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GalaadleHaut
09-21-2015, 06:28 PM
I think by now it is pretty obvious Ubisoft does not listen at all, contrary to what is being said, to the fan base. For instance, is been months we've been requesting hero specs to increase stats per level, every related blog article has most upvoted posts about that, there is even petitions somewhere, yet we still have this qualified by most boring creature growth instead. The fact that even VIPs had to post down the blog seems to show or at least suggests they don't have much of an impact in the inside either. Obviously h7 looks like an attempt to revive the failure which was h6 and telling on advertising campaigns that is taking for another example the beloved skill system from h5 is anything but true. Tons of analyses and posts by the best players have been done in Heroes Community, and in general I think is safe to say most of the articles down the blog have not been well-received. Despite all, the community is being told they are wrong, while is being said to others (people not involved in the process) that the game is being done with the community.

I therefore want to post here how doubtful I am about Ubisoft caring about its fanbase regarding h7 as they claim, since almost all their actions shows the opposite.

broui
09-21-2015, 07:23 PM
Increasing hero specs per level is dumb and op, in my view. Every 5 or 10 makes MUCH more sense.

GalaadleHaut
09-21-2015, 07:51 PM
Per level can mean every 2 level or every 3 level or every 5 level whatever, that's balancing matter in the end. Enjoy your creature growth lol

GalaadleHaut
09-22-2015, 08:56 AM
Ok probably I wasn't clear enough lol

The thing is currently we have creature specialists and they have something like +1 growth per week or something. And yes people want it like in the past games, for instance if you have a dryad specialist it shouldl give +1 attack and +1 defense every two levels, or every three levels for blade dancer specialist.

I don't have links of discussions at hand now but you can find them easily in HC or every hero article on the blog complain about specs lol, however HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/en/blog/post/view/mmh7-at-gamescom#55bb2aa029c836fa0d26f84f) is the latest rant we made about I think lol

unreal_az
09-22-2015, 12:45 PM
You are flaming Ubisoft about a minor thing like hero stats. Have you seen the gameplay? Have you seen the AI + Specs? If 7 AI take more than 20 seconds to pass turn even on week 20 in fog of war, I'm taking my i7 16 gb raid ssd 980 GTX and throw it out the window or I won't buy any more Ubisoft games.

GalaadleHaut
09-22-2015, 02:07 PM
Well this is just an example of course there is plenty, there is reports and wishlists all over HC but I guess is just going to be ignored like the rest, hero specs shouldn't be hard to correct though lol

And yes I've played both betas and AI is ridiculously dumb, I mean they talk about "expert AI" in the trailer while it can't even do the basics such as clear its own area, not even mentioning battles priorities which are just laughable.

Ubi-MoshiMoshi
09-22-2015, 02:19 PM
GalaadleHaut, Sorry to hear you think your feedback is being ignored, it certainly is not.

All feedback is very valuable to us.

Please have a read here https://mmh7.ubi.com/en/blog/post/view/beta-is-now-over-thank-you-again

Thanks

GalaadleHaut
09-22-2015, 02:47 PM
I could give you benefit of the doubt if there wasn’t things such as THIS (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=38292), created in 2012, revived a few pages later (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=38292&PID=1294866#focus) in an attempt to compromise and still satisfy most.

You need to understand that the skill system is of crucial matter yet the MMH7 Team seems very stubborn on not listening to the community’s wishes as seen HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy), you can clearly see the feedback from the Shadow Council about it HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy#553e854c6b3bb7523609c90b), HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy#553e783f29c836a66032802f) or HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy#553e79936b3bb7ca3409c8fa) just for the top three upvoted but there is more. Silence from the Team in return and no change at all after it.

How exactly well was the Spidercult received? I think you remember very well the community’s outrage after it and how we had to drive ourselves insane in order to get your attention.

I think the HOMM community is vocal enough to make it clear what are the aspects loved by most and also the ones hated by most over the years, the MMH7 Team is overdoing it, all they had to do was to take things from the past and slightly improve them, correct what was wrong in them. Is no secret some people from the community could have helped you with it. Not to mention Cepheus’s departure from the VIP group (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1058369#focus) back in the days of h6, and why exactly would Quantomas, who made the best AI ever done for the games, not be working with you, although he did express some if his views HERE (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1037007#focus) back in 2011.

Yet it seems from the very start a lot of things were set in stone from the Team and it looks like whatever we say to complain we will be wrong, just how hard would it be to listen to the feedback done throughout the years?

Most of the gameplay reveals were done very late down SC, if they really wanted to be as transparent as they said such matters should have been said in time, while there was still enough time to revisit it don’t you think?

I could go on and on but I think you have all the evidence from what has been said down SC and in HC.

Also on less important but still non-negligeable matters, why do we get a blue bambi instead of Unicorn if we want Blade Dancer, or neither of them if we want Phoenix? This is absurd, or it tells people who organized these flavor votes were not aware at all of the fan base’s expectations, polls gathered by Logical.Dust (you can find them down SC) clearly shows what creatures majority wanted.

All I see is the Team made something according to their own preferences, which clearly are not in line with the community’s expectations, and I believe this is bad for business, since you also aim at the old crowd with a so-called “back to the roots” campaign, yet I’ve witnessed more disappointment and flaming coming from the community rather than support. I believe some things are no-brainers for the success of this brand and if you want to have happy customers, I can assure you, a lot of people are going to check what is being said on the fan forums and wait for communities reviews before buying it, especially after h6 which is even more hated than h4.

From what I see, Ubi's words don't match their actions.

Antalyan
09-22-2015, 03:38 PM
GalaadleHaut, Sorry to hear you think your feedback is being ignored, it certainly is not.

All feedback is very valuable to us.

Please have a read here https://mmh7.ubi.com/en/blog/post/view/beta-is-now-over-thank-you-again

Thanks

I am sorry, Ubi-Moshi, but GalaadleHaut is right.

If you had listened to our feedback, there would be some official reaction about heroes specializations.

They have been the most criticised feature of this game since the skillwheel was released, but no word came from the team.

Only Marzhin once noticed something like "we may work on them later after the release" on HC. But that is all.

If you want to claim you develop this game with us, fans, you should discuss with us about the biggest problems we see on the game, not to keep silence.


Btw. I am still convinced that some minor skillwheel reworks should be done after the release. Not its general mechanics (unfortunately), but at least the class preferences. Are you sure that all 3 sylvan classes should be able to learn earth magic GM, or destiny GM should be avaiable only for one of 36 classes, or defense and ofense GM are the best ones for magic heroes? All these things and many others really make the classes "very, very different"...

bigaxd
09-22-2015, 07:18 PM
GalaadleHaut, Sorry to hear you think your feedback is being ignored, it certainly is not.

All feedback is very valuable to us.

Please have a read here https://mmh7.ubi.com/en/blog/post/view/beta-is-now-over-thank-you-again

Thanks

you havent really listened. You probably only read like 5 threads oor something.
There are so many things more than that that need fixing... I really doubt in 5 days it will be fixed.

I am already waiting for the rampage of negative feedback after release

RedPanties
09-22-2015, 09:07 PM
I think creature spec. can be made NOW before the game release. It must be pretty straightforward with your tools. Make all core creature specialists give +1 Might and +1 Defense per every two levels , elite - per every 3 levels and champion specialists if any - per every 5 levels.

Hey if they are not balanced we will tell you , don`t worry. We are dedicated...

BUT DO NOT POSTPONE FOR AFTER RELEASE.....SUCH A SMALL FIX WILL MAKE MANY PEOPLE LOVE THE GAME MORE

sorry for the caps I also feel nobody cares ...

kbct
09-22-2015, 09:48 PM
I therefore want to post here how doubtful I am about Ubisoft caring about its fanbase regarding h7 as they claim, since almost all their actions shows the opposite.

Do any of the other hero specializations scale with hero level? I thought most/all of them were static and only minor perks. If you scale one specialization, you have to scale them all.

Besides, I think heroes with creature growth specializations are useful at early levels and during the first couple weeks of the map.

That said, I do think it would be kinda cool to have creature abilities scale with hero level - beyond the normal scaling. But it's a minor, almost trivial issue.

And you're nitpicking. I'm just starting to look at the details of MMH7 and I'm excited about it. I definitely think Ubisoft and Limbic are listening to the fans - with old school attributes, town leveling, spells at guilds, limited town portals, very few resurrection and extra movement options, optional "random" skill leveling, etc.

We also got to choose two of the factions. That was cool.

RedPanties
09-22-2015, 10:05 PM
kbct, please if you are not experienced veteran don`t tell us that we are nitpicking. This is a major thing and combining this with the ****ty skillpizzas we have a serious problem here. Ubisoft just throws dust in your eyes and you are pleased. Excuse me but I don`t have to be happy with the things as they are. The things they gave us is nothing. They gave it to us after they ****ted on heroes VI and now it looks as they gave us something.

In all previous heroes besides VI we had creature spec. scaling with hero level. What is so difficult about it?

kbct, how can I know you are not UBISOFT bot? 2 posts ...your last sentence sounds very made up. They gave us to choose two factions.... wow I prefer not to choose anything in the game and have the skills and spec. fixed.

kbct
09-22-2015, 10:29 PM
kbct, please if you are not experienced veteran don`t tell us that we are nitpicking. This is a major thing and combining this with the ****ty skillpizzas we have a serious problem here. Ubisoft just throws dust in your eyes and you are pleased. Excuse me but I don`t have to be happy with the things as they are. The things they gave us is nothing. They gave it to us after they ****ted on heroes VI and now it looks as they gave us something.

