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WUAF_Co_Hero
07-10-2004, 02:51 AM
I found a few months back, what I'm sure many of you know, but I haven't seen any posts about it, so here it is.

In WWII, American tracers (at least, for the fighters) were red (like in FB / AEP), however, they weren't ONLY red (in reference to the .50's). The tracers would become white as the belt neared its end, to warn the pilot that he was low on ammo and to return to base.

Seeing as there is no ammo count, and counting seconds is a bit overboard since our lives aren't infact on the line, would this not be a good feature to add in, if possible?

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

WUAF_Co_Hero
07-10-2004, 02:51 AM
I found a few months back, what I'm sure many of you know, but I haven't seen any posts about it, so here it is.

In WWII, American tracers (at least, for the fighters) were red (like in FB / AEP), however, they weren't ONLY red (in reference to the .50's). The tracers would become white as the belt neared its end, to warn the pilot that he was low on ammo and to return to base.

Seeing as there is no ammo count, and counting seconds is a bit overboard since our lives aren't infact on the line, would this not be a good feature to add in, if possible?

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

LuftLuver
07-10-2004, 02:59 AM
Well, the US tracers are just completely wrong if you have watched even one or two runs of original guncam footage.

They are way too dark and they fire out in odd looking even pairs. They should be staggered, visible longer and much much brighter if Forgotten Battles wants to be more SIM-like.

Something more like the tracers of the I~16 would be way better for realism.

""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
"All your bases are belong to us."

Bob the Pilot
07-10-2004, 03:48 AM
US tracers look completely wrong in the game (sim) if you look at guncam footage. I think Oleg should see these. Sometimes it seems they only had tracer rounds in two of the machine guns, and the tracers clearly have a smoke trail.

Aaron_GT
07-10-2004, 04:07 AM
Remember that camera footage and how the eye sees bright lights is different. (The camera does indeed lie).

WUAF_Co_Hero
07-10-2004, 09:31 AM
This is all true, I have seen the guncam footage also, and thought the brightness may be obscured by a black and white camera, the shape is very distinct. The .50's litterally look like stretched out 'V's next to eachother. In that, I mean... they aren't perfectly straight by any stretch (the tracer rounds anyways).

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

WWMaxGunz
07-10-2004, 10:13 AM
Aaron, it depends on how much the film is affected by IR frequencies, which it is to some
extent. There's also the aperature setting for the camera.

Still there's pilot accounts saying they could tell by the tracers where the shots were.

And... if those muzzle flashes can be like they are then I don't think that 'can't see the
tracers' is very consistant. Do you? It's more like 'what isn't good is done, sometimes'
where one standard would be more in line. IMHO, different people are doing the data and
layouts of different planes or even aspects of the modelling, like DM's of different planes
and different guns. Then there's the feedback of the testers....


Neal

Aaron_GT
07-10-2004, 10:21 AM
I'd agree on the consistency.

With regard to being able to see them - gun cam footage is an unknown variable due to the factors you mention, plus in real life we have better visual acuity, stereoscopic vision, etc. The sim should try to simulate what reality looks like though! (i.e. NOT those horrible frame-rate killing muzzle flashes!)

TooCool_12f
07-10-2004, 02:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The .50's litterally look like stretched out 'V's next to eachother. In that, I mean... they aren't perfectly straight by any stretch (the tracer rounds anyways).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


no way.

the "V's" you see are the result of camera shake. The tracers follow a path that's, basically, straight (slight gravity drop and wind shift would be the only visible deviations)

Try to find footage where the camera isn't on the shooting vehicle and watch them there, you'll see what I mean http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

73GIAP_Milan
07-10-2004, 04:04 PM
Play B17 Flying Fortress (2) - The Mighty Eigth and have a look at those tracers..

