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View Full Version : Frame Limiting options in AC?



jesped
11-29-2015, 06:45 PM
As I am unable to maintain constant 60fps in Syndicate I would prefer an option to have it locked at 30fps, crank up the quality and resolution and let my display's Frame Interpolation smooth things out, which works great on most games. Problem is I've never seen a frame locking option in Assassin's Creed PC games.

Using a 390x with 15.11 Crimson drivers in Win7 and Win10 I currently tried several methods of frame limiting to 30:

AMD Crimson Frame Limiter option in drivers = Massive stutter
RTSS = lots of stutter
DXtory = stutter
Fraps with buffer video = heavy stutter
RadeonPro with forced Double Vsync (equivalent to Nvidia's Half Refresh) = better than any of the above but still stutter

So I think I'm running out of options to get stutter-free locked 30fps, and I wonder:

How is possible that in a PC with an i7@4,5GHz, 16GB and a 390x 8GB GDDR5 the Assassin's Creed games run worse than a PS4? It's not just Syndicate, Unity was exactly the same.

Despite the differences in quality, resolution and some under-30 ocasional dips, the PS4 videos I see on Youtube show a much smoother experience, which is staggeringly shaming.

How hard can it be for UBI dev team to just put a Frame Limiter option inside their games options or an option in the .ini file?

Any ideas?...

Rohith_Kumar_Sp
11-29-2015, 07:41 PM
Just use rivatuner and limit the FPS to 60 in the settings, or just use adaptive Vsync in Nvidia control panel.

jesped
11-29-2015, 07:52 PM
Just use rivatuner and limit the FPS to 60 in the settings, or just use adaptive Vsync in Nvidia control panel.

It seems either I don't do a good job explaining myself or you don't like to read much.

I am talking AMD (390x, but tried before with a 290x and a 7970), not Nvidia.

RTSS = Rivatuner Statistics Server

I'm trying to lock at 30, not 60.

I have a friend with a Nvidia 670SLI that says is ok forcing Nvidia "Half Refresh", but despite being the AMD's equivalent "Double Vsync" the best option so far for AMD users, there is still stutter.

Rohith_Kumar_Sp
11-29-2015, 08:03 PM
the problem with setting 30 FPS lock is that the cloth and Water/Rain physics are set to 30 FPS lock within the game and it makes the game that much worse, as with RTSS, i tried 60 FPS lock myself didn't have a problem, haven't tried 30 FPS. one other thing you can do it try Fraps or CAM app by NZXT and see if limiting it to 30 any smother.

strigoi1958
11-29-2015, 08:15 PM
Even though games are being released nowadays locked at 30 FPS and causing an outcry from groups like the framerate police.... I don't think ANY game offers that option not just AC games... as Rohith has correctly said Rivatuner or or adaptive vsync in NVCP are the only options.

Unfortunately Nvidia is far from perfect when it comes to drivers but as they work hand in hand with AC it means AMD take a while longer to come out with a good driver :(

You are right to point out that it is better to have a game with a set 30 FPS that runs smoothly and you can set your graphics quality to your own preference than to have higher FPS.
On fast driving and flying games it would be better to have more FPS but on games like AC... they are amazing on console and I'd be happy at that level even if I couldn't add nvidia or AMD options. I think more and more games will appear soon with locked FPS.

Frag_Maniac
11-29-2015, 09:26 PM
Currently I have resorted to....

1. Med settings with FXAA, Vsync On, AO Off, @ 900p
2. Disabling Bloom and Post FX in the AC.ini
3. Capping FPS to 40 via RTSS

Gameplay is so smooth now it rarely hitches. I never tried capping at 30, but honestly, I think I'd rather play at 40 and get a few hitches.

Spec:

i7-950
7970
8GB
W7

YazX_
11-29-2015, 11:04 PM
you can try to edit AC.ini here:

Documents\Assassin's Creed Syndicate

set

RefreshRate=X

to

RefreshRate=30

save and try it out.

jorimt
11-30-2015, 01:47 AM
It seems either I don't do a good job explaining myself or you don't like to read much.

I am talking AMD (390x, but tried before with a 290x and a 7970), not Nvidia.

RTSS = Rivatuner Statistics Server

I'm trying to lock at 30, not 60.

I have a friend with a Nvidia 670SLI that says is ok forcing Nvidia "Half Refresh", but despite being the AMD's equivalent "Double Vsync" the best option so far for AMD users, there is still stutter.

