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Jungmann
09-03-2004, 01:37 PM
I'm stoked to find this modelled in AEP in the D-model P-51. Use it sometimes, sometimes not. What do other people think of it?

And another question to you history experten--how did the AAF pilots like it, how long did it take for them to get used to it, and most of all, did it really work? And I suppose another question--why didn't the LW or the JIA have anything like them? Did they develop any?

I have two of these sights, one a K-14 like the one in the game, the other a Brit Mark II, the sight the US copied. Only it's a SEAC version--with Oscar and Tojo on the wingspan bar instead of Bf-109 and Me-110. Wonder if it will show up on the cowling of late Spits in PF?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v365/Jungmann/IL-Sig3.jpg

Jungmann

"Oh, the monkeys have no tails in Zamboanga..."

Jungmann
09-03-2004, 01:37 PM
I'm stoked to find this modelled in AEP in the D-model P-51. Use it sometimes, sometimes not. What do other people think of it?

And another question to you history experten--how did the AAF pilots like it, how long did it take for them to get used to it, and most of all, did it really work? And I suppose another question--why didn't the LW or the JIA have anything like them? Did they develop any?

I have two of these sights, one a K-14 like the one in the game, the other a Brit Mark II, the sight the US copied. Only it's a SEAC version--with Oscar and Tojo on the wingspan bar instead of Bf-109 and Me-110. Wonder if it will show up on the cowling of late Spits in PF?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v365/Jungmann/IL-Sig3.jpg

Jungmann

"Oh, the monkeys have no tails in Zamboanga..."

BlakJakOfSpades
09-03-2004, 01:46 PM
for me, its impractical. a dogfight moves too fast for me to be adjusting the distance of it as the distance is constantly changing, and in the short times i have to fire i just lead myself rather than use its special lead function. from what i've heard however, the pilots did like it IRL.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v344/BlakJakofSpades/sig2.jpg

LuftLuver
09-03-2004, 02:14 PM
"The K14 required 2 seconds to caculate the lead distance. An agonizing delay in a dogfight."

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"All your road courses are belong to us."

Chuck_Older
09-03-2004, 02:22 PM
In real life, some liked it, some didn't.

If you beleive what you read in some posts, it was an incredibly hyped piece of equipment that was supposed to turn you into a killing machine, but in reality, it sucked.

In FB, it has it's uses, but i guess that many sim pilots refuse to beleive it should have any limitations, and since it can't make you Dan'l Boone in every situation, it must be junk

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/Chuck_Older/BBB3.jpg
Killers in America work seven days a week~
Clash

Chuck_Older
09-03-2004, 02:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlakJakOfSpades:
for me, its impractical. a dogfight moves too fast for me to be adjusting the distance of it as the distance is constantly changing.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're using it wrong if you're constantly changing the range. In a P-51, the range was changed by twisting the throttle grip, but that type of "HOTAS" setup doesn't mean you should try to keep the pipper the same size as your target's wingspan as you gain or lose distance on it. And even if you WERE supposed to use it that way, what would be the point? It doesn't change your convergance at all, just the pipper size, which is all the 'range' adjustment you have. Set it so that it is sized approximately to the right size for your convergance range, then use it like a fixed sight that can calculate lead. Don't try to change the range constantly, you're over complicating the sight

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/Chuck_Older/BBB3.jpg
Killers in America work seven days a week~
Clash

Fennec_P
09-03-2004, 02:30 PM
I think its a nice general guide.

You just have to mentaly adjust above or below the computed pipper depending on range. If the target is far, put the pipper above the target. If very close, put the pipper below the target.

If nothing else, connecting the computed pipper and the fixed sight will make a snapshoot line that you can drag the target across.

I think it'd be more useful if it were on a plane other than the P-51. The spray+pray weapons and overly jerky pitch response rules out any kind of accurate shooting.

Chuck_Older
09-03-2004, 02:35 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=srch&s=400102&result_detail=3&x_as=&findw=K-14+Gunsight&f=23110283&sis=&dt=&author_name=Chuck_Older&sort_order=2&action=simplesearch&search=Search

that link should take you to some stuff I posted about how the K-14 works, if anyone is interested.

I am waaaay too lazy to even cut and paste a post today

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/Chuck_Older/BBB3.jpg
Killers in America work seven days a week~
Clash

Blutarski2004
09-03-2004, 02:41 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jungmann:
did it (K14) really work?


..... The K14 lead-computing gunsight was known in the 8AF as 'The Ace-maker'. I think that pretty much answers the questions of whether it worked and how well it was received by the fighter pilot community. In effect, it added about 100-200 yards to the maximum effective (killing) range of US fighter guns - essentially from 200 to 400 yards. Kills at ranges up to 700 yards using the K14 have been credited to certain 8AF aces, but I would not imagine such results to have been the expected norm. Such kills were almost certainly made against non-evading targets who either were unaware of their assailants or believed themselves to be safely out of effective gun range.

Luftlover is correct in his observation that the K14 required about 2 seconds to compute a firing solution. It also did not take kindly to aggressive or sudden maneuvers which would tumble the gyros. Yet, all in all, it worked as advertised and measurably improved the shooting results of pilots with average gunnery skills. Most fighter attacks were undetected bounces against unsuspecting and therefore non-evading targets. In such events, those 2 seconds were usually available to compute a firing solution and ensure that that first burst would lkiely hit the target.


And I suppose another question--why didn't the LW or the JIA have anything like them? Did they develop any?


..... The LW did develop a gyro-computing gunsight, but was unable to bring the design to field service standards before the end of the war.


I have two of these sights, one a K-14 like the one in the game, the other a Brit Mark II, the sight the US copied. Only it's a SEAC version--with Oscar and Tojo on the wingspan bar instead of Bf-109 and Me-110.


..... I'm really, really jealous. Where did you obtain them? Don't tell me EBay .... ;-)

BLUTARSKI