PDA

View Full Version : Death Kick



Slammin_
04-09-2004, 09:32 PM

Slammin_
04-09-2004, 09:32 PM

SKULLS Virga
04-09-2004, 10:10 PM
I always thought death kick was a great idea to add a little consequence to the game but have never been able to try it. I'll play it a little before I make my mind up whether or not it is a good thing.

IV|JG51Flatspin
04-09-2004, 10:10 PM
I am a huge advocate of deathkick - keeps it real and forces teamwork. 30 minutes for FBOW is fine, but 5 minutes for a DF seems good. Just enough to make ya think....hmmm...I really shouldn't have gone in alone to vulch that plane at that heavily protected field! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

If you opt for the 1 minute kick, I'd recommend kicking on one death. Maybe more deaths = more time.

S!
Flame resistant since 1988
=Elite=Flatspin
The Wings of Freedom (http://www.elitepx.com)

buggggggged
04-09-2004, 10:21 PM
some consequence or it will always be there.

Slammin_
04-09-2004, 10:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Elite_Flatspin:
I am a huge advocate of deathkick - keeps it real and forces teamwork. 30 minutes for FBOW is fine, but 5 minutes for a DF seems good. Just enough to make ya think....hmmm...I really _shouldn't have_ gone in alone to vulch that plane at that heavily protected field! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

If you opt for the 1 minute kick, I'd recommend kicking on one death. Maybe more deaths = more time.

S!
_Flame resistant since 1988_
=Elite=Flatspin
http://www.elitepx.com<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I bet your do great in team meetings on the job too. Really, this is the kind of input that makes our hobby evolve.

Keep it going folks. This subject caught my attention bigtime. I love everything we have already, but there is a certain 'Quakeset' settling in, and though some fine folks have provided us some tools to avert 'Air Quake', me thinks it might be a good time to slow things down a bit and get more into 'flying for a living' instead of this 'flying as long as I can' http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

As Clint Eastwood said, "Dying ain't much of a living, boy"

LW_lcarp
04-09-2004, 11:37 PM
Death Kick would make it more of a team based sim then. Help the guy out whos in trouble and he will in turn (we hope) will help you out.

As far as a time frame for the death kick make it for the rest of that map when the next map loads they can get back in. (Now here is where i say they couldnt get back in the fight when dead in the real thing.)

Was on you server today and must say hads a blast and lag wasnt an issue thanks

"If winning isnt everything why do they keep score"
Vince Lombardi

WUAF_Badsight
04-10-2004, 12:41 AM
KICKED AFTER EVERY DEATH ?

what about slow loaders with slower internet connections

they will spend long amounts of downtime simply due to loading

id vote for 1 minute but only if it was after your second death

TheGozr
04-10-2004, 01:48 AM
PROWAR has death kick of 4 and 5 minutes out right now on training periods.
and during fight is 2 death and out.

And also just before the Competition is limited with only the names of pilots making the fight.one day before the fight.

-GOZR
http://www.french.themotorhead.com/themotorhead_fighters/images/pix/il2fbtmhlogosmall.jpg &lt;--Competition Level IL2fb here (http://www.french.themotorhead.com/forgotten-battles/)

Madoka..
04-10-2004, 02:59 AM
Slamming, i dont know about the other people who fly online, but if i got kicked for getting killed, even if it was only for every 2nd or 3rd death, i would consider going to another server, being that dying is part of the game, and to penalize someone for that is kinda lame.

It might have the effect of emptying out your server, the guys here say they will like it, but i think that after a few kicks, they will go somewhere else, afterall the loading time gets kinda long if you have to do it 20 times a night http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

=TgD= Madoka

pinche_bolillo
04-10-2004, 03:12 AM
man you guys are joking right? bad enough the guy gets killed then he gets booted too, for the rest of the map some one suggested. imagine the poor slob that gets death kicked, then tries and tires to rejoin, after he wastes 10-30 minutes depending on how long death kick lasts, or maybe the game is full now (1 minute death kick) to grab a new plane and get killed again and death kicked again!!!

if you have a group of people playing together and 1-2 of them get death kicked, the entire group may leave.

also this would make virtual stalking even more appealing. If there is some one in the game that you dislike just stalk them, and even if they bail, you can just shoot them and kill them. who will be the first "virtual death kick stalker" :O

many times I do not re-join a game just because I am auto kicked for connection reasons. add death kick and some lazy slob like myself wont even bother hitting "join this session"

death kick is similar to kicking a man when he is down.............insult to injury.

but slamming its your server and you do as you please, dont listen to an idiot like myself.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/230_1081512293_bolillo_loco.jpg

DuxCorvan
04-10-2004, 03:30 AM
Well, I'm the responsible for yesterday's post. I defended the death kick only for historical-like missions, and for people who knows what the rules are. My intention was to implement fear of death in the game, to enhance team tactics and rational behavior of pilots.

