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View Full Version : Please allown option to eliminate Wingtip smoke



XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:13 AM
Salute Oleg

As the game stands now, it is not possible to eliminate the green and red smoke trails from wingtips, even in full real.

So we get situations where a server is full real, and players are using wingtip smoke to identify themselves.

This is exactly the opposite of what full real should be. As far as I know, no WWII fighter carried smoke pots on its wingtips. Too much drag and useless weight.

Oleg, please allow for elimination of this feature.


Thankyou RAF74 Buzzsaw

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:13 AM
Salute Oleg

As the game stands now, it is not possible to eliminate the green and red smoke trails from wingtips, even in full real.

So we get situations where a server is full real, and players are using wingtip smoke to identify themselves.

This is exactly the opposite of what full real should be. As far as I know, no WWII fighter carried smoke pots on its wingtips. Too much drag and useless weight.

Oleg, please allow for elimination of this feature.


Thankyou RAF74 Buzzsaw

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:26 AM
I have to agree with this. Please add the option to remove it.

----------------------------------------
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As we all know, the Soviet Union had too many fighter pilots during WW2. So Stalin's scientists came up with a brillient way to solve this problem. They would make some of their pilots fly British made Hurricanes. The Hurricane was an uber flying coffin. It was designed to maximize pilot kills by providing nothing but fabric and a few wooden spars around the cockpit. This setup prevented the pilot from escaping easily while at the same time not interfering with enemy bullets and shrapnel trying to pass through it. The rest of the Hurricanes structure was designed to ricochet bullets and shrapnel into the cockpit. And thanks to the cockpits superb design, all of them would pass through the cockpit and the pilot inside with little difficulty. Of course the Hurricane's designers didn't stop there. In order for the Hurricane to become a flying coffin, they had to make it easy to shoot. They did this by making the Hurricane the slowest monoplane fighter in use at the time and even gave it a very bulky shape so that it would be easy to spot and hit. The final feature of the Hurricane was its ability to bury or cremate itself. And because it was made of biodegradable materials, the Hurricane was environmentally friendly after it buried itself. Because of these brillient features, the Hurricane was a perfect flying coffin and helped the Soviets solve the pilot surplus they were suffering.
http://www.bestanimations.com/Humans/Skulls/Skull-06.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 07:38 AM
Actually there are other more dispicable reasons people use smoke in online games that goes completely against the nature of the game.

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 08:38 AM
Get's my vote - anyone notice it can (seem to) cause lag?

JG5_UnKle

"Know and use all the capabilities of your airplane. If you don't sooner or later, somebody who does, will kick your ***"


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XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 08:54 AM
RAF74Buzzsaw_XO wrote:

- This is exactly the opposite of what full real
- should be. As far as I know, no WWII fighter
- carried smoke pots on its wingtips. Too much drag
- and useless weight.
-
- Oleg, please allow for elimination of this feature.
-
-
- Thankyou RAF74 Buzzsaw
-
-
-

Actually, the BF109 and I guess most other planes had flare ports allowing to fire off colorfull flares for identification purposes.

Still doesn't excuse the use of smoke, but in DiD Online War, we used short smoke "bursts" to simulate the use of those flares.

Just a different angle of view.

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 09:32 AM
It's a good policy to remap the smoke buttons to
something hard to press, though, as accidentally
pressing it and making yourself obvious isn't a
good policy either!

One smoke related thing I have noticed is that
if you 'blip' the engine on a Yak when you have
too rich a mixture tends to produce somke. A nice
touch - although it has led to some issues in squad
games where we have warned each other that we are
smoking due to damage, whereas it is just a smoky
engine.

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 10:34 AM
That smoke occurs when the mixture is too rich. But it isn't just smoke, your engine looses alot of power too. When I see a smokey plane (not damaged) I immidiatly know that pilot is no real threat in that particular plane.