You need both a 30 fps cap via RTSS and Double Vsync (30Hz) enabled for a consistent, stutterless framerate (as long as you can stay at or above 30 at all times with your specific settings and setup, of course). FYI, each methods do very separate things. RTSS involves limiting frametimes (30 fps cap = 33.3ms), and 1/2 refresh/Double Vsync involves limiting refresh rate (half refresh rate of 60Hz is 30Hz). Most people that complain about 30 fps PC gaming not being as smooth as consoles is because they never enable both.


the problem with setting 30 FPS lock is that the cloth and Water/Rain physics are set to 30 FPS lock within the game and it makes the game that much worse, as with RTSS, i tried 60 FPS lock myself didn't have a problem, haven't tried 30 FPS. one other thing you can do it try Fraps or CAM app by NZXT and see if limiting it to 30 any smother.

The reason for that is because the cloth physics glitch is tied to refresh rate, not framerate. As I stated above, RTSS caps frametime, not refresh rate. Putting the game in 30Hz, along with a 30 fps cap via RTSS will correct that issue, at least until they patch in a fix for 60Hz+ refresh rates.

jesped
11-30-2015, 11:48 PM
you can try to edit AC.ini here:

Documents\Assassin's Creed Syndicate

set RefreshRate=X to RefreshRate=30 save and try it out.

Already tried that, and DisplayableRefreshRate, which was present in AC4 .ini file. None of those work when set to 30.



Even though games are being released nowadays locked at 30 FPS and causing an outcry from groups like the framerate police.... I don't think ANY game offers that option not just AC games... as Rohith has correctly said Rivatuner or or adaptive vsync in NVCP are the only options.

Unfortunately Nvidia is far from perfect when it comes to drivers but as they work hand in hand with AC it means AMD take a while longer to come out with a good driver :(

You are right to point out that it is better to have a game with a set 30 FPS that runs smoothly and you can set your graphics quality to your own preference than to have higher FPS.
On fast driving and flying games it would be better to have more FPS but on games like AC... they are amazing on console and I'd be happy at that level even if I couldn't add nvidia or AMD options. I think more and more games will appear soon with locked FPS.

Yes, there is many games in PC that either are capped by default at 30 or have a menu or config option to limit framerate. I am currently playing The Evil Within, which has an option in the menu to choose either 30 or 60, and it doesn't have any problem when you play. It is perfectly smooth as a PS4 (I just compared with locked 30fps in Infamous Second Son last night).

Then I launch Unity or Syndicate and just rotating the view does microstuttering. It feels like there is something just wrong trying to force the Anvil engine to do locked 30fps with external tools, even with Double Vsync. But the AC console versions are locked 30fps... so there is that. Why there is no option for Frame Limiting in the PC ports is what amazes me at this point. It doesn't seem like it would take a lot of work from the devs part.




the problem with setting 30 FPS lock is that the cloth and Water/Rain physics are set to 30 FPS lock within the game and it makes the game that much worse, as with RTSS, i tried 60 FPS lock myself didn't have a problem, haven't tried 30 FPS. one other thing you can do it try Fraps or CAM app by NZXT and see if limiting it to 30 any smother.

On the contrary, having 30fps physics in a 30fps game makes much more sense than having 30fps physics in a 60fps game, which is what is happening right now with Syndicate.

As written in my first post, I already tried Fraps, and even other video recording apps that do a similar job. All of them show different degrees of stutter and/or microstutter.




You need both a 30 fps cap via RTSS and Double Vsync (30Hz) enabled for a consistent, stutterless framerate (as long as you can stay at or above 30 at all times with your specific settings and setup, of course). FYI, each methods do very separate things. RTSS involves limiting frametimes (30 fps cap = 33.3ms), and 1/2 refresh/Double Vsync involves limiting refresh rate (half refresh rate of 60Hz is 30Hz). Most people that complain about 30 fps PC gaming not being as smooth as consoles is because they never enable both.

The reason for that is because the cloth physics glitch is tied to refresh rate, not framerate. As I stated above, RTSS caps frametime, not refresh rate. Putting the game in 30Hz, along with a 30 fps cap via RTSS will correct that issue, at least until they patch in a fix for 60Hz+ refresh rates.

I am unable of running RTSS along with RadeonPro. The game crashes at launch, even adding RTSS.exe to the exclusion list inside RadeonPro's preferences.

RTSS doesn't alter the displayed Hz by your display. RadeonPro doesn't alter the Hz either even when using Double Vsync, it is a different method than RTSS or Fraps or DXtory. RadeonPro has its own Frame Limiter, that can be used along with Double Vsync or not, but it just introduces more stutter instead of making it smoother.


I would love to find a good solution for this, as I see it coming every year with each new AC title released, but my point is that it seems that it would be easily fixable by the devs just adding an option to the PC versions that locks the game the same way it is locked on consoles.