In all previous heroes besides VI we had creature spec. scaling with hero level. What is so difficult about it?

kbct, how can I know you are not UBISOFT bot? 2 posts ...your last sentence sounds very made up. They gave us to choose two factions.... wow I prefer not to choose anything in the game and have the skills and spec. fixed.

I am an experienced veteran. I just don't hang out on the forums.

Hey, more power to you if want creature power scaling via a specialization. I don't think it's a bad idea - I just think it's a minor issue and one should not conclude the dev and publisher don't care about the fan base if it's not implemented.

Besides, it doesn't matter at level 30 if one stack has +10 might. It's such a low level consideration at that point.

At low levels and early in a map, it does matter if you have twice the number of one stack. So 2x or 1.5x creature growth is far more powerful than a couple extra points of might and defense.

Am I a bot? No, but I am a fan like you.

GalaadleHaut
09-22-2015, 11:05 PM
I definitely think Ubisoft and Limbic are listening to the fans - with old school attributes, town leveling, spells at guilds, limited town portals, very few resurrection and extra movement options, optional "random" skill leveling, etc.
As in we are expected to applaud for reversal of atrocious decisions which should never have been done in the first place lol


We also got to choose two of the factions. That was cool.
We also voted some factions out, not so cool.

kbct
09-22-2015, 11:41 PM
As in we are expected to applaud for reversal of atrocious decisions which should never have been done in the first place lol

You have to take chances. Sometimes it doesn't work out. Any successful person knows that. But there are good things about MMH6 and other HOMM games besides HOMM3.


We also voted some factions out, not so cool.

Do you complain about everything? Let me guess, you voted against the Dungeon and Sylvan factions as well?

Let's talk about your latest rant. Why does the lack of creature power scaling via hero specialization imply a lack of love from Ubisoft and Limbic?

GalaadleHaut
09-23-2015, 12:25 AM
lol you didn't even read my rant, neither did you read the links I provided, so you do that first please lol

kbct
09-23-2015, 12:49 AM
lol you didn't even read my rant, neither did you read the links I provided, so you do that first please lol

Homie, I read a number of your rants - here and on the main HHM7 site. You don't stop. You b!tch about everything.

Tell me why anyone should listen to you.

broui
09-23-2015, 12:52 AM
lol you didn't even read my rant, neither did you read the links I provided, so you do that first please lol

I've read more of your rants, comments, questions, concerns and complaints than anyone else's in the past year+.

I get where you're coming from. Really. You have made yourself clear. Over. And over.

One of your worst habits is to make assumptions based on little (if any evidence) - most notably the assumption that developers don't read your stuff or consider it. I think this assumption highly improbable. In fact, if you listen carefully to the recent streams, they were more forthcoming than you give them credit for.

What was clear to me - especially with the streams - was that there are a myriad of debates within the circle of developers about quite a few things. Skills and AI were specifically named. Upon release, it'll be fairly similar to what we experienced with beta - no major changes. Expecting anything but a polishing of what has already been made is really unreasonable.

They also said EVERYTHING is on the table post release. It seems a reasonable assumption that the more hours people play, the better the feedback we can provide.

Don't like the skill system, the classes? Expecting a major overhaul is folly but expecting some changes isn't. Same with specializations (a controversy that is over-rated in my view but worthy of a post release-working-toward-expansion discussion).

GalaadleHaut, over this process you've sort of elevated yourself to be a kind of spokesman for us old timey fans of this series. I don't disagree with many of your concerns about and desires for this game. But, just because people either don't respond directly or even flat disagree with you doesn't mean that they're not listening and considering.

broui
09-23-2015, 01:01 AM
Per level can mean every 2 level or every 3 level or every 5 level whatever, that's balancing matter in the end. Enjoy your creature growth lol

Fine. Creature growth is helpful but a little dull. Okay. But so is +1 Might/+1 Def.

How about every 5 levels, a significant and new specialization (but all related)...

Example: Levels 1-5, +1 (creature type) growth. At level 5, those creatures get a Might boost. Level 10 a Defense boost. 15, a Morale boost. 20, a Destiny boost. And so on...

Other Heroes that are more skill based in their specializations get different boosts: magic, improved archery, improved skill mastery, whatever...

My point is, if you want the specializations to improve every so many levels, mix it up. We can be more creative than + 1 growth or Might or whatever.

RobvD84
09-23-2015, 08:15 AM
Well this problem doesn't exist only with the Heroes franchise under Ubisoft. Prince of Persia and The Settlers series have been badly treated too. There is even word that the new The Settlers game is dead. And there was also a lot of complains that it looked too kiddie (the new hero mechanic instead of a normal armie). So it is not only the Heroes franchise that gets wrong decissions.

Anyway for me this is not just aboout a few things they completely missed but about they said that the game would be made with us, the fans and that they will take all the best things from previous games and make the best game. But we given them help and suggestions ever since the release of H6 and nothing has been done with it (and most of them didn't even get a reaction), so what Galaad says about this is true in my eyes.
As for making the best game was already failed the moment they decided that they used H6 as the basis for this game for me. And they even made the H6 level up system the main mechanism for H7. Yes they tried to make a compromise, but this "random" is not random. The skeelwheel is still locked and there is not just like in the old heroes games a file that makes the game choose those skills randomly (atleast not without the locked skills).
I don't like the creature boost specializations, but for me that isn't the biggest problem.
I do have a feeling a lot can be fixed with the modding tools, but it is sad it should be resolved like this.

Ubi-MoshiMoshi
09-23-2015, 09:56 AM
Guys, please keep to discussing the game and not each other.

Thanks

RedPanties
09-23-2015, 11:22 AM
if you have listened to us we wouldn`t fight now over stupid things.

broui, I see you have great ideas but DEVS won`t change it for that simple +1 def and you are asking about serious ****. Be realistic

RedPanties
09-23-2015, 02:33 PM
@kbct

your words tell me what a veteran are you, Heroes who give creature growth are not main hero material and not interesting at all. One can buy them and use their special as secondary heroes. If you think that 15 might 15 defence for a core creature is not a big deal you must play a map until week 10 with huge armies. Please let`s talk about real heroes game...I

kbct
09-23-2015, 03:57 PM
@kbct

your words tell me what a veteran are you, Heroes who give creature growth are not main hero material and not interesting at all. One can buy them and use their special as secondary heroes. If you think that 15 might 15 defence for a core creature is not a big deal you must play a map until week 10 with huge armies. Please let`s talk about real heroes game...I

First of all, you're not gonna start a map at level 30, so let's assume your hero is level 24. That's +12 Might and +12 Defense. That's a 60% increase in damage for that stack. If you have twice the number of creatures in the stack, that's a 100% increase in damage. How is that not better?

And that's at level 24. At early levels, the advantage is even more pronounced. In addition, a hero with the creature growth specialization also gets double base growth from any creature dwellings in the town's area of control. So, theoretically you could have a 133% increase in damage.

But who cares??? Specializations are minor perks. I'll beat the game with any specialization.

Just because the devs haven't implemented your favorite specialization (that actually dilutes the hero power) doesn't mean they're not listening to the fan base.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 10:08 AM
I definitely think Ubisoft and Limbic are listening to the fans - with old school attributes, town leveling, spells at guilds, limited town portals, very few resurrection and extra movement options, optional "random" skill leveling, etc.
I actually think this post deserves a tadly more detailed answer lol

First of funny that you consider most stuff which is from h5 (the one just before h6 lol) and not necessarily in the original games as “old school attributes”, building prerequesites has always been there, not town leveling lol
Speaking of which, I like my prerequesites to make sense, for instance blacksmith offering barracks or mage guild monastery, but how can you even think in the first place to need marketplace and resource silo for Strider or MG4 for Treant lol Also what is it with the ridiculously low cost in resources of strong dwellings, 10 dragon-whatevercrystal or 5 of each (or something among these lines) for Champion structure? Maybe I need to recall in some other iterations cost could go up to 30 but let’s stop nitpicking lol
The adventure map suffers from this kind of crap, indeed, why bother enrich it with banks and special buildings if you don’t even need the treasures in the first place siigh lol
Yes we got mage guilds back, but we still get this nonsense of 7 schools of magic which is creating unnecessary complications in the design, another thing the HOMM community has been very vocal about, yet no, we can just go **** ourselves “because Ashan”. Lol …
Again you imply "limited town portals" or "very few resurrections" as an “old school attribute”, have you even ever played h3 lol
As for the "extra movement options", pardon me if I feel like logistics is missing from the game when the buff went from +30% to +3 mvt point lol
Regarding the random skills, we all know they don’t work like in previous games for obvious reasons and again, as I linked in a previous page, the hero progression is an important part and I don’t understand why the Team is so stubborn with its “master your destiny” obsession almost nobody likes. Not so surprisingly, defenders of this system are almost 100% of the time also h6 players lol
Btw there was an informative debate about the random system HERE (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=41661&pagenumber=2) and I eventually invite you to read it lol

So yeah, not only I don't see why I should be grateful for them to bring stuff back when they are the ones who took it away in the first place (thanks for giving us back what we already had, you rock lol) but also why I should keep my mouth shut when said features are not even brought back properly lol


Anyway we pretty much digress from my main point which can still be read on page 1 and more in depth in my reply to Moshi lol and I also think is either ignorance or plain bad faith not to see how much of h6 is in h7, despite what has been said in the first news we received from h7 back in August last year and from which I was thrilled about at first.