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As we all know, the Soviet Union had too many fighter pilots during WW2. So Stalin's scientists came up with a brillient way to solve this problem. They would make some of their pilots fly British made Hurricanes. The Hurricane was an uber flying coffin. It was designed to maximize pilot kills by providing nothing but fabric and a few wooden spars around the cockpit. This setup prevented the pilot from escaping easily while at the same time not interfering with enemy bullets and shrapnel trying to pass through it. The rest of the Hurricanes structure was designed to ricochet bullets and shrapnel into the cockpit. And thanks to the cockpits superb design, all of them would pass through the cockpit and the pilot inside with little difficulty. Of course the Hurricane's designers didn't stop there. In order for the Hurricane to become a flying coffin, they had to make it easy to shoot. They did this by making the Hurricane the slowest monoplane fighter in use at the time and even gave it a very bulky shape so that it would be easy to spot and hit. The final feature of the Hurricane was its ability to bury or cremate itself. And because it was made of biodegradable materials, the Hurricane was environmentally friendly after it buried itself. Because of these brillient features, the Hurricane was a perfect flying coffin and helped the Soviets solve the pilot surplus they were suffering.
http://www.bestanimations.com/Humans/Skulls/Skull-06.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 10:58 AM
I'll sign up for this request. I made it myself back 6 months ago on this very forum.

All I want is a toggle switch for the host to have as an option like icons, and map view, and complex engine, etc.

=TC= PVT.Roger

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 12:14 PM
Again, if you don't want it, DON'T USE IT!!! Everyone here is simply brainless, they can't figure that above fact for themself. Set it to a key combination you don't ever think about, and BOOM! It's gone!

Boosher-PBNA
----------------
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XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 12:43 PM
You're the brain dead one, we are talking about preventing OTHER players from using it in a server.

----------------------------------------
I/JG1 Oesau (http://jg1-oesau.org) is recruiting. Join us!

Stab.I/JG1Death at HL, Maj_Death at Ubi.com

As we all know, the Soviet Union had too many fighter pilots during WW2. So Stalin's scientists came up with a brillient way to solve this problem. They would make some of their pilots fly British made Hurricanes. The Hurricane was an uber flying coffin. It was designed to maximize pilot kills by providing nothing but fabric and a few wooden spars around the cockpit. This setup prevented the pilot from escaping easily while at the same time not interfering with enemy bullets and shrapnel trying to pass through it. The rest of the Hurricanes structure was designed to ricochet bullets and shrapnel into the cockpit. And thanks to the cockpits superb design, all of them would pass through the cockpit and the pilot inside with little difficulty. Of course the Hurricane's designers didn't stop there. In order for the Hurricane to become a flying coffin, they had to make it easy to shoot. They did this by making the Hurricane the slowest monoplane fighter in use at the time and even gave it a very bulky shape so that it would be easy to spot and hit. The final feature of the Hurricane was its ability to bury or cremate itself. And because it was made of biodegradable materials, the Hurricane was environmentally friendly after it buried itself. Because of these brillient features, the Hurricane was a perfect flying coffin and helped the Soviets solve the pilot surplus they were suffering.
http://www.bestanimations.com/Humans/Skulls/Skull-06.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 01:19 PM
Maj_Death wrote:
- We are talking about
- preventing OTHER players from using it in a server.
-
-----------------------------------------------------

If wingtip smokes aren't available, then people will simply use "nav" or "landing" lights.
Then what ?
Ban the lights too ?

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 01:36 PM
Cant agree. The inflight chaos is already big enough on online servers, you have to navigate on your own, and with the artificial landscape its not always easy. The wingtip smoke is used most of the time to help find the leader after TO, and make a formation. Few people use it in combat, and guess why.... it tells EVERYBODY where you are... something not really desireable. Further I will its only something that makes up for the lack of resulution and limits of a computer simulation.


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XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 01:41 PM
The one thing that worries me is that if all the settings suggested over the last four months would be implimented, then the difficulty options screen would look like the switchboard of the first Cray Computer.

Maybe some kind of server-side .ini file would be better suited for all those additional option settings.

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 01:43 PM
FPS_Stierlitz wrote:
- If wingtip smokes aren't available, then people will
- simply use "nav" or "landing" lights.
- Then what ?
- Ban the lights too ?

No, planes definitely did (with a few exceptions) have
lights. The lights are a bit bright in daytime, though.
(It would be nice to have a time-of-day variation on
the brightness to make it a little more realistic in
some way).

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 02:03 PM
the landing light should be seen only when you are IN FRONT of the light,and the nav light unseen farther than 50m away during day.i agree on the smoke tip to be host controlled.

yesterday i was on a vow,an allied russian squad used smoke,landing light and nav light during the whole fight....immersion killer /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 02:07 PM
If you're looking for immersion, FB is the LAST place you should be looking!



I agree with Isegrim. Too much chaos going on already.




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Jagderband 44
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XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:16 PM
These features already requested in a "master post."

