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View Full Version : Ubisoft, please bring back Naval gameplay & exploration



GoldStone93
11-02-2015, 01:00 PM
We all know that feeling.

http://wpmedia.o.canada.com/2013/08/acga_sp_61_caribbeansea_spyglass_1377255636.jpg
http://static5.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1365/13658182/2641995-assassins_creed_rogue_shay_1409668984.jpg

Sailing across the oceans with a new island or landmark in sight, ready to drop anchor, dive into the water & set foot on uncharted territory. And once you had scoured the surroundings and found a viewpoint, you were treated to a stunning vista (especially in Black Flag)
Black Flag & Rogue nailed this feeling. The all encompassing feeling of freedom. To go as you please, to do as you please, to go exploring like a 16th century conquistador & hopefully find some secrets. They were the first games in the AC series to dial down on the rooftop & building parkour that became extremely boggy & tiresome (AC3 did it too a little) & really give a new meaning to "sandbox"

But with recent titles - Syndicate & Unity, I believe the series has de-evolved and lost the edge & the roll it was on.
Sure, Unity was great with it's photo-realistic landscapes of Paris, customisation options, co-op & deeper parkour system but it never grand in scope or scale. It's story sucked, it's ending sucked & the premise felt like a retread of past AC titles. Even Rogue felt like it was it's own maverick, and it was quite easily a Black-Flag copy & paste job (but done so damn well) It least it dared to do something new and delved into the perspective of a Tempar. And Syndicate, well I refuse to buy or play it. It just looks so gimmicky & dull.

I only hope that Ubisoft somehow brings back them feels. Whether through naval gameplay or not. I truly believe a lot of AC fans are begging for it.
UBISOFT! Listen to your god-damn fans... oh, and make Rogue backwards compatible for Xbox One!

Locopells
11-02-2015, 01:07 PM
This topic has been touched on before, My take on the matter, was that I wouldn't be against it returning as part of an AC game (for example, Spanish Armada missions in an Elizabethan era game), but I don't see them doing another game with it as a main focus.

Spins off using the same mechanics however, that's another matter... :cool:

dxsxhxcx
11-02-2015, 01:23 PM
Just make a new IP focusing on the pirate fantasy, with cursed treasures, magic, exploration and all that... there is no reason to limit what this mechanic can offer (in terms of story and gameplay) because of AC...

unfortunately, I'm afraid that they'll use this card only when AC stop selling...

GoldStone93
11-02-2015, 01:26 PM
Can so totally see them bringing it back for the next title.
I have strong reasons to believe that Taiwan & the Phillipines might be where AC will be going next, perhaps during the Sino-French war? (it's in Desmond's maternal line)
That place would be ripe pickings for Naval gameplay.

Going4Quests
11-02-2015, 02:14 PM
To be honestly, the assets and gameplay exist. Imo I'd love that every generation of AC would still contain all previous gameplay assets, so ultimately we have the BIGGEST games ever, at a low cost. If they want they could add in sailing for the sea around England and on the Thames. :P

ze_topazio
11-02-2015, 02:24 PM
Eventually they will, if we had naval every game eventually even the super fun naval would get tiring in the same manner that people are getting really tired of the other mechanics.

VestigialLlama4
11-02-2015, 02:49 PM
Naval in SYNDICATE would not have worked because the context of Victorian London wouldn't allow for those kind of expansive sea battles people liked so much. This was a time of merchant ships and steamboats.

There can be more naval in the future. Like if they ever go to Egypt in Napoleon's time you can do the Battle of Aboukir Bay.

Eventually they will make a new IP on Naval in Next-Gen, because the naval gameplay can be developed and expanded on further than what they did in Black Flag certainly.

JamesFaith007
11-02-2015, 02:50 PM
My guess is that would depend on location of future main AC so main game and naval should be loosely connected similar to AC3 and AC4.

My dream combination is AC Siam (king Mongkut era) and naval AC Chinese sea (era of pirate queen Ching Shih).

Pr0metheus 1962
11-02-2015, 03:23 PM
I'd love more naval warfare. I think the problem the developers face is to find an era that supports it. Elizabethan London would be the best bet for a setting that would support naval warfare (the Spanish Armada, Sir Walter Raleigh, Sir Francis Drake and all that), but AC just did London, so I doubt that's going to happen anytime soon. In my view, Syndicate was a lost opportunity, because the most interesting age for London is the Elizabethan age. A Victorian era AC game should have been set in India or North Africa, in my opinion. But what's done is done, I guess.