So I shall say it again, the community has mostly been ranting for a full year yet it seems to be more convenient to look at us like nostalgic farts who clearly don’t have any kind of standard/expectation coming from a HOMM game lol



I think the truth of the matter is there is strong disagreements on conceptual and philosophical level of the game between the HOMM community and the Ubi Team. This is an argument which was thrown at me “but every one will have his own preferences thus we can’t really decide which are the best features”. Well, I think Dommforge from HC actually nailed it pretty much HERE (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=41568&PID=1326959#focus) lol
I’ll just quote out and comment his bottomline, details are in the link lol


Honestly, most of the game is just done already. Just take the best parts of each HoMM game, and improve upon them. There is a lot of work to polish those systems, which is way better than creating another failed mechanics for a year and repeating HoMM 6's failure.

To be honest, I have very little faith in Ubi. They seem to ignore the fans' wishes way too much.
This is exactly what I’m talking about, and the only explanation I see is the Team may like the series yet fail to grasp what is genius about. What is definitely clear is I never ever read anywhere people highly praising h6 AoC or obscure h4 feature “Governor”, then some people will say we have a “fetish for the h5 skill system”. No, the h5 skill system was awesome and could have been highly improved, on contrary to some of the stuff we see in h7, which can only qualify as “better than h6” lol



Just because the devs haven't implemented your favorite specialization (that actually dilutes the hero power) doesn't mean they're not listening to the fan base.
When said fan base has been complaining about it during the whole development yet they keep telling us “NO + GROWTH IS BETTER” I think it exactly means they’re not listening to the fan base lol


You b!tch about everything.
Sorry but I don’t see why I shouldn’t call out BS when I see it lol

RobvD84
09-24-2015, 01:58 PM
Yeah it is a shame. It seems a lot of ppl are still beeing blinded by the name of the franchise only. You see this in other entertainment bussines too (like music and movies). HoMM never was about the pretty graphics and the silly animations or having everything done for you.
But yeah as already has been said by Galaad and many other, we have been telling Ubi for years (some even since H5 was beeing made) what not to do, and what was the best action to make/take. And yet they stubbornly (if this is a word) ignore (atleast that is how we see it) all of this. And then they wonder why ppl are angry and rage at some of the things they revieled. And then we haven't even mentioned the reputation Ubisoft has for years. It's not for nothing that ppl call Ubisoft the worst gaming company next to EA. Yes there have been small improvements, but this get overshadowed by everything that is wrong about Ubisoft.
This probably will be my last Ubisoft game, i just wanted to support this franchise. There only a few reasons why i ever would buy a new Ubisoft game again and they have to change a lot and fix a lot.

kbct
09-24-2015, 02:38 PM
Sorry but I don’t see why I shouldn’t call out BS when I see it lol

I know you're a prolific poster over on the Heroes Community website. I know you guys go over to the Shadow Council and upvote each other's posts to create the illusion of mass consensus behind your ideas. Honestly, you guys have a lot of good ideas. I agree with a majority of Elvin's and everyone else's suggestions in the Change Wishlist to make MMH7 better.

But it's not your game. You're not taking any financial risk. And while you guys over at Heroes Community are VERY knowledgeable about Heroes games, you're less than 1% of people that bought MMH6. Not only that, according to a poll on your site, less than half of you definitely plan to buy MMH7. You haven't even pre-purchased the game (although it's my guess you're using that as leverage and will buy it once the modding community can "fix" it). So, why do you think your group speaks for the rest of the 99%+ that bought the previous game?

And Ubisoft and Limbic are listening. You're smart enough to know your tactics of outrageous allegations and illusionary consensus will get their attention. Not in a positive way, but in a negative way. And I know you don't care that you come across as a giant arse on these forums to many people that just want to get excited for the latest MMH game. I know you're doing it because you're ultra passionate about the Hereos series and you love, love, love HOMM3 and HOMM5. But still, MMH7 is their game and we should at least let them try out their new ideas.

Let's see how the game is received. Maybe after the initial bug fixes and balancing adjustments, Ubisoft and Limbic will come looking to the Heroes Community for answers if the game does poorly. Good luck.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 02:55 PM
I agree with a majority of Elvin's and everyone else's suggestions in the Change Wishlist to make MMH7 better.

But it's not your game. You're not taking any financial risk. And while you guys over at Heroes Community are VERY knowledgeable about Heroes games, you're less than 1% of people that bought MMH6.
So according to you listening to suggestions which could make the game better is taking financial risk? lol


you love, love, love HOMM3 and HOMM5
Well actually I love HOMM more than any other game, is MMH I have a problem with lol
Did I ever mention I think h5 visuals look like warcraft? lol

kbct
09-24-2015, 03:13 PM
So according to you listening to suggestions which could make the game better is taking financial risk? lol

Better is a subjective term. Better for you?


Well actually I love HOMM more than any other game, is MMH I have a problem with lol
Did I ever mention I think h5 visuals look like warcraft? lol

I know, Terry Ray (a writer for the series) made a good point when he said he tries to look at the series as a whole. But he likes MMH6 better than HOMM5 which is blasphemy on the Heroes Community website. Why? Because he prefers character drama over other aspects of the game. Who is to say he is wrong? And he's a fan too.

But I was just quoting what you said on HC. Maybe you will be able to put 3 and 5 in the closet. Let's see.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 03:23 PM
Better is a subjective term. Better for you?
Better as more in line with the community’s expectations you seem fast to dismiss lol
But haven’t we already agreed Ubisoft does not listen to suggestions because they fear a financial risk lol

kbct
09-24-2015, 03:38 PM
Better as more in line with the community’s expectations you seem fast to dismiss lol
But haven’t we already agreed Ubisoft does not listen to suggestions because they fear a financial risk lol

I want to give their new ideas a try before I throw stones. I mean, I hate the moon doe as much as the next guy, but what matters to me is how I feel about the game after I finish it. And I won't know the answer to that for another week or two.

I think you have a misconception that HC speaks for the entire fan base. Nor can you even say there is universal agreement on certain aspects of the game - like random vs. free skill choice.

And Ubisoft hasn't implemented your ideas because they want to do something different. And they get the final say because it's their game. But they've listened.

Like I said, if the game is received poorly (and we all know HC will be banging on the negative drum), maybe they will implement some of your ideas in the future. They said as much on their streams. But to be clear, Elvin had a lot balancing suggestions on his list. Those are relatively easy fixes.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 03:56 PM
I think you have a misconception that HC speaks for the entire fan base.
I never said HC speaks for the entire fanbase, I’ve said is one of the most constructive HOMM forums for feedback so please do not twist my words lol


Nor can you even say there is universal agreement on certain aspects of the game - like random vs. free skill choice.
What I can say is free skills pick only appeared in h6 when no one ever asked for it in the first place lol
The random skill system is a core feature of the game and in h7 is so poorly implemented it could scream “we put your dumb random skills in as an option” lol


And they get the final say because it's their game.
Only because they bought IP lol, they started to dismiss things related to the series as early as they acquired them, starting with the consequent work from NWC themselves back in pre-h5 era because they wanted to do something precisely different lol

The **** they keep on taking on the original games for over a decade now is IMO outrageous.

kbct
09-24-2015, 04:37 PM
I never said HC speaks for the entire fanbase, I’ve said is one of the most constructive HOMM forums for feedback so please do not twist my words lol

Who is the fan base you're speaking about then? Does it include me or Terry Ray (a writer for the series?

You did vote for two factions and the associated line-ups and you did get the Necropolis lineup changed. That's listening to the community.

But I know you're not happy with that. You want the ideas from Heroes Community implemented in the game. And if Ubisoft doesn't implement them, they're not listening to the fans - or more specifically, to the Heroes Community members.


What I can say is free skills pick only appeared in h6 when no one ever asked for it in the first place lol
The random skill system is a core feature of the game and in h7 is so poorly implemented it could scream “we put your dumb random skills in as an option” lol

I love being able to pick my own skills and perks. I don't mind a lot of random things in a game, but I don't want character development to be random. Others on your site clearly agree with me.

But to your point, they did listen to the community (i.e. you) and implemented a random skill option. You just don't like it. Maybe they will tweak it later, but I think it goes beyond being random, you want it almost identical to HOMM5.


Only because they bought IP lol, they started to dismiss things related to the series as early as they acquired them, starting with the consequent work from NWC themselves back in pre-h5 era because they wanted to do something precisely different lol

The **** they keep on taking on the original games for over a decade now is IMO outrageous.

Yeah, that's exactly right - because they bought the IP.

They want to try new ideas. They can't all be HOMM1 clones, right? HOMM3 worked out for you and so did HOMM5. That never would have happened if they made the same game every time or simply tweaked them.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 04:45 PM
You want the ideas from Heroes Community implemented in the game. And if Ubisoft doesn't implement them, they're not listening to the fans - or more specifically, to the Heroes Community members.
That’s clearly not what I’m saying lol


I think it goes beyond being random, you want it almost identical to HOMM5.
Absolutely not lol


They can't all be HOMM1 clones, right?
Who ever, ever said that lol

kbct
09-24-2015, 04:55 PM
That’s clearly not what I’m saying lol

So when you say Ubisoft doesn't care about the fan base, who are you talking about then?


Absolutely not lol

Well, there is a random skill option then.