Is there any way to ask the devs directly about this?

jarvisjones
12-01-2015, 01:50 AM
I have been playing max graphics and I just had to turn on vsync and set the refresh rate to 30 in game. works fine and ive tested it (I use evga precision but uplay also has a frame counter you can turn on). if you don't have the option to change refresh rate to 30 you should still be able to set it to 30 fps in the control panel.

jesped
12-01-2015, 02:16 AM
I have been playing max graphics and I just had to turn on vsync and set the refresh rate to 30 in game. works fine and ive tested it (I use evga precision but uplay also has a frame counter you can turn on). if you don't have the option to change refresh rate to 30 you should still be able to set it to 30 fps in the control panel.

Maybe that would be an option, but my display (Panasonic PT-AE5000E projector) doesn't have a 30Hz progressive output by default. It has a 30Hz Interlaced display mode, but Interlaced modes doesn't work in windows games.

I've been trying to force a 30Hz Progressive resolution, but so far nothing has worked. The most near I reached was fooling the system forcing an EDID resolution that sets 30 over a 60Hz original mode, and even the games display it as 30, but on the real gameplay nothing is changed, it is still unlocked and trying to do 60.

But although maybe forcing a real 30Hz resolution may work, it is not the main point, because both PS4 and other PC games work perfectly in my display when locked at 30fps with a 60Hz display signal.

jandraelune
12-01-2015, 05:44 AM
ACS has the same goals placed on it as ACU. 1080@30.

The ' engine ' used in ACU and ACS is simply not optimized to run faster then 30fps.

Remember consoles and PC's have different API's and hardware. Console API can handle 500% more Draw Calls...but their hardware cant handle a single large event. PC's are the other way around limited to 10k Draw Calls with Dx11 vs Console at 50k Draw Calls.

ACU fails hard on PC due to that issue...the Draw Calls over tax the API and the hardware is waiting for the API to catch up....but instead of idling down the hardware speeds up =.=

ACS runs smoother due to far far less Draw Calls, which allows it to run on less system resources then ACU.

Ubisoft them self said they wanted to push the API to get more detail then any other game. They did that at the cost of maxing out the API and resulting in breaking performance and glitching engine with endless NPC and clutter break downs.

jorimt
12-01-2015, 05:54 AM
Maybe that would be an option, but my display (Panasonic PT-AE5000E projector) doesn't have a 30Hz progressive output by default. It has a 30Hz Interlaced display mode, but Interlaced modes doesn't work in windows games.

I've been trying to force a 30Hz Progressive resolution, but so far nothing has worked. The most near I reached was fooling the system forcing an EDID resolution that sets 30 over a 60Hz original mode, and even the games display it as 30, but on the real gameplay nothing is changed, it is still unlocked and trying to do 60.

But although maybe forcing a real 30Hz resolution may work, it is not the main point, because both PS4 and other PC games work perfectly in my display when locked at 30fps with a 60Hz display signal.

Yeah, I'm running a Nvidia setup myself. I didn't realize AMD's Double Vsync version only limited fps, not refresh rate. Also didn't know RadeonPro had compatibility issues with RTSS.

Nvidia's 1/2 Refresh option actually limits the refresh rate through vsync on a 60Hz display, which bypasses any compatibility issues that can be had with certain displays. That is unfortunate that you're display can't accept a native progressive 30Hz signal.

It appears however, that RadeonPro has a 1/2 refresh rate option titled "Always On (Double Vsync)" under the Tweaks tab, and as you said, a framerate limiter titled "Dynamic Framerate Control" built in. Both are listed in the documentation here: http://www.radeonpro.info/manual/contents/the-tweaks-tab

As you said though, they may not be as effective as RTSS + Nvidia 1/2 refresh in smoothing out the game at 30 fps.

Good luck, I hope you get it working ;)

Frag_Maniac
12-01-2015, 06:26 AM
I tried using the AC.ini refresh command to go to 30 and it puts the game at 24. I tried capping it to 30 with RTSS, and that of course works, but the frame rate being so low as I suspected caused such a lack of smoothness it looks like micro stutter.

So I'm going back to lower graphics settings using 40 FPS. Hope the patch sorts out the performance problems like it did with Unity. I guess we'll know soon.

jesped
12-01-2015, 04:57 PM
There is several elements at play for the final result, and the display is one of them too. In my primary display, any stutter/microstutter is much more noticeable due to Frame Interpolation. I have a secondary Acer 254 120Hz monitor and the stutter is much less noticeable there.

But this is not a problem of my display, because ALL other games work ok and are smooth. It is just UBI titles and specially AC games that stutter like a$$.

Will try the new patch, but I think nothing has changed in this regard.