I suppose they could also go the Napoleonic Wars route, with Nelson at Trafalgar, etc. Maybe a game set during the Peninsular Wars? But that was three years after Trafalgar, so it's difficult to find a match up between land and sea that makes sense during that time period.

I guess there are the Chinese pirates, as JamesFaith007 suggests. I support anything that gets AC exploring lesser known eras and regions, but Ubisoft seems to be desperate to take us to the most obvious and well-known conflicts in history.

F3nix013
11-02-2015, 03:27 PM
Im sorry but i flat out hate naval missions. It took me everything i had to get through the BF story. In BF i didnt storm any seaside fortresses, i didnt upgrade my fleet or anything. Even in AC3 i didnt do 1 naval mission aside from the beginning that was part of the main story. if i didnt have to do it, i stayed away from it.

VestigialLlama4
11-02-2015, 03:54 PM
I'd love more naval warfare. I think the problem the developers face is to find an era that supports it. Elizabethan London would be the best bet for a setting that would support naval warfare (the Spanish Armada, Sir Walter Raleigh, Sir Francis Drake and all that), but AC just did London, so I doubt that's going to happen anytime soon. In my view, Syndicate was a lost opportunity, because the most interesting age for London is the Elizabethan age. A Victorian era AC game should have been set in India or North Africa, in my opinion. But what's done is done, I guess.

The funny thing is Elizabethan London is so different from Victorian London in many ways, some buildings, like Whitehall Palace (bigger than Versailles) is no longer there today. If Ubisoft were to make a game in that time it would be essentially a completely different city and game from what we have. It's still worth going there.

cawatrooper9
11-02-2015, 04:24 PM
I absolutely loved the naval gameplay in ACBF and Rogue (not so much in AC3)...

But I think it's time the series moved on. I love seeing how the developers use more or less unique assets that reflect the times- for instance, the Thames really blew me away in Syndicate. The fact that the ships move at different speeds, don't travel in straight lines but merge into different lanes... I love naval gameplay, but I wouldn't mind seeing what else the devs can do when given the chance.

m4r-k7
11-02-2015, 04:33 PM
On the one hand I feel like they aren't going to do this as I feel like Rogue was made for this exact reason.

On the other hand I feel like one day we will get a Black Flag 2 but I would much rather Ubisoft build a pirate IP. Seeing as they introduced it in Black Flag, I would have no complaints of this pirate series being in the same universe as Assassins Creed as long as it sets itself apart from the AC lore. The mechanics and systems developed for Black Flag are technological marvels and so it would be a waste (IMO) to not re-use them for another game / pirate IP.

harsab
11-02-2015, 04:44 PM
No no no! if they do return Naval i hope it will be a minor aspect as i hated it. I found it extremely boring & didn't give me a great feeling.

Pr0metheus 1962
11-02-2015, 04:53 PM
I would much rather Ubisoft build a pirate IP.

The problem with that is that AC: Black Flag already did it, and likely better than it could be done again. What I'd like to see is Ubisoft developing a pirate IP as a sort of spin-off from Black Flag - have it take place in the AC universe, but be wholly naval and pirate based and with the Templar Assassin conflict being very much outside the scope of the game. That way, they could take a lot of the best things from Black Flag and take it all in a new direction, with none of the annoying baggage that AC has gathered throughout the years.

m4r-k7
11-02-2015, 05:02 PM
The problem with that is that AC: Black Flag already did it, and likely better than it could be done again. What I'd like to see is Ubisoft developing a pirate IP as a sort of spin-off from Black Flag - have it take place in the AC universe, but be wholly naval and pirate based and with the Templar Assassin conflict being very much outside the scope of the game. That way, they could take a lot of the best things from Black Flag and take it all in a new direction, with none of the annoying baggage that AC has gathered throughout the years.

My thoughts exactly :)

The only thing they need to keep from the AC Universe is the pirates ability to parkour on the ship as that was really fun.

ze_topazio
11-02-2015, 05:09 PM
There are many places where naval could work even without Pirates.