Who ever, ever said that lol

Good, then give their new ideas a chance.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 05:08 PM
1. Could we actually get back to square one and look again how each news individually were generally received by the community? HC, SC, CH, here, you name it lol
Maybe you didn’t even read the Cepheus and Quantomas posts yet lol

2. A random skill option which is inferior to the ones from previous games by a large margin lol

3. What chance exactly, for them to prove their concept is better than the one from the game we love? lol
I am not against evolution, but am firmly convinced if you want to make a successful sequel you need to not dismiss the most acclaimed features of the past games lol

RobvD84
09-24-2015, 05:19 PM
You just don't get it huh. It is not about them trying, they had that chance with H5 and H6. This was thier moment to create a truly great Heroes game. But since they took H6 as basis it was already set in stone that it won't be a "great" game. Also since H6 they have devided the fan base, wich is a big problem. Now they did try to solve it a bit with a "fake random" level up system. But to me it is just another slap in the face.
Also my other problem is that this isn't the only game Ubisoft is screwing up (in my eyes). And yes i do believe they owe us after the failure of H6, wich they abbandoned so quick after the expansion. Yes i know they said the coding was to hard, but that is thier fault to begin with. They made the choice to use this code.
And my biggest problem is that Ubi HQ (since i don't think this team is responsible for this) saw this game as a big risk and never had any intention of putting much money into it. And thier reason is that the fan base is non-existant (in thier eyes), wich is based on nothing. I still think 30% of all potential buyers don't even know this game is beeing made. You won't sell any games if nobody knows about it. I don't want it to be hyped as much as AC or WD, but atleast try. But this is the same as the resources and time problem, wich is again Ubi HQ to blame. This sometimes pisses me off. Imagine if this game had the same treatment as AC, how great this game could have been. Wich i think this game deserves, especially if you say it is going to best of the whole franchise. This game is closer to a indie game then a AAA title, and we still have to pay like it is a "big game"/"AAA title".
There is a big chance this is the last Heroes game.

Elle-One
09-24-2015, 06:00 PM
The main issue with H6 will always be for me that it's a bug-riddled mess. What I expected from H7 was that it would not be a bug-riddled mess. The two betas have clearly shown that this was too much to ask.

Anything else, I can live with. Sure, a lot of things like hero specialization, more flexibility when it comes to choosing skills, better graphics, whathaveyou would all go a long way to improve the game and have been demanded by the fans and ignored by Ubi for months, but what really makes me not buy this game is the complete lack of quality control.

All those promises "Yeah, sure, we can change that later." just prove to me again and again that this game is not ready for release and expecting people to buy it in the hope that it'll work some day is utterly disrespectful.

Oh, and before it's mentioned, I am aware that there was a Stream where people talked about how much the game is going to improve before release. There was also a Stream before the first beta that showed a playable game and we all know how that turned out.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 07:53 PM
Listening to the fans has never produced a good game.
Actually it made TotE lol

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 07:58 PM
TotE is the latest official expansion for h5 lol

RobvD84
09-24-2015, 08:14 PM
@Griffildur I am sorry, but did you even read what ppl have said? They already tried with H5 and H6 and failed miserably. Whe asked them to do good and listen to us for years. And you think ppl will stay silent after that? Also you state that there is no company that listen to thier fans but that is bs, there enough who listen. Blizzard is 1 for example. And i bet there are many more. Ofcourse you can't satisfy everyone. But Ubi has (greatly) devided the fanbase since H6. They said they wanted to make the best game, but from the beginning they couldn't get it done because Ubi HQ decided that this game isn't worth the risk (yes i am talking about the resources and time).
And saying you can't criticise a game because you don't support it financially (atleast that is what i can make out from what you said) is the biggest bs i hear. I have heard this **** a couple of times now on different sources about different games, but this is so much bs. We are criticising them exactly because they showed time and time again they don't know what to do (look at how H6 turned out, and they even call that a financial succes *pukes*). Even the H7 site is an example of that with all these problems going on with it. I haven't even been able to comment and see comments for almost a month. And all of these small problems and mistakes have been happening to the making of H7 too. But not everything is too blame on this Ubi team and Limbic. The most is to blame on Ubi HQ. Can't stress this enough.

RobvD84
09-24-2015, 08:17 PM
I
Why don't you take all the people who think like you, make a whole new HOMM just the way you think it should be done and then we'll sit down and compare.

Well maybe a lot of ppl want to, but since i (and many others) haven't learned how to make games i don't think this will be possible. Ofcourse i can always learn things, but learning myself is going to be almost impossible.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 08:58 PM
What i said is that when it comes to making a game, no company is going to listen to the fans. Why? Because fans are divided and can't make up their own mind.
You do know h7 is being advertised as being made as a “best-of Heroes with and for the community” and there is the whole Shadow Council program right? lol


they will not listen and should not even try to please everyone because it is simply not possible.
Actually the only people I saw being really pleased are h6 fans, you know the most acclaimed and praised to the skies title by the HOMM community lol


Ubi is not the creator of the HOMM series and whatever they do they will never come close to what the first games were.
Totally agree, doesn’t that bothers you? lol
However, h3 is still being patched by the community and the add-on truly feels like it could have been done by NWC themselves lol
Same can be said about h5.5, better than what we got from Nival lol


Homm6 was radically different, still playable though.
Playable might be pushing it lol


I love those games and I want to see what happens next, if anything.
I love those games and I’d appreciate to see a new installment which is not mediocre lol


The H7 site I don't miss or care for. I had a look, it was full of Russian stuff so I am happy to give that a go.
Not really sure what you mean here lol


If UBI didn't care at all they wouldn't have invested anything, nor would they have bothered to make another HoMM game.
They can still milk money from this franchise and unfortunately this farce will on go as long as people are satisfied with crappy sequels, as someone else said, the name is the golden goose, not the content lol


Show them a bit of respect.

I am going to quote someone else here as I agree 100% with him lol :


why would I have any automatic obligation to support a random publisher and developer who had literally nothing to do with that original creation, and are debatably actively involved in dragging it down so far it might never be able to get back up? lol

nope, Ubisoft and Limbic have to earn my loyalty and respect, and so far since Heroes 6 they have done very, very little to warrant any of that IMO

kbct
09-24-2015, 09:03 PM
1. Could we actually get back to square one and look again how each news individually were generally received by the community? HC, SC, CH, here, you name it lol
Maybe you didn’t even read the Cepheus and Quantomas posts yet lol

It's pretty clear that when you're talking about the aggrieved "fan base" and "community," you're talking about the members of the Heroes Community website. All your links point back to the Heroes Community website. Your links to the Shadow Council website are posts written by and upvoted by members of the Heroes Community website.

I did read the Cepheus and Quantomas posts. Cepheus quit the VIP group associated with Ubisoft but was under a NDA so he couldn't say much about it. And the AI Qunatomas created is getting no love from Ubisoft. But what's your point? That Ubisoft should have listened to them?

Why not be honest and admit you're not talking about the entire fan base, but a group of fans from Heroes Community?


2. A random skill option which is inferior to the ones from previous games by a large margin lol

I'm glad skills aren't random. And I'm part of the fan base.

What is the best way to implement skills in a game is by no means clear cut.


3. What chance exactly, for them to prove their concept is better than the one from the game we love? lol
I am not against evolution, but am firmly convinced if you want to make a successful sequel you need to not dismiss the most acclaimed features of the past games lol

The game we love? Who is we?

kbct
09-24-2015, 09:16 PM
That's not quite what i said. What i said is that when it comes to making a game, no company is going to listen to the fans. Why? Because fans are divided and can't make up their own mind. Things that you like for example, I don't. Vice versa is also true. Yes they make take some ideas here and there but they will not listen and should not even try to please everyone because it is simply not possible. That's what i said, maybe not in so many words but it's what I meant.

Agreed. I'm surprised Limbic listens as much as they do.

If you took a poll from the entire fan base on the best skill system, it would be all over the place.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 09:25 PM
Sorry Sherlock but you’re loosing sight here lol

Why not be honest and admit Ubisoft created a different fan base for a different game? lol

My links points to HC because HC is constructive and these links could be of some help lol
But not only HC is ranting lol, and honestly I doubt the whole Shadow Council is being upvoted by HC members, anyway what you imply here is purely speculative I don't see why you keep bringing it up as the ultimate strike lol

Besides, I don’t really see what’s your issue with the Heroes Community from www.heroesofmightandmagic.com, you said yourself people down there can give good advice yet in the same time you seem desperate to narrow it down as a small group of conservatives with their canes and knowledge which will ruin the series lol


What is the best way to implement skills in a game is by no means clear cut.
Do I really have to repeat myself about random skills, and how suddenly it stopped being considered as a core feature of the game since h6 lol


The game we love? Who is we?
About all the people who expressed discontent and frustration during this year for one, as well as all the people who are going to be disappointed after the release lol

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 09:49 PM
And I never said so lol
However, when you look at the feedback from the community in general about some important features of the game which influences the playstyle it's not exactly high praise, but rather "wtf they did what again?" lol

kbct
09-24-2015, 10:25 PM
But not only HC is ranting lol, and honestly I doubt the whole Shadow Council is being upvoted by HC members, anyway what you imply here is purely speculative I don't see why you keep bringing it up as the ultimate strike lol

Well, it is true that the SC posts you link to are HC members. No attempt at an "ultimate strike." I only presented it so other people can make up their own minds. You talk about how you try to get your voices heard on this page::

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=41669&PID=1326974#focus

I'm not saying it's all of you guys, but there is a circle jerk going on.

But again, MMH6 sold 280,000 units. The fan base is much larger than a couple hundred or a couple thousand fans. And this fan doesn't mind them trying new ideas (like a free skill system) if the game is fun to play.