See:
http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view.asp?name=Olegmaddoxreadyroom&id=zwrky

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:30 PM
Wingtip smoke is a serious PAIN IN THE ... for servers. Slows frame rates down and adds to lag when some stupid a$$ clown is flying around like that.

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:31 PM
Reminds me of the jerks firing rockets continuously in Red Baron 3D... Makes you wish you send a 20 kV pulse down their modem line...

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:44 PM
Please Oleg for the Server side Carvs Let the Servers Decide Wing tip smoke On or Off This is a Must

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XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 06:47 PM
Boosher-PBNA wrote:
- Again, if you don't want it, DON'T USE IT!!!
- Everyone here is simply brainless, they can't figure
- that above fact for themself. Set it to a key
- combination you don't ever think about, and BOOM!
- It's gone!


NO Boosher your the Brainless one, We want no WTS so that newbs & Lag masters cannot inable the smoke & flyaround Like Imbaciels with WTS Inabled Its very annoying

Think Before You Speak

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I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold
I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</FONT>

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 07:12 PM
There is validity to your point, however I'd opt to keep it. I usually see the smoke used to get around the visual limitations of the monitor. It is a useful method to help ID each other.

Weren't flares sometimes used for this.

Anyway, I got shot down in VOW the other day and the guy who got me turned on his wingtip smoke and flew a vertical circle around my parachuting pilot as some sort of victory celebration. This was really cool as it called attention to his position and I got to watch as one of my teammates blasted him from the sky. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Sorry about the lack of realism, but that justified the inclusion of wingtip smoke to me.

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XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 07:31 PM
RAF74Buzzsaw_XO wrote:
- Salute Oleg
-
- As the game stands now, it is not possible to
- eliminate the green and red smoke trails from
- wingtips, even in full real.
-
- So we get situations where a server is full real,
- and players are using wingtip smoke to identify
- themselves.
-
- This is exactly the opposite of what full real
- should be. As far as I know, no WWII fighter
- carried smoke pots on its wingtips. Too much drag
- and useless weight.
-
- Oleg, please allow for elimination of this feature.
-
-
- Thankyou RAF74 Buzzsaw


oh really?? and no WW2 pilots surived when their planes crashed while sitting in them.... so shall we jump off a tall building next time when our planes crash to simulate the real life situation??

it is a blardy computer software! its got its own limitations! u get much better resolution and FOV in a real life situation... seriously.. am getting sick of ppl who constantly saying "ban this, ban that" to make the game "more real"... get over it!
i would agree to "ban this ban that" if they ship FB with TrackIR or a 3D virtual cockpit pod with 360 degrees of vision....

XyZspineZyX
06-30-2003, 10:10 PM
Well, I have to agree that the smoke is used to make up for limitations that come with a monitor, but maybe limiting the smoke to a certain ammount of time?

Set the game so that a player has 30seconds of smoke in total. Then people who turn it on acidentaly don't havi it on forever, and there is no way to keep it on for an entire dogfight.

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 01:27 AM
We have icons as an option...so what was the point of the forced smoke again?

Don't you realize virtual pilots are dying from second hand smoke??? Sorry...had to throw that last bit in.

Message Edited on 06/30/0307:28PM by RedHarvest

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:24 AM
I'm lost. Wingtip smoke may not be realistic and affords some perks. But how it translates into a lobbyable advantage that needs to be restricted is beyond me.

Don't care either way though. Just wanted to note that some of the things being asked for are getting very... ummm... petty?

<hr width="400">Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.
That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and have their
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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:52 AM
My objection to it isn't the ID bit, it is the unwanted clutter of extra smoke. However, it is awfully silly to allow smoke identification in full real without icons, LOL. It can cause a performance hit for some and therefore can introduce lag and that is why I oppose it.

Jetbuff wrote:
- I'm lost. Wingtip smoke may not be realistic and
- affords some perks. But how it translates into a
- lobbyable advantage that needs to be restricted is
- beyond me.
-
- Don't care either way though. Just wanted to note
- that some of the things being asked for are getting
- very... ummm... petty?

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 06:41 AM
Simple as I reffered to earlier its used by players in DF servers to cheat by causing framerate lag to a player that is on their six therefore preventing that player from hitting them and also losing their target.

Its happening more and more often in DF servers because people are for a majority unsporting and will use any advantage they can find even if its outside the rules of a game.