I really think they come close as they were in real life, clearly visible, not red but more orange and last but nog least, NOT completely straight like those I-16 Laserbeams.. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Don't jump me now, but i've taken a small film once, with hypercam from b17 and converted it to greyscale..the footage became pretty much like the WWII guncamfootage when it came to tracer-realism..

just some idea here.. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Salute and Regards,

73GvIAP_Milan
Formerly known as: Der_Tote_Baron
______________________________
73GvIAP Squadron Leader for IL2 Sturmovik

LeadSpitter_
07-10-2004, 04:34 PM
when i first came to this game thats the first thing i noticed that looked so bad was tracer colors.

tie fighters, theres noway 303s look like .50 either

.50s int his game seem to all fire at the same exact time which is giving them a this crazy recoil.

the real guns were syncronized fire 2 at a time from then inner outwards giving the guns great accuracy and perfectly sycronized, this also increased the rof

The tracers should definatly be slightly thicker and orangish not, have more base to the sound. I have seen the browning m2 two fired a couple times with red phosphorus. Also not all squads used them, some used tracer for thier inner guns only white other squads used red. some used non except at the end of the clip to show when they are close to being out of ammunition.

I myself cant stand the red tracers and always prefered the white burning trace.


I really am not a fan of the lazer beams effect they use. Long two colored super bright strip of color, not a small looking burning round that fades very quick and disapates in color.

cfs3 and mighty eight ii have the most realistic tracers and real gun sounds.

http://img14.photobucket.com/albums/v43/leadspitter/LSIG1.gif

PlaneEater
07-10-2004, 04:35 PM
The B-17II tracers were intended to mimic gun camera footage. The dev team did that deliberately, and did it against the advice of the game's historical and technical advisors, many of whom were WWII vets.

So don't take B-17II as a good example.

PraetorHonoris
07-10-2004, 05:12 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 73GIAP_Milan:
I really think they come close as they were in real life, clearly visible, not red but more orange and last but nog least, NOT completely straight
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

My maschine gun must have been wrong... I saw completly straight tracers when firing.
Hey, but it was just a MG3 (improved MG42), maybe US maschine guns cause different tracers http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Serious:having seen lots of tracers during my time in the Luftwaffe, tracers seem quite fine, maybe the brightness could be higher on .50cal, but they are as straight in RL as they are in the game.



http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/7306/Aermelband.jpg
Jagdgeschwader 71 "Richthofen"

http://smilies.cw08.calibra-web.de/html/images/smilies/armee/wos_armee_063.gif http://smilies.cw08.calibra-web.de/html/images/smilies/armee/wos_armee_099.gif http://smilies.cw08.calibra-web.de/html/images/smilies/armee/wos_armee_071.gif
Oleg Maddox Ready Room in Action

TooCool_12f
07-11-2004, 08:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Play B17 Flying Fortress (2) - The Mighty Eigth and have a look at those tracers..

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


excuse me, but you take a game to proove the point about real life? if you take a game, it has no more legitimity than IL2 or crimson skies. A game is the way it is because the programmer wanted it that way, not because that was what real life looks like.

Again, find real time footage filmed by a camera that wasn't tied to the shooter and you'll see what it really looks like

TooCool_12f
07-11-2004, 08:39 AM
here you have two videos where you can see tracers:

http://www.knobcreekshoot.com/images/videos/Machine%20Gun%20Mayhem300.wmv


http://www.bigjimsmgs.com/VIDEOS99/tracer.avi

right click and "save as"

resolution isn't that great, but it serves the purpose http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

73GIAP_Milan
07-11-2004, 08:39 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif what can i say to that? Them tracers sure look a whole lot more realistic than the current laserlike stuff the guns are currently spewing out...

and for the guys that have seen Band Of Brothers; those tracers by the mg42's are certainly NOT straight, as those guns recoil and shake...imagine the same thing happening in a dogfight, with moving planes.. - you know the story.
Read the book; Farewell Mickey Mouse by Len Deighton, there are a few passages in it describing the tracers iirc...

Sure as hell that i aint no wwII vet, nor a weapon specialist, but hey, anything is more realistic then the current tracers in Il2..

Salute and Regards,

73GvIAP_Milan
Formerly known as: Der_Tote_Baron
______________________________
73GvIAP Squadron Leader for IL2 Sturmovik

PraetorHonoris
07-11-2004, 09:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 73GIAP_Milan:
and for the guys that have seen Band Of Brothers; those tracers by the mg42's are certainly NOT straight<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't you get it? I was shooting this gun very often, when I was in the Luftwaffe.
The tracers are straight.

