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XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 08:38 PM
I've never played any FS and I would like to know your opinion about it.
Is it worth a try?
Will someone who likes FB flying model, enjoy FS2004's?
What are the cons and pros?
Why would anyone buy it?

A lot of questions but just because I've never seen it I'm curious and I bet that a lot of people in this community play it too.

Thanks

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 08:38 PM
I've never played any FS and I would like to know your opinion about it.
Is it worth a try?
Will someone who likes FB flying model, enjoy FS2004's?
What are the cons and pros?
Why would anyone buy it?

A lot of questions but just because I've never seen it I'm curious and I bet that a lot of people in this community play it too.

Thanks

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 08:45 PM
Hi there,

I have been looking over all the screenshots and I have decided to take the plunge - mostly because a guy over at flightsim.com tipped me off to a low price $59.99 CDN instead of $79.99 (a little steep in my opinion). Anyhow, it should ship in a few days so I'll let you know what I think. I play FB pretty exclusively and have never tried a civilian sim.

Here's why I bought it:

Beautiful visuals - check out the weather and plane models!
The chance to fly ANYWHERE in the world
Being able to use ATC and GPS like a real plane - getting a taste for more realistic flight procedures.

That said, I have NEVER even played a MSFS game before and you never know, I might hate it - if nobody else that has 2004 now posts, I'll let you know how it goes.

P.S. Check out http://www.flightsim.com and look around their forums - lots of info there and a few FB fliers as well.

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 08:45 PM
The game looks sick, and I will buy it as soon as I cough up $55.

AMD Athlon XP 1700+ T-Bred B
Epox 8K9AI
PC2100 512MB DDR
GeForce 4 Ti4600 128MB
Game Theater XP w/ Sony MHC-BX6AV

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 08:55 PM
I fly fs2002 like crazy but have held off on 2004. There are alot of missing bridges/visual cues for flying, although there are supposed to be many visual enhancements such as better scenery textures, autogen, clouds, ATC and weather effect improvements as well as better aircraft flight characteristics. OH, clickable VC's too.

I guess I'm still having too much fun w/ fs2002 to justify spending $55 on it. I'm sure I'll wind up getting it but I'd rather pay for an FB addon first http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 08:56 PM
YOU CANT SHOOT ANYTHING

http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/griffon.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 09:01 PM
I have FS2002 so I'll wait till the price comes down on FS2004.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
http://www.tamiya.com/japan/products/list/48plane_img/61027.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 09:08 PM
I've had it for 6 days now. It's definately worth a try, especially if you've never dabbled in civilian flight sims. There are some pretty big differences between it and FB (aside from the not being able to shoot anything... hey you can ram stuff!):

1) The focus is more on flying and navigating properly and utilizing your instruments.

2) FB runs a magnitude smoother! Folks in the FS2004 camp seem to think 20fps is fine. Granted, it's fully playable but the framerate leaves a little to be desired IMO

There are a couple of shortcomings but no real show stoppers. The bridges are very wacky in parts. Another thing I dislike is that there are some bugs in the training missions... makes it difficult if you don't realize they're bugs and you just think you're doing something wrong.

The sim does have a very different feel to it and is very enjoyable. If you're more into the combat aspect of FB and not much into the flying aspect, I would just stick to FB, but if you'd like to get a deeper appreciation for aviation in general you should pick up a copy.

P.S. Mine came with a snazzy toy of the "Spirit of St. Louis".



<center>http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/~logston/banner.jpg </img>
</center>

Message Edited on 08/04/0301:09PM by StainRat

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 09:26 PM
Is the FM any better than it was in FS2002? That's the only thing keeping me away from it.

http://www.cherokee.org/Culture/images/proctorZeke.jpg
"My ancestors didn't come over in the Mayflower--they met the boat."


http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612345111

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 09:27 PM
I am getting it in a few weeks. I loved FS98 and FS2000, I skipped out on FS2002 and lost my old FS CDs so this game is a godsend, the cloud effects look stunning.

<center>
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I do not know any good signature message, so I will put this anyway.
-=[CGDreamerX]=-

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 09:36 PM
FS2004 friggen ROCKS. It fixes so many of the downfalls of 2002, the weather is great, the skies finally look really great, the ground scenery is decent. yadda yadda.

I already did my pitch and sharing of opinion in the Pilot Lounge, and IMO anyone crapping on FS2004 or avoiding buying it is missing out on something really EXCELLENT.