Jetbuff wrote:
- I'm lost. Wingtip smoke may not be realistic and
- affords some perks. But how it translates into a
- lobbyable advantage that needs to be restricted is
- beyond me.

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

Message Edited on 07/01/0312:41AM by Cragger

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 08:16 AM
Cragger wrote:
- Simple as I reffered to earlier its used by players
- in DF servers to cheat by causing framerate lag to a
- player that is on their six therefore preventing
- that player from hitting them and also losing their
- target.
-
- Its happening more and more often in DF servers
- because people are for a majority unsporting and
- will use any advantage they can find even if its
- outside the rules of a game.


r u serious?? which DF server are you referring to? maybe i should go and have a look... cos i've never seenppl doing it b4... using wing tip smoke to lag?? if ur system is fast enough to run FB, the wing tip smoke won't affect ur FPS at all, but if ur system is too slow to run FB, whether there is wing tip smoke or not won't make a difference... it is gonna lag anyway....

seriously... i dun see ur point of arguement.... and i would rather to see my opponent flying with wing tip smoke on, since it is easier to track them down... so how can ppl use it to their advantage???

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 09:14 AM
i want my plane to be better than all the others, with bigger guns and more view from the cockpit...or...or ill stamp my feet and throw myself to the floor crying

"the empty can rattles the most"

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 09:18 AM
Apparently you don't fly online much or have just been lucky as I too have ran into many pilots using this 'tactic'. It usually happems when I get on someones six and they can't shake me so in desperation they turn on their wingtip smoke.

Yes, I have a very fast machine and yes it can/does lag you if it is a very full server.

Server admins should have the option to turn it off.

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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 10:04 AM
i'm just wondering.. what is the wingtip smoke for? if it's not for telling your friends to turn them on to figure out who's who when you're fighting.. what are we supposed to use it for?


oh, and yeah.. if Oleg gets rid of the wingtip smoke i will use the landing and nav lights.

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 12:26 PM
I see a new DR. Phil episode now "switchwhiners and there obsession for switches for everything"



"Of all my accomplishments I may have achieved during the war, I am proudest of the fact that I never lost a wingman. It was my view that no kill was worth the life of a wingman. . . . Pilots in my unit who lost wingmen on this basis were prohibited from leading a [section]. They were made to fly as wingman, instead."
Erich 'Bubi' Hartmann "Karaya One"

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 12:34 PM
Cragger, I must have missed your post. So you're saying that the desperation of some FB players has reached that low? Sad, sad situation... I'm hoping the lag-fixing that is apparently due with the patch may help get rid of this new idiocy.



Now RedSpar's sig, that's a much more worthy topic than this. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif LOVE the sig man. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:11 PM
Yes it is a sad tactic of desperation. Both me and redspar's computers are about equal. He has the slightly better card and I have the slightly better processor and motherboard. And even though I get an average of 30 fps in BlackDeath at excellent settings with 4xAA smoke will cause lag on a loaded server.

Not only that but it can and will obscure your view during critial firing opportunities.

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:34 PM
Cossack13 wrote:
- There is validity to your point, however I'd opt to
- keep it. I usually see the smoke used to get around
- the visual limitations of the monitor. It is a
- useful method to help ID each other.
-
- Weren't flares sometimes used for this.
-

Hey Cossak I Do Like the wing tip smoke Myself but I dont use it unless for some ID situation wich is rare at best

If the server Has the Option to Inable or disable then Vow Could leave it On & DF servers or whatever could disable it

Were not saying Banish the WTS all together Just Give the Servers The Choice I think that is Fair for all Involved myself

S Cossak

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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:41 PM
Spanker Wrote:
oh really?? and no WW2 pilots surived when their planes crashed while sitting in them.... so shall we jump off a tall building next time when our planes crash to simulate the real life situation??

it is a blardy computer software! its got its own limitations! u get much better resolution and FOV in a real life situation... seriously.. am getting sick of ppl who constantly saying "ban this, ban that" to make the game "more real"... get over it!
i would agree to "ban this ban that" if they ship FB with TrackIR or a 3D virtual cockpit pod with 360 degrees of vision....


Apperantaly You didnt read the thred @ all no one is saying to banish the WTS

Only that We The Servers could have an Option to disable it or Not After all we payed for the dam game we built our Servers Its our Map we made So why couldnt we have an option to turn it off if we Like...

U know Im sick of People like you who dont host Games & dont read the threds & then Shoot there mouths off when they have no clue whats realy going on!!!

Run along now !!!

