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XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 02:20 AM
Hey all,

I'm doing a bit of a beta report here. I'm not sure if there is still an e-mail to submit this to. If there is, I will submit it.

Disclaimer: None of my observations are backed by scientific evidence of flight controls, aerodynamics or anything else. I am meerly reporting what I am seeing and giving opinion and providing an impetus for further testing. This was by no means an exhaustive test either, however, it should be taken that my observations were made with the utmost to fairness on all sides.

Observations (in no particular order):

1) The new P-47 skins are fantastic for both the D-27 and the D-10 and D-20. I'd also like to thank whoever fixed the radiator bug on the P-51. It now works very nicely and it looks good.

2) The P-51: There are changes to this bird since the leaked beta version. Its a bit slower to accelerate and doesn't roll quite as quickly. But this has also had the unfortunate side effect of also making the plane feel quite a bit more sluggish in the control authority. Previous to the update, the P-51 was very charming to fly. It responded very quickly to controls and this seemed to be much like what veterans had reported. It now is not quite as fun to fly.

3) The P-47 D-27 has been much improved and it feels much better than in the 1.2Beta. It rolls better but its not incredibly manuverable at the same time. I have noticed however a strange instability at around 320-380 kph. Above that speed, the D-27 is very stable, below that speed the D-27 also seems very stable. Using roll or pull back on the stick around those speeds seems to ilicit a snap stall and the aircraft rolls onto its back. I don't remember reading anything about that (please point it out to me if it has been). It seems like a bug...since it seems to happen at those specific speeds (perhaps there are other impacts as well).

4) The Browning .50 machine gun. Point of much contention in the forums. This gun has been improved since 1.11 and its now possible to break parts off of planes, do damage to engines, and in general break things up. However, its been changed since the 1.2Beta where it felt properly effective based on gun camera footage. So its not as weak as before but not as effective as it was in 1.2Beta and in my opinion slightly too weak again.

However on this point I did notice in the 1.2Beta instances where a single burst would snap wings off. Rare but present. It seems that this may have been attempted to have been fixed...but its gone too far the other way. Find a middle ground between here and where it was in 1.2Beta and I can assure you that I'll never complain again.

5) New effects seem to be present for hits on aircraft with MG's and for times when parts fly off or tails get snapped off. Fantastic addition to the visual effects that I didn't really notice before but I seem to see it quite a bit now. Excellent work on those, leave them alone, they are perfect now.

6) Gunner accuracy has been fixed to a large extent I think. There is more spray and less hits landed. There are some sniper like moments still present but I can live with those. So well done here.

7) German planes seem to have gotten a boost around here quite a bit. The D-9, although I know TX-Zen disagree's with this next bit (and I respect him as a very qualified D-9 dogfight server guy - he bailed me outa some tought fights once or twice http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif), seems to have been improved. She's less twitchy and the guns are more effective. In general German guns seem to do more damage than before (20mm's) and seems much more in line with what we should have. The changes are not huge, very subtle in this case very effective.

8) The new maps are fantastically done. I have yet to try the reduced palm tree Pacific map but I never had much slow down anyways. Kudos to the level of detail placed into the Normandy and Ardennes maps.

9) As mentioned several times...the P-40 seems to suffer from heavy controls above 450kph. Is this correct? It does seem to out roll the Zero which is good (this is purely observational - I did not test roll times).

10) P-39 seems more twitchy than before...which is good. Still effective in the right hands. Like it should be.



And that concludes my observations for now. Not comprehensive but with several issues I found important to note (always key to remember good things as well as not so good things).

Again, if someone knows of the beta e-mail please toss it up on this thread. Oleg asked for feedback and he shall get feedback. At the very least (especially in the FM department) any sort of explanation for reasons why things are (ie. performance is consistent with recorded data or game engine allows us to do this but not that, etc.) would also be appreciated!

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig.jpg
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 02:20 AM
Hey all,

I'm doing a bit of a beta report here. I'm not sure if there is still an e-mail to submit this to. If there is, I will submit it.

Disclaimer: None of my observations are backed by scientific evidence of flight controls, aerodynamics or anything else. I am meerly reporting what I am seeing and giving opinion and providing an impetus for further testing. This was by no means an exhaustive test either, however, it should be taken that my observations were made with the utmost to fairness on all sides.

Observations (in no particular order):

1) The new P-47 skins are fantastic for both the D-27 and the D-10 and D-20. I'd also like to thank whoever fixed the radiator bug on the P-51. It now works very nicely and it looks good.

2) The P-51: There are changes to this bird since the leaked beta version. Its a bit slower to accelerate and doesn't roll quite as quickly. But this has also had the unfortunate side effect of also making the plane feel quite a bit more sluggish in the control authority. Previous to the update, the P-51 was very charming to fly. It responded very quickly to controls and this seemed to be much like what veterans had reported. It now is not quite as fun to fly.

3) The P-47 D-27 has been much improved and it feels much better than in the 1.2Beta. It rolls better but its not incredibly manuverable at the same time. I have noticed however a strange instability at around 320-380 kph. Above that speed, the D-27 is very stable, below that speed the D-27 also seems very stable. Using roll or pull back on the stick around those speeds seems to ilicit a snap stall and the aircraft rolls onto its back. I don't remember reading anything about that (please point it out to me if it has been). It seems like a bug...since it seems to happen at those specific speeds (perhaps there are other impacts as well).

