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Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 04:13 AM
Hi!
I think cocpit bf 110 is beautifull in FB (the same P-38) but i have some doubt about its FM.
I wonder if max dive speed was better then Bf109. In FB max dive speed Bf 110 is 920km/h. Next thing is cotrols(expecialy elevator) at high speed. As i know 110 controls became heavy at speed above 400km/h. So with speed 500 - 600 - 700 shuld be very heavy. Bf110 in Fb has much better cotrols(elevator) at high speed than P-38 (without dive break).
Next thing is that flaps combat are not jamming at high speed. in bf 110 combat flaps works even at 900 km/h. But these problem is in other planes too. I thought that combat flaps could be down without jamming at high speed only in some planes (for example P-51).

Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 04:13 AM
Hi!
I think cocpit bf 110 is beautifull in FB (the same P-38) but i have some doubt about its FM.
I wonder if max dive speed was better then Bf109. In FB max dive speed Bf 110 is 920km/h. Next thing is cotrols(expecialy elevator) at high speed. As i know 110 controls became heavy at speed above 400km/h. So with speed 500 - 600 - 700 shuld be very heavy. Bf110 in Fb has much better cotrols(elevator) at high speed than P-38 (without dive break).
Next thing is that flaps combat are not jamming at high speed. in bf 110 combat flaps works even at 900 km/h. But these problem is in other planes too. I thought that combat flaps could be down without jamming at high speed only in some planes (for example P-51).

Fehler
03-15-2004, 04:19 AM
That kinda makes up for the fact that the 110 rear gunner cant hit a darn thing. Did they train this guy at all? I swear I havent seen him hit a plane at even 100 meters! We have to send him back to gunnery school!

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Gershy
03-15-2004, 04:28 AM
I think the Bf110s FM seems to be quite ok. The controls ARE heavy at higher speeds, you can't roll at all anymore over 450 and it takes ages to pull out of a dive compared to other fighters. If the P38 is even worse in that it's rather a P38 FM problem. The 110 "feels" more or less like I expected it to be. I'd ask about P38FM http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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So long.We wish you well.
You told us how you weren't afraid to die.
Well then, so long.Don't cry.
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Not all martyrs see divinity.
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JaBo_HH--Gotcha
03-15-2004, 04:29 AM
witam ! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I think that the controls are getting heavy enough. Granted, combat flaps at about 900 seem pretty odd but besides the plane seems to be more or less ok. you can light it up quite easy. Cockpit armor is non-existant (when shot from below i often lost Gunner, got wounded and the engine started to smoke immediately..).
once it drops to 350 km/h and you're in a dogfight without support you're dead meat immediately...

maybe this flap thing is worth a look, but also on other planes.
Compared to the p-38, well. The p-38 is a flying tank, taking unbelievable amount of damage and generally fast.
In case you'd like to see how heavy the controls can get I'd suggest you to load it up with 2 x 500SD and go for a dive on a ship. once you're faster than 500 the ground will come near damn fast, although you're pulling like a jerk...

Of course I never applied flaps at over 420 so it maybe my fault.

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Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 04:43 AM
Has anybody info about max dive speed Bf110?

Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 04:53 AM
Bf110 is tought plane too now in FB(How diffrent opinions, isn't). But now in Fb most planes are to tought.

[This message was edited by Kwiatos on Mon March 15 2004 at 04:15 AM.]

[This message was edited by Kwiatos on Mon March 15 2004 at 04:30 AM.]

JaBo_HH-BlackSheep
03-15-2004, 05:02 AM
it is not tough.

you can shoot it to junk with a few salvos, P38 can fly home with a bruning engien http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

BTW: 110G2 is a groundattack plane and is / should be pretty good armored (the G2 was!)

Gershy
03-15-2004, 05:44 AM
The ingame G2 is pretty weak. One hit with light guns usually results in gunner killed, controls damaged and at least one engine smoking. I get elevator control damage nearly everytime someone just looks at my 110 in a mean way.

-----------------------------

So long.We wish you well.
You told us how you weren't afraid to die.
Well then, so long.Don't cry.
Or feel too down.
Not all martyrs see divinity.
But at least you tried.

Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 06:03 AM
I suggest you change side and try to shoted down Bf-110. Im sure its not weak. Could have havy damage and if you dont damage its control could fly very long even with smoking engines.
But i think max dive speed 920 km/h is so much for bf110 and elevator works not bad at these speed.

Atzebrueck
03-15-2004, 06:12 AM
At high speeds the 110 has got one of the heaviest elevators and ailerons of all planes http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

I don't know about which 110 you are talking. Certainly not about the one of FB, it seems http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.
It is not tough: Everytime I flew the 110 online my engines started to burn after a few bursts, my controls were gone and either me or the gunner have been killed.
It's one of the planes in which one gets shot down the most.

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Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 06:43 AM
Try P-38 you see what is heavy control. As i read P-38 had heavy elevator and these we have in FB (very heavy i think) , Bf110 had heavy elevator too but in FB had 100% better and you could pull out from dive without problem.
Bf 110 shloud be weak for damage. It was easy to shoot when was catched by single fighter. Bf 110 was quite good as a fighter in early years of war because its top speed, and firepower but beging from Battle of Brtitain have only little chance to survive when was catched by single fighter.

BlitzPig_DDT
03-15-2004, 07:29 AM
Why is it assumed that the 110 should be completely helpless and barely able to sustain flight under it's own power? This is rampant, and troublesome.

Further, why is it assumed that you can draw a direct comparison between the P-38 and Bf-110?

They are 2 totally different designs. Having 2 engines and props is their only similarity. Remember that the P-38 had a very low critical mach and entered into compressibility so easily because of the large gaps in the airframe and presence of the cockpit pod with relation to the H-stab/elevator.

I do suspect the compressibility of the P-38 is a bit overmodeled, but, then again, it might not be. Dive flaps were added because it was so bad remember. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Diving to over 500 in the 110 is a bad idea, controls become nearly useless. It doesn't take much damage at all, just the .50s from the early model P-38 tear it up. And finally, the 110 is meat on the table for anyone who is a half decent pilot, unless they are flying a large bomber, and even then it'd be close. lol

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BlitzPig_DDT
03-15-2004, 07:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kwiatos:
Try P-38 you see what is heavy control. As i read P-38 had heavy elevator and these we have in FB (very heavy i think) , Bf110 had heavy elevator too but in FB had 100% better and you could pull out from dive without problem.
Bf 110 shloud be weak for damage. It was easy to shoot when was catched by single fighter. Bf 110 was quite good as a fighter in early years of war because its top speed, and firepower but beging from Battle of Brtitain have only little chance to survive when was catched by single fighter.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ah, here's the problem. That does not account for context. It's NOT helpless. Nor should it be. You do seem to expect it to be however.

Fact is, in any single fighter you can pwnz it quite easily. And yes, it does go down pretty quick.

I don't mean to be rude, but, if you are having difficulty taking it down, I'd suggest going against lower level AI, and working on your overall aerial combat skills.

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Kwiatos
03-15-2004, 07:58 AM
Yea I could dive in Bf110 at 920 km/h and have no problem to pull out. I know that problem with P-38 was no with elevator cotrol but with lose lift at high speed - so whats for are dive flapes. I just wonder if Me110 could dive 920 km/h?

JaBo_HH-BlackSheep
03-15-2004, 08:12 AM
have you ever seen a 110 diving Online up to 920 km/h ???

it is completly useless in combat, cause you climb bad and can't manouver if you reach 500km/h you will need to got to 6 or 8k to reach this topspeed and you'll need verry long to pull it up.

Don't mess havy elevator control with compression (the thing the P38 has)

Gunner_361st
03-15-2004, 09:43 AM
I love the BF110. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

After 1942, yes, the BF110 is at a disadvantage. It's climb rate in that era is unremarkable, its top speed mediocre, and its high speed handling poor.

But if you do fly her right, you do have a chance to win. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

My best online sortie so far in the BF110 G2 is 2x P38J Lightnings and 1x P47 D10 Thunderbolts shot down. That is with default armament. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

While the BF110 can turn a tight circle for its size at slow speeds, I do not recommend it unless you have buddies to back you up. Best thing to do is E-fight just like an ME109. It may not be the best plane for the job, but you can do it, and its armament is excellent, especially with the amount of ammo they packed into it, even with default load.

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