RzaRecta357
11-02-2015, 05:22 PM
I'd love it but the TCs first post made me want to vomit after it's first or second line. Yeah we know that feeling. That annoying feeling of trying to work the free running across the ship and down the mast so that you can jump into the water and swim to an island to grab ONE collectible then climb back up.

Haha

cawatrooper9
11-02-2015, 05:40 PM
The problem with that is that AC: Black Flag already did it, and likely better than it could be done again. What I'd like to see is Ubisoft developing a pirate IP as a sort of spin-off from Black Flag - have it take place in the AC universe, but be wholly naval and pirate based and with the Templar Assassin conflict being very much outside the scope of the game. That way, they could take a lot of the best things from Black Flag and take it all in a new direction, with none of the annoying baggage that AC has gathered throughout the years.

Hmmm, haven't ever considered that as a possibility before.

I suppose the only issue with that would be that I'd like to have a series of naval games set in a variety of times and places- I'm very much over the Caribbean and the Atlantic North.

I've always said that a Mediterranean game during the classical era with a trireme would be awesome. Granted, canons wouldn't be available, but there are so many other cool features that could be added! Also, there is a ton of potential for reusing assets for cities that can be visited, with a classical makeover (Any AC1 or AC2 City, Rome, Valencia, Constantinople...) and we could also get new cities like Athens or Carthage!

Then, a game where you sail a large Junk during the Ming Dynasty would be amazing!

I'd also like something set in the Nile or the Amazon. I picture the Amazon like a mix between the River Vally or Rogue and the tropical jungles of ACBF, but the Nile would be more like a larger version of the Thames (and it would allow for an Egyptian setting!)

A Heart of Darkness inspired Congo setting would be cool, too. You could play as an Assassin fighting against the slave trade in the area- a theme that has been touched on in some of the series' smaller games, but hasn't really been thoroughly explored in the major releases.

Finally, a more modern game would be cool, too- maybe something set off a European coast during WWI or WWI?

flyin-bart
11-02-2015, 05:47 PM
I would like to see further development in the naval gameplay too. I really enjoyed Black Flag, never got around to playing Freedom Cry or Rouge yet though, but it's on the list :)

Jackdaw951
11-02-2015, 08:16 PM
You know I agree, OP. :)

Yes, I'm up for more seafaring.

SixKeys
11-02-2015, 10:33 PM
Yeah, no thanks. Three games with naval is more than enough.

Hans684
11-02-2015, 10:38 PM
Vikings, not the same but they can work around it. It's AC after all, no need to limit it's potential.

Pandassin
11-02-2015, 11:37 PM
As much as I loved naval in AC3 and AC4, I got tired out after Rogue. Three games is enough.

I wouldn't mind a minor comeback, like a few missions similar to AC3. Heck, something as minor as a rowboat or a gondola is enough for me. I just don't want anything major in any more AC games, AC4 nailed it. if I want to do naval stuff, AC4 is the game to do it.

If something major for naval was to return, I'd want it to be in it's own pirate game rather than an AC game, with much more customisation on your character and the ship itself. That would be pretty neat :D

cawatrooper9
11-02-2015, 11:47 PM
If something major for naval was to return, I'd want it to be in it's own pirate game rather than an AC game, with much more customisation on your character and the ship itself. That would be pretty neat :D

Or even better, the ability to trade out your flagship for a better one- kind of like in the fleet minigame, or Sid Meiers' Pirates! game.

SixKeys
11-03-2015, 01:09 AM
Or even better, the ability to trade out your flagship for a better one- kind of like in the fleet minigame, or Sid Meiers' Pirates! game.

This never made sense to me. In Sid Meier's Pirates, sure, that game wasn't really about building up personalities. You could become any kind of captain. But in AC it makes sense that different people would prefer one kind of vessel over another. The Jackdaw was so great because you grew attached to it. If you could swap it out for a Man-O-War any time, it wouldn't be the same.

cawatrooper9
11-03-2015, 03:25 PM
This never made sense to me. In Sid Meier's Pirates, sure, that game wasn't really about building up personalities. You could become any kind of captain. But in AC it makes sense that different people would prefer one kind of vessel over another. The Jackdaw was so great because you grew attached to it. If you could swap it out for a Man-O-War any time, it wouldn't be the same.