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I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</FONT>

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:44 PM
Jetbuff wrote:
- I'm lost. Wingtip smoke may not be realistic and
- affords some perks. But how it translates into a
- lobbyable advantage that needs to be restricted is
- beyond me.
-
- Don't care either way though. Just wanted to note
- that some of the things being asked for are getting
- very... ummm... petty?


Petty ???

How hard do you think it shall be for Oleg to impliment this into sim its not petty if you were a host you would know

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I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

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XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:50 PM
spanker wrote:

- r u serious?? which DF server are you referring to?
- maybe i should go and have a look... cos i've never
- seenppl doing it b4... using wing tip smoke to lag??
- if ur system is fast enough to run FB, the wing tip
- smoke won't affect ur FPS at all, but if ur system
- is too slow to run FB, whether there is wing tip
- smoke or not won't make a difference... it is gonna
- lag anyway....
-
- seriously... i dun see ur point of arguement.... and
- i would rather to see my opponent flying with wing
- tip smoke on, since it is easier to track them
- down... so how can ppl use it to their advantage

Your Probly the guy runing around with the WTS ON!!!

I have a blazing fast PC with a gig of ram & it does make lag Spank I should say frame Loss Its lame, This is not a thred for debate, this was a post too Oleg & 1C asking for the Server Option to disable WTS, if the Server chooses, so
why are you here trying to debate this when its not a debate

Run along already

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I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold
I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</FONT>

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 02:53 PM
Franta wrote:
- i want my plane to be better than all the others,
- with bigger guns and more view from the
- cockpit...or...or ill stamp my feet and throw myself
- to the floor crying
-

Another I dont read the thred I just shoot off my mouth Poster

Why do you feal the nessicity to Mock other peoples request?

Go away


<CENTER> http://home.mchsi.com/~zmarinaro1969/shin1.jpg </center>

<Center><div style="width:700;colorhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gifurple;font-size:14pt;filter:shadow Blur[color=black,strength=11)"><Center>
I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold
I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</FONT>

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 03:01 PM
Cragger wrote:
smoke will cause lag on a loaded
- server.

Cragger I dont think its lag.. Its more Like Frame Loss

To me Lag or Latency is Packet related due to the sim sending info out over the net

Frame Loss is when your V_Card looses frame per second because it has to draw all that dam smoke

Possibly its a Combination of bolth

if you want a prime exzample just hop on the Six of some dipstick flying the B1 Rocket Plane You will incoure lots of FPS Loss due too all that grimey black smoke it trails behind it

Im not saying remove the smoke from the b1 either LOL

Just remove the B1 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold
I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</FONT>

Message Edited on 07/01/0308:05AM by Locust_161st

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 06:12 PM
Franta wrote:
- i want my plane to be better than all the others,
- with bigger guns and more view from the
- cockpit...or...or ill stamp my feet and throw myself
- to the floor crying
-
- "the empty can rattles the most"


Or the empty head...and yours is really rattlin'

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 06:27 PM
I'm pretty new here and to FB, I haven't played on line much ether, but on 56k IL 2 and FB are the only playable flight sims I have for online, Thx Oleg! I don't mean to butt in but I have more than once lost a good shot due to lag! No WTS involved just the limits of 56k. even with the limits of my 17" monitor I don't think I'd like to see WTS in a dog fight, just wouldn't look right! That said maybe where going about this the wrong way, some one mentioned flares! How about a limited number of those for each aircraft, blue ones for LW and red for VVS, than when online T will trigger flares, Careful you don't use em all up, you mite need one to land if your own AA mistakes you for bad guys just a thought!

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 06:34 PM
Locust_161st wrote:
- Apperantaly You didnt read the thred @ all no one is
- saying to banish the WTS
-
- Only that We The Servers could have an Option to
- disable it or Not After all we payed for the dam
- game we built our Servers Its our Map we made So why
- couldnt we have an option to turn it off if we
- Like...
-
- U know Im sick of People like you who dont host
- Games & dont read the threds & then Shoot there
- mouths off when they have no clue whats realy going
- on!!!
-
- Run along now !!!

oh really?? and i am sick of ppl who jump straight to conclusion!! who said i dun host games?? i host VOW missions! so plz... dun make me sickk

and i am using wat i said as an example to say that not everything in real life can be modeled in a piece of computer software...