Of course, a DF server all-against-all should not take this into consideration, for it's made just for quakish kill-die-kill fun.

- Dux Corvan -
http://www.uploadit.org/DuxCorvan/Altamira2.jpg
Ten thousand years of Cantabrian skinning.

Tully__
04-10-2004, 05:08 AM
I'm tentatively in favour of it, but I strongly suggest that you keep the consequences very mild until your regulars get used to the concept http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I'll go further and say that until lots of servers use this option, there wont be any need for severe consequences. Those that don't have the patience to fly proper tactics will rapidly choose another server after only one or two kick/rejoins.

=================================================


http://members.optusnet.com.au/tully_78th/sig.jpg

IL2 Forums Moderator
Forum Terms of Use (http://www.ubi.com/US/Info/TermsOfUse.htm)

Salut
Tully

SeaFireLIV
04-10-2004, 05:17 AM
Death kick? You mean you die the game returns you to the lobby like in some FPS shooters?

An interesting idea. I like it. Yep definitely. Death SHOULD facter in somehow, there should be a cost. I`d start with the `allows you back immediately` option.

SeaFireLIV...

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/spitfpetite.jpg

KrasniyYastreb
04-10-2004, 05:25 AM
I think a better idea would be to implement an option where a player that has died or been shot down cannot respawn for a certain amount of time, or maybe until all the planes in the air at that time have either landed or been destroyed. Something akin to Rainbow 6...

I think kicking should be reserved for those players that violate the rules of the server or behave badly. Even the best of us get shot down from time to time, and why penalize a player who might have lost a close fight or just gotten unlucky? This might also have the adverse side-effect of making players fly the most uber plane available to try to avoid getting shot down, which would make for rather monotone dogfights.

lil_labbit
04-10-2004, 06:33 AM
Definitely against it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif I'm not good enough you know. But what the heck - you say you want to death-kick players and then you say this "(shoulder shooting, kill stealing - I shoot kill stealers)" Slammin_ ??? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif

Now if there's ONE thing EVERYONE hates it's team killers ! - no matter what the cause -

And you loose points that way too... Just kick em if you don't like that sort of thing. On a side-note kill stealing for getting the kill assigned to you went on in RL too http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://members.home.nl/lil.labbit/lilseesya.jpg
Night is better than Day

capt_frank
04-10-2004, 06:42 AM
if anyone's thinking about implementing a death kick, then i vote for what Krasniy Yastreb said:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I think a better idea would be to implement an option where a player that has died or been shot down cannot respawn for a certain amount of time, or maybe until all the planes in the air at that time have either landed or been destroyed. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

not super harsh, but provides a good penalty for getting fried. call it the penalty box. i personally would use the time to get another beer... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

edit: p.s. i sure like the idea that one would loose all his/her points when croaked.

http://home.bellsouth.net/coDataImages/p/Groups/118/118940/pages/277850/30.jpg

Lone_Wulffe_CR
04-10-2004, 07:09 AM
Interesting idea, but what about those times that I spawn and immediately get vulched... kicked!?

That part is going to end up making me move to another server as well. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

And yes.. vulching occurs whether the rules allow it or not.. just in different amounts.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Saluté from CR A Proud Member of The Lone Wulffe Squadron (http://www.lonewulffe.com)

http://img5.photobucket.com/albums/v22/LWulffe_CR/image.jpg

willyvic
04-10-2004, 07:33 AM
I am not familiar enough with the feature to make an educated comment. So I ask this:

What features does the "death kick" command offer? IE; kick to ready room vs kick to lobby, denial of respawn, etc.

Where does this "death kick" feature reside and how can I read up on it?

http://www.geocities.com/mompeepers/willyvic/mig3u.jpg

Tully__
04-10-2004, 08:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lone_Wulffe_CR:
Interesting idea, but what about those times that I spawn and immediately get vulched... kicked!?

That part is going to end up making me move to another server as well. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

And yes.. vulching occurs whether the rules allow it or not.. just in different amounts.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Saluté from CR A Proud Member of http://www.lonewulffe.com

http://img5.photobucket.com/albums/v22/LWulffe_CR/image.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Unless the host chooses settings that are totally unreasonable, that isn't going to happen. The settings allow the host to kick so that (for example) you don't get kicked unless you die more than 3 times in 5 minutes (or any other number of kills and time period). Like I said further up, I wouldn't mind provided the host chooses fairly lax settings.

