only wonder why you didn't already), or the Air Force of the country nearest to you that has one, if yours doesn't. There is one "realism setting" that no SIMULATOR or GAME or whatever you choose to brand it will EVER simulate, and that setting is "irreversible death"

Red_Russian13
07-25-2004, 11:47 PM
Not this AGAIN! We argue about this every couple of weeks...The guy was asking a simple question, and got an answer. Do we have to have a dozen replies as to what method of play is better than the other? To each his own...and to each his own server, the option to play however we want is available.

Red Russian

WUAF_Badsight
07-25-2004, 11:58 PM
if External Bandit Lock view was able to be disabled . . . . ..

external views would be accepted by more

.
__________________________________________________ __________________________
actual UBI post :
"If their is a good server with wonder woman views but historic planesets...let me know!" http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Dawg-of-death
07-26-2004, 12:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
No, it's a training wheel for a SIMULATION, which is supposed to try and recreate as much as possible, the real conditions of the subject matter at hand.

A gamer, used to having easy-to-find-on-the-Internet kewl cheats and other dross like that wouldn't understand the concept.

Gamers are irrelvant. I'm answering the question of a guy who's trying to get better at the SIMULATION.

Far as I know, no pilot in the history of flight could get a rotating viewpoint in back of his plane so he could see better. Case closed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You may want to reconsider your closed case. All of Boeings fighter jet sims project the image of the sky 360 degrees around pilot. He turns his head, up, back, left, right. He dosn't close one eye and use tunnel vision thur a crt. The IL2 simulation is unrealistic with cockpit on. Virch w/gauges is closer. And those gages are all you need to fly.

Your sitting in a chair in front of a crt or lcd display. I've only flown 1 simulator. A fairchild metro...........No desk chair, no crt. I walked into a cockpit.
HMMMMMMMMMMMMM.........It didnt have training wheels but it simulated a real air craft. Not 90 or 100 square inches of view. I have seen a bunch of sims though, even WWII sims. The USS Lexington has several WWII era simulators on display, Insturment only LOL. Unfourtunatly Boeings sims are over a million bucks.

Do you fly in the real world. Are you training to be a WW2 piolot? IL2 is not for pilot training ........Its a WWII simulation Game.
I love this game and play it ever day . I cracks me up when people think it is for pilot training. If thats the way you like to play then fine but, on or off dosn't make you a pilot or a gamer. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

Bad-MF(Mongrel Fighter) AKA .......Dawg-of-death

Alexander_Seil
07-26-2004, 12:46 AM
I have to say that playing without cockpit is indeed less realistic. The simulators you are referring to are civilian in nature, hence there is no need to restrict the pilot's viewing area...there is nothing he could possibly see there that he could not tell from his maps, charts, gauges and communications with the flight controller. In Il-2, the cockpit realistically (to a degree) restricts your ability to see the enemy and line up shots. The fact that you aren't able to turn and tilt your head as in real life is offset by the fact that, unlike real life, you have an unlimited number of lives (and ability to pause and look around, to boot)...This is not to diminish my point, however, that this is a game and everyone can play it with as much realism/unrealism as they want to, it's just that I wouldn't agree at all that flying without a cockpit is more realistic (or more comfortable, for that matter).

BennyMoore
07-26-2004, 12:53 AM
Actually, that system also has one tiny flaw, and that is that you still cannot benefit from leaning to see around obstructions.

The best system would be a high resolution head mounted monitor that wraps completely around your field of vision, so that you have complete perepherial. Infrared tracking would allow you to move your virtual head at the same rate as you move your real head. If you move your real head ninety degrees right, your pilot moves his ninety degrees right. If the program was decent, lean would also be incorporated. Lean your real life head a foot to the left while looking back, and suddenly your virtual pilot is also rubbernecking.

That is my dream for flight simulation. However, that sort of technology is in the ten to one hundred dollar price range, so it's cheaper to actually fly. Therefore I plan on doing that instead. I'd rather fly a real Cessna than the best simulated warbird. Of course, what I'd really like is to fly a real warbird, but obviously that's not an option. Maybe in my next life...