GalaadleHaut
09-24-2015, 10:54 PM
Rofl give me a break lol, Ubisoft claims they listen to the fan base, yet you’re telling me they should ignore people which are taking time to provide feedback through various fan forums lol
With who is Ubisoft making the game then, the silent mainstream players which don’t know crap about the series? lol
Erwan le Breton and some other employees claim there is a VIP program and all, although on that same thread you just linked two VIPs seem to strongly suggest they had little to no impact, which also seemed to be Cepheus's point in the previous link lol

If Ubisoft does not care about the fans fighting for a great game but only targets mainstream audience, maybe they shouldn’t claim the game is done with the fans like at gamescom or other PR events or at the very least not advertise the product as a “back to the roots” so-called "best-of" when the whole game is built upon h6 lol


But again, MMH6 sold 280,000 units.
Would you mind to source this figure? lol

kbct
09-25-2015, 01:16 AM
Rofl give me a break lol, Ubisoft claims they listen to the fan base, yet you’re telling me they should ignore people which are taking time to provide feedback through various fan forums lol
With who is Ubisoft making the game then, the silent mainstream players which don’t know crap about the series? lol
Erwan le Breton and some other employees claim there is a VIP program and all, although on that same thread you just linked two VIPs seem to strongly suggest they had little to no impact, which also seemed to be Cepheus's point in the previous link lol

If Ubisoft does not care about the fans fighting for a great game but only targets mainstream audience, maybe they shouldn’t claim the game is done with the fans like at gamescom or other PR events or at the very least not advertise the product as a “back to the roots” so-called "best-of" when the whole game is built upon h6 lol

Would you mind to source this figure? lol

I'm not telling you Ubisoft/Limbic should ignore your suggestions. I'm telling you they listened to your suggestions and chose to do something else. And if they don't implement your suggestions, it doesn't mean they're not listening to the fans. The fan base is much, much larger than "the community." And there are a number of cases that show Ubisoft/Limbic have done something directly as a result of fan input.

In fact, I know you were a force in getting the Necropolis lineup changed - which they did. And you're still not gonna buy the game even after you got what you wanted. Why? Because it's not enough. Personally, there are a number of things I would have preferred they'd spend their time and money on instead. Heh, like the Moon Doe. Or the Strider.

Who are they making the game for? Well, me for one. I don't go on the forums (except maybe here for the last couple days) and am not a part of "the community," but I know a lot about the games. I probably don't know as much as you about the lore (you seem to be a passionate artsy type lol), but I definitely know the mechanics and how to win battles. I can't wait to play this game - even after reading Elvin's long list of proposed changes.

Yeah, the VIPs got smacked around by Ubisoft and went running for the hills. Not sure why - damn NDAs - but I wish they would have maneuvered better and got a few changes implemented before slinking back to the forums. Honestly, they had the best chance to affect change. Maybe they just weren't prepared for the corporate world. Who knows. Please provide a link if you know what actually happened.

The "best of" is completely subjective. But Ubisoft/Limbic did incorporate a number of pre-MMH6 elements into MMH7.

As for the unit sales, it's from VGChartz. And Griffildur is correct, the estimated unit sales are probably higher since they don't include online sales like Steam and Uplay. Why do you ask? Did you think MMH6 was an economic failure since it is almost universally trashed by "the community"?

broui
09-25-2015, 04:34 AM
"Actually the only people I saw being really pleased are h6 fans, you know the most acclaimed and praised to the skies title by the HOMM community lol"

This is statement is grounded in fantasy. Total falsehood (not to mention NOT laugh out loud worthy). I count myself among those who have played every iteration of Heroes and found myself quite pleased with the 2nd Beta even if I did have quite a few suggestions for tweaks. And no, I'm not a big H6 fan - the bugs and the Ubi server make that impossible - but I do think it had quite a few redeeming qualities. Having said that, H7 isn't even close to H6 in design and those who make that contention are bloviating.

Also, the contention that random skills or leveling is one of those features of Heroes that is indispensable is at least hyperbole. I liked the random thing, but it was also quite problematic - even with H5. I'm not a huge lover of this skill pizza either - it's far too limited - but it's also not a deal breaker.

What IS indispensable (and not coincidentally a 3rd major detractor of H6) is a good, easy-to-use map editor (especially with an RMG). This has that which makes the future of H7 bright.

We're a long way from the final version of H7. Lots of patching and tweaking. Expansions are likely to have a similar effect on this game that the expansions did for H5. By the end, this game may or may not actually be the best ever, but it is likely to be in the conversation. I don't say that lightly.

My philosophy has been to spend most of my energy focusing on what is right, what works. Doing so, I believe, has helped my perspective when providing criticism and feedback. These developers clearly have a vision. It isn't exactly what I would have come up with, but I respect what they're trying to do. Rather than focus on my own personal wish list, I think it more productive to try to help these folks realize their vision as effectively as is possible.

In saying all this, I guess I'm also disputing the notion that there is any consensus at all regarding Heroes. There really isn't. And yes, I've read pages and pages over at the HC. Frankly, if I took the attitude some here and the blog have taken, no one (or almost) could be classified a "real fan", whatever that means. Few can claim 20 years of Heroes playing. But, I think my 7 year old daughter is a "real fan". Why? She freakin' loves Heroes (3, 4, 5, and 6). So is my wife (5 & 6). Why are they real fans? They love the game. Period. They get immersed in it - moreso if there is a good story attached. Everyone participating here and the blog and the HC and Celestial Heavens are "real fans". Doesn't matter when they started. They're going out of their way to be part of the conversation - not simply to play it and call it a day - but to be active in their participation, be vocal about what they think. Separating ourselves into factions (irony not lost here) is dumb and insures only cloudy feedback and limited results.

Wonder why you feel they're not listening? I think they are, but that's beside the point. I wouldn't if I were them.

Rant over. I now return you to your regularly scheduled bickering. Cheers.

GalaadleHaut
09-25-2015, 11:10 AM
I'm telling you they listened to your suggestions and chose to do something else. And if they don't implement your suggestions, it doesn't mean they're not listening to the fans
Lol dude, it’s not my suggestions, is what is being said all over the forums, for years, siigh lol
It’s the features which has been acclaimed by the community (oh you’re putting brackets now? lol) and are missing from the so-called “best-of”.


The "best of" is completely subjective. But Ubisoft/Limbic did incorporate a number of pre-MMH6 elements into MMH7.
Actually a best-of in the industry is a compilation of the “best features” which I think are defined by the general feedback from customers lol
You won’t make a Led Zeppelin best-of and not include Stairway to Heaven for instance lol


Personally, there are a number of things I would have preferred they'd spend their time and money on instead. Heh, like the Moon Doe. Or the Strider.
Well there is just too many tasteless crappy models isn’t there lol


I definitely know the mechanics and how to win battles.
It’s not the impression I had a few pages back, you look to me like someone who has very limited knowledge of the original games (cf “old school attributes” lol)
But I trust you about h6 mechanics, I’m sure you know these even better than I do lol


Please provide a link if you know what actually happened.
What about the post from Cepheus I linked on page 1, I doubt the situation has changed much ever since lol


Why do you ask? Did you think MMH6 was an economic failure since it is almost universally trashed by "the community"?
Because I was actually surprised by the low number lol
And yes I met very few h6 lovers coming from players of h1-5, again why do you put brackets to qualify these lol
Although I will always fail to understand how a game which was not an economic failure still ended up bankrupting its developers lol (and BH even blamed Ubi on the matter as seen HERE (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=470614) for those who missed it lol)
Anyway, as I already said, people will keep buying every crap sequel Ubi release because there is the Heroes name on the box, and I think Ubi knows it well enough lol


'm not a huge lover of this skill pizza either - it's far too limited - but it's also not a deal breaker.
Well for me it obviously is lol


Wonder why you feel they're not listening? I think they are, but that's beside the point. I wouldn't if I were them.
Maybe because you do know contrary to them what made this games great. Seriously broui your ability to see good in bad is commendable, but it doesn’t really clean Ubi from raising wrong expectations.

Antalyan
09-25-2015, 04:42 PM
I have to admit I am more optimistic after the last friday stream.

kbct
09-25-2015, 05:51 PM
Lol dude, it’s not my suggestions, is what is being said all over the forums, for years, siigh lol
It’s the features which has been acclaimed by the community (oh you’re putting brackets now? lol) and are missing from the so-called “best-of”.

I put quotation marks around "the community" because you're not talking about the fan base in this thread as the title suggests. You're talking about a small subset of the fan base. And when I say "your" suggestions, I mean "your community's" suggestions. Don't be so pedantic.

It's mindboggling to think that Ubisoft and Limbic aren't listening to your "community."

On the stream today, Limbic said this about Heroes Community:

BeYo_OnD: if you want to read some ideas

BeYo_OnD: take a look here from time to time

Limbic_ramiro: heroes community?

Limbic_ramiro: we look at it almost every day believe it or not

On balancing:

Ubi_Nox: Balancing will also be monitored after release following your feedback

Limbic_fox: @Natalka_toh Will look into it. We can basically patch balancing without problems

On HC insiders:

BeYo_OnD: and also please listen more to the insiders, Elvin, JJ, vitirr, lepastur and all

Limbic_ramiro: trust me, we do. but at the end of the day it's a "can we?"

Limbic_ramiro: we tried our best and we already change/implemented many things you will love that weren't on the plan. Other like changing the skillwheel are just out of the scope

On VIPs:

BeYo_OnD: @Limbic_oak, make sure to listen to the VIPs feedback and ideas for the H7 future

Limbic_oak: @Beyo_ond we always listen, even if it doesn't make it in

And on what you presented as "evidence" in your first post, not implementing your favorite kind of hero specialization:

As mentioned before, specialization will be one of our main focus for the future of the title

I can't go around and around with you, but you're talking out of your arse if you think Ubisoft/Limbic aren't listening to the fan base.

