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Gold31415
09-01-2015, 02:13 PM
Anyone else think that removing modern day elements was the biggest mistake in Unity?

There seemed no point to doing any of the missions, no higher goal, no modern day reveals. Whats the point then?

It's like Ubisoft catered Unity to people who just got into the franchise as opposed to people who buy AC games every year.

That and the ending sucked big time.

SixKeys
09-01-2015, 03:06 PM
Biggest? No. The biggest problem was releasing an unfinished game riddled with bugs and other problems when they knew it wasn't ready.

D.I.D.
09-01-2015, 03:18 PM
No.

Worse things:

- Overstuffed with knowingly bad missions in order to pad the game and provide unlockable content (not a criticism of the game designers, but you know who), to the point of diluting the game. There's a great game hidden in the heart of Unity, if it was pared down (and it's still my favourite one so far, for that reason).

- Almost total misuse/underuse of one of the richest sources of historical drama in world history, replaced with nothing good

- Played up a love story with no substance

- Didn't know how to end.

Removal of the modern day comes way down that list for me. I fail to see how adding some AC4/Rogue sections would have improved Unity at all, and really I loved how little it ripped me out of the experience.

This assumption that everything that happens has to have some impact in 2015 is very strange. Why? In our world, we've had the dramatic conflicts going on for thousands of years and history remains interesting. Sometimes, that history is interesting because it has a direct influence on modern politics forever more (like the FRENCH REVOLUTION for example, DAMN), and often it doesn't directly affect the modern day but either way these are stories worth retelling. If you're offered a fiction in which the Templars were an Illuminati-type organisation that didn't stop in the early 1300s. they're not twiddling their thumbs most of the time. Every part of their conflict as it relates to a major historical event ought to be interesting by itself. I don't understand why the question is "What did this mean to the modern day?" before something else is asked: "What did this mean to Arno's day?". Arno doesn't live or think like a resident of Paris, even as a transplant from Versailles, so we're cut off from the effects of this turmoil.

Put simply, if the same people who singularly failed to write an engaging French Revolution story or even a convincing human love story were tasked with bolting their best shot at a MD story onto it, how could that ever have resulted in an awesome game overall?

x3SLyONe
09-01-2015, 03:22 PM
i agree linking modern day with past made it exciting with modern conspiracy, if they do add it in Syndicate i dont want to read about it on a tablet or go to a website for the information i want full on animations/story.

dxsxhxcx
09-01-2015, 03:31 PM
they've been doing that since AC4, the only difference is that in Unity they were able to make it worse than already was...

Gold31415
09-01-2015, 04:07 PM
Put simply, if the same people who singularly failed to write an engaging French Revolution story or even a convincing human love story were tasked with bolting their best shot at a MD story onto it, how could that ever have resulted in an awesome game overall?

Thanks, but I meant in an ideal world :)

D.I.D.
09-01-2015, 04:33 PM
Thanks, but I meant in an ideal world :)

I don't know. It's really hard to say. I don't know what incarnation of the MD is seen as the peak by MD fans. Would that be ACB for the fruition of its Scooby/Buffy gang, or AC3 for its Desmond sections? For me, I think ACB was the most successful MD and AC3 the least successful. I suspect it's not nostalgia for a thing we had so much as a sense of mourning for a thing we felt sure we were about to get but never truly did. I guess a fair percentage of our love for any part of the series lies partly in our imaginations and best hopes for the next game.

dxsxhxcx
09-01-2015, 05:10 PM
I don't know. It's really hard to say. I don't know what incarnation of the MD is seen as the peak by MD fans. Would that be ACB for the fruition of its Scooby/Buffy gang, or AC3 for its Desmond sections? For me, I think ACB was the most successful MD and AC3 the least successful. I suspect it's not nostalgia for a thing we had so much as a sense of mourning for a thing we felt sure we were about to get but never truly did. I guess a fair percentage of our love for any part of the series lies partly in our imaginations and best hopes for the next game.

IMO AC1 was the best, story-wise it gave us a good amount of information (for the 1st game) and (IMO) it has the best ending of all the MD, I don't know what people see in ACB's modern days, apart from its ending (that ended up not having much relevance to the grand scheme of things), all we did was free roam an empty Monteriggioni to collect pointless collectibles, IMO the MD should focus on the narrative and not try to provide the same experience we have with historical portion of the game, in AC3 (IMO) they tried too hard and it didn't feel very satisfying, it also felt rushed as hell, I believe immersion should prevail over gameplay during the Modern Days and each sequence should be meaningful and move the story forward..