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 06:38 PM
Locust_161st wrote:
-
- Your Probly the guy runing around with the WTS ON!!!
-
- I have a blazing fast PC with a gig of ram & it does
- make lag Spank I should say frame Loss Its lame,
- This is not a thred for debate, this was a post too
- Oleg & 1C asking for the Server Option to disable
- WTS, if the Server chooses, so
- why are you here trying to debate this when its not
- a debate
-
- Run along already
-

omfg! this sh!t is getting personal now! after jumping to the conclusion that "people like you dont host games"... now you are saying i am the one using WTS to lag my enemy's system??

oh yeah... you are so right... 100%... how can u possibly know that?? wow... magic.... magic.... pure magic... i admit defeat... Mr. Know Everything aka. Pr. Prophet...

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 07:02 PM
a picture tells a thoudsand words...

see for yourself...

my system is XP2600+ (@2100Mhz o/c from XP1800+), 512DDR, nForce 2, GF4 Ti4200 AGP 8X 64MB

all setting maxed out except terrain effects

i've put in 3 wingmans and 12 other BI-1 to simulate the load on my system (otherwise the FPS sits comfortable at 85 without changing)

as u can see from the screen shots, WTS on or off does not affect the FPS

<img src=http://members.optushome.com.au/commonfiles/wts/1.JPG>
<img src=http://members.optushome.com.au/commonfiles/wts/2.JPG>
<img src=http://members.optushome.com.au/commonfiles/wts/3.JPG>
<img src=http://members.optushome.com.au/commonfiles/wts/4.JPG>
<img src=http://members.optushome.com.au/commonfiles/wts/5.JPG>
<img src=http://members.optushome.com.au/commonfiles/wts/6.JPG>

Message Edited on 07/01/0306:05PM by spanker

XyZspineZyX
07-01-2003, 07:19 PM
I don't understand why peeps here feel they have to rip each other apart! Do's any one here fly CFS 3 do we not think IL 2 and FB are the best possible sims given today's technology we could ask for! This should be fun, why can't we have more respect for each other! Think of what could be accomplish with a developer willing to lesion to what we have to add, what must Oleg and others think of us when reading what we've wrote. How many good ideas have been lost under the wait of flame after flame! Can popping flares be done in FB, if so would that be a good effect every one could live with!

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 12:04 AM
ok really.. i use the wingtip smoke to identify friendlies but if this is not what it should be used for.. then what?? can someone tell me?? would Oleg just let us have smoke to make our planes look prettier? or is anyone out there writing "marry me" with their smokes on?

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 12:17 AM
Spanker that really doesn't show much of WTS impact on FPS in loaded contiditions because of how low you have everything set which is obvious in that picture.

1. You have no anti aliasing on. Big FPS boost and reduces transparency impact.

2. From the pixelation of that images you obviously ran that in 1024 X 768 resolution or lower.

3. Terrain detail is very low.

4. Not a single cloud huh?

5. Object lighting has been reduced because the normal light mapping on the paint is basic and subdued.

6. And the BIGGEST ONE OF ALL that is the sloppiest photo edit job I've ever seen, the insert of the fake FPS fields is obvious due to their pixelation and lack of blending.


All that is being asked is the simple option for server admins to turn off WTS in the "realism" settings. Not to remove it from the game, seeing how blatanly defensive you are getting on a perfectly logical request I'm almost guarenteed your using it to foul up other players. If it where for ID purposes only your Landing lights and Nav lights work just as well and even better at range cause you can blink them.

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

Message Edited on 07/01/0306:19PM by Cragger

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 12:58 AM
Cragger wrote:
- Spanker that really doesn't show much of WTS impact
- on FPS in loaded contiditions because of how low you
- have everything set which is obvious in that
- picture.
-
- 1. You have no anti aliasing on. Big FPS boost and
- reduces transparency impact.
-
- 2. From the pixelation of that images you obviously
- ran that in 1024 X 768 resolution or lower.
-
- 3. Terrain detail is very low.
-
- 4. Not a single cloud huh?
-
- 5. Object lighting has been reduced because the
- normal light mapping on the paint is basic and
- subdued.
-
- 6. And the BIGGEST ONE OF ALL that is the sloppiest
- photo edit job I've ever seen, the insert of the
- fake FPS fields is obvious due to their pixelation
- and lack of blending.