This is my experiance with this weapon, not what I read about it. And I trust my experiance.
I don't care about what you have read somewhere. I have seen these tracers.



http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/7306/Aermelband.jpg
Jagdgeschwader 71 "Richthofen"

http://smilies.cw08.calibra-web.de/html/images/smilies/armee/wos_armee_063.gif http://smilies.cw08.calibra-web.de/html/images/smilies/armee/wos_armee_099.gif http://smilies.cw08.calibra-web.de/html/images/smilies/armee/wos_armee_071.gif
Oleg Maddox Ready Room in Action

GvSAP_Dart
07-11-2004, 12:47 PM
Unfortunately, we've all been trained to think tracers are squiggly things in the air when fired from aircraft - not unusual, considering that:

A) The vast bulk (99.9%) of all real footage of aircraft firing at other aircraft comes from gun cameras, which were shaking like all get out and not designed for cinematic quality.

B) Hollywood used a heckuva lot of it at first, and then, in order to maintain "consistency" with earlier films that used it, kept the squigglies in effect. The average Joe out there would be upset and cry "fake" if a WWII movie came out and none of the tracers wiggled about.

C) I have seen tracers wiggle while firing an M-60 machinegun...but it was due to the recoil (bipod from the prone). However, AG, who was less than a foot away, wasn't hindered and they were quite straight to him....as they were for me when we exchanged roles. Likewise, when firing a proper 5-7 round burst, the tracers straighted up nice and cleanly for me.

____________________________________
http://www.darts-page.com for more foolishness

S 8
07-11-2004, 01:36 PM
I like the tracers in Forrest Gump http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/113_1089291819_super3.jpg

Choctaw111
07-11-2004, 02:08 PM
I spent 12 years in the US Army and I was in the Airborne Infantry and have fired many types of machine guns and have seen countless tracers. Tracers look straight to the person or camera that is not affected by the recoil. But when you are actually shooting the gun they look squigly because your eyes and head are shaking from the recoil. I am not sure how much recoil the pilots felt when shooting machine guns or cannons but if it was a lot then they would look slightly sqiggly specially for the camera. They should have this in the game. When you fire tracers look squiggly but as soon as you realease the trigger button they would look straight. They should also have a realistic gun camara that takes movies in black and white and shows the squiggly tracers just like in real like. I actually have a lot of camcorder footage that I made myself or had one of my Army buddies take while I was firing machine guns including the M2 50 Cal that is the subject of so much debate. I wish that I had a way to put it on my computer so that I could post it here...

Jippo01
07-11-2004, 04:45 PM
Footage of "straight" tracers:

http://www.pipari.net/maccari/pohta/Pimeaammunta.mpg


-jippo

LeLv28 - Fighting for independency since 2002
http://www.lelv28.com

Falkster's Ju-88 fan site:
www.ju88.de.tf (http://www.ju88.de.tf)

WUAF_Co_Hero
07-11-2004, 09:43 PM
Then perhaps the addition of "squiggly" tracers should be added for the first person perspective of the pilot shooting? In other words, tracers would BE straight, but if you were IN the plane firing, they would seem squiggly. Don't know if this is possible, but I presume that would be THE most realistic alternative would it not?

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

VW-IceFire
07-11-2004, 10:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WUAF_Co_Hero:
Then perhaps the addition of "squiggly" tracers should be added for the first person perspective of the pilot shooting? In other words, tracers would BE straight, but if you were IN the plane firing, they would seem squiggly. Don't know if this is possible, but I presume that would be THE most realistic alternative would it not?

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ahh the realm of cinematic effects. Thats where you take the simulation of FB and take it to the next level putting the immense quality of the simulation underneath you and then add effects to try and add flare and style to whats going on around you. I hope that some of that becomes a part of BoB. Not in an unrealistic way and not in a prohibitive way...but just to fool us a little more into thinking were there.

As it stands, we haven't seen daylight showings of American style red tracers yet. At night they are quite visible...of course so are the ones in the game. How about during the day time.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/tmv-sig1.jpg
RCAF 412 Falcon Squadron - "Swift to Avenge"

Bob the Pilot
07-12-2004, 03:13 AM
The point is that the tracers don't look right. I always knew that they look different on the guncam than in reality (especially the jiggle-like effect). But they definitely don't look like this. All the guns fire at the same time, this is not realistic, and the tracers should be brighter.

jurinko
07-12-2004, 06:50 AM
i saw a P47 footage strafing trains and it seemed to me that the density of tracer rounds was quite high and only 1 mg in each wing had the tracers loaded. They were of white-yellow glowing colour but it was colorized footage so it´s just my perception. They flew pretty straight.