=================================================


http://members.optusnet.com.au/tully_78th/sig.jpg

IL2 Forums Moderator
Forum Terms of Use (http://www.ubi.com/US/Info/TermsOfUse.htm)

Salut
Tully

willyvic
04-10-2004, 08:42 AM
Tully,
Ya have any info on my question? Would appreciate being pointed in right direction. Don't need an indepth explanation. Just a reference/explanation I can go get and read for myself. Thanks.

http://www.geocities.com/mompeepers/willyvic/mig3u.jpg

Tully__
04-10-2004, 09:25 AM
I believe it's a feature of the server scripting software from Greatergreen. I don't have a link handy but you may find one in the "Sturmovik Essentials" thread near the top of the forum.

=================================================


http://members.optusnet.com.au/tully_78th/sig.jpg

IL2 Forums Moderator
Forum Terms of Use (http://www.ubi.com/US/Info/TermsOfUse.htm)

Salut
Tully

willyvic
04-10-2004, 09:26 AM
Thanks for quick reply. Will take a look.

http://www.geocities.com/mompeepers/willyvic/mig3u.jpg

MosDef_99th
04-10-2004, 12:42 PM
You missed a reply in your poll.."HELL NO!, Slammin"....

Cmon man..its not like your running an airstart server. Anybody who's shot down has to respawn and take off and gain alt/speed. And you already have pilot deaths counting against team objectives where there are fewer pilots than planes. And a lot of us 56ker's get booted enough from server as it is presently.

Here's the thing Slammin; your server is one of the most consistently visited because it's always relatively full. A wide variety of virtual pilots from aces to total noobs fly on it 24 hours a day. Even a laxed deathkick will not improve the culture of killstealing; noobs getting waxed by squads of 3 or more continuously while chasing the same plane that 3 other teammates are will, eventually, show them the value of teamwork versus "at all costs" tactics.

If you REALLY want to improve the culture on your server, then implement an extreme teamkilling boot; not just for a couple of runway collisions or such. I've been on your server some days with jerks getting their kicks from ramming teammates on the runway 7 or 8 times straight, dropping their bombs while there to get anybody they've missed, and then switching to the other team to continue once they've been revealed. This in turn resorts everybody else on that side trying to teamkill this one jerk. I've seen this at least twice. Eliminating this option by kicking after 5 or 6 same team deaths or so would help.

Also, that damn 109Z, IMHO, kinda discredits this whole sim. Even though I'll fly it for "revenge" time to time, it is the epitome of the "Quakeset". And maybe something to keep joining pilots from craming on one side to prevent 10 vs 5 odds and such. But keep in mind as a frequent visitor to your server(we need FW200's) I'm just making kind suggestions; you're gonna do what u figure anyway. But...if you thought your server thinned out when you went to full cockpits...........

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/DAR/BUC-01.jpg

lil_labbit
04-10-2004, 01:45 PM
yeah here we go again lol

that thing in your sig too though

http://members.home.nl/lil.labbit/g1a.jpg
(the original)

http://members.home.nl/lil.labbit/lilseesya.jpg
Night is better than Day

Jaws2002
04-10-2004, 02:19 PM
Interesting idea Slammin, but there's a problem.
You are running a scripted server. This gives us something to go after. I personally like to get a FW-190 F8 heavy and go bomb the planes on the ground, since they all count.
Who will fly ground attack planes when he knows that he has 25% chances to get to the target, and 5% chances to make it back home, with all the late war monsters lurking above, and knowing that will have to rejoin the game after every sortie ?
This death kick will eliminate planes like Il-2 Stuka, and other slow ground attack aircraft from the server.
Just observe how many dedicated mudmovers survive a sortie on a server with externals, icons, and late war fighters.
Poor bastards are suffering enough allready http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif , no need for a death-kick.

GK.
04-10-2004, 03:54 PM
no offense to slammin or anyone.

but slammins server is a noobie server with noobie settings. it is where new pilots are learning how to fly. they might be new to the game and could get discouraged by a death kick. slammin should be kept fun for the noobs.

Tully__
04-10-2004, 05:15 PM
Jaws2002, private topic. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=25510001&m=719101643&r=719101643#719101643)

=================================================


http://members.optusnet.com.au/tully_78th/sig.jpg

IL2 Forums Moderator
Forum Terms of Use (http://www.ubi.com/US/Info/TermsOfUse.htm)

Salut
Tully

surlybirch
04-10-2004, 06:29 PM
Slammin',

You run a great server, but I must ask you to make it full real. Or at the very least remove the icons.