1. you want me to put AA on?? fine y me, i will do it when i get home, i am going out now

2. i am running on 1024 X 768, the most practical resolution

3. Terrain is set at Excellent (tell me if you run in Perfect mode??!!)

4. can chuck cloud in if u want me to, it was ran in QMB, by default there is no cloud

5. Object lighting is set to max

6. this is the part really p!ssing me off! i can send u the ORIGANAL .tga FORMAT SCREEN SHOTS if you really want to be an @$$

in the worst case, even if i am "cheating" (as great Mr. I know Everything II thinks, oh yeah, thats YOU! Cragger), this is only to show when the PC is under a load (which it is in the demo i ran, because the MAX FPS would be limited at 85 FPS due to my refreshrate when it is not under a load).... it doesn't matter what setting or resolution i am running under (again, take whatever way u want to), all it has to show is that WTS has no real impact on performance! it doesn't matter whether there is cloud or not! the FPS will be lower if there is cloud, but WTS under that situation won't change a thing, because in this case, the PC is under the same amount of RELATIVE stress when WTS i on and off

and have you ever heard of ACDSee ?? huh?? try use one and transform your screenshot into .jpg format with 65% default quality, see what the "pixelation" (the way you put it) looks like! if i want to fake fotos, i can do better job than this... as i said b4, if u really want it, i can send you ALL the original screen shots i've taken...


blatanly defensive?!?! oh yeah?? better than some1 who once again jumps into conclusion and you guys said WTS shud be banned cos of FPS hit, i am here to prove iit has no effect on FPS! and u, Mr. Cragger is the one who first mentioned the FPS hit with WTS, now u r getting away with saying realism and all these other stuff while calling me blatanly defensive?!?! quite ironic, isn't it??

-"I'm almost guarenteed your using it
- to foul up other players.

again, jumping to conclusion here... u ever fly VOW?? ever seen any1 doing it in a serious game huh?? even in the DF server i go to, i RARELY see any1 doing it...

it really p!sses you off when u see such a post first thing in the morning and just b4 u go out to have some fun.... with all the false assumptions and conclusions demeaning other ppl... and you are demeanning urself the most, it shows how little respect you have for others....





Message Edited on 07/02/0312:26AM by spanker

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 02:21 AM
It does have an effect you ultra Noob

You think we are coming here & lying

I can do thoes same tests On my own pc & it has no effect Sure No problem, but when yer online & theres already 200 300 Ping... I have dsl so my ping is normaly 100 or less like 50 but when the Even nOOber Than you Noobs turn on there WTS it does have an effect Why are you so adament that it does not have an effect ? (IT DOES)

I guessed that this must be because you like too turn on your smoke & fly around when someone gets your Six LOL

Why else would it bother you ? if we wanted the Option to shut it off ? Just shut up already you simply want too argue
Go away & let us ask for the Options we need

Notice I said Options... You can Host Vow all day & keep your smoke & Choke on it for all I care, I want too disable it On my server OK!!!!!!

Is that ok with you ?

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<Center><div style="width:700;colorhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gifurple;font-size:14pt;filter:shadow Blur[color=black,strength=11)"><Center>
I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold
I am alive forevermore.
I am the Alpha and the Omega
the Begining and the End.</div> <center>

<center><FONT COLOR="white">ӚFJ M œ R D ˜ ӡ[/i]</FONT>

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 02:30 AM
Do's anyone know how many aircraft where equipped with flairs or how they where used. This as add-on would be a lot of fun. What if at max distance your own flak targeted you till you pop flair or where within seeable rang and what if you only had say 8 of em, as a group you'd be forced to fly better formation to keep track of your peeps I can hear it now POP FLAIRS! POP FLAIRS, well it was someone else's idea and I think it's a good one! More realistic than seeing funsmoke off wing tips in battle

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 04:01 AM
JV44Heiden wrote:
- If you're looking for immersion, FB is the LAST
- place you should be looking!
-


Do you know of a more immersive sim? Please tell me so i can get it...


That is one reason why I prefer coop servers. With a primary goal in mind other than getting points and shooting down the other guy (unless ofcourse it's part of the mission) you get more cooperation and team play....IMHO of course...

<CENTER>http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg <marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"Straighten up.......Fly right..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee> http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat

<CENTER><FONT COLOR="ORANGE">vflyer@comcast.net<FONT COLOR>
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Message Edited on 07/01/0311:07PM by Bearcat99

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 05:01 AM
Easy boys...

AntiAliasing makes a big difference on framerate hits from smoke. Usually I don't get much of a hit unless I am behind the guy and I am flying near/through the smoke.