Meh, I would've loved to swap it out for a bigger ship. Piloting the Queen Anne's Revenge and the Royal Fortune were some of the highlights of the game for me, kinda made the Jackdaw seem inadequate.

Megas_Doux
11-29-2015, 06:50 PM
I enjoyed naval, I really did, but no more heavily focused games please. I mean, I would love a couple of missions, however an entire naval/rural game..NO!

Sesheenku
11-30-2015, 12:09 AM
Ewww gross.

Black Flag is the worst thing to happen to the series. It didn't fix the core game and then it brought people like you around that only care about the naval aspect... which is only good because it has zero competition, every other company that's tried to make a good pirate game has failed somehow.

No thanks, let's continue improving the main game.

You can have a spin off or something.

D.I.D.
11-30-2015, 02:00 AM
Ewww gross.

Black Flag is the worst thing to happen to the series. It didn't fix the core game and then it brought people like you around that only care about the naval aspect... which is only good because it has zero competition, every other company that's tried to make a good pirate game has failed somehow.

No thanks, let's continue improving the main game.

You can have a spin off or something.

"Ugh, commoners!"

That's pretty disrespectful to the incredible work of the team that made the sailing systems. They made a gameplay mechanic that provided sensations of bliss in basic navigation and tense excitement in combat. In gaming terms, with such slow incremental improvements and the paucity of fresh elements, that's a minor miracle.

The naval gameplay was not simply good because it has no competition. It has no competition because it was a phenomenal achievement. ACIII's team made a great system on its first try, and Black Flag knocked it out of the park. There are piracy and naval warfare games before and since ACIV, but none of them are remotely as good as BF and it's very hard to imagine any of them yet to come being better than this one component of AC.

A future AC with sailing doesn't need to be as heavy with it as BF was, and could use it sparingly like ACIII did.

Megas_Doux
11-30-2015, 02:26 AM
"Ugh, commoners!"

That's pretty disrespectful to the incredible work of the team that made the sailing systems. They made a gameplay mechanic that provided sensations of bliss in basic navigation and tense excitement in combat. In gaming terms, with such slow incremental improvements and the paucity of fresh elements, that's a minor miracle.

The naval gameplay was not simply good because it has no competition. It has no competition because it was a phenomenal achievement. ACIII's team made a great system on its first try, and Black Flag knocked it out of the park. There are piracy and naval warfare games before and since ACIV, but none of them are remotely as good as BF and it's very hard to imagine any of them yet to come being better than this one component of AC.

A future AC with sailing doesn't need to be as heavy with it as BF was, and could use it sparingly like ACIII did.

Naval was a crowning achievement and think she/he is not stating the contrary. However I kinda agree with some of what Sesheenku wrote: naval felt almost as a diversion of AC's problems, its core problems. I rather have a strong main substance first and then some side stuff -kinda telling that a strong core has not been truly achieved after 8439480293 games- than many good, even amazing secondary mechanics.

As I said, I had a blast with the pirate naval theme and its possibilities regarding the open world aspect of the game, but another heavily based one for THIS franchise??? Just no.

D.I.D.
11-30-2015, 02:41 AM
Alright, but I'm saying it's not simply dumb luck that BF has not been superseded, or they're just fortunate nobody beat them. Nobody would think twice about making a new FPS or a third-person adventure game, despite all the great ones out there. But making a naval warfare game, after Black Flag? Any developer facing that brief would be shaking like a s***ting dog, and rightly so.

I agree that it probably was a bit of sleight of hand. The games were at the end of a console generation and working to its limits, and the naval combat was a master stroke in papering over the cracks while the series moved towards the new gen. Unity and Syndicate have done great things for the core, even if some issues remain. The inclusion of naval now is unlikely to be to the detriment of fixing land-based AI or whatever, given that naval is already so good.

Sesheenku
12-04-2015, 06:14 PM
"Ugh, commoners!"

That's pretty disrespectful to the incredible work of the team that made the sailing systems. They made a gameplay mechanic that provided sensations of bliss in basic navigation and tense excitement in combat. In gaming terms, with such slow incremental improvements and the paucity of fresh elements, that's a minor miracle.