Dawg-of-death
07-26-2004, 01:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Alexander_Seil:
I have to say that playing without cockpit is indeed less realistic. The simulators you are referring to are civilian in nature, hence there is no need to restrict the pilot's viewing area...there is nothing he could possibly see there that he could not tell from his maps, charts, gauges and communications with the flight controller. In Il-2, the cockpit realistically (to a degree) restricts your ability to see the enemy and line up shots. The fact that you aren't able to turn and tilt your head as in real life is offset by the fact that, unlike real life, you have an unlimited number of lives (and ability to pause and look around, to boot)...This is not to diminish my point, however, that this is a game and everyone can play it with as much realism/unrealism as they want to, it's just that I wouldn't agree at all that flying without a cockpit is more realistic (or more comfortable, for that matter).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I undersatand what you are sayig. All I am saying is that with cockpit on with a 21"monitor you have about 100 suqare nches of veiw and 200 with it off. Compared to a real WWII plane feild of veiw that would be like flying with one eye or one eye squinting. One eye is more realistic than one eye squinting. The guys that say they are sim pilots not gamers because of on or off cockpit crack me up. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

S~

Bad-MF(Mongrel Fighter) AKA .......Dawg-of-death

Dammerung
07-26-2004, 01:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dawg-of-death:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
No, it's a training wheel for a SIMULATION, which is supposed to try and recreate as much as possible, the real conditions of the subject matter at hand.

A gamer, used to having easy-to-find-on-the-Internet kewl cheats and other dross like that wouldn't understand the concept.

Gamers are irrelvant. I'm answering the question of a guy who's trying to get better at the SIMULATION.

Far as I know, no pilot in the history of flight could get a rotating viewpoint in back of his plane so he could see better. Case closed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You may want to reconsider your closed case. All of Boeings fighter jet sims project the image of the sky 360 degrees around pilot. He turns his head, up, back, left, right. He dosn't close one eye and use tunnel vision thur a crt. The IL2 simulation is unrealistic with cockpit on. Virch w/gauges is closer. And those gages are all you need to fly.

Your sitting in a chair in front of a crt or lcd display. I've only flown 1 simulator. A fairchild metro...........No desk chair, no crt. I walked into a cockpit.
HMMMMMMMMMMMMM.........It didnt have training wheels but it simulated a real air craft. Not 90 or 100 square inches of view. I have seen a bunch of sims though, even WWII sims. The USS Lexington has several WWII era simulators on display, Insturment only LOL. Unfourtunatly Boeings sims are over a million bucks.

Do you fly in the real world. Are you training to be a WW2 piolot? IL2 is not for pilot training ........Its a WWII simulation Game.
I love this game and play it ever day . I cracks me up when people think it is for pilot training. If thats the way you like to play then fine but, on or off dosn't make you a pilot or a gamer. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

Bad-MF(Mongrel Fighter) AKA .......Dawg-of-death<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Maybe Boeing's Simulators are like that because MODERN FIGHTERS HAVE NEAR 360 VISIBILITY. I fly a Cessna 172(Moving the the 152 though), and you CAN'T SEE EVERYTHING. You cant see above to the sides, or in front and below, forget anything behind you. You wanna move your head? Get TrackIR, or a REAL Simulator. IL-2 is the most realistic WWII sim you will EVER get for the time being on a Home Computer... Cockpit off is probably the most unrealistic option in the difficulty switch panel(Well, almost) You lose the feel of the airplane when flying without a cockpit(Unfortunalty, in "Sims" like BF1942 you have to or can't see anything). Most aircraft you cannot have a Dead-Six View. There is always something in your way, and its harder with a cockpit on, but not by much... Wanna check under you? Just Roll 180 and fly inverted for a bit. Behind you? Just give it a little yaw.

Oh, there are no fighter pilots down in hell...
Oh, there are no fighter pilots down in hell...
The whole damn place is full of queers, navigators, and bombadiers...
Oh, there are no fighter pilots down in hell...

WTE_Galway
07-26-2004, 02:02 AM
whilst not particualrly caring either way about cockpits ..... i am rather curious about how the "cockpit off" view letting you see below the nose and under the floor is supposed to make up for the limited peripheral/rear vision ????

bit odd really

Nanuk66
07-26-2004, 03:28 AM
My god! - Ur all gamers ffs!

Including you Stiglr. Say it with me - 'we are all gamers' - you are playing a game whether you like it or not! You can throw your toys out the pram as much as you want but to anyone that knew how you spent your time, they would be calling you a GAMER!

IL2 is a game. You are not in WW2. You are not flying real planes in a global conflict 60 years ago.

Your playing a game that simulates WW2 combat flying. Plenty of you seem to be missing out the 'game' part.

I think a reality slap is in order round here sometimes!

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
07-26-2004, 06:41 AM
Well the predominant attitude in here seems to be ....