Also it only seems to happen in servers of 15 or more.


The main point of this thread is this: (read it and then read it again) SERVERS ADMIN SHOULD HAVE THE OPTION TO TURN IT OFF

As a personal note, IMO it is plain cheesy and not realistic to turn on smoke if someone is on your 6 firing at you.

Real planes didn't do that in WWII (unless the engine was hit or on fire) and since this is a realistic sim...well you get the picture.

You guys are blowing this thread out of porportion.

Recap:

The main point of this thread is this: (read it and then read it again) SERVERS ADMIN SHOULD HAVE THE OPTION TO TURN IT OFF


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XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 05:15 AM
I retract the part about the editing the fps bar in the images, I was not aware how bad bleed over from red on blue was with jpeg compression. However, submitting a compressed image is not a good idea for 'proof' because it degrades the quality of the image.


Add about 20 or so AI aircraft and follow your plane around will its on autopilot. You'll notice a 2 to 8 FPS hit depending on the angle and what else is in the image. And take the shots when all the aircraft are mixing it up. This however still does not simulate the load of online play because of networking being done by the program at the same time.

It can cause lag and pauses online because the the smoke being turned on has to be updated to the server then sent out to all players synced and rendered, and then the smoke has to be tracked with the player position which involves further load on the network causing split second pauses which are enough for the predicition code to lead the guy on your six away chasing an image that will warp back to where you are.

But of course you already know this from what i can decern from that mad jumble of words spewed forth that you do use this at least of obscure yourself from your target then of course you'd be defensive about it because you don't want to lose that ace slipped up your sleeve like most 'cheats' do. Its not realistic to have colored smoke coming off your wings whenever you want (Again I didn't say anything about realism, only the realism setting switchboard which is its name).

http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

Message Edited on 07/01/0311:18PM by Cragger

XyZspineZyX
07-02-2003, 05:35 AM
this smoke thing is a bit of a non issue

http://lamppost.mine.nu/ahclan/files/sigs/spitwhiners1.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-03-2003, 01:12 AM
I play on a med to low spec'ed machine and wing tip smoke never causes lag or FPS drops.

Adjust your settings, your card obviously cant handle everything.

<font face="Courier New">
&nbspBaldieJr
_____ | _____
_\__(o)__/_
./ \.
Whiners don't play vulchers
(er, winners)
</font>

XyZspineZyX
07-03-2003, 02:13 AM
On second thought...

Stop playing with AI in online games. Thats your real problem, not smoke.



<font face="Courier New">
&nbspBaldieJr
_____ | _____
_\__(o)__/_
./ \.
Whiners don't play vulchers
(er, winners)
</font>

XyZspineZyX
07-03-2003, 02:28 AM
"This however still does not simulate the load of online play because of networking being done by the program at the same time."

Read the whole passage next time. As to your first comment I get a average 30 fps in "The Black Death" with Perfect settings and 4x AA. I play with Excellent setting.

BaldieJr wrote:
- On second thought...
-
- Stop playing with AI in online games. Thats your
- real problem, not smoke.
-


http://www.redspar.com/redrogue/CraggerUbisig.jpg

About after 30 minutes I puked all over my airplane. I said to myself "Man, you made a big mistake." -Charles 'Chuck' Yeager, regards his first flight

XyZspineZyX
07-03-2003, 02:54 AM
Cragger wrote:
- "This however still does not simulate the load of
- online play because of networking being done by the
- program at the same time."
-
- Read the whole passage next time. As to your first
- comment I get a average 30 fps in "The Black Death"
- with Perfect settings and 4x AA. I play with
- Excellent setting.
-
- BaldieJr wrote:
-- On second thought...
--
-- Stop playing with AI in online games. Thats your
-- real problem, not smoke.
--

Its hopeless. Sorry for the intrusion. I'll take my logic elsewhere.

<font face="Courier New">
&nbspBaldieJr
_____ | _____
_\__(o)__/_
./ \.
Whiners don't play vulchers
(er, winners)
</font>

XyZspineZyX
07-03-2003, 04:04 AM
i subscribe to having the option of allowing, or not, wingtips smoke in multiplayers servers....

no need to tell me about the frame rate, i don't care...

no need to tell me why you like it, a lot of people like icons, but we still have the option of turning them off...

XyZspineZyX
07-03-2003, 11:16 AM
Another good option would be to only allow landing lights when the gear is down and/or flaps at landing position.



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