The naval gameplay was not simply good because it has no competition. It has no competition because it was a phenomenal achievement. ACIII's team made a great system on its first try, and Black Flag knocked it out of the park. There are piracy and naval warfare games before and since ACIV, but none of them are remotely as good as BF and it's very hard to imagine any of them yet to come being better than this one component of AC.

A future AC with sailing doesn't need to be as heavy with it as BF was, and could use it sparingly like ACIII did.

Excitement in combat? Did you enjoy your 3 options for combat? Dual swords, Dual hidden, and pistols? So fun, so innovative!

They decreased variety, which is a HUGE no no in a game like AC that MUST have variety due to simplistic combat.

I don't think it was an improvement at all, they decreased variety in combat, simplified it from 3, and did nothing to fix the terrible mission structures left from three like those god awful tailing missions.

How is the naval game play good anyways? I had beaten it all quite quickly and all it was was maneuvering properly while repeatedly slamming the ships. It was equally as repetitive as the other game play, the difference being that ground combat lasts about 2 seconds and thus manages to not overstay its welcome.

I'd rather not have it all, the core game needs a proper iteration. IMO Unity has the right idea content wise, it was stuffed with things to do and customization but still had a couple of flaws that don't interrupt my enjoyment mind you but need to be fixed all the same for the ultimate AC.

Oh and I'm not disrespecting anyone by criticism don't be ridiculous.


Alright, but I'm saying it's not simply dumb luck that BF has not been superseded, or they're just fortunate nobody beat them. Nobody would think twice about making a new FPS or a third-person adventure game, despite all the great ones out there. But making a naval warfare game, after Black Flag? Any developer facing that brief would be shaking like a s***ting dog, and rightly so.

I agree that it probably was a bit of sleight of hand. The games were at the end of a console generation and working to its limits, and the naval combat was a master stroke in papering over the cracks while the series moved towards the new gen. Unity and Syndicate have done great things for the core, even if some issues remain. The inclusion of naval now is unlikely to be to the detriment of fixing land-based AI or whatever, given that naval is already so good.

They keep making those cause the moronic triple A market is afraid to try anything different. They're all cowards content to push out mostly exceedingly dull average games because the public is a bunch of idiots as well that'll eat up anything that functions and call it great.

I finally see CoD doing something a little different since before it was just a Quake 3 Clone with less variety in guns and muh realism.

They're all pathetic but at the same time, they're just catering to the pathetic sheep that call average slop like Destiny an amazing game.

I'll commend Ubisoft for regaining my interest after 3 and 4, they unexpectedly broke from their dullness, something the rest of the AAA market has failed to do.

However they must remain vigilant to not fall into the same trap as before if they want to prove they're not just another triple A developer that just wants to push out average content to please the common simpleton, who wouldn't know a good game if it was beating their teeth down their throat with a mallet.

Sorrosyss
12-04-2015, 09:14 PM
I've said it before, but I detested the naval stuff. Don't get me wrong, I love exploring. But not across endless water with very little to look at. I never got on with the camera during combat either, it was just laborious. But I digress...

I'd support a return to the frontier type of exploration. Woodland, caves etc, can still offer exciting parkour without the need for giant buildings. Hunting was fairly fun too. But I'd rather be doing it on my character's own two feet, than in a forced vehicle mechanic.

Civona
12-05-2015, 03:21 AM
in case anyone hasn't said it, naval is cool but Ubisoft should make a standalone naval game that is just about sailing and exploring islands and not sneaky assassinating

Senningiri_GR
12-06-2015, 10:16 AM
Well I believe that the naval mechanic in Assassin's Creed 4:Black Flag and Assassin's Creed Rogue was fantastic. There has\d never been something like this before. Now if the franchise needs more of it... Well I believe an other game sett in the Mediterranean Sea would be great as there would be different types of ships and different rules. Also South Europe had larger cities than those of Assassin's Creed 4:Black Flag and Assassin's Creed Rogue while the game mechanic was proven great in cities too. The best would be before 17th century.

AdrianJacek
12-06-2015, 11:03 AM
[..] the naval mechanic in Assassin's Creed 4:Black Flag and Assassin's Creed Rogue [...]. There has\d never been something like this before.
Well, that's not true.
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/assassinscreed/images/f/f7/Aquila_Edge_Artwork.png/revision/latest?cb=20120830114954