MS got it really right and I'm really impressed.



<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 09:40 PM
it was Fs2000 that got me hooked on Pc simulations, i couldent aford Fs2000 but i could afford Cfs1 which got me into combat sims (off topic )

<center>I know my name is spelled wrong

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 10:11 PM
screw microsoft, dont get it unless you can get it for free

best civialian sim is X-plane

check out www.x-plane.com (http://www.x-plane.com)

the graphics are great now, and its got the most realistic flight and physics models, real aircraft manufactures use it to test thier designs, it also comes with its own plane building utility, you can make any kind of plane you can think of and it will figure out how it flys according to the design, it works great

also it has a demo you can download

----------------------------------------

http://www.microworks.net/pacific/aviation/xfl-1.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 10:16 PM
The scenery in X-plane simply can't compare with FS2002.

And as far as addon planes go - you may be able to make any plane for X-plane, but FS addons actually model the plane and it's systems. A good example is the PSS A320 - if you don't know how to program the computers on the plane you can't even take off! X-plane won't do that.

However I do believe that X-plane has better modelling of flight than FS. X-Plane can be used towards real world ATP hours. And I think X-Plane does helicopter flight better.

But really for the best of both worlds (scenery and flight dynamics) FS is the winner between these 2 IMO.

Not taking into account the M$ factor here. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 10:29 PM
the ground still looks like crap but the sky is pretty amazing, very very good fps and very smooth online too.

Also you can fly anywhere in the world which is the best feature of the ms's


I wish oleg would design the flight sim to have full world geography he can keep the same quality of graphics now just have it done in sections, when you reach the edge of the map kind of how gta loads up


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Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:10 PM
The FM is pretty much the same as FS2002 but the ATC (can land on multiple runways now as well as be denied VFR take off's and landings) and the weather makes up for it.

You can see storms building in the distance and all the planes now have a virtual cockpit (The Lear Jet is an amazing plane).

I bought and was very impressed at how much better it is over FS2002. If you liked the latter at all you will love FS2004.

As far as aviation sims go nothing compares.



See you in the fence.....

Asus P4B533 i845E
P4 2.4
Asus GF4 Ti 4200 128MB (44.03)
1 GIG DDR RAM (PC 2100)
SB Audigy
MSFF2
XP Home

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:43 PM
What about DM? No really...in FS2002 you could seemingly pass THROUGH other planes, and when you hit the ground you simply "bounce" back up. Or do I have the settings wrong?*scratches head,looking confused*/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:49 PM
No, it's crap!!!!!!!!

Hot Space

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:52 PM
StainRat wrote:


- P.S. Mine came with a snazzy toy of the "Spirit of
- St. Louis".

Sold!!



http://mysite.freeserve.com/jjffjj/images/0-picture.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:55 PM
I picked it up at Walmart for 49 bucks, not shabby at all, and it came with the Wright Flyer. I really like it, one thing that I really like about it is that the ILS is better IMO, than 2002. The clouds are fantastic, I just need an upgrade. I still run an xp1700 and GeForce 3, but with everything maxed and the clouds off, I get very decent frame rates. So I turn the clouds up a little and everything else down a little to find a happy medium. Its much less jerky than 2002, now, I just need to wait until PSS releases the new A330/A340 and 747/777 series aircraft. To run the new addons I will need an upgrade for sure, I'm trying to wait a little longer until LOMAC comes out. What can I say, I like jets, no matter how big or small.



"The Peacock will be on time, fan his tail."

William Frederick "Bull" Halsey

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:57 PM
Spirit of St. Louis? I got the crappy wright flyer with my copy.

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:57 PM
Mine just showed up 2 minutes ago in a cute metal box/tin/thingy.

Da Buzz
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<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/perdomo3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 12:34 AM
Its exactly as MS2002, except for improved weather and ATC and GPS; is what i hear. Seems to be just a $59.00 patch for MS2k2. yes the graphics are awesome, the scenery is even more awesome, very photorealistic. You can fly anywhere in the world and see all the regular landmarks, and it will take u exactly the same amout of time to get to say NY to Paris. The cockpits are also photorealistic with every button clickable with the mouse. Detailed airports and taxiways are superb. There are so many user add-ons, and literally thousands of excellently modeled planes to download at http://www.avsim.com I literally got 3 gig of planes alone! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif not to mention all the scenery files, which is probably another gig or 2 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I've had MSFS2002 for a year now and enjoyed it quite a bit, and i am sure FS2004 is not gonna be much different. I hear the new aircraft modeled in FS2004 are more on the vintage uninteresting side with the already familiar Cessnas, Boeings etc.
And NO you cant shoot anything and blow$hit up /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif lol
Wish "microsucks' would make a modern combat flight sim, i think it would rock! In my opinion they made too many CFS series, and the last one was lame.


w*v

Message Edited on 08/04/0307:38PM by Swivet

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:04 AM
Don't make the same mistake twice.