RobvD84
09-25-2015, 06:07 PM
Well i think a part that is to blame for this is miscommunication and just staying silent. How can we know these stuff if they don't say anything? We have been asking for them to be more in touch with us. And yet when we asked (demand) for a reaction or an answer and then they don't say anything. And then they only answer questions that have been asked million times. So it is not completely our fault that they give off the idea of not giving a damn. Yeah i know it's not easy and they are busy for making the release a good experience. And they are also a bit understaffed (atleast that is what it feels like sometimes). And still i blame Ubi HQ the most out of all of this, because they set the limits, wich is still bs.

NataliaDrumeva
09-25-2015, 07:29 PM
@Limbic.

Thank you for answering all my question today. I have to tell what baffled me at some moments. When I approached you several times with questions why you put level cap, why shooters can`t attack in melee you said it was design decision. This is not excuse if you listen to us and that`s easy to implent specifically those two. You promised to investigate the matter about shooters. Why the level cap is beyond me. You replied that it is difficult to reach level 30. So what if I want to make a super big map with lots of neutral monster to kill I am limited because the FUN STOPS when you reach level 30 so I can make as large and epic adventure as the stupid level cap allows me..

I think we will have serious problem with the battle sites. At first I praised you included this time but on the question why battle sites are so hard - you said they give big rewards(5 grand and major artifact is big reward wtf?!) and are intended for end game. Why leave all battle sites for end game.

We need battle sites for early, mid and end game. This should be your next big topic for improvement. That`s how it was in h3 and h5 .

broui
09-26-2015, 12:11 AM
@Limbic.

Thank you for answering all my question today. I have to tell what baffled me at some moments. When I approached you several times with questions why you put level cap, why shooters can`t attack in melee you said it was design decision. This is not excuse if you listen to us and that`s easy to implent specifically those two. You promised to investigate the matter about shooters. Why the level cap is beyond me. You replied that it is difficult to reach level 30. So what if I want to make a super big map with lots of neutral monster to kill I am limited because the FUN STOPS when you reach level 30 so I can make as large and epic adventure as the stupid level cap allows me..

I think we will have serious problem with the battle sites. At first I praised you included this time but on the question why battle sites are so hard - you said they give big rewards(5 grand and major artifact is big reward wtf?!) and are intended for end game. Why leave all battle sites for end game.

We need battle sites for early, mid and end game. This should be your next big topic for improvement. That`s how it was in h3 and h5 .

During the previous stream, they told me that level cap is optional on user made maps. But I tend to agree about level caps. Don't need them. If the AI is smart and creature growth occurs at a decent rate, there is no "god-like" state a hero can achieve that shouldn't be countered (at least somewhat) by the game. I'm super old school, 20 year Heroes vet. Level caps are for campaigns. Otherwise, I have no use for them and any map I create won't have them.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about battle sites. Could you elaborate?

kbct
09-26-2015, 03:15 AM
During the previous stream, they told me that level cap is optional on user made maps. But I tend to agree about level caps. Don't need them. If the AI is smart and creature growth occurs at a decent rate, there is no "god-like" state a hero can achieve that shouldn't be countered (at least somewhat) by the game. I'm super old school, 20 year Heroes vet. Level caps are for campaigns. Otherwise, I have no use for them and any map I create won't have them.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about battle sites. Could you elaborate?

Natalia posts on Heroes Community and is a multiplayer pro who likes to create her own sophisticated maps. Unlike GalaadleHaut, she prefers the free skill system over the random one and has made positive comments about the MMH7 skill system. She was on the Twitch stream today and got a number of her questions answered by Limbic.

Anyway, you can change the level cap for any map in the editor, but you can't choose a level above 30 right now. Well, if she creates an huge map with lots of neutrals, she wants to be able to level up the hero until the end of the map.

I believe Battle sites are places like the Ancient Ruins or the Dragon Utopia where you get a reward for killing the creatures inside. It sounds like they can't be modded and are currently too difficult for low to mid-level heroes.

The funny thing is I think she'll get the changes which is ironic considering she posted her request in GalaadleHaut's thread saying Ubisoft doesn't listen to the fans. LOL.

NataliaDrumeva
09-26-2015, 09:51 AM
During the previous stream, they told me that level cap is optional on user made maps. But I tend to agree about level caps. Don't need them. If the AI is smart and creature growth occurs at a decent rate, there is no "god-like" state a hero can achieve that shouldn't be countered (at least somewhat) by the game. I'm super old school, 20 year Heroes vet. Level caps are for campaigns. Otherwise, I have no use for them and any map I create won't have them.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about battle sites. Could you elaborate?


I will copy/paste from HC as I can`t say anymore. Moreover you are veteran and I give example with heroes 3

These are battle sites takedowns

for week 1 - like imp cache, crypt
Battle sites for professionals at week 1 - fly hive, medusa whatever,dwarven treasury
battle sites for week 2 - cyclops cave, naga bank,conservatory
battle sites for week 3 - utopia.

This way the map becomes very varied and you fight not only neutral monsters each week but battle sites also. For me in multiplayer maps the most challenge and game breaking events happened in those battle sites in heroes V.

Here is my analysis of H7 battle sites bear in mind I don`t know what dangerous cave`s strength/guards will be.

week1 - crusader commandery
week 2 -Elemental Forge
week 2 professionals - Haunted Ruins
week 3 - utopia, shantiri ruins

I can`t wait to get my hands on the editor and start making a map so I found out during the stream with Julien there are two more battle sites - Haunted Ruins and Dangerous Cave.
I really hoped Haunted Ruins is the same strength like heroes 3 crypt - you could fight it day 1-3 week 1. It had pivotal role in economy.
I checked stream Haunted Ruins had 650 Skeletons 200 Ghosts 10 Vampires. So I will put it week2 professionals/week 3. I imagine it would be possible on my map which has a nice setup for fast leveling up and contains two towns so this is very specific.

I don`t know where Dangerous Cave would go but right now we don`t have enough battle sites for early game and mid game. I may repeat myself but they told me that was a design decision(to deny us the fun of flagging such battle sites during the first stages of the game). Which is a bad one imo.

malax83
09-26-2015, 01:16 PM
A generation (it means 20 - 25 years) is passed. The fan base is cut between the young ones who played after H4 and the older ones who know well H2.

Some mechanics can t be supported by the old generation, there s for now so much example, as Arcane Knowledge, Flanking, Skillwheel restrictions (actually there are only 9 abilities pick when you are reaching your level cap... preset skills on heroes... 1 point ability need to access to the next level skill... ), levels twons requirement is restrictions....

Heroes specialization is one detail which is less valuable but means a lot of things anyway. In fact it s easier to criticize the game talking about specialization, cause you put the finger on the consequence : imo balance.

broui
09-26-2015, 03:02 PM
A generation (it means 20 - 25 years) is passed. The fan base is cut between the young ones who played after H4 and the older ones who know well H2.

Some mechanics can t be supported by the old generation, there s for now so much example, as Arcane Knowledge, Flanking, Skillwheel restrictions (actually there are only 9 abilities pick when you are reaching your level cap... preset skills on heroes... 1 point ability need to access to the next level skill... ), levels twons requirement is restrictions....

Heroes specialization is one detail which is less valuable but means a lot of things anyway. In fact it s easier to criticize the game talking about specialization, cause you put the finger on the consequence : imo balance.

I'm not sure I agree. I'm in that "older" crowd and the only examples you provide that I have issue with is the Skill wheel and level cap. Flanking is okay by me and I've not played with Arcane Knowledge enough to formulate an intelligent opinion one way or another. Level caps are going to have to be lifted in the end. The skill wheel will need a good deal of adjustment because there are no differences between heroes of the same class - except their picture - which is way too limiting and will become a major liability for longevity.

broui
09-26-2015, 03:10 PM
I will copy/paste from HC as I can`t say anymore. Moreover you are veteran and I give example with heroes 3

These are battle sites takedowns

for week 1 - like imp cache, crypt
Battle sites for professionals at week 1 - fly hive, medusa whatever,dwarven treasury
battle sites for week 2 - cyclops cave, naga bank,conservatory
battle sites for week 3 - utopia.

This way the map becomes very varied and you fight not only neutral monsters each week but battle sites also. For me in multiplayer maps the most challenge and game breaking events happened in those battle sites in heroes V.

Here is my analysis of H7 battle sites bear in mind I don`t know what dangerous cave`s strength/guards will be.

week1 - crusader commandery
week 2 -Elemental Forge
week 2 professionals - Haunted Ruins
week 3 - utopia, shantiri ruins

I can`t wait to get my hands on the editor and start making a map so I found out during the stream with Julien there are two more battle sites - Haunted Ruins and Dangerous Cave.
I really hoped Haunted Ruins is the same strength like heroes 3 crypt - you could fight it day 1-3 week 1. It had pivotal role in economy.
I checked stream Haunted Ruins had 650 Skeletons 200 Ghosts 10 Vampires. So I will put it week2 professionals/week 3. I imagine it would be possible on my map which has a nice setup for fast leveling up and contains two towns so this is very specific.

I don`t know where Dangerous Cave would go but right now we don`t have enough battle sites for early game and mid game. I may repeat myself but they told me that was a design decision(to deny us the fun of flagging such battle sites during the first stages of the game). Which is a bad one imo.