4) The Browning .50 machine gun. Point of much contention in the forums. This gun has been improved since 1.11 and its now possible to break parts off of planes, do damage to engines, and in general break things up. However, its been changed since the 1.2Beta where it felt properly effective based on gun camera footage. So its not as weak as before but not as effective as it was in 1.2Beta and in my opinion slightly too weak again.

However on this point I did notice in the 1.2Beta instances where a single burst would snap wings off. Rare but present. It seems that this may have been attempted to have been fixed...but its gone too far the other way. Find a middle ground between here and where it was in 1.2Beta and I can assure you that I'll never complain again.

5) New effects seem to be present for hits on aircraft with MG's and for times when parts fly off or tails get snapped off. Fantastic addition to the visual effects that I didn't really notice before but I seem to see it quite a bit now. Excellent work on those, leave them alone, they are perfect now.

6) Gunner accuracy has been fixed to a large extent I think. There is more spray and less hits landed. There are some sniper like moments still present but I can live with those. So well done here.

7) German planes seem to have gotten a boost around here quite a bit. The D-9, although I know TX-Zen disagree's with this next bit (and I respect him as a very qualified D-9 dogfight server guy - he bailed me outa some tought fights once or twice http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif), seems to have been improved. She's less twitchy and the guns are more effective. In general German guns seem to do more damage than before (20mm's) and seems much more in line with what we should have. The changes are not huge, very subtle in this case very effective.

8) The new maps are fantastically done. I have yet to try the reduced palm tree Pacific map but I never had much slow down anyways. Kudos to the level of detail placed into the Normandy and Ardennes maps.

9) As mentioned several times...the P-40 seems to suffer from heavy controls above 450kph. Is this correct? It does seem to out roll the Zero which is good (this is purely observational - I did not test roll times).

10) P-39 seems more twitchy than before...which is good. Still effective in the right hands. Like it should be.



And that concludes my observations for now. Not comprehensive but with several issues I found important to note (always key to remember good things as well as not so good things).

Again, if someone knows of the beta e-mail please toss it up on this thread. Oleg asked for feedback and he shall get feedback. At the very least (especially in the FM department) any sort of explanation for reasons why things are (ie. performance is consistent with recorded data or game engine allows us to do this but not that, etc.) would also be appreciated!

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig.jpg
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

Hunter82
11-11-2003, 02:26 AM
see here

http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=Olegmaddoxreadyroom&id=ztxxf

=======================================
Ubisoft IL2/Lock On Moderator
ATI Catalyst Driver Beta Tester
Hunter82 wrote:"I did not have technical relations with that question"
Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>
Catalyst Bug Reporting (http://apps.ati.com/driverfeedback/) </center>
=======================================

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 02:44 AM
Rgr that thx.

If anyone has comment before I send it off, that'd be appreciated as well.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig.jpg
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 03:35 AM
Not sure whether ammo damage was changed, but the differences you are seeing are probably more due to the reduction in recoil effects. In my opinion, this has made the .50 caliber more effective than ever.

--AKD

http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 04:31 AM
Ok...

The AI still do all their squirrel flying when you have then descend in altitude. They will not just nose down and descend. They start a nose down descent and then start flying erratically, and inevitably they collide and you'll lose two out of every four. In fact, you can often lose a whole flight of four.

This is not just with fighters, it's also with bombers. It is really strange looking when bombers start stunting like bi-planes... LOL

This really needs a fix /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

---------------- /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 04:44 AM
Glad to see someone else notice that wings are torn off too easily. IMO the .50's and especially all of the 20mm cannons recieved a huge boost.

<center>
http://www.brooksart.com/Icewarriors.jpg

"Ice Warriors", by Nicolas Trudgian.

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 04:49 AM
My point was that bug was present in 1.2Beta and not in the present build and that a middle ground for the .50 cal could be found. I did not notice the reduction in recoil. That could be an important consideration http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

But I will look for it.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig.jpg
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

XyZspineZyX
11-11-2003, 03:22 PM
bump

XyZspineZyX
11-12-2003, 12:58 AM
Well, the AI are still dumb as ever.

Been doing some QMB with Jap planes, vs vs P51s.

The AI wingmen fly in front of or just off the side of attackers and the attackers don't pursue or even take an easy shot.

It just looks so dumb to have such an easy kill right in front of the AI and he turns away or just keeps flying.

The wingman is basically just following along for the ride. It might save the player, because the wingman gets his butt shot off being a dumbA$$.

---------------- /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
11-12-2003, 01:14 AM
One nice touch I noted was how the tracers have been staggered on planes armed with .50 cals (P-40, P-47, P-51). You seem to get a much more continuous stream of tracers now (they used to clump up into groups) which helps with aiming a bit.



"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

XyZspineZyX
11-13-2003, 09:51 PM
bump

XyZspineZyX
11-13-2003, 11:01 PM
when I use the mouse to look around, the throttle returns to 51% everytime ,both in cockpit and out.



<img src=http://www.luftwaffepics.com/LCBW/FW190-D9-29_small.jpg>
"yeah whatever"