No incurra en la misma equivocaci¨n dos veces.

¸´*Ž³²´Ž

Ne faites pas la m¨ºme erreur deux fois.

Machen Sie nicht den gleichen Fehler zweimal.

Non faccia due volte lo stesso errore.



Lt.Davis

http://www.angelfire.com/hero/apvg/tigerlogo01.jpg


**Speed is the KEY**

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:23 AM
Sorry to those that like it, but I think it sucks. Wasted money for me. Back to FB.

Da Buzz
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<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/perdomo3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:31 AM
I haven't gotten it yet, and don't plan to do so any time soon. In a lot of ways I'd really like to have it, but I've put so much work into my FS2K2 installation, customizing the terrain and the scenery, acquiring top-quality add-on aircraft (the stock ones are pretty lame, though they can be fixed up with enough work) and tweaking it in various ways. I just can't make myself give it all up.

I know they're saying that most of the FS2K2 addons will work in 2K4, but they're also saying some of them don't work as well; and anyway I'd still have to move everything over, that's a hell of a job - my main FS2K2 folder is nearly at 2 gigs right now, that's how much stuff I've got in there - and inevitably there'd be some things I'd lose.

I just spent this afternoon creating a flight model for a graphically beautiful but FM-challenged Stampe SV4 - that happens sometimes, it's not just IL-2/FB that gets gorgeous planes that don't fly correctly, but with FS you can fix them yourself and don't have to WAIT FOR A DAMN PATCH THAT HALF THE TIME GETS THEM JUST AS WRONG THE OTHER WAY, sorry, sorry, forget I said that...what I was going to say, when you put in that kind of work you have to think very hard about possibly having to throw it away.

And then too I'm hearing about some performance issues, some people are saying that those pretty clickable virtual cockpits eat a lot of framerate and I'm already pushing it with all that high-res terrain mesh and fancy scenery I've got laid down. So I don't know.

Somebody who's just starting out, though, probably ought to go with FS2K4. There's going to be plenty of good stuff for it within a year or so - people are already working like crazy to update some of the FS2K2 add-on planes and scenery to work in the new version - and it does, undoubtedly, have a lot of improved features, if your computer rig is capable of handling it and if you can run FB that shouldn't be a problem.

And I'll probably talk myself into getting it eventually. After all, I finally talked myself into getting FB even though I was happy with Il-2...and that may be one reason I'm shy of going to another new sim; once burned, you know....

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:38 AM
StainRat wrote:
There are some pretty big differences
- between it and FB (aside from the not being able to
- shoot anything... hey you can ram stuff!)

Really? I thought M$ didn't allow you to do that after 9/11.


*****Only left handed people are in their right minds.*****

<center>http://www.ghosts.com/images/wing.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:53 AM
Anybody who dosen't want to pay full price. You can have mine for $40. 2 hours old.

Da Buzz
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<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/perdomo3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 05:21 AM
Buzz, you crack me up man. I can't see how you can make a sound judgment that quick, but hey, to each their own.

Here's some of my latest FS2004 adventure screenies:

http://acompletewasteofspace.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2111



<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 05:27 AM
Mine was free. Still sit'n here on the desk lol. No big hurry to install it as it has no gun's on the plane's. Where the hell is LOCK ON. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 05:47 AM
I am of two minds whether to get it

I mainly fly addon aircraft and my FS2002 has the skyworld clouds addon that actually seem better than the Fs2004 ones and i have already downloaded Mesh and airports for everywhere I fly. Not sure if it will benefit me much.


The only thing so far that has caught my eye is the improved ATC and the ability for AI to use multiple runways .. FS2002 gets stuck if you program a realistic number of planes trying to take off and land at once ... you get this huge queue to takeoff on the taxiway and a radical number in circuit.

<center> http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0SQDLAtUWiWZ3BKw19!aryp7v3C1h1DuNwpHOOuqhlraGSyMAY KiPEOZAA1OBgsLu*Sa0UQ2my0PiFyvNkJ5K7Clsoy7yNtEvOXY nHDuPNiotpZACY2oJxw/aircraftround.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 06:46 AM
Dex,

I put more time into FS2002, and never liked it. I was hoping 2004 would be much better. Four hours told me it isnt. It will take more than better clouds to win me over.

btw..Please check your PM at the PL.

Da Buzz
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<center>
http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/foto1/perdomo3.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 10:16 AM
I finally cracked and bought FS2004 and the B25 Mitchell 'Briefing Time' by MAAM-SIM and I'm pretty stunned.

http://www.avsim.com/pages/0203/briefing_time/briefing_time.html


This is one of the most lovingly crafted and complete sim aircraft I have ever seen. It also works perfectly in FS2004 ( which was a bit of a gamble ).
Now if I could just use that weaponry .......

michapma
08-05-2003, 10:35 AM
Off topic, locking.



Oops, I can't do that. /i/smilies/16x16_robot-very-happy.gif

I won't buy it because I don't fly 2002 more often than once or twice a month, and it works well enough for what I want. I saw 2004 in the store yesterday and in Switzerland it's going for 119.- CHF ($88US). Doesn't bring enough in my opinion. If for some reason I start going more general aviation I'll get it. My brother has been anticipating it eagerly for some time, and he invests a lot in mods. He's hoping for better graphics and weather, and even ATC. I wish he could quit his job and go into aviation. /i/smilies/16x16_robot-happy.gif

Dex, nice mods. I recognized Juliana, and not from having been there previously. I especially liked the water textures and buildings. Where did you get that stuff, which packages are they?

Mike

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

SKULLS_Chap

<a href="http://www.skulls98.netfirms.com/il2/index.html" target="_blank" style="color: #191970; font-size: medium">The
SKULLS</a></p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

Zayets
08-05-2003, 10:36 AM
Want a real FM? Want something worth for the money you spend? Want Mars and space shuttle? Want fun and decent frame rates? Want a real civil sim? The answer is here:
http://www.x-plane.org



Zayets out

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 01:19 PM
michapma wrote:
- Dex, nice mods. I recognized Juliana, and not from
- having been there previously. I especially liked the
- water textures and buildings. Where did you get that
- stuff, which packages are they?
-
- Mike

Hey Mike, those screenies are all default stuff. The only mod is the plane, which is a FS2002 plane from Project Opensky.



<p align="center"> http://www.1stclassproperties.ca/mr/Spit.jpg
Tongue-tied & twisted,
just an earthbound misfit,
I.
</CENTER>
</p>

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 01:25 PM
Hmm I have FS2002, and some great add on aircraft, Mig-21, 421c, Archer, Dreamfleet 737, and a bunch of hi-res scenery and airports, I want fs2004 bad, since my yoke has gone unused for a while (except for TB-3 and HE-111 flights), except I doubt my P3 1ghz and GF3 ti-200 will handle it, need to get a new comp first. The best thing I like is the tons of free scenery downloads for Alaska and bush flying, and trying the dangerous landings, this to me is as much of a challenge as DF. Just learning the navigation, and progamming FMC's is cool too.

Anyone running this on a slow system? Need to overcharge some customers and get a new computer, thats the American way afterall isnt it?

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 01:36 PM
I tried it for a few hours as well and I liked the clouds, the clouds, oh and the clouds. If you can through your $$$ away, than maybe it's worth it. I just don't like having to use too much of my own imagination to make the game better. That's way I dig sitting back in my FB cockpit looking out the window. /i/smilies/16x16_robot-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_robot-happy.gif

<center><img src=http://home.bresnan.net/~krojas/img/77banner.jpg alt="Click here to visit Maddog-Simulations.com!"> (http://www.maddog-simulations.com)</center>

michapma
08-05-2003, 01:49 PM
Hmm, my screen doesn't look like that, I guess you've got more stuff turned on, although mine's set pretty high.
Thanks,
Mike

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

SKULLS_Chap

<a href="http://www.skulls98.netfirms.com/il2/index.html" target="_blank" style="color: #191970; font-size: medium">The
SKULLS</a></p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 02:45 PM
I've flown SIMS since the 70's and the Msft FS series since I guess 81...