---------------------
Letka_13/Liptow @ HL

Bob the Pilot
07-12-2004, 07:48 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jurinko:
i saw a P47 footage strafing trains and it seemed to me that the density of tracer rounds was quite high and only 1 mg in each wing had the tracers loaded. They were of white-yellow glowing colour but it was colorized footage so it´s just my perception. They flew pretty straight.

All the guncams I've seen are like this... The density of the tracer rounds is quite high and only 1 mg in each wing had tracer rounds. The German tracers on the other hand seem quite accurate.

---------------------
Letka_13/Liptow @ HL
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

TgD Thunderbolt56
07-12-2004, 08:00 AM
I'd really like the opportunity to get completely rid of tracers in my 50's. Give me a full load-out of API



http://home.earthlink.net/~aclzkim1/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/il2sig2.jpg

Choctaw111
07-12-2004, 08:35 PM
You can see the 50 cal tracers very well during the day. In Il2 they are very difficult to see at all. You can barely see them even right when they come out of the gun. Also when they come out of the gun they look like a very long thin streak of a bright red, orange color. The bullets travel so fast that the human eye percieves them a a long streak, not the short stubby things in FB. I have a friend who might be able to take my Hi-8 camcorder footage of the me firing the 50 cal and put it on my computer so that I can post it here. You should see the 50 cal tracers at night!!!! They are very bright and they travel for 2,200 meters before they burn out!!! That is over one and a half miles! Thay burn for about 4 seconds keeping in mind that once a bullet leaves the barrel is starts to quickly slow down due to the friction of the air. Also bullets need to bounce off of more objects including the ground. Some bullets will stick in the ground, especially depending on the angle they hit the ground, but when you are low level strafing ground targets most of the bullets will bounce off the ground into the air. It is really neat to whatch the tracers bouncing around and then flying into the air...

Choctaw111
07-12-2004, 08:42 PM
If anyone is intersted I also have a digital camera that can take movies. I just recently got it. I have some 50 cal tracer rounds here at home that I "aquired" during my years in the Army. I can pull the bullet from the casing and light the tracer compound with a torch( I have done this many time before so don't worry. The tracers need a lot of heat to ignite. Some people believe that once they come into contact with the air that they light off but they don't. They require the intense heat from the gunpoder charge to light.) If anyone is interested I will try to post it here. The tracer is so bright that you can not look at it directly without seeing spots afterwards if you know what I mean. I hope that this will clear up any doubts about how a 50 cal tracer is supposed to look like...

TheJoyStick
07-12-2004, 09:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Choctaw111:
If anyone is intersted I also have a digital camera that can take movies. I just recently got it. I have some 50 cal tracer rounds here at home that I "aquired" during my years in the Army. I can pull the bullet from the casing and light the tracer compound with a torch( I have done this many time before so don't worry. The tracers need a lot of heat to ignite. Some people believe that once they come into contact with the air that they light off but they don't. They require the intense heat from the gunpoder charge to light.) If anyone is interested I will try to post it here. The tracer is so bright that you can not look at it directly without seeing spots afterwards if you know what I mean. I hope that this will clear up any doubts about how a 50 cal tracer is supposed to look like...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Can't wait.

Choctaw111
07-12-2004, 09:43 PM
How do I post a movie. I would love for all of you to see what an actual 50 cal tracer looks like. I told my oldest son that we would be filming it this time(burning the tracer) and we will do it tomorrow(13JUL04). If someone can tell me how to post a movie or even a picture since I do not know how I will make sure I get this here sometime tomorrow!