Thanks Natalia. For some reason I had something else in my head. I'll be looking for your maps. You sound like my type of map maker. Probably my favorites of all time were made by someone who called themselves Ururam Dururam or something like that. Made a campaign for H4 that was utterly epic. Great story telling and game play. But a level cap would have made his type of map making dull after a while.

"Design decisions" that they're sticking to (your example included) - many will have to be revisited after release. Perhaps they meant it when they said that nothing is off the table.

NataliaDrumeva
09-26-2015, 03:29 PM
I encourage you to visit my thread about hero specializations on HC and give some advice, proposition, inspiration.

ScuipiciTB
09-28-2015, 07:16 AM
I think it's silly to say that they don't listen, after all it's their own money. Thing is Ubisoft doesn't put big budget into this game because it's a niche. Homm fans are very divided and are hard to please, especially some of the old fans. I found comments with " the graphic style looks like heroes 3, it sucks" and then on the same page, another comment " the graphics look like heroes 6, it sucks". This goes on and on. The thing I don't like about some of the old fan base is that they are very whiny, they cry and moan too much. I myself played heroes 3 back in the old days and while the gameplay was nice, the lore sucked. I'm glad ubisoft decided to remove all the SF crap "this is not a real world is only a virtual reality ship" and decide instead to create the wonderful world of Ashan. Heroes 5 was a blast to play, really loved it. Heroes 6 was not so good as Heroes 5 but still enjoyed the story very much and some other stuff. Heroes 7 seems to have so much good stuff to please almost everyone, including the old fans. You even get the old campaigns in the future patch. The game has so much good things to offer, I can't understand why people would cry so much. The only thing I didn't liked was the same skins from heroes 6 to some of the creatures. Luckily the vampire and the lich got new model and was very happy with what we got, the vampire and the lich have the best model in any of the heroes games. I wish Lamasu and Ghosts got new models as well but...I think they were forced not to by the budget limit. I understand some people being very concerned about bugs like in heroes 6, I really do, but I would like for more Homm fans to acknowledge that we are one of the most whiniest and douchiest fanbase out there. Congrats to Limbic for making this game, I will buy my copy later today, cheers! :)

victorash
09-28-2015, 12:08 PM
@ScuipiciTB (http://forums.ubi.com/member.php/1874716-ScuipiciTB): I have a similar opinion with you. I started writing here a quick post, then it got big and I created a new thread. I'll copy here a few things as this was the purpose. Btw are you from Romania? you have a funny nick :)

For all: a selection from an earlier post (this thread - http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1275786-A-neutral-good-(less-emotional)-feed-back-before-the-game-release)

I read what you all wrote on the forums lately and there is a tendency to either be very enthusiastic or very negative (frankly I consider that destructive criticism and complaining never helped). So I felt the need to offer a more neutral - slightly good feed-back (anyway less emotional) with a few days before release.

First of all there is no such thing as bugless game, nor will it include everything from the start. At least this is what I learnt in the past when I tested a Heroes’ clone game for mobile devices for about 5 years (also doing maps and other things - being part of the team gives you liberty). What is important here is: 1. The potential of the game to develop 2. The willingness of the devs to listen and do what they can to make things better.
Taking into consideration the above I would declare satisfied by how the game looks/behaves till now. Because it has enormous potential and it has a lot of features from the beginning (you already know them - complex editor, RMG, the capacity of modding). Modding is facilitating by the devs. What better way to express that they are not rigid and are ok with the game to be diverse and fan oriented. So as Limbic said - it's not the best game (but could be in the future), but it's definitely one of the most complete at release. The only down part is that the game moves slow for my laptop, but it's 4 years old anyway and laptops where never known for good GPU. But it's decent with low specs and it's a motivation for me to buy a new laptop.

On the last Limbic stream I also asked for some features that for now won't be implemented (like ranged units being able to choose their attack as melee if you want, not just melee attack if they are blocked, during battles seeing the original number of the unit's stack in order to know when to heal/resurrect, etc.). But they said they will consider them for later. This is the most important. It is well known that now the trend is to release the game earlier and then to add patches. This is because games are more and more more expensive & complex. So you actually need that money to develop the game further. It's like in Heroes. You will fight with non-upgraded units for the money to upgrade then. It's impossible to wait and buy only top tier units to fight. You use what you have. So I understand them, not to mention that there are many good games coming in autumn and they have a small window to get attention.

Another thing that I learnt during developing that game is that you can't satisfy everybody and that there will be always somebody complaining and somebody ecstatic - and this is because it's their nature and this is only a context to express how they are. Also there will always be nostalgics that will say that things were better before and there will always be forever unsatisfied people that will find something to criticize. In the same time the devs are in-between of taking the good things from the previous series and put enough innovative stuff so that the game is not Heroes 3,5 or 6,5 or so on. They can’t put everything. It's like cooking, if you take your preferred first course and the second one, add you preferred desert and drink and put it all in a pot it will be terrible. It’s nice to have different things separate. Merging Heroes 1 + Heroes 3 + Heroes 5 (the ones I consider the best in the series) doesn’t give the success recipe. Also doing another game very similar to Heroes 3 (because this version was the most appreciated by fans), won’t give you automatic success. I like new & different and a few old spices from the past.

ScuipiciTB
09-28-2015, 03:04 PM
@ScuipiciTB (http://forums.ubi.com/member.php/1874716-ScuipiciTB): I have a similar opinion with you. I started writing here a quick post, then it got big and I created a new thread. I'll copy here a few things as this was the purpose. Btw are you from Romania? you have a funny nick :)

For all: a selection from an earlier post (this thread - http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1275786-A-neutral-good-(less-emotional)-feed-back-before-the-game-release)

I read what you all wrote on the forums lately and there is a tendency to either be very enthusiastic or very negative (frankly I consider that destructive criticism and complaining never helped). So I felt the need to offer a more neutral - slightly good feed-back (anyway less emotional) with a few days before release.

First of all there is no such thing as bugless game, nor will it include everything from the start. At least this is what I learnt in the past when I tested a Heroes’ clone game for mobile devices for about 5 years (also doing maps and other things - being part of the team gives you liberty). What is important here is: 1. The potential of the game to develop 2. The willingness of the devs to listen and do what they can to make things better.
Taking into consideration the above I would declare satisfied by how the game looks/behaves till now. Because it has enormous potential and it has a lot of features from the beginning (you already know them - complex editor, RMG, the capacity of modding). Modding is facilitating by the devs. What better way to express that they are not rigid and are ok with the game to be diverse and fan oriented. So as Limbic said - it's not the best game (but could be in the future), but it's definitely one of the most complete at release. The only down part is that the game moves slow for my laptop, but it's 4 years old anyway and laptops where never known for good GPU. But it's decent with low specs and it's a motivation for me to buy a new laptop.

On the last Limbic stream I also asked for some features that for now won't be implemented (like ranged units being able to choose their attack as melee if you want, not just melee attack if they are blocked, during battles seeing the original number of the unit's stack in order to know when to heal/resurrect, etc.). But they said they will consider them for later. This is the most important. It is well known that now the trend is to release the game earlier and then to add patches. This is because games are more and more more expensive & complex. So you actually need that money to develop the game further. It's like in Heroes. You will fight with non-upgraded units for the money to upgrade then. It's impossible to wait and buy only top tier units to fight. You use what you have. So I understand them, not to mention that there are many good games coming in autumn and they have a small window to get attention.

Another thing that I learnt during developing that game is that you can't satisfy everybody and that there will be always somebody complaining and somebody ecstatic - and this is because it's their nature and this is only a context to express how they are. Also there will always be nostalgics that will say that things were better before and there will always be forever unsatisfied people that will find something to criticize. In the same time the devs are in-between of taking the good things from the previous series and put enough innovative stuff so that the game is not Heroes 3,5 or 6,5 or so on. They can’t put everything. It's like cooking, if you take your preferred first course and the second one, add you preferred desert and drink and put it all in a pot it will be terrible. It’s nice to have different things separate. Merging Heroes 1 + Heroes 3 + Heroes 5 (the ones I consider the best in the series) doesn’t give the success recipe. Also doing another game very similar to Heroes 3 (because this version was the most appreciated by fans), won’t give you automatic success. I like new & different and a few old spices from the past.


Yes, I'm from Romania. Our opinion is similar, tho it's not shared by many "vets" ( hate this term, looks silly ). It became like meme "heroes 3 is the best, **** the rest", even those who didn't even played heroes 5 or 6 say that just because it's cool to say or something. Heroes 3 was good, was one of the best games at that time and I have many memories playing that game, but heroes 5 beats it, at least for me. And from what I see, heroes 7 will also beat it.

bigaxd
09-28-2015, 05:15 PM
this heroes looks awful, buggy, terrible design. And with Ubisoft partnership even worse

NataliaDrumeva
09-28-2015, 09:24 PM
I recheked stream from Friday and saw there are always 2 native heroes in the Hall of Heroes. Why do the developers always simplify stuff? In CB1 there was 2 heroes , in CB2 one hero and now again 2 heroes. Maybe it was a design decision again?
Anyway this is simplifying the game quite a bit..

broui
09-28-2015, 11:55 PM
I recheked stream from Friday and saw there are always 2 native heroes in the Hall of Heroes. Why do the developers always simplify stuff? In CB1 there was 2 heroes , in CB2 one hero and now again 2 heroes. Maybe it was a design decision again?
Anyway this is simplifying the game quite a bit..

That'll be on my list tomorrow. I intend to do what I have been doing during both CBs which is to make a list of what I see that could use attention. I don't mind a limited number of heroes in the HoH, but with only one from the faction I'm playing per week available, we're relying on luck.

