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View Full Version : 109F-2 / F-4 comments (newbies take note)



BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 06:35 AM
I'd like comments concerning these two birds, performance wise.

A comparison of the two in relation to each other, as well as how they stack up against other nations planes would be most welcome.

Thanks!

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(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

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BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 06:35 AM
I'd like comments concerning these two birds, performance wise.

A comparison of the two in relation to each other, as well as how they stack up against other nations planes would be most welcome.

Thanks!

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 07:49 AM
40 views, no comments.

The community swings toward allies a little too much.

The only difference between the two is 4lbs, due to the 20mm cannon that replaces the 15mm cannon (F-4 has 20 mm).

The F-4/2 can beat the pants off any other fighter of the same years, unless it fights a 109-G2, which outclasses it completely.

The main advantage of the F-4/2 is in its light-weight. Its a very energetic fighter, and able to recover quite well from over-sticking.

Forward vis in the 2 is better than the 4, so if you dont need the extra punch of the 20 mm cannon, use the 2.

If in doubt, shallow dive, gain speed, and then climb away from the enemies. In servers with La7's and such, I've no idea how to fight with it. Maybe in a few days I'll have more information.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
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(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

Lixma
01-02-2004, 07:51 AM
F4 will dance like a ballerina but is too underpowered to compete consistently with the later war a/c. F2 is similar but the guns are even less effective than the F4's. Both are incredibly fragile - one bullet will knock out some control axis or another and the slightest damage to the wings result in a lot of drag and the loss of manouverability.

If you want to survive in one then use it's climb to alt (which is quite good) and stay there. BnZ is frustrating as it's almost impossible to nail an enemy in one pass so you need a lot of patience. I never follow good advice though and end up tearing around on the deck (at which it excels) but once you've picked up an enemy on your 6 it's unlikely you'll get away due to the F's magic-bullet-magnetism.

Edit: La7s ? Feck that...if you can get them into a stall fight you may open a brief window to get a couple of shots in before they start running. And the Russian birds just absorb lead so either way you're buggered.

BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 08:19 AM
I had a good run with it last night on a server running '42-and-earlier planesets (i forget which server). Although the G2 is a better killer, I like the nimbleness of the F's, probably due to my flying the I-153 for so long.

As for its bullet-attractant: thats no lie. The most annoying thing is the oil on the windscreen: All you have to do is look at the engine funny and you get a blackened wind-screen.

Using Il2Compare, it looks like the F-4 is faster (than F-2), but according to the two planes specs, they should be identical.

Vs an La7... lol. If the La is at 4,000 meters and the F-4 is at 6,000 meters, the F-4 is about 20 km/h faster, but the La's climb is higher, so it will catch up to the F-4.

On the deck, the F-2/4 rocks in an early-war scenario.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
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+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

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FW190fan
01-02-2004, 09:14 AM
I'm flying a 109F-2 campaign right now.

It's pretty much king of the sky in 1941., it's fast, climbs great, and can dive away from anything you will meet in 1941 including Migs and Laggs.

The only thing I'm worried about is flak.

http://www.texasairmuseum.com/images/fw190splash.jpg]

LEXX_Luthor
01-02-2004, 09:17 AM
what servers are these hahaha

Fb109F4.....1941
La~7......1944

__________________
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Stanly is a moron, kai is a walking dead beet, Xev just want sex.

GoodKn1ght
01-02-2004, 10:37 AM
I like flying the f4 on greatergreen but the i16 owns me. It turns circles around the f4 and seems like it can outclimb it. Damn i16s are like mosquitoes. Any tips?

BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 10:58 AM
BnZ em.

The only reason why the I-153's and I-16's can give you a run is because they can change energy states just as quckily as you.

All three planes are very light and very nimble.

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+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
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|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

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GoodKn1ght
01-02-2004, 12:32 PM
bnz is a tough option in the f4, i find the plane doesnt handle at high speeds.

BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 01:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GoodKn1ght:
bnz is a tough option in the f4, i find the plane doesnt handle at high speeds.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

?

It handles quite well at high speeds. It just doesn't handle like an I-16, which is a superior turner.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

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/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

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Vipez-
01-02-2004, 02:04 PM
It's a good plane.. but it has one significant disadvantage in game: very poor elevators at speeds after 400 kmh (elevators become too heavy after only 400 kmh, should be after 650 kmh) and high-altitude handling.. For example compare it to P-40E and Yaks on above 7000 meters, F-4 is much harder to handle. And it stalls easily at those heights.. while Yaks and P-40E maintain energy much better on high alts.

Elevators makes effective B&Z very hard, as if the P40 or Lagg3 you dive on you begin to pull the stick your F-4 goes down 2-3 km before you can pull up.. while the allied planes pull up instantly at high speeds.

ON slow speed fighting it holds its own again Lagg3s and Migs, but not against Yaks/Polikarpovs/P-40s. And B&Z is pretty hard due to poor elevators.. however, patience and practise makes champpion (or so they say http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif ) .. on high altitude battles its quite hard, as Migs and P40s tend to be ├╝ber on high alts http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


__________________________


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SKULLS_LZ
01-02-2004, 02:07 PM
If you're in a "historical" 1941 server, and there is a good I-16 pilot in there, stay the h*ll away from the I-16 (and P-40) if you do not have an *excellent* wingman. Once you start turning, you are as good as dead.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
&lt;IMG SRC="http://www.jwilliamsmusic.it/belushi.jpg"&gt;&lt;BR&gt;Yeah I vulched ya. Now put a cork in it and pick another base before I bust a c@p in your sorry @ss.

GoodKn1ght
01-02-2004, 02:11 PM
yeah i dont know what speed you bnz at, but i find it hard not to go over 400 even with cutting throttle and droping cmbt flaps. then even if i manage that, the i16 peppers the crap out of me in the zoom climb and i dont have enough E to get away.

The f4 is supposed to be the best german dogfighter but it even sucks at that because the russian planes just turn too well.

BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 02:29 PM
Maybe I just fly differently. I have some rules that I fly by that seem to make for a good forumla.

I assume others do this sort of thing. Like, if I drop below a certain speed, I stop turning and dive. Once above a certain speed, I climb. I also climb at one specific speed and with a certain amount of stick deflection (no inclinometer). I trim for 80% throttle and never touch the trim or throttle unless I'm in a real emergency.

I never ever continue turing below a certain speed and I never dump speed with flaps and such. Real life pilots always say: speed is life.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
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(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

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GoodKn1ght
01-02-2004, 02:46 PM
I think you missed the point, skulls summed it up nicely. the f4 doesnt stand a chance against the i16 unless you are really lucky or have a good wingman. The elevator is horrible above 400 so bnz is really really hard.

BaldieJr
01-02-2004, 02:56 PM
Nevermind.

Trust me: You turn with an I-16 and you're going to loose. Instead of commiting to a kill that you can't get, turn that speed into altitude and get out of there.

I personaly see no problems with the elevator at high speed, but I don't yank the stick much either.

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
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(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

BfHeFwMe
01-02-2004, 04:58 PM
Trade both in for a plain G-6 any day. The mg's are way to anemic.