VestigialLlama4
09-01-2015, 06:00 PM
Anyone else think that removing modern day elements was the biggest mistake in Unity?

Well the most fun part of UNITY was the parts not set in 1790s Paris...aka all the Modern Day intrusions like Jacques de Molay prologue, Belle Epoque Statue of Liberty, Eiffel Tower, Hundred Years War, so I don't have any problems with the modern day elements at all.


There seemed no point to doing any of the missions, no higher goal, no modern day reveals. Whats the point then?

One can very well ask what was the point of the MD in AC-2, Brotherhood, Revelations? Each game had some McGuffin-quest that is essentially an excuse to stay in the Animus and it was pretty flimsy as excuses go. AC-2 you are Desmond, you hang out with the Assassins and its essentially what, 12 minutes of gameplay, and I don't know if the Altair-Maria romantic date flashback counts in that. Brotherhood had an interesting segue between past-and-present and it was more "dynamic" but it had an ending that was a huge cop-out. Revelations is tonally very different but I actually like it for that reason but its basically stalling time for AC-3.

The only games where the Modern Day were truly interesting was AC1, AC3 and Black Flag.


It's like Ubisoft catered Unity to people who just got into the franchise as opposed to people who buy AC games every year.

Which is odd because logically you release a game every year to maintain the fan base and do your relaunches for the game releases that take their time.

UNITY is terrible because the meat of the game, the historical section was poor on every concievable level and its just a shoddy production that has deservedly become the shame of Ubisoft.

Gold31415
09-01-2015, 09:44 PM
I think ACB was the most successful MD and AC3 the least successful.

I loved the AC3 MD sections. The quiet cave was like a calm, where you could be updated with why exactly you were doing what you were doing in the animus in some peace and quiet. Also the fact that you were working toward opening the giant door.

VoldR
09-01-2015, 11:41 PM
they've been doing that since AC4, the only difference is that in Unity they were able to make it worse than already was...

Im surprise no one mentions liberation when it comes with no walking around in the present days... At least unity can see two present day people, all liberation has is a recording voice telling u about a stereo lies in the "game" ur playing and how to find the true events of the story "unedited"

SixKeys
09-02-2015, 12:08 AM
Im surprise no one mentions liberation when it comes with no walking around in the present days... At least unity can see two present day people, all liberation has is a recording voice telling u about a stereo lies in the "game" ur playing and how to find the true events of the story "unedited"

But Liberation started off as a handheld game. AC: Bloodlines was the same when it comes to lack of modern day, except it had even less (zero). But that was a PSP game so no-one cares.

Shahkulu101
09-02-2015, 12:32 AM
I agree with Matknapers, Unity's problems are so large in quantity and scale that the lackluster MD is the least of it's problems.

- Terribly repetitive side missions with no joy, personality or purpose meaning they amount to nothing but petty chores.
- Map completely obfuscated by pointless icons.
- infuriating movement - getting into a window or dropping to a ledge etc is a major pain in the arse and you always get detected because of it. Parkour is heavy, cumbersome
and has no flow.
- AI has no clear set of rules and is totally inconsistent, making every stealth action a gamble that is likely to result in a chaotic mess.
- Scandalous historical story that disgraces the legacy of the French Revolution with nonsense royalist propaganda and an unconvincing love story.

The only thing it has going for it are a few of the assassination missions which are well-designed and among the best levels in the series (Sivert, lafreniere, Le Peltier) and relatively pretty graphics. The combat is okay for encouraging stealth, another pro I supoose, and I hope further combat systems adopt a similar level of challenge (fat chance going by Syndicates footage), but even if it's an implied fail state it should still feel somewhat satisfying - Unity's felt absolutely awful to play.

Sorry, I know this isn't really relevant - but I just finished Unity again and had to rant. Ugh.

LoyalACFan
09-02-2015, 06:13 AM
Helllll no. I'm really confused as to why people are clinging so desperately onto the stupid modern-day plot when it hasn't really delivered anything satisfying since Brotherhood. DITCH THE MODERN STUFF. The more they hang onto it, the more painfully obvious it becomes that they've simply run out of MacGuffins to go searching around in the Animus for; you can't introduce a new super-special alien device in every game and make them all relevant in the overarching plot, so the more recent stories have begun to downplay that factor. The modern crew in AC4 wound up disregarding the Observatory because modern surveillance was better anyway. Rogue's Animus justification was basically just that Otso was a Shay fanboy (though it also happened to invent the most ludicrous Firt Civ tech to date, with the world-holding-together-machine-thingies). And Unity's modern character literally wound up saying "welp, that was all a complete waste of time, gj tho."