TheErwinner
09-29-2015, 12:20 PM
there are too many anecdotes to even cover describing the problems with Ubisoft's management of the series and areas they could clearly improve, either objectively or in subjective areas where what they do is not popular.

Heroes Community isn't a hive mind or some kind of team but a popular discussion platform of Heroes, there is no absurd notion of HC taking any kind of action, any more than the Ubisoft forums or a football stadium has agency of its own, there are individual players on HC who may independently know each other and agree with each other though, as I tend to agree with Galaad for instance.

there is a truth that the fan base has taken the Ubisoft production team of Erwin to task more than usual in response to what is regarded as incompetence from Ubisoft, after driving their H6 partner Black Hole to bankruptcy and being identified by multiple credible sources in the know as people unwilling to listen/holding the series back with mismanagement.

GalaadleHaut
10-01-2015, 11:45 AM
Unlike GalaadleHaut, she prefers the free skill system over the random one
Nobody's perfect lol

GalaadleHaut
10-14-2015, 01:44 AM
The funny thing is I think she'll get the changes which is ironic considering she posted her request in GalaadleHaut's thread saying Ubisoft doesn't listen to the fans. LOL.
Assuming the game is playable (lol), were her requests implemented finally? lol

Zuhav
10-14-2015, 12:25 PM
God Galaad..can you stop loling at everything as if you had some disease ?
Sounds like you're mocking everyone's opinion...Hard to take your words seriously with that attitude...

I'm a veteran too and I enjoyed playing all the iterations of the franchise.

For Hmm 1 to 3 was the same game getting better and better till its peak at Hmm 3. Then Hmm 4 tried to change things ( dunno why ), I didn't like those changes because of the choices between creatures you had to make and the heroes based combats ( creatures almost didn't matter you could just go for full heroes army + champion creatures and it was OP and going too far away from initial game mechanics/plot ). Still enjoyed it a lot.
I was glad they went back to Hmm 3 basis with Hmm 5 and there was so much additions but some stuffs hit me hard.

In particular ramdom skills. You could loose a game just for not having the right ones. For instance if your enemy had luck skill maxed out and you hadn't, you had lower chances to win the fight. Same for attack and defense skills because of the percentages of increased damages reductions and attack damages. It felt like you needed to get those skills otherwise you would likely be wiped by your opponent in multi-player games. Still enjoyed a lot, I think this is the one I enjoyed the most.


Then Hmm 6 came out and...gosh graphics were amazing animations/effects etc...I remember being astonished by vampires and the inferno's legendary creature teleportation smoke effects. I was glad they left the cartoonish style of Hmm 5 behind.
Something great, was the faction's unique powers. Every creatures had so much abilities which made them unique and there was nice combos to set up in battles. Town portal between cities was great as well as converting cities and bosses battles. I was so happy to see that you could choose your spells and skills at will. It felt like they decided to get rid of most of the restrictions and randomness in Hmm 5. At this time I felt like they had clearly identified what was going wrong in former Hmm games and fixed it.
But after countless hours the statement was : too much freedom leads to boring single skill build, too much abilities leads to creatures almost impossible to balance properly, too much same faction cities leads to even more creatures which leads to battles relying mainly on numbers more than strategical/tactical decisions. Direct damages spells were then worthless cause too weak...etc...etc...etc...
Before realizing it was quite a broken game, I had so much fun and the graphics improvements blew my mind so hard that I still enjoyed it afterwards.

In the end we can say that every single Hmm game added something to the series. And with such a complex game, it is really hard to tell wether or not random skills is better than free skills. Or, heroes specializations are better with +1/+1 or whatever. The goal should be anyway to bring something balanced, well rounded and fun as pleasant to the eyes to the board. And may be simplification is needed to achieve this goal.
That's what I think this game will add to the franchise : some kind of rationality.
I hope it will not be detrimental to the overall game experience. Because it feels quite sad to see some solid concept and features disapear from an iteration to another. Few steps backwards could be seen as salvation if it is handled wisely.

For now on, I'm quite disappointed by the state of the game but i think there's nothing that can't be tweaked and polished by future patches. There's still hopes for brighter future.

I might be mistaking, this is my personal opinion and I might as well have missed the bigger picture.

GalaadleHaut
10-14-2015, 12:59 PM
Random skills were oriented-random, so you could still get what you want considering you understood how the system works lol
Only odds for ultimates in h5 were a bit broken, and in h3 you could eventually get ONE unwanted skill out of 8 and you have to deal with it because you know lol
I disagree with you about balance, h3 and h5 for instance were not really balanced however they are super fun IMO lol
Btw "veteran" is a term about competitive online multiplayer from TOH, so maybe just say old-timer or long-time fan lol

Anyway I'm pretty convinced Ubi will never be able to make a good Heroes game and should sell the rights or at least stop the massacre.

DepartedSha
10-14-2015, 02:27 PM
Have you heard the wonders of Ubisoft? They have gone and made a nice announcment on might and magic Duel of Champions. They release the long waited Draft mode almos year late and then they say that that game won't be updated anymore. So my advice to any player playing ubisoft games... Don't or atleast don't spent any money on them. Ubisoft doesn't care about the game it's funcionality or bug they have in them. They are just going to take your money and leave the crappy game behind.

I and many others enjoyed MMDoc, but ubisoft doesn't care. They neglet the ubpdates, bugfixess and all community managing and still the game is great. But now as they announce that they won't do jack **** about the game anymore it means that bug will stay, no additional content on a ****ing card game so it will never see any change in the games.

I seirously recomend you to not buy any of this crappy companies games. It's not worht it.

MrD69
10-14-2015, 05:46 PM
Skill wheel sucks. Might look like the one in H5, but it sure does not function the same

Marathronite
12-24-2015, 11:26 AM
I could give you benefit of the doubt if there wasn’t things such as THIS (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=38292), created in 2012, revived a few pages later (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=38292&PID=1294866#focus) in an attempt to compromise and still satisfy most.

You need to understand that the skill system is of crucial matter yet the MMH7 Team seems very stubborn on not listening to the community’s wishes as seen HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy), you can clearly see the feedback from the Shadow Council about it HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy#553e854c6b3bb7523609c90b), HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy#553e783f29c836a66032802f) or HERE (https://mmh7.ubi.com/us/blog/post/view/skillwheel-the-design-philosophy#553e79936b3bb7ca3409c8fa) just for the top three upvoted but there is more. Silence from the Team in return and no change at all after it.

How exactly well was the Spidercult received? I think you remember very well the community’s outrage after it and how we had to drive ourselves insane in order to get your attention.

I think the HOMM community is vocal enough to make it clear what are the aspects loved by most and also the ones hated by most over the years, the MMH7 Team is overdoing it, all they had to do was to take things from the past and slightly improve them, correct what was wrong in them. Is no secret some people from the community could have helped you with it. Not to mention Cepheus’s departure from the VIP group (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1058369#focus) back in the days of h6, and why exactly would Quantomas, who made the best AI ever done for the games, not be working with you, although he did express some if his views HERE (http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=36851&PID=1037007#focus) back in 2011.

Yet it seems from the very start a lot of things were set in stone from the Team and it looks like whatever we say to complain we will be wrong, just how hard would it be to listen to the feedback done throughout the years?

Most of the gameplay reveals were done very late down SC, if they really wanted to be as transparent as they said such matters should have been said in time, while there was still enough time to revisit it don’t you think?

I could go on and on but I think you have all the evidence from what has been said down SC and in HC.

Also on less important but still non-negligeable matters, why do we get a blue bambi instead of Unicorn if we want Blade Dancer, or neither of them if we want Phoenix? This is absurd, or it tells people who organized these flavor votes were not aware at all of the fan base’s expectations, polls gathered by Logical.Dust (you can find them down SC) clearly shows what creatures majority wanted.

All I see is the Team made something according to their own preferences, which clearly are not in line with the community’s expectations, and I believe this is bad for business, since you also aim at the old crowd with a so-called “back to the roots” campaign, yet I’ve witnessed more disappointment and flaming coming from the community rather than support. I believe some things are no-brainers for the success of this brand and if you want to have happy customers, I can assure you, a lot of people are going to check what is being said on the fan forums and wait for communities reviews before buying it, especially after h6 which is even more hated than h4.

From what I see, Ubi's words don't match their actions.

I feel sad reading this, because it's the truth.

Ubi-MoshiMoshi
12-24-2015, 11:34 AM
Hi Marathronite and welcome to the forums,

Please stop bumping old topics.

Thanks

Marathronite
12-25-2015, 07:42 PM
Hi Marathronite and welcome to the forums,

Please stop bumping old topics.

Thanks

Hello,
Needless to say I don't feel very "welcomed" when being accused of "bumping" when all I do is reply to the topics that got my attention...

Bongowomabt
12-27-2015, 02:04 PM
Hi Marathronite and welcome to the forums,

Please stop bumping old topics.

Thanks
I love how ubi only reply when they are annoyed with someone :D

Ubi reply with something like this. We are looking at ur ideas and hopefully will implement them.

Just fix the game changing bugs and crashes. I know we are getting a update next year and its way to early for it. fix the bugs then bring more stuff for us when the game is playable. I lost a stack of troops today witch in the campaign is not to nice (but wait the campaign is so easy u only need to cast 1 fire wall to win a battle :D

Mortician874
12-28-2015, 01:01 PM
Of course Ubisoft does not care about their fanbase. If they did we would have a great game instead of the current and continuous failures.

Ubi-MoshiMoshi
12-28-2015, 03:37 PM
Think this thread has also run its course and is turning into an insult thread.

Closed.