A deathkick might work, but probably on the wrong folks. How would a deathkick work if somebody creeps up and steals a kill? The guy who got shot down gets booted and the kill stealer flys along his merry way.

My suggestion is to remove a few of the arcadish elements and you'll see better flying. Please note I didn't say everything, but right now, the triangle arrows just make it too easy to engage.

SURLY

http://surlybirch.tripod.com/mudbar.txt

SURLYbirch

IV|JG51Flatspin
04-10-2004, 08:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Who will fly ground attack planes when he knows that he has 25% chances to get to the target, and 5% chances to make it back home, with all the late war monsters lurking above, and knowing that will have to rejoin the game after every sortie ?
This death kick will eliminate planes like Il-2 Stuka, and other slow ground attack aircraft from the server.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Answer: Me...and I fly almost exclusively IL2.

Deathkick discourages "Lone Wolves", and frankly, Lone Wolves should be afraid of it - as it supports a team effort. You got a guy taking off or landing? CAP the field and communicate with him to let him know it's safe. You want to attack enemy positions in an IL2? Get escorted...and communicate with your escort.

Teamwork.

There are plenty of mosh pits out there, it'd be nice to see a DF server that isn't one.

S!
Flame resistant since 1988
=Elite=Flatspin
The Wings of Freedom (http://www.elitepx.com)

[This message was edited by Elite_Flatspin on Sat April 10 2004 at 09:54 PM.]

Indianer.
04-12-2004, 04:25 AM
Great idea slammin although the wonderwoman settings need to go also.

"Wer auf die preussische Fahne schwort, hat nichts mehr, was ihm selber gehort"

AEnderby
04-12-2004, 05:16 AM
I used to fly Warbirds S3 games (big shout to axis bomber squads, KG2 especially), I enjoyed flying as if we only had one life to live. I don't think it has a place in casual games like DF, but hey, it's the hosts privelege. If whoever hosts wants "one life to live" then so be it. If we don't like to fly that way then don't join the server.

IHMO it has it's place, dunno if IL2/FB/AEP supports the functionality though.

LilHorse
04-12-2004, 10:52 AM
I think it's a good idea provided that:
A) It's full real.
B) The plane set is year/ theater limited.
C) It's scripted. That way there will be objectives and ground pounders wouldn't be left out. Also, the whole issue of "kill stealing" wouldn't even come up since the overall mission objective will be what's important. Who cares if two guys are firing at the same bandit as long as it goes down.
It'd also be nice to have a slot set aside on TS for each side.

Then again you get all this in online wars and more. There's more that just a five minute period for those since you have to wait till that mission is completed before flying with your squad again. Or you have to see if somebody else is starting another mission when you get back into the lobby. Either way your virtual pilot life has ended (and your kills/ points gone) and you have to start a new one. Of course VEF tallies up total kills/ points over the number of pilots but they are ratioed by the number of pilot deaths.

Slammin_
04-12-2004, 10:53 PM
Yeah, I think I'll hold off on adding death kick. I won't go full real with the maps I have and I don't have time to re-do them all with proper period/location/planesets - things the FR crown seem to prefer.

Just thought I'd run it by you guys, so thanks for the input!

S!

Slam

PS

Though the vote results indicate many want to see a death kick added, I really suspect that many that voted for it probably do not even play on my server. I base this on the number of requests in this thread to change other server settings.

ryan2107
04-12-2004, 10:59 PM
24 hour death kick. itll be like you really died

OutaFocus
04-12-2004, 11:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slammin_:
Yeah, I think I'll hold off on adding death kick. I won't go full real with the maps I have and I don't have time to re-do them all with proper period/location/planesets - things the FR crown seem to prefer.

Just thought I'd run it by you guys, so thanks for the input!

S!

Slam

PS

Though the vote results indicate many want to see a death kick added, I really suspect that many that voted for it probably do not even play on my server. I base this on the number of requests in this thread to change other server settings.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I cut my teeth on your site when I first started online and I found it to be one of the better servers. I still visit on a regular basis because for the most part its a good bunch of people.
I believe the decision to hold off is a good one. You need us noobs to practice on. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional.

StellarRat
04-13-2004, 12:15 AM
Instead of a kick why not just a delay before you can take off? Like say, 1 to 5 minutes? That way you wouldn't lose your place in the game. Also, I think there should be some penalty for getting your airfield clobbered by bombers like an additional delay before take off or no rearming for a certain amount of time. As it stands now the bombers in online play don't really do as much damage as they would in real life from a strategy viewpoint. A real bombing attack could knock a field for hours or days. Even some long lasting craters might be enough. Imagine trying to take off from a field with holes everywhere. Of course all these settings should be server controllable.