Gold31415
09-02-2015, 06:03 PM
In my opinion you can't deny that the modern day setting in AC4BF was awesome.

Seeing the offices of (what was an analogy to Ubisoft) seeing all the books lying around which true fans have in their room as well. It was like a love letter to fans. The sinister yet inviting feeling of exploration. Seeing a book or item you missed getting in real life just sitting on a shelf ingame.

Also the whole playing in the animus being a metaphor for playing the game yourself, whoever at Ubisoft thought of the -lets make Ubisoft Abstergo- thing was a genius. You could get out of the Animus when you wanted and snoop around the offices exploring, and learning more about the backstory, ACII like puzzle progression, it was awesome. And if you didn't want to you didn't have to!

It was the best modern day setting of all AC's to me, followed closely by ACIII (and ACII which was not as good because it was triggered and not freeroam.)


To me people who say get rid of the modern day sections (somehow) remind me of the Call of Duty fans, just explosions and shooting and nothing else, though that may be judgmental on my part.

Sorrosyss
09-02-2015, 07:17 PM
Ditching it was a huge mistake. But one of several. It definitely didn't help that they focused so much on the historical story - being as weak as it was. But then, it was rushed out the door. It was obvious to all, and everybody knows that. We just hope for a bounce back to form with Syndicate.

HDinHB
09-02-2015, 10:03 PM
In my opinion you can't deny that the modern day setting in AC4BF was awesome.

I can deny it, and I do. I do.


awe·some
ˈôsəm/
adjective

extremely impressive or daunting; inspiring great admiration, apprehension, or fear.

"the awesome power of the atomic bomb"
synonyms: breathtaking, awe-inspiring, magnificent, wonderful, amazing, stunning, staggering, imposing, stirring, impressive;

Or, as the Urban Dictionary defines it.

awesome
Something Americans use to describe everything. "Oh wow it's just awesome"

The only nice thing to say about the MD in Black Flag is it wasn't the MD in Unity.

LoyalACFan
09-03-2015, 03:26 AM
To me people who say get rid of the modern day sections (somehow) remind me of the Call of Duty fans, just explosions and shooting and nothing else, though that may be judgmental on my part.

IMO the modern day is making AC more like COD by sticking around. To have a modern section, you have to have a justification for the Animus, which always manifests itself in the form of some long-lost Piece of Eden that the modern crew wants. So every ancestor's story, at some point, has to boil down into "gotta get dat artifact from da bad guyz," which limits the amount of creativity the writers can have. Imagine being told "here, write an original story about Victorian London, except you have to have a random unrelated ancient piece of technology at the core of the entire narrative." Every game's story will, to a large degree, be the same as the last game's until this situation is rectified. Ancient glowy MacGuffins were cool once, but I'm seriously f***ing over it now.

JWRK
09-03-2015, 07:36 AM
- Scandalous historical story that disgraces the legacy of the French Revolution with nonsense royalist propaganda and an unconvincing love story.

u mad bro ?

I can't even imagine the fit Mélancon fanboys would throw if Unity really slammed the Revolution like it deserves. But Assassin's Creed is not the series to do that.

VestigialLlama4
09-03-2015, 07:42 AM
But Assassin's Creed is not the series to do that.

Before Rogue Unity it wasn't, but now it is.

As this historian confirms here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r47yZIYBUzc

Likewise you can consult this thread I made:

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/954025-ACU-History-A-list-of-demonstrable-lies-and-inaccuracies-**SPOILERS**

JWRK
09-03-2015, 08:58 AM
Before Rogue Unity it wasn't, but now it is.

The Creed series is about killing everyone who stand in your way and "the end justifies the means". Neither Unity nor Rogue has changed that, and it makes any criticism of the Reign of Terror hypocritical and toothless. Mission One : "The Law of Suspects might be going too far? Maybe ?" Mission Two : "Kill these unarmed blokes because a medium precog dreamt they might be up to something".


As this historian confirms here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r47yZIYBUzc

If I were immortal there would be a chance of me watching a video of someone talking slooooooooowly about something over stock videogame footage, I suppose.