TooCool_12f
07-13-2004, 11:02 AM
making the tracers "squiggly" may be difficult, but one way to make it "realistic" would be to "simply" shake the pilot when shooting. However, I'm ready to bet that many would complain that they can't see anything (including tracers) if they were shaken that way. What's more, the tracers are "seen" squiggly by the camera for a reason: a tracer is a "travelling point". The camera has an aperture delay which makes it register the tracer as a line, and as the camera is shaken during the recording, the line doesn't appear straight. On our PCs, the tracers are drawn as lines (necessary since there's no "aperture delay" on PC display), which means that you wouldn't ever see them "squiggly" unless they're drawn that way for everybody.


another thing I notice is that some people want them "more visible", while others call them "lasers"... this argument seems far from over to me http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

WUAF_Co_Hero
07-13-2004, 12:51 PM
I am aware of why they seem squiggly, and thought it may be HARD, so is making a flight sim. And if anyone would complain that they shake when shooting, then they have no place here (as long as say... a P-51 shakes less than say... a 109k4). Just because it makes it harder, is no reason to avoid realism.

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

Choctaw111
07-13-2004, 01:31 PM
I have just come in from outside and have lit off the 50 Cal tracer. I am sorry to say that my digital camera was set on a very low resolution setting so the movie is very small. I can not seem to edit the movie as I need a lot more practice with Adobe ImageReady. I have a picture from the clip though I just need to know how to post it here. I also recorded it on my Sony Hi8 camcorder. The tracer is very bright and there is no way that you would have anyt rouble seeing in on even the brightest day which it was fairly bright outside today. Will someone please tell me how to post a picture. Thanks....

TheJoyStick
07-13-2004, 01:54 PM
Awesome.


www.photobucket.com (http://www.photobucket.com) better hurry, though, they stop taking registrations in 2 hours.


I have a public account if you want to use it.

PublicPhotoAccount2 - Password is green48

Just upload it there, and copy the [img] tag, then post it here.

[This message was edited by TheJoyStick on Tue July 13 2004 at 01:04 PM.]

Choctaw111
07-13-2004, 02:34 PM
I have posted the picture at photobucket. Thanks joystick.http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/50Cal.bmp
But as you can see that even on a bright day the 50Cal tracer still burns very brightly. The flame you are seeing IS THE TRACER AND NOT THE TORCH!!! The flame from the propane torch is not even visible in this photograph...

[This message was edited by Choctaw111 on Tue July 13 2004 at 01:47 PM.]

[This message was edited by Choctaw111 on Tue July 13 2004 at 02:42 PM.]

Choctaw111
07-13-2004, 02:41 PM
If you look closely I am using a torch to get enough heat to light the tracer. Rmember that the flame you see is NOT THE TORCH but the tracer burning!! I am sorry that the picture is so small but you can see how bright it is and that it would not be difficult to see at all. As I have said ealier a 50 Cal tracer will burn out after it has traveled 2,200 Meters or over 1 1/2 MILES!!! It burns for over 3 seconds. Oh, and when the tracer burns out the bullet still keeps on going till it does hit something. Maybe this isn't modeled in the game due the processing power it would take to keep the bullets going even after the tracer has burned out but who knows...Just imagine this thing traveling at 1,000 meters per second what a long bright streak this would make!!! Man I wish the the 50 Cal tracers look this bright in the game and that they made a bright long streak right when they come out of the gun just like the way it is in real life. It would be awesome!!!!! Also note the smoke that is vidible just above and left of the burning tracer. These tracers do produce smoke but not as much as we are used to seeing in FB. The smoke in FB is too dense and needs to be lessened a bit...http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/50Cal.bmp

[This message was edited by Choctaw111 on Tue July 13 2004 at 01:51 PM.]

[This message was edited by Choctaw111 on Tue July 13 2004 at 02:44 PM.]

Matz0r
07-13-2004, 04:04 PM
The germans are way ahead of the yanks, they invented tracers that covered the target instead of showing the bullet path http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

TheJoyStick
07-13-2004, 07:09 PM
I must say, you've got some stones holding that flare like that.. I've never tried it, but I'm sure they get pretty warm, aye?

Choctaw111
07-13-2004, 07:15 PM
You use the word flare which I guess a tracer kind of is. But remember that this is an actual 50 Cal Tracer round that I had just pulled from the brass casing just before I lit it off. I used a pair of pliers to hold the tracer with because it gets VERY HOT!!! You can see how bright it is even on a sunny day. No problem seeing them at all!!!

TheJoyStick
07-13-2004, 07:27 PM
Err, tracer, yeah, sorry... But, yeah.. Stones...