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v323/tHeBaLrOgRoCkS/planes/talk_to_the_hand.jpg

sorry just wanted to try it and here seemed as good a place as any http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v323/tHeBaLrOgRoCkS/planes/signiture3.jpg

dazza9806482
07-26-2004, 06:41 AM
Ive explored before the relative arguments and merits of externals, ww, and 'full real'

however aside from all the other arguments, my main reason for prefering cockpit on with externals is the joy of the cinematic action of the game.

its a beautiful game and i love to watch other dogfights whilst im online- to see how other players are doing and watch crazy engagments

all with complete control over what im seeing, flybys, zooming in etc. all in real time- cant be arsed with tracks.

in my experience the great pilots remain great pilots with externals, indeed engagements can be nerve-wrackingly tense because of the awareness, instead of being bounced from behind after 20 mins.

my 2p, its a beautifull game enjoy it.

not like the cold sweat and oil soaked fear of 60 years ago.

FW-Raptor
07-26-2004, 07:11 AM
Yup depends on server m8

posted 25-07-04 10:04
Depends on the server settings most have a locked cockpit with those views disabled.

C:\Documents and Settings\Matthew G Miles\My Documents\My Pictures\spitfirepainting.jpg

Hoarmurath
07-26-2004, 07:16 AM
Quite fun to have someone saying "its a game, its meant to be fun, etc, etc".... And what about thinking that maximum immersion can be fun? The fact that you prefer to fly at a lower level of difficulty don't make it a funnier way of playing the game. You have to live with the fact that some people have indeed much more fun while staying in cockpit with no external views...

http://hoarmurath.free.fr/images/sighoar.jpg (http://hoarmurath.free.fr/files/internationale-ru.mp3)
56Kers are strongly advised to NOT click on my signature http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

bazzaah2
07-26-2004, 07:26 AM
you should read that Franz Stigler transcript.

He said that straps are relatively loose and so he was able to turn and check his six relatively easily - maybe that Linda Blair thing isn't so lame after all.

It's a game, Penelope.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_05.gif

Crashing online as :FI:SpinyNorman

XyZspineZyX
07-26-2004, 09:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bazzaah2:
you should read that Franz Stigler transcript.

He said that straps are relatively loose and so he was able to turn and check his six relatively easily - maybe that Linda Blair thing isn't so lame after all.

Crashing online as :FI:SpinyNorman<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And for every pilot who kept them loose, there was another pilot who may have broken his face open on a crash landing who kept them tight. I don't think there's a definitive answer on how much rearward visibility any one pilot could have (independent of his canopy and fuselage impacting the view, of course).

Food for thought.

El Turo
07-26-2004, 11:57 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:

Ur

...

Your playing a game that simulates WW2 combat flying.

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just wanted to take a moment to point out that I got a good chuckle out of the fact that you're ( http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif ) basting people for misuse of the word "lose" in your sig, yet you ironically hatchet the word "you're" two completely different ways within a single posting. Too funny!

Also, bonus points for misuse of "its" and assorted other bastardizations of words in your sig.

Absolutely beautifully done, mate. Seriously.. ur the most funniest evah.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

Callsign "Turo" in IL2:FB & WWIIOL
______________________
This place
was once
a place
of worship
I thought,
reloading my rifle.

~V.

bazzaah2
07-26-2004, 12:29 PM
presumably straps could be adjusted.

The fact that Stigler said that makes me think that the headturning thing ain't quite so bad, though could do with a little toning down.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_05.gif

Crashing online as :FI:SpinyNorman

Holycannoli
07-26-2004, 03:37 PM
Ooh my post got good! Cockpit views are a hot topic huh?

You know, I see both sides here. There's a lack of reality with both cockpit and ww view. So I figure, I gotta choose the lesser of two evils, and that lesser evil is cockpit only with externals.

WW may be fun, but I fear if I start using it, I'll come to depend on it, and not be able to perform with cockpit view.

badatit
07-27-2004, 12:01 AM
One of these days...

One of these days... (http://www.digit-life.com/articles/vfx3d/)

One of these days, it'll be fast enough, and affordable for all.
S!