Likewise you can consult this thread I made:
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/954025-ACU-History-A-list-of-demonstrable-lies-and-inaccuracies-**SPOILERS**

I'll do it later.

strigoi1958
09-03-2015, 12:09 PM
Wow, I'm stunned... I know I couldn't be the only person in the world who is not a fan of MD but I never expected to find any others in the forum. ;)

In answer to the OP's question... No, removing the MD was a logical step for me, but that's just because I'm solely an avid AC game fan.

To clarify... I'm not saying other people are not avid AC game fans but they are avid story and book and historical fans as well, whereas my only interest is in playing the game... the bits that involve me using my controller as an assassin.

The MD section for me is the boring part that links the exciting bits of immersed gameplay together or rather.... it's the un-skippable sections that interrupt me playing my game.

Initially it was needed to explain the animus and why we use the animus...

Butt I guess some people's curiosity was piqued and ask who are these mysterious first civ and what happens to the people in the animus...

but MD spiraled out of control like a tv series that becomes unbelievable by trying to throw in ever increasing shock factors to keep the mystery until the next episode. kill Lucy, Father kidnapped, commit suicide or the world is destroyed.... the next step would have to have been even more extreme... sacrifice your family or we'll implode the sun...

Don't get me wrong.... just because there are things about the game I am not bothered about (because all the great things vastly outweigh the trivial things ;) ) I understand that others want and like those sections and to me it is not a negative thing ... the MD is an extra that is there for those who want to walk around a stadium as Desmond or an office building playing the 80's game frogger... doing the story section rather than be in the game section.

Possibly and this is just my opinion... someone at ubi might have said... the MD was getting a bit silly and escalating too quickly... then they toned it down in AC4 to "join the templars or die" and started to make it far more believable... still adding a shock factor but more believable...

So, maybe they will slowly introduce it back in at a more controlled rate.

There are so many directions they could take the MD so it's inclusion would be less of an interruption to the assassin game and maybe become part of the game. The 1st civ could be involved as advisors or observers in the memories and the md section could be the end section where we have discovered the location of the artifact and race the templars to the location (somewhat like the artifact buried in achilles grave.). Or they could come back to the MD to load another time or person so we could jump from Altair to Arno to Cesare Borgia to Evie to Elise to Charles Lee or whoever we discover on the journey to finding the missing artifact... if someone in the past knows its location then the MD section could be used to locate a descendant so we can get some DNA and then access the persons memory in the animus to continue the journey...

Or introduce templars from the present using their own animus in the memories so an added danger in game but also the MD section could be used to sabotage the templar animus and help us win the race to locate the artifact....
Or the artifact may now be in a place where a building has been constructed or locked in a security deposit box or its location is only found after solving clues in the MD.

At present... the MD is about 1st civ and other people who I do not care for and... they stop me playing as an assassin. MD either needs to either be a fully integrated part of the game or it needs to be just a cameo at the beginning and a story after the game ends for those who want story/ mystery and searching through sound clips, pages of data looking for obscure references.
At present it is neither.

I don't care for MD in its present condition and maybe Ubi are thinking of phasing it out... but I'd like that even less... I'd like it importance in the game to be raised not just the story.

I'm sure some will disagree and say the MD part where we are not playing as an assassin is still part of the assassin game not just the story... but I hope some can see how these could be seen as almost two separate things to just gamers (like myself) and options exists to merge the two so everyone can feel it belongs in the game.

Shahkulu101
09-03-2015, 12:27 PM
u mad bro ?

I can't even imagine the fit Mélancon fanboys would throw if Unity really slammed the Revolution like it deserves. But Assassin's Creed is not the series to do that.

An actual historian consulted the script, and advised that they edit it because it was too pro-royalist, and therefore counter-factual. My problem isn't even that they take a pro-royalist stance, it's that they alter facts in order to support that agenda. I wouldn't be happy if it was completely pro-revolutionary either and Robespierre was hailed as hero, because this series has always been fair and balanced when it comes to historical representation - especially AC3.

VestigialLlama4
09-03-2015, 03:43 PM
My problem isn't even that they take a pro-royalist stance, it's that they alter facts in order to support that agenda.

I wouldn't be happy if it was completely pro-revolutionary either and Robespierre was hailed as hero, because this series has always been fair and balanced when it comes to historical representation - especially AC3.

THIS. I completely agree.

Shahkulu101
09-03-2015, 06:25 PM
THIS. I completely agree.

We are of the same mind?

A miracle. ;)