I got FS 2004, and I think it is a great and worthwhile expense. Let me relate a an interesting "flying" sense/experiences....

First, at "100% full real" if you will, ie in cockpit with all the behavior.. the planes will challenge.. especially the stick and rudder planes... There is a excellent modeling of torque, and yaw-pitch coupling. I love IL2/FB.. but this aspect is not strongly modeled imho. I took the Ryan NYP plane in its "historical" rainy takeoff.. It is a challenge.. witht the adverse yaw.. Now.. I normally use my FFB2 twist rudder for IL2/FB/CFS etc... however, I added my CH Rudder Pedals (I also use a CH throttle)... and it really made a huge difference in handling both the Ryan and the Piper Cub.

The reason being, is that the twist rudder works fast and great for warbird sims, where yaw coupling is I believe over-damped. With these little early planes the sure fixed rudder pedals only position the rudder where you place it..and you definetely "feel" yourself controlling the yaw.

The Piper Cub is really a sense "flying". It is fun to do cross-couples yawing, side and forward slips into grassy small strips, ducking around clouds.. etc. You can really do barrel rolls with just rudder and elevator. Spins and snaps feel right to me.

What fascinated me, actually, was flying the Cub for a couple of hours, then I came over and picked up the P47D-22 for some online flying at HL.. and I was very impressed that the P47 "felt" so heavy in hand ... It was really a good sensation going from a light very manouveralbe plane to the heavy P47's slow roll and extended times to manouver...

So, I think if you enjoy the sensation of flight, it is worth getting !




" The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down ": General Chuck Yeager, USAF, describing his first confrontation with a Me262 - - -
" Aggressiveness was a fundamental to success in air-to-air combat and if you ever caught a fighter pilot in a defensive mood you had him licked before you started shooting ": Captain David McCampbell, USN, leading U.S. Navy ace in W.W.II.

michapma
08-05-2003, 03:22 PM
TWOGTOTO,

Are you saying the flight model is different from the one in 2002, or just that the new planes have good flight models?

Mike

<table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="10"><tr valign="middle" bgcolor="#3e463b"><td height="40" colspan="3" align="center">The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide project (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/)</a></td></tr><tr bgcolor="#515e2f"><td width="40%">FB engine management:
Manifold Pressure sucks (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182081-1.html)
Those Marvelous Props (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182082-1.html)
Mixture Magic (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html)
Putting It All Together (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html)
Those Fire-Breathing Turbos (Part 1 of 6) (http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182102-1.html)</td><td align="center">

SKULLS_Chap

<a href="http://www.skulls98.netfirms.com/il2/index.html" target="_blank" style="color: #191970; font-size: medium">The
SKULLS</a></p></td><td width="40%" align="right" valign="top">Hardware:
Flight Simulation Performance Analyzed (http://www.simhq.com/_air/air_062a.html)
Building a home-made throttle quadrant step by step (http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=us_il2sturmovik_gd&id=zkavv)
Sound Can Be Hazardous for Games (http://www6.tomshardware.com/game/20030405/index.html)</td></tr></table>

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 04:19 PM
Mike,

I have not compared the same planes between the two.

The new planes are of course all prop, stick and rudder... Much more "flying sense" than a Cessna... with an obvious sense of yaw, coupling, torque.

Not much of that in 737's, or even Beech Barons... compared to the Ryan NYP, etc...

" The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down ": General Chuck Yeager, USAF, describing his first confrontation with a Me262 - - -
" Aggressiveness was a fundamental to success in air-to-air combat and if you ever caught a fighter pilot in a defensive mood you had him licked before you started shooting ": Captain David McCampbell, USN, leading U.S. Navy ace in W.W.II.

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 05:26 PM
I have a friend who has an Extra 300, and i've been up in it many times. I also flew in competition RC aerobatics for years. I love aerobatics. The Extra 300 FM in 2002/2004 is a joke. Try a simple loop in it, and tell me if you think it's even close to the real plane?

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 05:37 PM
Agreed Buzz. I can do complete loop's in the 777 at full real. Not to mention bouncing on the runway and actually going through the runway at times (as mentioned before).

The FM is not even close to that of FB but I didn't buy it for that.

I do like to insturment fly and the ATC and GPS is very cool and then mix in the weather that is entertaining to me to say the least.

I still give it a thumbs up

See you in the fence.....

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