WTE_Galway
07-27-2004, 12:08 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:
My god! - Ur all gamers ffs!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

well actually i find doing circuits in the Emil or gladiator better practice for RL flying training than FS2004 .. so to some extent the program is a sim

my observation over the years about these debates is the "only a game" brigade seem to tend more to online one off dogfights and the "sim" boys tend to play offline campaigns like experten or get involved in VEF VOW online wars so the two types rarely meet in combat anyway

wayno7777
07-27-2004, 12:39 AM
I can't even remember which key to use for ww so I don't use it. I do use F2 and F8 occasionally. Sometimes it's hard to see where everybody goes so I check outside. Btw only offline.

http://img74.photobucket.com/albums/v224/wayno77/FB%20shots/Aircraft/heinkel_219.jpg
Any landing you can walk away from is a good one!

Nanuk66
07-27-2004, 03:39 AM
'I just wanted to take a moment to point out that I got a good chuckle out of the fact that you're ( ) basting people for misuse of the word "lose" in your sig, yet you ironically hatchet the word "you're" two completely different ways within a single posting. Too funny!'

Yes very good, well spotted, doesnt take to much to amuse you does it! And believe me you're/ur not the first to point that out. However, as i have pointed out to people before, You're and ur sound the same when spoken in English, whereas Lose and Loose dont even sound the same when said.

Maybe you havent been on the net long Turo, a little kid?, i dont know. But it doesnt bother me and most people if a word is used and been bastardised as long as when u first read it u understand it right off i.e. ur/you're it's/it is etc but when people write loose instead of lose it pisses me off cause when i read it i read it as LOOSE. Say it out loud and u (\o/) might understand.

Nice pick up on that thou m8. Obviously you are one of the ******s that cant spell lose properly and cant use the right one in the right context so are having a pop. Well, aussies were never known for their grammer i suppose....


Thanks for shopping, please come again.

P.S. in the quote you say 'basting' - sounds like fun, dunno what it means thou! (You see how this can go round and round m8? - Just spell Lose and loser properly and stfu already!)

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
07-27-2004, 11:26 AM
Guys

Guys

Cant we all just get along ?

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v323/tHeBaLrOgRoCkS/planes/signiture3.jpg

BennyMoore
07-27-2004, 10:17 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:
doesnt...ur...havent...dont...doesnt...u...u...cau se...u ...thou m8...cant...grammer...dunno...thou...m8<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're giving me a headache. Is that extra character or two really that hard? Is it worth being illegible? Apparently so, for today, it's "in" 2 spell werds rong. Totally fat... "Being coherent is overrated," eh?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:
You're and ur sound the same when spoken in English<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know who taught you English, but he obviously wasn't very good at it. For your information, illiterate one, "ur" is pronounced "er," as if you were uncertain as to what you are about to say. "U" is pronounced "uh," like you were just hit in the stomach. "Thou" rhymes with "cow" and is a Middle English word that is a form of "you." "M8" is pronounced "emmate" and is not a word. "Grammer" is incorrect, and is actually spelled "grammar." And all of those contractions (or whatever they are) which you murdered need to have an apostrophe in them.

Before getting all wound up at someone else's comedic misuse of a single word, you might want to consider becoming legible yourself. Yes, paying attention in elementary school does pay off!

eXtra_Corrosiv
07-27-2004, 10:33 PM
what is external bandit lock view? do you have to bind that or is it on the keyboard?

--------------------------------------------
Athlon 3200+ / 2x512 corsair c2pt 3200LL / radeon X800 Pro / Audigy 2 ZS / WinXP / Saitek X45
--------------------------------------------
p4c 3000 -800/ abit ic7/2x512 corsair twin x LL/ bfg 6800u /audigy platinum/ winxp ch fighter stick and usb throttle.

eXtra_Corrosiv
07-27-2004, 10:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by El Turo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:

_Ur_

...

_Your_ playing a game that simulates WW2 combat flying.

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just wanted to take a moment to point out that I got a good chuckle out of the fact that you're ( http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif ) basting people for misuse of the word "lose" in your sig, yet you ironically hatchet the word "you're" two completely different ways within a single posting. Too funny!

Also, bonus points for misuse of "its" and assorted other bastardizations of words in your sig.

Absolutely beautifully done, mate. Seriously.. ur the most funniest evah.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

Callsign "Turo" in IL2:FB & WWIIOL
______________________
This place
was once
a place
of worship
I thought,
reloading my rifle.

~V.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LMFAO @ evah :lol:

--------------------------------------------
Athlon 3200+ / 2x512 corsair c2pt 3200LL / radeon X800 Pro / Audigy 2 ZS / WinXP / Saitek X45
--------------------------------------------
p4c 3000 -800/ abit ic7/2x512 corsair twin x LL/ bfg 6800u /audigy platinum/ winxp ch fighter stick and usb throttle.

Red_Russian13
07-27-2004, 10:39 PM
BennyMoore;

I once pointed this sort of thing out to someone here. You know, the whole extra letter thing. It's just so bloody hard to read all that internet chat stuff. Now, one or two words are fine, but when the whole post is riddled with the stuff...well, never mind. I'm sure you get my point. That post got edited though...ho hum.

Red Russian

Plus, I don't even know what half of that stuff means...someone post a dictionary of internet chat acronyms...

wayno7777
07-27-2004, 11:34 PM
My kid has one somewhere, let me look.

Here it is:
Acronyms
@ AT
A/S/L AGE, SEX, LOCATION?
AAMOF AS A MATTER OF FACT
AA ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS
AAA TRAVEL CLUB
ADN ANY DAY NOW
AFAIK AS FAR AS I KNOW
AFK AWAY FROM KEYBOARD
AKA ALSO KNOWN AS
B4N BYE FOR NOW
BAK BACK AT KEYBOARD
BBFN BYE BYE FOR NOW
BBS BULLETIN BOARD SERVICE
BF BOYFRIEND
BRB BE RIGHT BACK
BTA BUT THEN AGAIN
BTW BY THE WAY
BYOB BRING YOUR OWN BEER
CIS COMPUSERVE INFORMATION SERVICE
CMIIW CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG
CU SEE YOU
CUL SEE YOU LATER
CUL8R SEE YOU LATER
DIKU? DO I KNOW YOU?
DTRT DO THE RIGHT THING
E- ELECTRONIC
EOT END OF THREAD
EDT EASTERN DAYLIGHT TIME
EST EASTERN STANDARD TIME
F FEMALE
F2F FACE-TO-FACE
FAQ FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS
FCOL FOR CRYING OUT LOUD
FITB FILL IN THE BLANK
FUD FEAR, UNCERTAINTY AND DOUBT
FWIW FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH
FYA FOR YOUR AMUSEMENT
FYI FOR YOUR INFORMATION
GAL GET A LIFE
GF GIRLFRIEND
GIWIST GEE, I WISH I'D SAID THAT
GOK GOD ONLY KNOWS
GTG GOT TO GO
HHOK HA! HA! ONLY KIDDING
HHOS HA! HA! ONLY SERIOUS
HOYEW HANGING ON YOUR EVERY WORD
IAC IN ANY CASE
IANAL I AM NOT A LAWYER
IC I SEE
IKWUM I KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN
IMCO IN MY CONSIDERED OPINION
IME IN MY EXPERIENCE
IMHO IN MY HUMBLE OPINION
INPO IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER
IOW IN OTHER WORDS
IRC INTERNET RELAY CHAT
IRL IN REAL LIFE
IWBNI IT WOULD BE NICE IF
JIC JUST IN CASE
KWIM KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
L8R LATER
LMAO LAUGHING MY *** OFF
LMGDAO LAUGHING MY G-D DAMN *** OFF
LOL LAUGHING OUT LOUD
LTNS LONG TIME NO SEE
M MALE
MYOB MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS
N/M NEVERMIND
OIC OH, I SEE!
OMG OH MY GOD!
OTF ON THE FLOOR (LAUGHING)
OTOH ON THE OTHER HAND
PAW PARENTS ARE WATCHING
PMFBI PARDON ME FOR BUTTING IN
PMFJI PARDON ME FOR JUMPING IN
PNCAH PLEASE NO CUSSING ALLOWED HERE
POV POINT OF VIEW
PTMM PLEASE, TELL ME MORE
RE REGARDING
ROFL ROLLING ON FLOOR LAUGHING
ROTFL ROLLING ON THE FLOOR LAUGHING
RSN REAL SOON NOW
SO SIGNIFICANT OTHER
TAFN THAT'S ALL FOR NOW
TIA THANKS IN ADVANCE
TNTL TRYING NOT TO LAUGH
TNX THANKS
TTBOMK TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE
TTFN TA-TA FOR NOW
TTKSF TRYING TO KEEP STRAIGHT FACE
TTYL TALK TO YOU LATER
TTYL8R TALK TO YOU LATER
TYVM THANK YOU VERY MUCH
URL UNIVERSAL RESOURSE LOCATOR (WEB SITE ADDRESS)
WB WELCOME BACK
WTF? WHAT THE F?
WRT WITH RESPECT TO
WTGP? WANT TO GO PRIVATE?
WYSIWYG WHAT YOU SEE IS WHAT YOU GET
WYGIWYPF WHAT YOU GET IS WHAT YOU PAY FOR
YIU YES, I UNDERSTAND
YIWGP YES, I WILL GO PRIVATE
YMMV YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY

And this one I learned here; IIRC If I Recall Correctly
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v224/wayno77/FB%20shots/Aircraft/TA-152pic.jpg
Any landing you can walk away from is a good one!

Nanuk66
07-28-2004, 03:21 AM
'"ur" is pronounced "er"' - no it isnt u moron!

'"U" is pronounced "uh," like you were just hit in the stomach.' - again - no is isnt, are you even English? Say the Alphabet out loud and when you get to 'U' and you say 'uh' then you are doin something wrong u ******.

'"M8" is pronounced "emmate" and is not a word' - lol wot a nonce! really? it aint a word? Crazy! You must be the life and soul of the local bar!

'And all of those contractions' - eh?

'Before getting all wound up at someone else's comedic misuse of a single word' - if you talking about lose/loose can you show me where people have been using it in a 'comedic' way please. I think u'll just find its a lack of understanding. Plus its in my sig, it not directed at anyone specifically. Also, i didnt start this attack.

If you think Benny, that 'U' and 'you' and 'm8' and 'mate' are the same as 'lose' and 'loose' then you are indeed a spastic.

'Is that extra character or two really that hard? Is it worth being illegible?' - Do you even know wot the word 'illegible' means? If my post was indeed that illegible then u wouldnt be able to read it and therefore comment on it. We can nit pick all day.

The difference between u and me thou is i aint gonna call someone a Losser.

Aint you a Yank anyway?
And shouldnt u be kissing Gib's *** in another post somewhere...?

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

Artic_Wulf
07-28-2004, 03:49 AM
It all comes down to personal preference, Il-2/FB/aces has more view options than some Sims that have been around in the past.
I can remember a major Online War hosted in EAW by the JZG23 group in 2000.
Back then an outside view with Icons was your only setting you could have from memory with that Sim, and that was considered hard.

I would not say reality, compared to IL-2, but then even IL-2 is still only a simulator and should never be refered to as any level of reality even with the hardest settings used.

The level of difficulty you choose to use the game at would be a better term of reference I think, the term reality should never enter the conversation when talking about flight Simulators, because it is not and never will be reality.
So yes I am definatley one of the, Its only a game, Get a life, crowd.

S!

Taylortony
07-28-2004, 11:53 AM
I always fly with the cockpit on but i do have externals enabled as i like to look at the skins etc and pick up skinning tips and ideas.. as well as watching the flybys http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
there cool.... never use the little gauge and arrows windows as one i think it puts in on a arcade level and two it does not do justice to the likes of Captain Haddocks excellent cockpits.. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif but thats just me

gates123
07-28-2004, 12:32 PM
Bottom line is when I'm online I enjoy the opportunity to bounce. If external views are on all people do is look around their a/c for incoming dots and it takes all the fun out of it. Padlock is just as bad since it will lock on a enemy a/c without any effort. Enemy icons on can ruin a bounce also. What's the point in playing online if you can't sneak up on someone!

http://www.fightingcolors.com/custompagestuff/b17visibility72.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

BennyMoore
07-28-2004, 10:33 PM
You are a stupid and illiterate child, and I don't know why I'm wasting my time arguing with you. I suppose it's because I'm seriously alarmed by the ignorance of people nowadays and feel bound to attempt to combat it.

Have you ever heard of phonics? It's the study of the way letters sound when placed in words. "U" is, by itself, pronounced "uh," as I said. "Duh, bum, f**k, c**t," and "dumb" all demonstrate this. Adding other letters can make it make an "oo" sound, but almost never does it make a "yoo" sound. Just because its title is pronounced "yoo" does not mean that its phonic sounds like "yoo." The only word I can think of right now where it does sound like "yoo" is "puke," which happens to be the urge I feel when I see your posts, which are, by the way, illegible. Look it up in the dictionary; it means "unreadable," which is exactly how your posts are.

As for "ur," dull one, it is also almost always pronounced "er" unless modified with other letters. "Purr, burr, cur," and "rural" demonstrate this. In "failure," it is pronounced "yer" as you claim it usually does, but note that this is because of the addition of an "e" at the end. The only exception to this rule that I can think of is "urine." Think about that every time you post, dunce!

This concludes today's grammer (sic) lesson for 2day. I mean, today. If you can't get that through your head, then it's time to go back to kiddie garten.

Red_Russian13
07-28-2004, 10:55 PM
Wayno;

Holy Crud! That's a lot of internet-speak. Thanks for posting. Now maybe I'll understand what people are trying to say...or hopefully most of it. Thanks!

Red Russian

El Turo
07-28-2004, 11:33 PM
Dearest Nanuk,

OMGLOLSTFU!

Love,

Turo

FI.Snaphoo
07-29-2004, 12:35 AM
Not to weigh too heavily in on this, but I felt had to since there seems to be some misunderstanding when it comes to the rather silly contraction of "ur" if you say the letter by itself (like in grammar school) it isn't pronounced "uh" as has been claimed. It has a "yoo", or "you" as it is understood, sound. Add to that the "r", which grammar school again taught me has an "arr", or "are" as it is understood, sound. You then can easily come up with "u r", or "you are", a mere omition of a space will get you a simple contraction of "ur" or "you're". It's a silly indication of a word and purely phonetically based. Not to mention quite lazy. But the argument of semantics that seems to be going on is even more silly.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>"U" is, by itself, pronounced "uh,"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

U (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=u)

u1 or U ( P ) Pronunciation Key (yoo)
n. pl. u's or U's also us or Us
The 21st letter of the modern English alphabet.
Any of the speech sounds represented by the letter u.
The 21st in a series.
Something shaped like the letter U.
U A grade that indicates an unsatisfactory status

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The only exception to this rule that I can think of is "urine." Think about that every time you post, dunce!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Uniform
unique
union
unify
unanimous
Utah
unilateral
unicorn
unicyclist
unite
UNIX
ubiquitous

[This message was edited by snaphoo on Thu July 29 2004 at 01:06 AM.]

bazzaah2
07-29-2004, 01:18 AM
Maybe it's time for a grammar/spelling sticky.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_05.gif

Crashing online as :FI:SpinyNorman

Nanuk66
07-29-2004, 05:54 AM
Whoa Whoa Whoa, hold on a sec!

When did this become a nit picking thread full of nobs?
When did i post directly at someone for not spelling things right?

I didnt. I have some sentences in my sig explaining the difference between lose/loose/loser/looser. Then i get all these personal attacks from other people and basically hijacked the thread!

Bendermoore - u really are a joke.

'You are a stupid and illiterate child, and I don't know why I'm wasting my time arguing with you. I suppose it's because I'm seriously alarmed by the ignorance of people nowadays and feel bound to attempt to combat it.'

Ignorance? Are you fecking kidding? Obviously you as well are one of the ******s that dont know the difference between lose and loose, and have taken offence to my sig as its shown ur own idiocy to yourself. Thats not my fault that your school didnt teach ya better! But now you know and you wont mistakenly post stuff like ' you are a looser'. Hows about you dont waste my time and yours by arguing any more cause i seem to lose some IQ every time you post.

'Have you ever heard of phonics?' - Yes, but wtf that has to do with internet gaming message boards i have no idea.

'"U" is, by itself, pronounced "uh,"' - again, no it isnt. If u are reading a thread and someone types 'U' and you are reading it as 'uh' then you are indeed a spaz, and i can do nothing about that.

'Just because its title is pronounced "yoo" does not mean that its phonic sounds like "yoo."' - Funnily enough i dont take into account how words sound phonically when im posting threads on a gaming messageboard. And tbh, if someone in a post typed 'Yoo' id still know wot they were saying, wouldnt Jo0?

'which are, by the way, illegible. Look it up in the dictionary; it means "unreadable," which is exactly how your posts are.'

AGAIN! - if my posts are so illegible then J00 wouldnt be able to read and therefore understand them, which would, in turn, mean that Y00 wouldnt be able to comment on them. DumbA55.

'The only exception to this rule that I can think of is "urine." Think about that every time you post, dunce!'

Well, i cant even be bothered. Do you want me to add more to the list that snaphoo has made? Or have you had enuff of looking like a *****?

'This concludes today's grammer (sic) lesson for 2day.'

U mean it already started?!?!
Your the guy with the problem when people use 'u' instead of 'you' or 'Ur' instead of 'your' not me. I suggest u deal with it or write it in your sig. Again there is nowhere where ive hijacked a thread to point out to some poster that they have spelt 'lose' wrong. Its in my sig, either u read it and take note or u dont. You are being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative Bender.

Ive had something similar in my sig on many other message boards throughout the years of playing games (it seems to be a spelling problem that doesnt seem to go away). And the word 'lose' is used alot in internet battle type games. Dont think you or turo are the first to be 'smart' and try and nit pick at me using 'u' and 'ur' or wotever. However u Bendermoore are the first to actually start claiming that 'U' is pronounced 'Uh' and 'UR' needs and 'e' in it to make sense. Special needs class methinks.

Plus it was Turo that first started it and i can only gather from his witty response 'OMGLOLSTFU!' that i cained his **** into the ground with my reply to his post. For evah...i mean ever urs tully u colonial cok. x x

Remember Bendermoore, if u got a problem with people using' u' and 'ur' then stick it in ur sig. If not, STFU. Not only are you boring but ur quite clearly full of **** too.

Lots of love,
NaNuk

P.S. Learn to fly the P38 you chump.

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

Miss-Kitten
07-29-2004, 06:26 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NaNuK66:

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry to say Nanuk but if you post an English Lesson and then post messages using incorrect English yourself then you don't have much credit for posting a lesson in the first place. If you want people to use proper form, you have to give a good example yourself. And frankly, you don't.

I mean what is wrong with writing in plain English, at least then people can take these posts more serious.

Sláinte!, :FI:Kitty
http://home.quicknet.nl/qn/prive/amatullah/fis01.jpg (http://www.fighting-irish.org/)

bazzaah2
07-29-2004, 06:42 AM
can we make this grammar thing a sticky please Ivan? Then we can move on to advanced subjects, such as the evil of unattached participles and the merit/demerits of split infinitives and my favourite, the confusion of the nominative plural with genitive singular. These are important issues and need to be dealt with, especially on a WW2 flight simulation chat board.

Some of our non-native English speakers may be benefit from such a thread as well.

You know it makes sense.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_05.gif

Crashing online as :FI:SpinyNorman

Miss-Kitten
07-29-2004, 06:54 AM
Baz, I suspect that you just like things sticky http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Sláinte!, :FI:Kitty
http://home.quicknet.nl/qn/prive/amatullah/fis01.jpg (http://www.fighting-irish.org/)

bazzaah2
07-29-2004, 07:05 AM
yup Kitty, sticky does it for me!

see you in the pub, lol.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_05.gif

Crashing online as :FI:SpinyNorman

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
07-29-2004, 08:06 AM
Benny / Nanuk, get a room or get married either way get outta here http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/1241.gif

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v323/tHeBaLrOgRoCkS/planes/signiture3.jpg

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
07-29-2004, 08:10 AM
P.s Ivan we need a new smiley 'TROLL MAGNET' http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v323/tHeBaLrOgRoCkS/planes/signiture3.jpg

Nanuk66
07-29-2004, 08:20 AM
Hows about u SMB Balrog.

K thx.

-----------------------------
English lesson 101:
The word is 'Lose' not 'Loose'. e.g.
That IL2 is gonna lose the fight against that 109.
That IL2's wing looks loose, its gonna fall off.
If i dive too vertically i will lose my wing. k thx.
------------------------------

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
07-29-2004, 09:03 AM
Awwww now thats not very nice is it honey. I was gona offer to be your bridesmaid but I aint gona bother now.
Your just too mean http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/cry.gif

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v323/tHeBaLrOgRoCkS/planes/signiture3.jpg

El Turo
07-29-2004, 09:59 AM
Dearest Nahnuck,

I was merely pointing out a bit of an ironical relationship between your nitpicking of other's spelling and word choice, whereas you yourself are a bit off in the weeds yourself.

Kind of like making fun of someone because you saw them in the check-out line at the gay porno store with a basket full of merchandise. Hey, guess what tough guy.. you were right there with them in line, thailor boy!

The fact that you've gotten so purple in the face about this, and that aparently I'm the ten-thousandth person to point out this amusing little irony sums up the whole thing rather nicely, I think. Too lazy to take a shower, but quick to decry your roommate's lack of personal hygiene.

LOL, indeed.

I think Alice Cooper said it best when he said:

Schoooooool's out.. 4.. summmah!!!!!!!!

Have a great summer break! Stay cool 4-evah.

Love,

~T.

[This message was edited by El Turo on Thu July 29 2004 at 09:13 AM.]

kant000n
07-30-2004, 11:40 PM
This has got to be one of the funniest threads evah! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif LMAO
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/354.gif