Choctaw111
07-13-2004, 07:34 PM
I have done this many times before but not recently. The first time I did it with a 50 Cal I was a little nervous but after that it was just a fun thing to do...Do you think that after seeing how bright they really are that the 50 Cal tracers in FB need to be reworked? I think so but what do you all think?

WUAF_Co_Hero
07-14-2004, 04:26 AM
I think it would infact be nice to see a more beefy tracer in FB for the .50, but to do it I think would require a general reworking of how all MG's are, as they are all probobly like this in some respect.

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

VFA-195 Snacky
07-14-2004, 09:29 AM
They probably dont want to make the tracers more visable because it will show the horrible dispersion.lol
ok ok, sorry bad joke. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Seriously I hope at some point the tracers can be adjusted to be more visable. It would be really cool to see those tracer balls glance off every now and then too like the real thing.

http://www.x-plane.org/users/531seawolf/b_a_presidential_first.jpg
"Navy1, Call the Ball- Roger Ball."

LuftLuver
07-14-2004, 10:02 AM
go fire the gunz on the I~16 and you will realise how woefully invisible the FB .50 tracers are compared to real life footage.

The I~16 gunz will show you just what is possible in FB, but being denied for the .50. Fix this problem, and I suspect many of the other complaints would dissolve away since ppl would finally see if they are hitting the target.

C'mon 1C games, we aren't working with dinosaurs here. Plenty of footage from 1941-45 so we don't have to guess. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
"All your bases are belong to us."

TheJoyStick
07-14-2004, 02:35 PM
I think an option to "Turn Off" tracers would be more welcomed than a tweak of the existing ones.

Choctaw111
07-14-2004, 03:32 PM
Here are what the 50 Cal tracers are supposed to look like. Remember that I had been in the US Army Infantry for over 12 years and the 50 was my baby. I know so much about this gun that I would regularly teach classes on how to take it apart, maintain it and of coarse to shoot it. Notice that I have added the ricochets with the appropriate amount of tracer smoke also. The tracers will seem to leave a thicker smoke trail after they hit something and slow down. This is the way it really is. I have used to color from the picture that I posted of me lighting the 50 Cal tracer so you could see the color and brightness so these are the most realistic tracers you will see for the 50 Cal anywhere. I hope that you like it. Tell me what you think...This is what the HUMAN EYE WILL SEE if you were looking at it from this perspective and if you are in the cockpit the tracers will look to have the same long streak not because of any camera but because of the HUMAN EYE!!!! I wish the Oleg would see this end realize that all of his tracer types need to be a really long streak right when they come out of the gun, at least from the pilots perspctive. When they are getting farther away they start to look like just a dot of that particular tracer color but when they are close to you they look like a long streak. Close, STREAK, far, DOT. I think we all get it now but I wish that the people that mattered would get it and make this GREAT SIM EVEN GREATER!!!!!

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/50Cal.bmp http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/P51_Strafing-zoomed2.bmp

[This message was edited by Choctaw111 on Wed July 14 2004 at 05:00 PM.]http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v343/PublicPhotoAccount2/P51_Strafing-zoomed1improved.bmp

[This message was edited by Choctaw111 on Wed July 14 2004 at 08:00 PM.]

Bob the Pilot
07-14-2004, 05:18 PM
^ very nice, but aren't they a little bit brighter? as if they're burning?

Choctaw111
07-14-2004, 05:37 PM
Keep in mind that I used the color from the photo to make the tracers in this pic. That is how bright they are. I am sorry if you are dissapointed but as you can see they are much more visible than the ones that we have now. And remember that this IS THE COLOR of a 50 Cal tracer. Have you seen the picture I posted of me lighting a 50 Cal tracer? This is the same color and brightness...

PlaneEater
07-14-2004, 05:47 PM
That looks pretty dead-on to me.

DEFINITELY looks better than what we have now.

WUAF_Co_Hero
07-14-2004, 11:14 PM
I wonder if a mod, or someone with some serious resolve could take this to oleg, or at least try to get the ball rolling on this matter?

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

TooCool_12f
07-16-2004, 11:06 AM
one thing I'd like to see added is a more "randomised" distribution, to avoid simultaneous tracers from all guns... If they went alternatively from various guns, it would give a nice "flow" of tracers...


more visible may be nice too... it's just the squiggly part that I don't think would work on a PC (it would be either overdone, or as it is now...) http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif